Why does the USA have only two large political parties?

[Linkiloo]

Experience shows that, for example, there is much greater voter awareness and engagement in France than in the U.S. Why this is so remains unclear.
This isn't to say that the French have it right. It is not meant to exalt nor denigrate America's oldest ally; it's just a comment.

maybe that has something to do with the difference in population size as well as geographical size of the countries. I am pretty sure where there are huge landmasses politicians have a harder time reaching the populace.

 

[Linkiloo]

Experience shows that, for example, there is much greater voter awareness and engagement in France than in the U.S. Why this is so remains unclear.
This isn't to say that the French have it right. It is not meant to exalt nor denigrate America's oldest ally; it's just a comment.

I found an interesting article on voter turnout. Seems in the US it is much lower than in Europe.
Why do so many French people vote?

 

[longknife]

A few comments in response to a sensible article from someone who is not an American.

Our Founders purposely avoided the parliamentary form of government that existed in Europe at the time of our independence. In fact, most Founders warned about the formation of political parties.

When political parties quickly formed, there were only two. It has basically remained the same ever since.

And the two major political parties have found ways to basically limit the chances of more parties arising.

You must understand, voting in the USA is controlled at the local level. Towns and cities decide which parties can participate in their elections. Counties, then states do the same.

I am looking at my sample ballot and it lists the following parties for the Senate race:

Independent American Party
Libertarian Party
Democrat Party
Republican Party
One candidate with No Party Affiliation
They get on the ballot by gathering a required number of verified signatures.

All of the other major positions have at least 3 parties listed.

We also allow voters to write in candidates who are not on the ballot.

Why is this?

Money!

It takes money to advertise and candidates pay huge amounts of money for ads in the media.

Will it ever change?

I have a gut feeling that there may be some major changes if Republicans sweep the upcoming November elections. The Democrat Pary as it now stands has got to splinter. I also think the American Independent Party is going to pick up a lot of new members.

Time will tell.

And I hope I answered your question.

 

[Lucian Hodoboc]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Republicans and the Democrats?

I love the liberals for being open minded and accepting but most Americans are ignorant dumb fucks, and I knew this before even moving here.

Then how did they become so advanced as a nation in only a few centuries?

 

[there4eyeM]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Republicans and the Democrats?

I love the liberals for being open minded and accepting but most Americans are ignorant dumb fucks, and I knew this before even moving here.

Then how did they become so advanced as a nation in only a few centuries?

First, they inherited a peaceful corner of the earth with virtually unlimited resources. Then, they had the examples of Europe, both those to follow and those to avoid. The rest is "dumb luck", if you will.

 

[Picaro]

I also think it is interesting that you have two parties and that is it. Obviously in Europe there are a lot of parties but it comes down to having to form coalitions which becomes some watered down version of what voters wanted and leads to strange deals and odd bedfellows. In Germany now the large colation between the social party SPD and the conservative CDU has led to the almost destruction of both, with people now voting increasingly far right or far left. It isn't looking good. Maybe two parties with clear majorities are better.

We have a lot of Parties; lobbyists just throw money at the two biggies, who pretend to be separate Parties, but they all rely on Goldman Sachs for their perks and bennies and plush retirements.

 

[Picaro]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Republicans and the Democrats?

I love the liberals for being open minded and accepting but most Americans are ignorant dumb fucks, and I knew this before even moving here.

Then how did they become so advanced as a nation in only a few centuries?

Early on we mostly relied on British and German money invested, and stealing technology from the British and French, via back-dating patents, and huge tariffs and other corporate welfare. We were isolated from Europe, so didn't suffer invasions from anybody after 1812, and lived in blissful ignorance and isolation between two giant moats. If the wars in Europe had ever stopped long enough, we would have been toast once they focused on us, but that didn't happen.

 

[Picaro]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Republicans and the Democrats?

I love the liberals for being open minded and accepting but most Americans are ignorant dumb fucks, and I knew this before even moving here.

Then how did they become so advanced as a nation in only a few centuries?

First, they inherited a peaceful corner of the earth with virtually unlimited resources. Then, they had the examples of Europe, both those to follow and those to avoid. The rest is "dumb luck", if you will.

And massive amounts of cheap disposable labor. Contrary to popular belief and lies to school children, 'free' labor was worse off than slaves. Even 'native' labor suffered a 15%-20% decline in average height form 1820 onward, a sign of widespread malnutrition, along with a 15% reduction in average lifespans as well, and high infant mortality rates. Salves before the Civil War had the same child mortality rates as whites, though bring in the South meant having higher morality rates than the better off Yankees, due to the swamps and longer cycles of hot weather and insects.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Republicans and the Democrats?

Because of the way people vote.

The US uses First Past The Post. It's negative voting. People will often vote for who they DON'T WANT to get in.

Germany has FPTP and PR within the same system. The larger parties do much better with FPTP than with PR. The CDU/CSU gained 77% of the seats with FPTP and only 35% of the seats with PR.

