Words are cheap, Jane Fonda

[konradv]

Reagan's dead and Fonda won't be soon enough

The world owes Ronald Reagan a debt of gratitude; he won the Cold War and saved untold generations from slavery.

Ronnie got lucky that he had someone like Gorbachev in the Kremlin. If he'd tried his agenda on the old-time hardliners, we could have had WW III. In actuality the winning of the Cold War was a 45 year effort by people of both parties. Why not credit Carter? He really got the ball rolling by supporting Afghan freedom fighters and getting the Soviets embroiled in their own Viet Nam. All Reagan-Bush did was ignore the country after the Soviets left, allowing the Taliban anf the Al Qaeda to take root. Gee thanks, Ronnie!!!

 

[JakeStarkey]

Whether the war is declared or not, the men and women our country send to fight it are at just as much risk, bleed blood that is just as red, lose limbs and eyes just as horribly, and die just as dead. Their families are just as stressed and just as grieved.

ANYBODY who puts them at greater risk by consoling and encouraging the enemy is their enemy and my enemy. And traitor seems to be an apt characterization.

I have no doubt that is true. However, unless war is declared, Fonda did not commit treason.

 

[Sallow]

Reagan's dead and Fonda won't be soon enough

The world owes Ronald Reagan a debt of gratitude; he won the Cold War and saved untold generations from slavery.

Ronnie got lucky that he had someone like Gorbachev in the Kremlin. If he'd tried his agenda on the old-time hardliners, we could have had WW III. In actuality the winning of the Cold War was a 45 year effort by people of both parties. Why not credit Carter? He really got the ball rolling by supporting Afghan freedom fighters and getting the Soviets embroiled in their own Viet Nam. All Reagan-Bush did was ignore the country after the Soviets left, allowing the Taliban anf the Al Qaeda to take root. Gee thanks, Ronnie!!!

The Wheat embargo had a far worse effect.

Carter's support was for harrassment. Ronald Reagan and George HW Bush upped that support by a huge magnitude and wanted to get the Russians expelled from Afghanistan.

 

[Foxfyre]

Whether the war is declared or not, the men and women our country send to fight it are at just as much risk, bleed blood that is just as red, lose limbs and eyes just as horribly, and die just as dead. Their families are just as stressed and just as grieved.

ANYBODY who puts them at greater risk by consoling and encouraging the enemy is their enemy and my enemy. And traitor seems to be an apt characterization.

I have no doubt that is true. However, unless war is declared, Fonda did not commit treason.

trea·son
–noun
1. the offense of acting to overthrow one's government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
2. a violation of allegiance to one's sovereign or to one's state.
3. the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.

Source: Dictonary.com

And the legal definition:

TREASON
This word imports a betraying, treachery, or breach of allegiance.

The Constitution of the United States, Art. III, defines treason against the United States to consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid or comfort. This offence is punished with death. By the same article of the Constitution, no person shall be convicted of treason, unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court.
http://www.lectlaw.com/def2/t103.htm

I don't see anything in that to suggest that a war has to be declared in order to commit treason. I am pretty sure there is nothing in U.S. law to suggest that either.

 

[Warrior102]

Has John Kerry been brought up yet?

If not - he should.

Woops - I just did.

 

[Sallow]

Whether the war is declared or not, the men and women our country send to fight it are at just as much risk, bleed blood that is just as red, lose limbs and eyes just as horribly, and die just as dead. Their families are just as stressed and just as grieved.

ANYBODY who puts them at greater risk by consoling and encouraging the enemy is their enemy and my enemy. And traitor seems to be an apt characterization.

I have no doubt that is true. However, unless war is declared, Fonda did not commit treason.

trea·son
–noun
1. the offense of acting to overthrow one's government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
2. a violation of allegiance to one's sovereign or to one's state.
3. the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.

Source: Dictonary.com

And the legal definition:

TREASON
This word imports a betraying, treachery, or breach of allegiance.

The Constitution of the United States, Art. III, defines treason against the United States to consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid or comfort. This offence is punished with death. By the same article of the Constitution, no person shall be convicted of treason, unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court.
Legal Definition of Treason

I don't see anything in that to suggest that a war has to be declared in order to commit treason. I am pretty sure there is nothing in U.S. law to suggest that either.

Reagan fulfilled 2 and 3 of your definition. Does he qualify too?

 

[JakeStarkey]

Whether the war is declared or not, the men and women our country send to fight it are at just as much risk, bleed blood that is just as red, lose limbs and eyes just as horribly, and die just as dead. Their families are just as stressed and just as grieved.

