Why would a God even need a hell?

[Bruce_T_Laney]

I have asked myself why a God would need a hell, ( and by hell I mean the Christian version of it). I mean here this great being of life and love , is said to have created a place of eternal misery? And something is just not right with that, because it makes no sense at all. But a lot of things in religion make no sense, but religion rains on humanity, getting all of our consciousness wet in one manner or another.

My view of God, and I don't know God, have never seen him or heard his voice; is a view that I know is already distorted by many things; but I view him as merciful, loving, kind, forgiving, longsuffering, all the things that this Christian hell is not. So I don't think this hell is God's creation, I think the Christians created it. I think this eternal hell punishing is what Christians would do with unbelievers, not God. I think its moreso what the Christians want.

Why would God make an eternal monument out of evil? For what? Why would such a being of great power of change, co-exist with misery forever? Why? I can't see it. I think something is seriously wrong with this myopic view of hell! The powers that exist which can seduce the consciousness of humanity into believing nonsense, is simply stunning.

Simple answer:

Humans have free will and with this free will we have choices that will be judge at the end of our time, and during the judgment God will weigh our signs and if they are too heavy then hell is where we end up at to spend the rest of time learning from our mistake...

Again it is the Free Will part...

Now you can argue against my simplistic logic and tell me I have to be incorrect or that I am foolish to even write such nonsense but I am answering your question...

Without the Free Will humanity would not sin but with it we do and must be held accountable for our sins and what other punishment would be fitting for our failure to control our sinful nature than putting us in a place that would torture us for eternity?

 

[Mickiel]

I have asked myself why a God would need a hell, ( and by hell I mean the Christian version of it). I mean here this great being of life and love , is said to have created a place of eternal misery? And something is just not right with that, because it makes no sense at all. But a lot of things in religion make no sense, but religion rains on humanity, getting all of our consciousness wet in one manner or another.

My view of God, and I don't know God, have never seen him or heard his voice; is a view that I know is already distorted by many things; but I view him as merciful, loving, kind, forgiving, longsuffering, all the things that this Christian hell is not. So I don't think this hell is God's creation, I think the Christians created it. I think this eternal hell punishing is what Christians would do with unbelievers, not God. I think its moreso what the Christians want.

Why would God make an eternal monument out of evil? For what? Why would such a being of great power of change, co-exist with misery forever? Why? I can't see it. I think something is seriously wrong with this myopic view of hell! The powers that exist which can seduce the consciousness of humanity into believing nonsense, is simply stunning.

Simple answer:

Humans have free will and with this free will we have choices that will be judge at the end of our time, and during the judgment God will weigh our signs and if they are too heavy then hell is where we end up at to spend the rest of time learning from our mistake...

Again it is the Free Will part...

Now you can argue against my simplistic logic and tell me I have to be incorrect or that I am foolish to even write such nonsense but I am answering your question...

Without the Free Will humanity would not sin but with it we do and must be held accountable for our sins and what other punishment would be fitting for our failure to control our sinful nature than putting us in a place that would torture us for eternity?

The Christian beliefs are stunning, they actually think that God believes human will to be more important than life itself; they think God would let his children be stupid enough to choose their own fate to be eternal torture ; stunning what deception can do to the human rationale.

They actually think God would allow a human to live in eternity while being punished every single second for 77 thousand years, plus, 54 million more years, plus, 90 billion more years of this incredible torture, plus, another 6,999,873 trillion more years, plus, ten thousand more years of this insane continual hurting of humans, just to assure them of having a free will to choose this, plus another 33,975 billion more years, then the process begins all over again and repeats itself for all of infinity.

You had better hope that God is nothing like Christianity.

 

[hadit]

Not according to Scripture, we don't.

We all have sinned, but all that sin is laid on Christ, Is. 53:6. In Is. 45:23 God swears to save everyone; no religion can stop him.

You still haven't dealt with all those Scriptures I posted where God clearly rejects people. Until you do that, you won't convince anyone.

Answer this one. If there is no need to do so, why are we commanded to repent and be baptized?