Also, the larger the party, the more chance they are going to win each individual race. Basically if you get more votes than the next party, then you win.

Theoretically you could win with 2 votes. If you get 2 votes and everyone else gets 1 vote, you win with only 2.

Smaller parties can't hope to get to beat the larger parties because so many people are looking at the other party they don't want to win.

With PR there'd actually be choice for the people, but then the partisan hacks don't want it, the rich don't want it as they can easily control the system as it is.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Liberals and the Democrats?

`
I think you mean the democrats and republicans. The US Constitution does not mandate any parties. These are "for profit" businesses whose service is to get people elected. It's a "duopoly", as both have made it near impossible for the national formation of a third party.
`

You've basically told him what he already knows. He wants to know WHY this is the case, not that it is the case.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Experience shows that, for example, there is much greater voter awareness and engagement in France than in the U.S. Why this is so remains unclear.
This isn't to say that the French have it right. It is not meant to exalt nor denigrate America's oldest ally; it's just a comment.

maybe that has something to do with the difference in population size as well as geographical size of the countries. I am pretty sure where there are huge landmasses politicians have a harder time reaching the populace.

Nothing to do with population size at all. It's to do with how the people get to vote.

 

[Windparadox]

You've basically told him what he already knows. He wants to know WHY this is the case, not that it is the case.

`
You've basically missed the point.

 

[Issa]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Liberals and the Democrats?

Because there is good and evil.

Supporting abortion on demand is evil.
Supporting forced labor is evil.
Supporting chaos and lawlessness is evil.

You either oppose evil or you are an enabler of it. Republicans oppose evil.

Republican are ok with cheating
Republicans are ok with racism and bigotry
Republicans are ok with name calling
Republicans are ok with nor helping the desperate
Republicans are ok with tax evasion
Republicans are ok with bullying
Republicans are ok with fraudulent universities
Republicans are ok with basically bending over to a conman/bully/cheater/liar/pussy grabber.

I'm okay with not giving your home nation not one red cent, nor one more iota of our military support.

Put that in your pipe.

Smoke it on up.

My nation is the US....love this country and would fight for it...but the fact is there are too many dumb fucks and its proven.

 

[Issa]

Why isn't there a third major political party besides the Republicans and the Democrats?

I love the liberals for being open minded and accepting but most Americans are ignorant dumb fucks, and I knew this before even moving here.

Then how did they become so advanced as a nation in only a few centuries?

Immigration sweet heart....the masses are average minded compared to Europeans.
Take for example silicon valley. NASA etc....mostly HB1 visa.....even spelling bee is dominated by sons of immigrants.

 

[EverCurious]

Oddly enough, one of the strongest Christian states (Alaska at 70%), is also the one that votes third party (Libertarian)

We're basically a different country from our dysfunctional southern cousins though so... ~shrug~

Alaska until the price of oil dropped recently also hands out govt freebies like candy, complete with artificial towns built for the 'natives' and oil royalties handed out to citizens from the stat treasury. that makes it a lot easier to be all 'libertarian n stuff' when you don't have to pay to live somewhere, keep roads in repair, hospitals up, that sort of stuff, much like dumbass upper class Burb Brats don't worry at all about barrios full of criminal illegal aliens they rarely ever see up close or have to pay any taxes to subsidize at their own expense.

<Begin rant>

Oooo someone's been hitting the fake news hard lately. Here's some /real/ news about Alaska's budgeting (slightly dated, but it was /during/ the recession.) - Understanding Alaska's Revenue - Understanding Alaska's Budget

"Over half the state’s total budget (56% in FY2012) and 90% of its discretionary spending (known as the general fund) comes from oil revenue."

"Money from Washington, D.C., currently provides about a fifth of Alaska’s total budget (19% in FY2012). Federal dollars are less flexible than oil dollars. They tend to pay for specific services (such as Medicare and the federal share of Medicaid) and building large infrastructure projects (think highways, bridges and airports) that may require state matching funds. In addition to being less flexible, they often come with strings attached (federal rules and regulations)." -- AKA shit the Feds piss away, not Alaska's gov. You see it's ironic since it's Fed mandated programs that require we pay "restitution" to the Alaska Natives (who's land was actually 'stolen' by the Russian's, not America) this comes in the form of heavy financial subsidies granted by the feds, medicare/medicaid that isn't managed by the state, but also in land that the state of Alaska has to cede to them - but whatever right? It's the numbers that matter when you're trying to shit on a fellow state because they happen to lean right. I find it hilarious when ya'll lower 48ers spout off stupidly about Alaska's budgeting and spending because we literally make as much off our investment portfolio as we do from the feds: "Another significant share of revenue to the state (19% in FY2012) comes from money the state earns on its investment funds."