ANYBODY who puts them at greater risk by consoling and encouraging the enemy is their enemy and my enemy. And traitor seems to be an apt characterization.

I have no doubt that is true. However, unless war is declared, Fonda did not commit treason.

trea·son
–noun
1. the offense of acting to overthrow one's government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
2. a violation of allegiance to one's sovereign or to one's state.
3. the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.

Source: Dictonary.com

And the legal definition:

TREASON
This word imports a betraying, treachery, or breach of allegiance.

The Constitution of the United States, Art. III, defines treason against the United States to consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid or comfort. This offence is punished with death. By the same article of the Constitution, no person shall be convicted of treason, unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court.
Legal Definition of Treason

I don't see anything in that to suggest that a war has to be declared in order to commit treason. I am pretty sure there is nothing in U.S. law to suggest that either.

Are you talking about the War clause in the Constitution? Yes, you are. Sustained.

 

[Warrior102]

Get a life! WTF care about what jane Fonda says?

What are you? Like 16? Some of us are older and don't pretend the only important stuff that happens occurred today. We remember good and well the incredible damage this TRAITOR did to the morale of our soldiers and to this nation during wartime. She was a major player in getting other people to do awful things to returning vets -people who were DRAFTED and not even there by choice but met upon their return with jeers, thrown bottles (a lefty favorite anytime) and being spit upon. Fucking bitch. Hope she rots in hell and she absolutely should go down in history books as the traitor she is. This female, when asked about the fact that after getting her way and being instrumental in destroying support for the war and following the withdrawal of US forces - 4 MILLION civilians were slaughtered by the communists -responded by saying it wasn't important because we shouldn't have been there at all. God save me from ever being the cold-hearted, inhumane monster that Jane Fonda is that I could EVER just dismiss out of hand as UNIMPORTANT the fact 4 MILLION people were murdered, much less murdered after I played such a pivotal role in the sequence of events that resulted in those murders.

Jane Fonda should never have been able to get a good night's sleep for the rest of her life -but that presumes the bitch has a conscience. And she doesn't. She has stated numerous times she has no regrets about what she did -or the fact it resulted in the mass murder of 4 MILLION people.

No they weren't. They were "slaughtered" by Americans.

Like this Conservative hero..

Lt. Calley.

William Calley - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
My Lai Massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

America commited a war crime and a genocide in Vietnam. There is no way around that.

Calley's men herded people into ditches and machined gunned them to death. They gang raped little girls. And he got away with the whole thing. It wasn't an isolated incident either.

Is this the fault of our troops? Not at all. They were poorly commanded by people in Washington. And they were pawns in a massive bloody crime of epic proportions.

Are Conservatives mad at this at all? Absolutely not. In fact..they did it again in Iraq. While the atrocities were kept to a minimum..it was a war crime nonetheless.

Lt. Calley was a conservative hero? Where did you get that revelation.

Having personally served 20+ years in the military - Lt. Calley, if he was to be judged on his political position - would be tagged as a Liberal.

Inexperienced, his men had no respect for him, snot-nosed college puke with no military bearing, hated universally. Sounds Liberal to me.

This is the type of "officer" real Americans in the field would frag, with smiles on their faces.

 

[Foxfyre]

I have no doubt that is true. However, unless war is declared, Fonda did not commit treason.

Source: Dictonary.com

And the legal definition:

TREASON
This word imports a betraying, treachery, or breach of allegiance.

The Constitution of the United States, Art. III, defines treason against the United States to consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid or comfort. This offence is punished with death. By the same article of the Constitution, no person shall be convicted of treason, unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court.
Legal Definition of Treason

I don't see anything in that to suggest that a war has to be declared in order to commit treason. I am pretty sure there is nothing in U.S. law to suggest that either.

Are you talking about the War clause in the Constitution? Yes, you are. Sustained.

Jakey, God love you, I can't tell if you are conceding the point or think you have disputed it.