Even Jesus said that no one is lost but the one consigned to destruction because scripture must be fulfilled.

That potentially could add up to a lot of people.

Would you be referring to this passage in John 17?

11 I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of[a] your name, the name you gave me, so that they may be one as we are one. 12 While I was with them, I protected them and kept them safe by that name you gave me. None has been lost except the one doomed to destruction so that Scripture would be fulfilled.

13 “I am coming to you now, but I say these things while I am still in the world, so that they may have the full measure of my joy within them.

I do believe He was referring to His disciples, and the one that was lost was Judas.

T have never read a scripture that claims Judas will not be saved.

Other than the quote I posted from Jesus Himself, you mean.

 

[hadit]

I have asked myself why a God would need a hell, ( and by hell I mean the Christian version of it). I mean here this great being of life and love , is said to have created a place of eternal misery? And something is just not right with that, because it makes no sense at all. But a lot of things in religion make no sense, but religion rains on humanity, getting all of our consciousness wet in one manner or another.

My view of God, and I don't know God, have never seen him or heard his voice; is a view that I know is already distorted by many things; but I view him as merciful, loving, kind, forgiving, longsuffering, all the things that this Christian hell is not. So I don't think this hell is God's creation, I think the Christians created it. I think this eternal hell punishing is what Christians would do with unbelievers, not God. I think its moreso what the Christians want.

Why would God make an eternal monument out of evil? For what? Why would such a being of great power of change, co-exist with misery forever? Why? I can't see it. I think something is seriously wrong with this myopic view of hell! The powers that exist which can seduce the consciousness of humanity into believing nonsense, is simply stunning.

Simple answer:

Humans have free will and with this free will we have choices that will be judge at the end of our time, and during the judgment God will weigh our signs and if they are too heavy then hell is where we end up at to spend the rest of time learning from our mistake...

Again it is the Free Will part...

Now you can argue against my simplistic logic and tell me I have to be incorrect or that I am foolish to even write such nonsense but I am answering your question...

Without the Free Will humanity would not sin but with it we do and must be held accountable for our sins and what other punishment would be fitting for our failure to control our sinful nature than putting us in a place that would torture us for eternity?

The Christian beliefs are stunning, they actually think that God believes human will to be more important than life itself; they think God would let his children be stupid enough to choose their own fate to be eternal torture ; stunning what deception can do to the human rationale.

They actually think God would allow a human to live in eternity while being punished every single second for 77 thousand years, plus, 54 million more years, plus, 90 billion more years of this incredible torture, plus, another 6,999,873 trillion more years, plus, ten thousand more years of this insane continual hurting of humans, just to assure them of having a free will to choose this, plus another 33,975 billion more years, then the process begins all over again and repeats itself for all of infinity.

You had better hope that God is nothing like Christianity.

If you want to use Scripture to bolster that viewpoint, you have to deal with the Scripture that says it's full of holes.

 

[hadit]

Mark 3:28 , again Jesus teaching, " ALL sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men." All of them, in 1 John 3:5 Jesus took all sin away, no Christian can bring any of them back and try to condemn someone.

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..

Now this so called " unforgivable sin", sinning against the Holy Spirit, there are exactly zero example of just how to do that given in scripture; so in my view, its impossible for a person to do it.

Your just going to have to find another way to condemn.

Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

 

[hobelim]

Christ came to seek and save every jackass and dick in this world; Luke 19:9; and he did it free of charge; we don't have to qualify, we don't have to race, we don't have to be approved by people like you;

its just a done deal.

How many of you are there?

 

[hobelim]

Mark 3:28 , again Jesus teaching, " ALL sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men." All of them, in 1 John 3:5 Jesus took all sin away, no Christian can bring any of them back and try to condemn someone.

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..

Now this so called " unforgivable sin", sinning against the Holy Spirit, there are exactly zero example of just how to do that given in scripture; so in my view, its impossible for a person to do it.

Your just going to have to find another way to condemn.

Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

I pretty much agree. According to scripture many people are just abandoned to their folly, this OP being a case in point. He denies the existence of hell without realizing that he is already in it. For as long as he lacks the awareness that he has already received the penalty for perjuring himself in the name of God repentance is impossible and consequently forgiveness and salvation will remain out of his reach.