The 'third party' part of Alaska comes in where instead of the state government pocketing all of our surplus income to spend on more government bullshit, we hand out a good portion of the capital gains to our people every single year. No state tax, no state sales tax, no muni taxes most places, low licensing fees, little regulation, and freedom for both Alaskan's and businesses. Alaska does for it's people, not its politicians. We also do a lot for the nation which your little bullshit "spends more" studies actually penalize us for. We have a massive military presence in the Pacific and are charged with defending not only the lower 48, but also Canada, Europe, Greenland, Iceland, the Northwest Passage, etc., etc. against America's strongest enemies (N. Korea, Russia, China.) We have the most national park land of any state in the nation by fucking far. And the cost of maintaining all of that /federally required/ stuff is considered as "Alaska costs" by your 'fake news' bullshit slant that Alaska, most importantly a 'republican' state, 'steals' from the feds.

Its bullshit for the uneducated masses who can't be bothered to learn a single thing about another state, or even the study they're reading, before bitching about said state's residents for purely hostile reasons of sowing hatred between state populations. The urban vs rural hatred that partisan assholes like you roll around in like pigs in shit. Congrats, here's your sign.

"Alaska has just over $61 billion in savings, of which $21 billion can be used to help offset a fiscal gap. This savings would fund three years of general fund spending at current levels should oil revenues dry up completely. With projected gradual declines in oil revenue the funds available in savings are anticipated to last through 2030." -- Our total annual budget is $11-13B a year so we'll be just fine long after you've blown your fiscal wad on illegal aliens and rancher subsidies. Shove that in your "better than thou" tail pipe and suck it little bro state. Texas, and ND, would be wise to follow our example in handling their state resources instead of pissing it all away.


** Note on National Parks - USA's largest national park is Wrangell–St. Elias in Alaska: at over 8 million acres (32,375 km2), it is larger than each of the nine smallest states. The next three largest parks are also in Alaska.

Denali National Park Alaska 1917 4,740,911.16 acres (19,185.7868 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park Alaska 1980 7,523,897.45 acres (30,448.1327 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park Alaska 1980 3,223,383.43 acres (13,044.5699 km2)
Katmai National Park Alaska 1980 3,674,529.33 acres (14,870.2926 km2)
Kenai Fjords National Park Alaska 1980 669,650.05 acres (2,709.9776 km2)
Kobuk Valley National Park Alaska 1980 1,750,716.16 acres (7,084.8969 km2)
Lake Clark National Park Alaska 1980 2,619,816.49 acres (10,602.0212 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park Alaska 1980 8,323,146.48 acres (33,682.5788 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 137,176 acres (555.13 km2)
Cape Krusenstern National Monument and Archeological District Alaska 649,124.53 acres (2,626.9138 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 464,117.93 acres (1,878.2186 km2)
Bering Land Bridge National Preserve Alaska 2,697,391.01 acres (10,915.9541 km2)
Denali National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,334,117.80 acres (5,398.9832 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park and Preserve Alaska 948,608.07 acres (3,838.8807 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park and Preserve Alaska 58,406.00 acres (236.3607 km2)
Katmai National Park and Preserve Alaska 418,698.80 acres (1,694.4139 km2)
Lake Clark National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,410,293.68 acres (5,707.2560 km2)
Noatak National Preserve Alaska 6,587,071.39 acres (26,656.9322 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park and Preserve Alaska 4,852,644.52 acres (19,637.9556 km2)
Yukon-Charley Rivers National Preserve Alaska 2,526,512.44 acres (10,224.4331 km2)
Sitka National Historical Park Alaska 116.29 acres (0.4706 km2)
Klondike Gold Rush National Historical Park (part of Klondike Gold Rush International Historical Park) **Alaska, Washington 12,996.49 acres (52.5949 km2)
Aleutian World War II National Historic Area (affiliated area) Alaska
Alagnak Wild and Scenic River Alaska
Inupiat Heritage Center (affiliated area) Alaska

We also pay out of our $11B annual budget for large numbers of state parks on TOP of all the federal parks. Like literally, you can't throw a damn rock without hitting a park up here - and we maintain it all for our love of nature and for the nations future generations to share it.

*** The Feds employee some 17.7K employees in fields ranging from national park management to earthquake/tsunami watch employees, FBI, CIA, FAA, etc. (I heard on TV not to long ago that we hit 20K but I can't find an online reference for that.)

**** Note on Military - Nine military bases are in Alaska. Fort Wainwright, Elmendorf AFB, and Fort Richardson are the largest bases in Alaska, each averaging about 6,000 military personnel. Eielson AFB North Pole, CLEAR AF Base Denali, Fort Greely Fairbanks, ISC Kodiak CG, Marine Safty CG Valdez, USCG Juneau. Active duty 19.4K, Reserve 4.7K, Civilian support staff 5K. That's a solid 25% of our population being directly employed by the military.