 

[Sallow]

What are you? Like 16? Some of us are older and don't pretend the only important stuff that happens occurred today. We remember good and well the incredible damage this TRAITOR did to the morale of our soldiers and to this nation during wartime. She was a major player in getting other people to do awful things to returning vets -people who were DRAFTED and not even there by choice but met upon their return with jeers, thrown bottles (a lefty favorite anytime) and being spit upon. Fucking bitch. Hope she rots in hell and she absolutely should go down in history books as the traitor she is. This female, when asked about the fact that after getting her way and being instrumental in destroying support for the war and following the withdrawal of US forces - 4 MILLION civilians were slaughtered by the communists -responded by saying it wasn't important because we shouldn't have been there at all. God save me from ever being the cold-hearted, inhumane monster that Jane Fonda is that I could EVER just dismiss out of hand as UNIMPORTANT the fact 4 MILLION people were murdered, much less murdered after I played such a pivotal role in the sequence of events that resulted in those murders.

Jane Fonda should never have been able to get a good night's sleep for the rest of her life -but that presumes the bitch has a conscience. And she doesn't. She has stated numerous times she has no regrets about what she did -or the fact it resulted in the mass murder of 4 MILLION people.

No they weren't. They were "slaughtered" by Americans.

Like this Conservative hero..

Lt. Calley.

William Calley - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
My Lai Massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

America commited a war crime and a genocide in Vietnam. There is no way around that.

Calley's men herded people into ditches and machined gunned them to death. They gang raped little girls. And he got away with the whole thing. It wasn't an isolated incident either.

Is this the fault of our troops? Not at all. They were poorly commanded by people in Washington. And they were pawns in a massive bloody crime of epic proportions.

Are Conservatives mad at this at all? Absolutely not. In fact..they did it again in Iraq. While the atrocities were kept to a minimum..it was a war crime nonetheless.

Lt. Calley was a conservative hero? Where did you get that revelation.

Having personally served 20+ years in the military - Lt. Calley, if he was to be judged on his political position - would be tagged as a Liberal.

Inexperienced, his men had no respect for him, snot-nosed college puke with no military bearing, hated universally. Sounds Liberal to me.

This is the type of "officer" real Americans in the field would frag, with smiles on their faces.

Nixon basically got his ass out of the fire.

Did you read Calley's biography?

William Calley was born in Miami, Florida. His father was a United States Navy veteran of World War II. Calley graduated from Miami Edison High School in Miami and then attended Palm Beach Junior College in 1963. He dropped out in 1964 after receiving unsatisfactory grades, consisting of two Cs, one D, and four Fs.[3] Calley then worked at a variety of jobs, including as a bellhop, dishwasher, salesman, insurance appraiser and train conductor.[4] While living in San Francisco in 1966, Calley received a letter from the Selective Service board requesting reevaluation of his medical condition. While attempting to return to Miami, his car broke down in Albuquerque, New Mexico, where Calley then reported to a recruiting official, enlisting in the U.S. Army on July 26, 1966.[4]

Later in 1974, President Nixon tacitly issued Calley a limited Presidential Pardon. Consequently, his general court-martial conviction and dismissal from the U.S. Army were upheld, however, the prison sentence and subsequent parole obligations were commuted to time served, leaving Calley a free man.[14]

Sometime in 2005 or 2006, Calley divorced his wife Penny, whose father had employed him at the V.V. Vick jewelry store in Columbus since 1975, and moved to downtown Atlanta to live with his son, William Laws Calley III.[15] In October 2007, Calley agreed to be interviewed by the UK newspaper the Daily Mail to discuss the massacre, saying, "Meet me in the lobby of the nearest bank at opening time tomorrow, and give me a certified check for $25,000, then I'll talk to you for precisely one hour."[16] When the journalist "showed up at the appointed hour, armed not with a check but a list of questions," Calley left.

Military family..dropped out of college..followed orders without question..pardoned by Nixon and ultimately wanting to profit..

Sounds pretty conservative to me.

 

[hortysir]

And that's all that needs to be said.

Bears repeating!

Makes one wonder if one needs to be rude to be heard!

Naah...
They hear it.
It interferes with their reality, s'all

 

[José]

Originally posted by wayne
Also, democratic elections in a communist country, what an oxymoron.

Since when a political leader has to be democratic to enjoy massive support from his people?

Washington, Jefferson, etc... created a racial dictatorship in North America that waged war against the native people of the continent, kept part of the population enslaved and restricted the right to vote to less than 10% of its citizens.

Despite being a bunch of racist, classist and sexist jerks they were the true heroes of the US independence and the legitimate political leaders of the new nation.

Any puppet state created by Britain and "headed" by loyalists equivalent to South Vietnam would be flatly rejected by the american people.

The people of Vietnam couldn't care less if Ho was a capitalist, a comunist or a feudalist. He was the greatest hero of Vietnam's struggle against French and Japanese colonial rule and that was all that counted for them.