To anyone whose mind has been defiled by what is false, reality itself is like a consuming fire that will never go out. When what a person professes to believe is contradicted by reality and refuted by their own conscience day and night, life itself is hell.

 

[Mickiel]

Mark 3:28 , again Jesus teaching, " ALL sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men." All of them, in 1 John 3:5 Jesus took all sin away, no Christian can bring any of them back and try to condemn someone.

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..

Now this so called " unforgivable sin", sinning against the Holy Spirit, there are exactly zero example of just how to do that given in scripture; so in my view, its impossible for a person to do it.

Your just going to have to find another way to condemn.

Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

Qute

Repentance is granted BY GOD, it is not worked up in the human by the Romans 2.;4 the Goodness of God leads you to repent.

 

[Mickiel]

Mark 3:28 , again Jesus teaching, " ALL sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men." All of them, in 1 John 3:5 Jesus took all sin away, no Christian can bring any of them back and try to condemn someone.

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..

Now this so called " unforgivable sin", sinning against the Holy Spirit, there are exactly zero example of just how to do that given in scripture; so in my view, its impossible for a person to do it.

Your just going to have to find another way to condemn.

Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

Repentance is- necessary for forgives. The Apostle Paul did not repent, he was forced to do Gods will. He was not givin a choice.


Repentance is not necessary for forgiveness, Paul and Moses did not repent, they were just told what to do. They had no choice. Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

 

[Mickiel]

Christ came to seek and save every jackass and dick in this world; Luke 19:9; and he did it free of charge; we don't have to qualify, we don't have to race, we don't have to be approved by people like you;

its just a done deal.

How many of you are there?

Only one,

 

[hobelim]

Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

Jesus submitted to the baptism of John which was done as a token of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. Then "the heavens opened up" to him.

Are you just making this up as you go along?

 

[Mickiel]

Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

Jesus submitted to the baptism of John which was done as a token of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. Then "the heavens opened up" to him.

Are you just making this up as you go along?

Lets look at that In John 29-32 John see Jesus coming and says, : Behold the L:amb of God who takes away the sins of the WORLD." ( and no Christian doctrine of condemnation can bring any of those sins back), John called Jesus the man to come after him. Then John saw the Spirit descending from heaven and it " Abode on him", meaning " It Stayed with him" The Spirit " Remained" with Jesus; stayed in him the rest of his life. Then it says that Jesus will baptize people with the Holy Ghost, not water. So Jesus is even changing baptism here.

 

[hobelim]

Lets look at that In John 29-32 John see Jesus coming and says, : Behold the L:amb of God who takes away the sins of the WORLD." ( and no Christian doctrine of condemnation can bring any of those sins back),

Sin is disobedience to the law. Jesus did away with sin by teaching the only right way to understand and conform to the hidden subjects of the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of eternal life for compliance effectively removing the burden of the law which is the death consequent for failure to fulfill the laws demands only for those who receive his teaching and do it..

Unless you eat his flesh(receive his teaching) and do it, (drink his blood) you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you.




BTW, if Jesus took away the sins of the world in some other way, how is it that you identify yourself as a sinner?

 

[Mickiel]

Lets look at that In John 29-32 John see Jesus coming and says, : Behold the L:amb of God who takes away the sins of the WORLD." ( and no Christian doctrine of condemnation can bring any of those sins back),

Sin is disobedience to the law. Jesus did away with sin by teaching the only right way to understand and conform to the hidden subjects of the law that leads to the fulfillment of the promise of eternal life for compliance effectively removing the burden of the law which is the death consequent for failure to fulfill the laws demands only for those who receive his teaching and do it..

Unless you eat his flesh(receive his teaching) and do it, (drink his blood) you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you.quote





Well I am what I am , Jesus took away my sin, meaning he took on himself the penalty for my sins , and I am no longer guilty in Gods sight; but I am still a sinner. In 1John 2:13, Jesus came into the world to save sinners, so he came for people like me; Jesus said he came NOT to call the ritghteous , but to " CALL" sinners to repentance; so the calling of Christ is not focused on Christian or believers. Its on unrepentant unbeleivers.