The Army and the Air Force make up more than 75 percent of that military might. Most of the training operations prepare service members for operating in inhospitable winter climates whether on the ground or in the air. Missile defense and detection mission is a high priority for the Alaskan Soldiers and Airmen stationed there. Clear Air Force Station is one of many early detection centers for Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles (ICBM) coming over the pacific or the North Pole. The Coast Guard has a large presence in Alaska with a variety of missions along the coast line and in the Bering Sea. The Naval Special Warfare Detachment Kodiak is a tenant of the base and uses the training areas for Winter Warfare for Navy SEAL Training.

 

[longknife]

Oddly enough, one of the strongest Christian states (Alaska at 70%), is also the one that votes third party (Libertarian)

We're basically a different country from our dysfunctional southern cousins though so... ~shrug~

Alaska until the price of oil dropped recently also hands out govt freebies like candy, complete with artificial towns built for the 'natives' and oil royalties handed out to citizens from the stat treasury. that makes it a lot easier to be all 'libertarian n stuff' when you don't have to pay to live somewhere, keep roads in repair, hospitals up, that sort of stuff, much like dumbass upper class Burb Brats don't worry at all about barrios full of criminal illegal aliens they rarely ever see up close or have to pay any taxes to subsidize at their own expense.

<Begin rant>

Oooo someone's been hitting the fake news hard lately. Here's some /real/ news about Alaska's budgeting (slightly dated, but it was /during/ the recession.) - Understanding Alaska's Revenue - Understanding Alaska's Budget

"Over half the state’s total budget (56% in FY2012) and 90% of its discretionary spending (known as the general fund) comes from oil revenue."

"Money from Washington, D.C., currently provides about a fifth of Alaska’s total budget (19% in FY2012). Federal dollars are less flexible than oil dollars. They tend to pay for specific services (such as Medicare and the federal share of Medicaid) and building large infrastructure projects (think highways, bridges and airports) that may require state matching funds. In addition to being less flexible, they often come with strings attached (federal rules and regulations)." -- AKA shit the Feds piss away, not Alaska's gov. You see it's ironic since it's Fed mandated programs that require we pay "restitution" to the Alaska Natives (who's land was actually 'stolen' by the Russian's, not America) this comes in the form of heavy financial subsidies granted by the feds, medicare/medicaid that isn't managed by the state, but also in land that the state of Alaska has to cede to them - but whatever right? It's the numbers that matter when you're trying to shit on a fellow state because they happen to lean right. I find it hilarious when ya'll lower 48ers spout off stupidly about Alaska's budgeting and spending because we literally make as much off our investment portfolio as we do from the feds: "Another significant share of revenue to the state (19% in FY2012) comes from money the state earns on its investment funds."

The 'third party' part of Alaska comes in where instead of the state government pocketing all of our surplus income to spend on more government bullshit, we hand out a good portion of the capital gains to our people every single year. No state tax, no state sales tax, no muni taxes most places, low licensing fees, little regulation, and freedom for both Alaskan's and businesses. Alaska does for it's people, not its politicians. We also do a lot for the nation which your little bullshit "spends more" studies actually penalize us for. We have a massive military presence in the Pacific and are charged with defending not only the lower 48, but also Canada, Europe, Greenland, Iceland, the Northwest Passage, etc., etc. against America's strongest enemies (N. Korea, Russia, China.) We have the most national park land of any state in the nation by fucking far. And the cost of maintaining all of that /federally required/ stuff is considered as "Alaska costs" by your 'fake news' bullshit slant that Alaska, most importantly a 'republican' state, 'steals' from the feds.

Its bullshit for the uneducated masses who can't be bothered to learn a single thing about another state, or even the study they're reading, before bitching about said state's residents for purely hostile reasons of sowing hatred between state populations. The urban vs rural hatred that partisan assholes like you roll around in like pigs in shit. Congrats, here's your sign.

"Alaska has just over $61 billion in savings, of which $21 billion can be used to help offset a fiscal gap. This savings would fund three years of general fund spending at current levels should oil revenues dry up completely. With projected gradual declines in oil revenue the funds available in savings are anticipated to last through 2030." -- Our total annual budget is $11-13B a year so we'll be just fine long after you've blown your fiscal wad on illegal aliens and rancher subsidies. Shove that in your "better than thou" tail pipe and suck it little bro state. Texas, and ND, would be wise to follow our example in handling their state resources instead of pissing it all away.


** Note on National Parks - USA's largest national park is Wrangell–St. Elias in Alaska: at over 8 million acres (32,375 km2), it is larger than each of the nine smallest states. The next three largest parks are also in Alaska.