 

[Patrick2]

Let's get to Sanity Island and up on Reality Rock.

No declared war? No treason.

A person who talks about "reality" suggests that the vietnam war wasn't a war.

 

[Patrick2]

Reagan's dead and Fonda won't be soon enough

The world owes Ronald Reagan a debt of gratitude; he won the Cold War and saved untold generations from slavery.

He committed Treason, violated the United States Constitution, plunged this nation into massive debt, fostered several government bailouts, and "won" the Cold War by bribing the Soviets.

You've truly taken leave of your senses.

 

[Dr Grump]

Get a life! WTF care about what jane Fonda says?

What are you? Like 16? Some of us are older and don't pretend the only important stuff that happens occurred today. We remember good and well the incredible damage this TRAITOR did to the morale of our soldiers and to this nation during wartime. She was a major player in getting other people to do awful things to returning vets -people who were DRAFTED and not even there by choice but met upon their return with jeers, thrown bottles (a lefty favorite anytime) and being spit upon. Fucking bitch. Hope she rots in hell and she absolutely should go down in history books as the traitor she is. This female, when asked about the fact that after getting her way and being instrumental in destroying support for the war and following the withdrawal of US forces - 4 MILLION civilians were slaughtered by the communists -responded by saying it wasn't important because we shouldn't have been there at all. God save me from ever being the cold-hearted, inhumane monster that Jane Fonda is that I could EVER just dismiss out of hand as UNIMPORTANT the fact 4 MILLION people were murdered, much less murdered after I played such a pivotal role in the sequence of events that resulted in those murders.

Jane Fonda should never have been able to get a good night's sleep for the rest of her life -but that presumes the bitch has a conscience. And she doesn't. She has stated numerous times she has no regrets about what she did -or the fact it resulted in the mass murder of 4 MILLION people.

Talk about a drama queen..

Now she is responsible for 4 million deaths...

Some people just shouldn't be allowed to vote...

 

[Dr Grump]

Whether the war is declared or not, the men and women our country send to fight it are at just as much risk, bleed blood that is just as red, lose limbs and eyes just as horribly, and die just as dead. Their families are just as stressed and just as grieved.

ANYBODY who puts them at greater risk by consoling and encouraging the enemy is their enemy and my enemy. And traitor seems to be an apt characterization.

But that doesn't apply to Fonda..

 

[logical4u]

Jane Fonda writes that a planned Saturday appearance on QVC was canceled by the shopping network after viewers complained, citing Fonda's political statements during the Vietnam War. Fonda was scheduled to promote her aging-with-spirit book "Prime Time: Making the Most of Your Life," due out Aug. 9.

On her website, Fonda writes:

The network said they got a lot of calls yesterday criticizing me for my opposition to the Vietnam War and threatening to boycott the show if I was allowed to appear. I am, to say the least, deeply disappointed that QVC caved to this kind of insane pressure by some well funded and organized political extremist groups...Most people don’t buy into the far right lies.

Jane Fonda's QVC appearance pulled over Vietnam, she says - latimes.com

That is ironic that QVC caved to same techniques she was "trying" to apply and did apply during Vietnam. I guess she showed her anti-fans how to do it.

 

[tinydancer]

I could never understand rich left wing born with a silver spoon in their mouths and always had it easy liberals fascination with communism. Hanoi Jane is just one of so many. Ayers father was a CEO. Dohrn grew up in an upper middle class family.

Ted Turner who absolutely admires Castro to death was born with a silver spoon in his mouth. The list of left wing maniacs who came from wealthy families is endless.

Truly strange.

Edit to add: Hanoi Jane was a true believer in communism.

 

[José]

Originally posted by tinydancer
I could never understand rich left wing born with a silver spoon in their mouths and always had it easy liberals fascination with communism.

I feel your pain.

I could never understand what's wrong with the idea that the right place for american soldiers who engage in unjust wars of agression is six feet below the ground with a bullet in the head.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Let's get to Sanity Island and up on Reality Rock. No declared war? No treason.

A person who talks about "reality" suggests that the vietnam war wasn't a war.

This from a couch ranger, oh my. Pat, you are just ignorant, not stupid. You are biased, you can't evaluate. OK. Vietnam was not a "declared" war in the sense of the Constitution's requirements. Go back and read the Tonkin Gulf Resolution. Compare it to the declarations by Congress in WWI and WWII. Then tell us how wrong you are. Sheesh.