Quote
BTW, if Jesus took away the sins of the world in some other way, how is it that you identify yourself as a sinner?

Because I still sin. I just have an Advocate with the Father; he and Christ are always ready to forgive

 

[hadit]

Mark 3:28 , again Jesus teaching, " ALL sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men." All of them, in 1 John 3:5 Jesus took all sin away, no Christian can bring any of them back and try to condemn someone.

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..

Now this so called " unforgivable sin", sinning against the Holy Spirit, there are exactly zero example of just how to do that given in scripture; so in my view, its impossible for a person to do it.

Your just going to have to find another way to condemn.

Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

Repentance is- necessary for forgives. The Apostle Paul did not repent, he was forced to do Gods will. He was not givin a choice.


Repentance is not necessary for forgiveness, Paul and Moses did not repent, they were just told what to do. They had no choice. Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

On the contrary, Paul DID repent. Remember when he faced the glorified Christ, who asked him why did Saul persecute Him. In order to become what Christ wanted him to be, Saul had to stop doing what he was doing because it was wrong. That is repentance. Moses faced consequences for his sin, as he was forbidden to enter the promised land. Jesus didn't have to repent, because He was sinless. He did what the Father wanted because He chose to do so. How well do you really know the Scriptures if you continue to ignore their entire thrust, which is that man has sinned and needs to repent? Again, deal with the White Throne Judgement.

 

[Mickiel]

Mark 3:28 , again Jesus teaching, " ALL sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men." All of them, in 1 John 3:5 Jesus took all sin away, no Christian can bring any of them back and try to condemn someone.

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..

Now this so called " unforgivable sin", sinning against the Holy Spirit, there are exactly zero example of just how to do that given in scripture; so in my view, its impossible for a person to do it.

Your just going to have to find another way to condemn.

Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

Repentance is- necessary for forgives. The Apostle Paul did not repent, he was forced to do Gods will. He was not givin a choice.


Repentance is not necessary for forgiveness, Paul and Moses did not repent, they were just told what to do. They had no choice. Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

On the contrary, Paul DID repent. Remember when he faced the glorified Christ, who asked him why did Saul persecute Him. In order to become what Christ wanted him to be, Saul had to stop doing what he was doing because it was wrong. That is repentance. Moses faced consequences for his sin, as he was forbidden to enter the promised land. Jesus didn't have to repent, because He was sinless. He did what the Father wanted because He chose to do so. How well do you really know the Scriptures if you continue to ignore their entire thrust, which is that man has sinned and needs to repent? Again, deal with the White Throne Judgement.

Paul did not repent, Notice what really happened in Acts 9:1-6 Paul was going about killing Christians and threatening those he did not kill. He was traveling and as he neared Damascus, a bright light from heaven knocked him down. It also blinded him. All Jesus did was ask Paul why is he persecuting him? Paul was scared to death, and asked Jesus what will he have him to do, and Jesus simply told him what to do; and he has been telling him what to do ever since. Paul did not repent, he did not fight, he did not argue, he simply did what all others that God and Christ speak to does; he did like he was told; he was given absolutely no choices.

That is what REALLY happens when God communicates with humans, they do as they are told; angels do as they are told, demons do as they are told; There are no choices with God; you either do what you are told, or you risk never doing anything ever again;

Welcome to reality; hello!

 

[hadit]

Mark 3:28 , again Jesus teaching, " ALL sins and blasphemies shall be forgiven men." All of them, in 1 John 3:5 Jesus took all sin away, no Christian can bring any of them back and try to condemn someone.

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..

Now this so called " unforgivable sin", sinning against the Holy Spirit, there are exactly zero example of just how to do that given in scripture; so in my view, its impossible for a person to do it.

Your just going to have to find another way to condemn.

Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

Repentance is- necessary for forgives. The Apostle Paul did not repent, he was forced to do Gods will. He was not givin a choice.