Denali National Park Alaska 1917 4,740,911.16 acres (19,185.7868 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park Alaska 1980 7,523,897.45 acres (30,448.1327 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park Alaska 1980 3,223,383.43 acres (13,044.5699 km2)
Katmai National Park Alaska 1980 3,674,529.33 acres (14,870.2926 km2)
Kenai Fjords National Park Alaska 1980 669,650.05 acres (2,709.9776 km2)
Kobuk Valley National Park Alaska 1980 1,750,716.16 acres (7,084.8969 km2)
Lake Clark National Park Alaska 1980 2,619,816.49 acres (10,602.0212 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park Alaska 1980 8,323,146.48 acres (33,682.5788 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 137,176 acres (555.13 km2)
Cape Krusenstern National Monument and Archeological District Alaska 649,124.53 acres (2,626.9138 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 464,117.93 acres (1,878.2186 km2)
Bering Land Bridge National Preserve Alaska 2,697,391.01 acres (10,915.9541 km2)
Denali National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,334,117.80 acres (5,398.9832 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park and Preserve Alaska 948,608.07 acres (3,838.8807 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park and Preserve Alaska 58,406.00 acres (236.3607 km2)
Katmai National Park and Preserve Alaska 418,698.80 acres (1,694.4139 km2)
Lake Clark National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,410,293.68 acres (5,707.2560 km2)
Noatak National Preserve Alaska 6,587,071.39 acres (26,656.9322 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park and Preserve Alaska 4,852,644.52 acres (19,637.9556 km2)
Yukon-Charley Rivers National Preserve Alaska 2,526,512.44 acres (10,224.4331 km2)
Sitka National Historical Park Alaska 116.29 acres (0.4706 km2)
Klondike Gold Rush National Historical Park (part of Klondike Gold Rush International Historical Park) **Alaska, Washington 12,996.49 acres (52.5949 km2)
Aleutian World War II National Historic Area (affiliated area) Alaska
Alagnak Wild and Scenic River Alaska
Inupiat Heritage Center (affiliated area) Alaska

We also pay out of our $11B annual budget for large numbers of state parks on TOP of all the federal parks. Like literally, you can't throw a damn rock without hitting a park up here - and we maintain it all for our love of nature and for the nations future generations to share it.

*** The Feds employee some 17.7K employees in fields ranging from national park management to earthquake/tsunami watch employees, FBI, CIA, FAA, etc. (I heard on TV not to long ago that we hit 20K but I can't find an online reference for that.)

**** Note on Military - Nine military bases are in Alaska. Fort Wainwright, Elmendorf AFB, and Fort Richardson are the largest bases in Alaska, each averaging about 6,000 military personnel. Eielson AFB North Pole, CLEAR AF Base Denali, Fort Greely Fairbanks, ISC Kodiak CG, Marine Safty CG Valdez, USCG Juneau. Active duty 19.4K, Reserve 4.7K, Civilian support staff 5K. That's a solid 25% of our population being directly employed by the military.

The Army and the Air Force make up more than 75 percent of that military might. Most of the training operations prepare service members for operating in inhospitable winter climates whether on the ground or in the air. Missile defense and detection mission is a high priority for the Alaskan Soldiers and Airmen stationed there. Clear Air Force Station is one of many early detection centers for Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles (ICBM) coming over the pacific or the North Pole. The Coast Guard has a large presence in Alaska with a variety of missions along the coast line and in the Bering Sea. The Naval Special Warfare Detachment Kodiak is a tenant of the base and uses the training areas for Winter Warfare for Navy SEAL Training.

What the hell does this crap have to do with the OP's original question?

 

[EverCurious]

Oddly enough, one of the strongest Christian states (Alaska at 70%), is also the one that votes third party (Libertarian)

We're basically a different country from our dysfunctional southern cousins though so... ~shrug~

Alaska until the price of oil dropped recently also hands out govt freebies like candy, complete with artificial towns built for the 'natives' and oil royalties handed out to citizens from the stat treasury. that makes it a lot easier to be all 'libertarian n stuff' when you don't have to pay to live somewhere, keep roads in repair, hospitals up, that sort of stuff, much like dumbass upper class Burb Brats don't worry at all about barrios full of criminal illegal aliens they rarely ever see up close or have to pay any taxes to subsidize at their own expense.

<Begin rant>

Oooo someone's been hitting the fake news hard lately. Here's some /real/ news about Alaska's budgeting (slightly dated, but it was /during/ the recession.) - Understanding Alaska's Revenue - Understanding Alaska's Budget

"Over half the state’s total budget (56% in FY2012) and 90% of its discretionary spending (known as the general fund) comes from oil revenue."

"Money from Washington, D.C., currently provides about a fifth of Alaska’s total budget (19% in FY2012). Federal dollars are less flexible than oil dollars. They tend to pay for specific services (such as Medicare and the federal share of Medicaid) and building large infrastructure projects (think highways, bridges and airports) that may require state matching funds. In addition to being less flexible, they often come with strings attached (federal rules and regulations)." -- AKA shit the Feds piss away, not Alaska's gov. You see it's ironic since it's Fed mandated programs that require we pay "restitution" to the Alaska Natives (who's land was actually 'stolen' by the Russian's, not America) this comes in the form of heavy financial subsidies granted by the feds, medicare/medicaid that isn't managed by the state, but also in land that the state of Alaska has to cede to them - but whatever right? It's the numbers that matter when you're trying to shit on a fellow state because they happen to lean right. I find it hilarious when ya'll lower 48ers spout off stupidly about Alaska's budgeting and spending because we literally make as much off our investment portfolio as we do from the feds: "Another significant share of revenue to the state (19% in FY2012) comes from money the state earns on its investment funds."

The 'third party' part of Alaska comes in where instead of the state government pocketing all of our surplus income to spend on more government bullshit, we hand out a good portion of the capital gains to our people every single year. No state tax, no state sales tax, no muni taxes most places, low licensing fees, little regulation, and freedom for both Alaskan's and businesses. Alaska does for it's people, not its politicians. We also do a lot for the nation which your little bullshit "spends more" studies actually penalize us for. We have a massive military presence in the Pacific and are charged with defending not only the lower 48, but also Canada, Europe, Greenland, Iceland, the Northwest Passage, etc., etc. against America's strongest enemies (N. Korea, Russia, China.) We have the most national park land of any state in the nation by fucking far. And the cost of maintaining all of that /federally required/ stuff is considered as "Alaska costs" by your 'fake news' bullshit slant that Alaska, most importantly a 'republican' state, 'steals' from the feds.

Its bullshit for the uneducated masses who can't be bothered to learn a single thing about another state, or even the study they're reading, before bitching about said state's residents for purely hostile reasons of sowing hatred between state populations. The urban vs rural hatred that partisan assholes like you roll around in like pigs in shit. Congrats, here's your sign.

"Alaska has just over $61 billion in savings, of which $21 billion can be used to help offset a fiscal gap. This savings would fund three years of general fund spending at current levels should oil revenues dry up completely. With projected gradual declines in oil revenue the funds available in savings are anticipated to last through 2030." -- Our total annual budget is $11-13B a year so we'll be just fine long after you've blown your fiscal wad on illegal aliens and rancher subsidies. Shove that in your "better than thou" tail pipe and suck it little bro state. Texas, and ND, would be wise to follow our example in handling their state resources instead of pissing it all away.


** Note on National Parks - USA's largest national park is Wrangell–St. Elias in Alaska: at over 8 million acres (32,375 km2), it is larger than each of the nine smallest states. The next three largest parks are also in Alaska.

Denali National Park Alaska 1917 4,740,911.16 acres (19,185.7868 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park Alaska 1980 7,523,897.45 acres (30,448.1327 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park Alaska 1980 3,223,383.43 acres (13,044.5699 km2)
Katmai National Park Alaska 1980 3,674,529.33 acres (14,870.2926 km2)
Kenai Fjords National Park Alaska 1980 669,650.05 acres (2,709.9776 km2)
Kobuk Valley National Park Alaska 1980 1,750,716.16 acres (7,084.8969 km2)
Lake Clark National Park Alaska 1980 2,619,816.49 acres (10,602.0212 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park Alaska 1980 8,323,146.48 acres (33,682.5788 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 137,176 acres (555.13 km2)
Cape Krusenstern National Monument and Archeological District Alaska 649,124.53 acres (2,626.9138 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 464,117.93 acres (1,878.2186 km2)
Bering Land Bridge National Preserve Alaska 2,697,391.01 acres (10,915.9541 km2)
Denali National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,334,117.80 acres (5,398.9832 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park and Preserve Alaska 948,608.07 acres (3,838.8807 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park and Preserve Alaska 58,406.00 acres (236.3607 km2)
Katmai National Park and Preserve Alaska 418,698.80 acres (1,694.4139 km2)
Lake Clark National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,410,293.68 acres (5,707.2560 km2)
Noatak National Preserve Alaska 6,587,071.39 acres (26,656.9322 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park and Preserve Alaska 4,852,644.52 acres (19,637.9556 km2)
Yukon-Charley Rivers National Preserve Alaska 2,526,512.44 acres (10,224.4331 km2)
Sitka National Historical Park Alaska 116.29 acres (0.4706 km2)
Klondike Gold Rush National Historical Park (part of Klondike Gold Rush International Historical Park) **Alaska, Washington 12,996.49 acres (52.5949 km2)
Aleutian World War II National Historic Area (affiliated area) Alaska
Alagnak Wild and Scenic River Alaska
Inupiat Heritage Center (affiliated area) Alaska

We also pay out of our $11B annual budget for large numbers of state parks on TOP of all the federal parks. Like literally, you can't throw a damn rock without hitting a park up here - and we maintain it all for our love of nature and for the nations future generations to share it.

*** The Feds employee some 17.7K employees in fields ranging from national park management to earthquake/tsunami watch employees, FBI, CIA, FAA, etc. (I heard on TV not to long ago that we hit 20K but I can't find an online reference for that.)