Repentance is not necessary for forgiveness, Paul and Moses did not repent, they were just told what to do. They had no choice. Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

On the contrary, Paul DID repent. Remember when he faced the glorified Christ, who asked him why did Saul persecute Him. In order to become what Christ wanted him to be, Saul had to stop doing what he was doing because it was wrong. That is repentance. Moses faced consequences for his sin, as he was forbidden to enter the promised land. Jesus didn't have to repent, because He was sinless. He did what the Father wanted because He chose to do so. How well do you really know the Scriptures if you continue to ignore their entire thrust, which is that man has sinned and needs to repent? Again, deal with the White Throne Judgement.

Paul did not repent, Notice what really happened in Acts 9:1-6 Paul was going about killing Christians and threatening those he did not kill. He was traveling and as he neared Damascus, a bright light from heaven knocked him down. It also blinded him. All Jesus did was ask Paul why is he persecuting him? Paul was scared to death, and asked Jesus what will he have him to do, and Jesus simply told him what to do; and he has been telling him what to do ever since. Paul did not repent, he did not fight, he did not argue, he simply did what all others that God and Christ speak to does; he did like he was told; he was given absolutely no choices.

That is what REALLY happens when God communicates with humans, they do as they are told; angels do as they are told, demons do as they are told; There are no choices with God; you either do what you are told, or you risk never doing anything ever again;

Welcome to reality; hello!

You said, "you risk never doing anything ever again". That should give you pause, because it contradicts your ever so certain claim that all will be saved, no matter what.

Deal with the White Throne Judgement. The more you ignore it, the more certain I will be that you have no intention of honoring Scripture, but only want that which agrees with you.

 

[Mickiel]

It says in 1 John 3:5 that Jesus came to do away with sin. Then it says that he who continues to sin is a child of the devil. If there was no such thing as sin, how can anyone continue to be a sinner? As 1John 3:4 says, sin is disobedience to the law. The only way that Jesus did away with sin is by teaching the right way to understand and comply with the law that leads to eternal life. If you do not do it, you cannot have the life promised for obedience to the law in you and are not saved from the consequences for failure to comply with the will of God..


Jesus didn't seem to mind people calling him crazy, a drunk, a liar, whatever. What he said was unforgivable was people saying that the source of his inspiration, God, was evil.

I'm not trying to condemn anyone. According to Jesus to deride a revelation of truth from God as evil can never be forgiven.

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

Repentance is- necessary for forgives. The Apostle Paul did not repent, he was forced to do Gods will. He was not givin a choice.


Repentance is not necessary for forgiveness, Paul and Moses did not repent, they were just told what to do. They had no choice. Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

On the contrary, Paul DID repent. Remember when he faced the glorified Christ, who asked him why did Saul persecute Him. In order to become what Christ wanted him to be, Saul had to stop doing what he was doing because it was wrong. That is repentance. Moses faced consequences for his sin, as he was forbidden to enter the promised land. Jesus didn't have to repent, because He was sinless. He did what the Father wanted because He chose to do so. How well do you really know the Scriptures if you continue to ignore their entire thrust, which is that man has sinned and needs to repent? Again, deal with the White Throne Judgement.

Paul did not repent, Notice what really happened in Acts 9:1-6 Paul was going about killing Christians and threatening those he did not kill. He was traveling and as he neared Damascus, a bright light from heaven knocked him down. It also blinded him. All Jesus did was ask Paul why is he persecuting him? Paul was scared to death, and asked Jesus what will he have him to do, and Jesus simply told him what to do; and he has been telling him what to do ever since. Paul did not repent, he did not fight, he did not argue, he simply did what all others that God and Christ speak to does; he did like he was told; he was given absolutely no choices.

That is what REALLY happens when God communicates with humans, they do as they are told; angels do as they are told, demons do as they are told; There are no choices with God; you either do what you are told, or you risk never doing anything ever again;

Welcome to reality; hello!

You said, "you risk never doing anything ever again". That should give you pause, because it contradicts your ever so certain claim that all will be saved, no matter what.

Deal with the White Throne Judgement. The more you ignore it, the more certain I will be that you have no intention of honoring Scripture, but only want that which agrees with you.