**** Note on Military - Nine military bases are in Alaska. Fort Wainwright, Elmendorf AFB, and Fort Richardson are the largest bases in Alaska, each averaging about 6,000 military personnel. Eielson AFB North Pole, CLEAR AF Base Denali, Fort Greely Fairbanks, ISC Kodiak CG, Marine Safty CG Valdez, USCG Juneau. Active duty 19.4K, Reserve 4.7K, Civilian support staff 5K. That's a solid 25% of our population being directly employed by the military.

The Army and the Air Force make up more than 75 percent of that military might. Most of the training operations prepare service members for operating in inhospitable winter climates whether on the ground or in the air. Missile defense and detection mission is a high priority for the Alaskan Soldiers and Airmen stationed there. Clear Air Force Station is one of many early detection centers for Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles (ICBM) coming over the pacific or the North Pole. The Coast Guard has a large presence in Alaska with a variety of missions along the coast line and in the Bering Sea. The Naval Special Warfare Detachment Kodiak is a tenant of the base and uses the training areas for Winter Warfare for Navy SEAL Training.

What the hell does this crap have to do with the OP's original question?

Ask Picaro, he's the one who brought it up. I just mentioned that Alaska voted third-party [and thus so can anyone else] ~shrug~

 

[frigidweirdo]

You've basically told him what he already knows. He wants to know WHY this is the case, not that it is the case.

`
You've basically missed the point.

There was a point? No, I don't think I missed the point, I think you were rambling.

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,

1. There is a new major party on the horizon.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

 

[Picaro]

Oddly enough, one of the strongest Christian states (Alaska at 70%), is also the one that votes third party (Libertarian)

We're basically a different country from our dysfunctional southern cousins though so... ~shrug~

Alaska until the price of oil dropped recently also hands out govt freebies like candy, complete with artificial towns built for the 'natives' and oil royalties handed out to citizens from the stat treasury. that makes it a lot easier to be all 'libertarian n stuff' when you don't have to pay to live somewhere, keep roads in repair, hospitals up, that sort of stuff, much like dumbass upper class Burb Brats don't worry at all about barrios full of criminal illegal aliens they rarely ever see up close or have to pay any taxes to subsidize at their own expense.

<Begin rant>

Oooo someone's been hitting the fake news hard lately. Here's some /real/ news about Alaska's budgeting (slightly dated, but it was /during/ the recession.) - Understanding Alaska's Revenue - Understanding Alaska's Budget

"Over half the state’s total budget (56% in FY2012) and 90% of its discretionary spending (known as the general fund) comes from oil revenue."

"Money from Washington, D.C., currently provides about a fifth of Alaska’s total budget (19% in FY2012). Federal dollars are less flexible than oil dollars. They tend to pay for specific services (such as Medicare and the federal share of Medicaid) and building large infrastructure projects (think highways, bridges and airports) that may require state matching funds. In addition to being less flexible, they often come with strings attached (federal rules and regulations)." -- AKA shit the Feds piss away, not Alaska's gov. You see it's ironic since it's Fed mandated programs that require we pay "restitution" to the Alaska Natives (who's land was actually 'stolen' by the Russian's, not America) this comes in the form of heavy financial subsidies granted by the feds, medicare/medicaid that isn't managed by the state, but also in land that the state of Alaska has to cede to them - but whatever right? It's the numbers that matter when you're trying to shit on a fellow state because they happen to lean right. I find it hilarious when ya'll lower 48ers spout off stupidly about Alaska's budgeting and spending because we literally make as much off our investment portfolio as we do from the feds: "Another significant share of revenue to the state (19% in FY2012) comes from money the state earns on its investment funds."

The 'third party' part of Alaska comes in where instead of the state government pocketing all of our surplus income to spend on more government bullshit, we hand out a good portion of the capital gains to our people every single year. No state tax, no state sales tax, no muni taxes most places, low licensing fees, little regulation, and freedom for both Alaskan's and businesses. Alaska does for it's people, not its politicians. We also do a lot for the nation which your little bullshit "spends more" studies actually penalize us for. We have a massive military presence in the Pacific and are charged with defending not only the lower 48, but also Canada, Europe, Greenland, Iceland, the Northwest Passage, etc., etc. against America's strongest enemies (N. Korea, Russia, China.) We have the most national park land of any state in the nation by fucking far. And the cost of maintaining all of that /federally required/ stuff is considered as "Alaska costs" by your 'fake news' bullshit slant that Alaska, most importantly a 'republican' state, 'steals' from the feds.

Its bullshit for the uneducated masses who can't be bothered to learn a single thing about another state, or even the study they're reading, before bitching about said state's residents for purely hostile reasons of sowing hatred between state populations. The urban vs rural hatred that partisan assholes like you roll around in like pigs in shit. Congrats, here's your sign.

"Alaska has just over $61 billion in savings, of which $21 billion can be used to help offset a fiscal gap. This savings would fund three years of general fund spending at current levels should oil revenues dry up completely. With projected gradual declines in oil revenue the funds available in savings are anticipated to last through 2030." -- Our total annual budget is $11-13B a year so we'll be just fine long after you've blown your fiscal wad on illegal aliens and rancher subsidies. Shove that in your "better than thou" tail pipe and suck it little bro state. Texas, and ND, would be wise to follow our example in handling their state resources instead of pissing it all away.


** Note on National Parks - USA's largest national park is Wrangell–St. Elias in Alaska: at over 8 million acres (32,375 km2), it is larger than each of the nine smallest states. The next three largest parks are also in Alaska.

Denali National Park Alaska 1917 4,740,911.16 acres (19,185.7868 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park Alaska 1980 7,523,897.45 acres (30,448.1327 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park Alaska 1980 3,223,383.43 acres (13,044.5699 km2)
Katmai National Park Alaska 1980 3,674,529.33 acres (14,870.2926 km2)
Kenai Fjords National Park Alaska 1980 669,650.05 acres (2,709.9776 km2)
Kobuk Valley National Park Alaska 1980 1,750,716.16 acres (7,084.8969 km2)
Lake Clark National Park Alaska 1980 2,619,816.49 acres (10,602.0212 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park Alaska 1980 8,323,146.48 acres (33,682.5788 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 137,176 acres (555.13 km2)
Cape Krusenstern National Monument and Archeological District Alaska 649,124.53 acres (2,626.9138 km2)
Aniakchak National Monument and Preserve Alaska 464,117.93 acres (1,878.2186 km2)
Bering Land Bridge National Preserve Alaska 2,697,391.01 acres (10,915.9541 km2)
Denali National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,334,117.80 acres (5,398.9832 km2)
Gates of the Arctic National Park and Preserve Alaska 948,608.07 acres (3,838.8807 km2)
Glacier Bay National Park and Preserve Alaska 58,406.00 acres (236.3607 km2)
Katmai National Park and Preserve Alaska 418,698.80 acres (1,694.4139 km2)
Lake Clark National Park and Preserve Alaska 1,410,293.68 acres (5,707.2560 km2)
Noatak National Preserve Alaska 6,587,071.39 acres (26,656.9322 km2)
Wrangell-St. Elias National Park and Preserve Alaska 4,852,644.52 acres (19,637.9556 km2)
Yukon-Charley Rivers National Preserve Alaska 2,526,512.44 acres (10,224.4331 km2)
Sitka National Historical Park Alaska 116.29 acres (0.4706 km2)
Klondike Gold Rush National Historical Park (part of Klondike Gold Rush International Historical Park) **Alaska, Washington 12,996.49 acres (52.5949 km2)
Aleutian World War II National Historic Area (affiliated area) Alaska
Alagnak Wild and Scenic River Alaska
Inupiat Heritage Center (affiliated area) Alaska

We also pay out of our $11B annual budget for large numbers of state parks on TOP of all the federal parks. Like literally, you can't throw a damn rock without hitting a park up here - and we maintain it all for our love of nature and for the nations future generations to share it.

*** The Feds employee some 17.7K employees in fields ranging from national park management to earthquake/tsunami watch employees, FBI, CIA, FAA, etc. (I heard on TV not to long ago that we hit 20K but I can't find an online reference for that.)

**** Note on Military - Nine military bases are in Alaska. Fort Wainwright, Elmendorf AFB, and Fort Richardson are the largest bases in Alaska, each averaging about 6,000 military personnel. Eielson AFB North Pole, CLEAR AF Base Denali, Fort Greely Fairbanks, ISC Kodiak CG, Marine Safty CG Valdez, USCG Juneau. Active duty 19.4K, Reserve 4.7K, Civilian support staff 5K. That's a solid 25% of our population being directly employed by the military.

The Army and the Air Force make up more than 75 percent of that military might. Most of the training operations prepare service members for operating in inhospitable winter climates whether on the ground or in the air. Missile defense and detection mission is a high priority for the Alaskan Soldiers and Airmen stationed there. Clear Air Force Station is one of many early detection centers for Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles (ICBM) coming over the pacific or the North Pole. The Coast Guard has a large presence in Alaska with a variety of missions along the coast line and in the Bering Sea. The Naval Special Warfare Detachment Kodiak is a tenant of the base and uses the training areas for Winter Warfare for Navy SEAL Training.

What the hell does this crap have to do with the OP's original question?

Ask Picaro, he's the one who brought it up. I just mentioned that Alaska voted third-party [and thus so can anyone else] ~shrug~

And of course you avoided answering. Why should the Feds be giving your state anything if it has a surplus, and is all 'libertarian and stuff'. Your state can't exist without Federal aid. Your problem is is people know too much about Alaska, not the other way around as you try to spin it, which is why the 'Libertarian Vote' there is so hilarious and hypocritical.

Hlaf the state business comes from a heavily subsidized and bennie ridden oil industry, but apparently Alaska doesn't like to include those in the calculation, same for the fishing industry, mining industry, etc, etc., all of which help keep that 'surplus' alive, along with military spending.