I think a person can be saved, and given nothing to do in the Kingdom; they just have to go outside of the gates and hope to be involved there. I did not say God would kill them.

As far as the Great White Throne Judgment, God will not judge humans there. In John 5:22 Jesus said the Father will judge no human, but GAVE ALL judgment to him. In John 17:2 Jesus also taught that the Father GAVE him power over ALL humans, to literally GIVE them ALL eternal life. Unlike Christians, Jesus will GIVE ALL humans that free eternal life, without cost.

Deal with that, and see if you can still condemn a human after reading this stunning truth.

 

[hobelim]

I think a person can be saved, and given nothing to do in the Kingdom; they just have to go outside of the gates and hope to be involved there.

When a person receives an invitation to a black tie event but shows up dressed in filthy rags and reeking of vomit they do not get to enter, and they do not get to hang around, they are banned by the doorman, escorted off the premises, and thrown out into the darkness where there is wailing and gnashing of teeth.

 

[hadit]

You cannot repent of sin unless you are convicted of sin. Conviction comes through the action of the Holy Spirit. If God stops convicting you, you cannot repent and be forgiven. Repentence is necessary for forgiveness.

Repentance is- necessary for forgives. The Apostle Paul did not repent, he was forced to do Gods will. He was not givin a choice.


Repentance is not necessary for forgiveness, Paul and Moses did not repent, they were just told what to do. They had no choice. Jesus. never repented.. Jesus nad no free will choices. He came to do Gods will, not his own.

On the contrary, Paul DID repent. Remember when he faced the glorified Christ, who asked him why did Saul persecute Him. In order to become what Christ wanted him to be, Saul had to stop doing what he was doing because it was wrong. That is repentance. Moses faced consequences for his sin, as he was forbidden to enter the promised land. Jesus didn't have to repent, because He was sinless. He did what the Father wanted because He chose to do so. How well do you really know the Scriptures if you continue to ignore their entire thrust, which is that man has sinned and needs to repent? Again, deal with the White Throne Judgement.

Paul did not repent, Notice what really happened in Acts 9:1-6 Paul was going about killing Christians and threatening those he did not kill. He was traveling and as he neared Damascus, a bright light from heaven knocked him down. It also blinded him. All Jesus did was ask Paul why is he persecuting him? Paul was scared to death, and asked Jesus what will he have him to do, and Jesus simply told him what to do; and he has been telling him what to do ever since. Paul did not repent, he did not fight, he did not argue, he simply did what all others that God and Christ speak to does; he did like he was told; he was given absolutely no choices.

That is what REALLY happens when God communicates with humans, they do as they are told; angels do as they are told, demons do as they are told; There are no choices with God; you either do what you are told, or you risk never doing anything ever again;

Welcome to reality; hello!

You said, "you risk never doing anything ever again". That should give you pause, because it contradicts your ever so certain claim that all will be saved, no matter what.

Deal with the White Throne Judgement. The more you ignore it, the more certain I will be that you have no intention of honoring Scripture, but only want that which agrees with you.

I think a person can be saved, and given nothing to do in the Kingdom; they just have to go outside of the gates and hope to be involved there. I did not say God would kill them.

As far as the Great White Throne Judgment, God will not judge humans there. In John 5:22 Jesus said the Father will judge no human, but GAVE ALL judgment to him. In John 17:2 Jesus also taught that the Father GAVE him power over ALL humans, to literally GIVE them ALL eternal life. Unlike Christians, Jesus will GIVE ALL humans that free eternal life, without cost.

Deal with that, and see if you can still condemn a human after reading this stunning truth.

I'm sorry, but you simply cannot come to that conclusion after actually reading this:

11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. The earth and the heavens fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

I do not condemn anyone. It is the Word of God that makes it clear all will be judged, and some will be condemned. It is not my job to condemn, but rather to warn and show the way out. No one need be condemned, but many will be. Remember this that Jesus HIMSELF said -

Luke 13:

23 Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”

He said to them, 24 “Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25 Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’

“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’

It doesn't get any clearer than that.