"You didn't get there on your own"

[Vast LWC]

I personally did not see it as Obama taking clain for anything.

I did, however, see it as Obama taking away form business owners the satisdfaction of knoiwing their personal risk was just that....THEIR personal risk.

I never said to myself.."I am successful becuase I am smart"
Nor did I say "I am successful becuase I work hard"

I have said...many times....that I would NOT be successful if I were NOT smart...I would NOT be successful if I did NOT work hard.

and most important...

"I would not be successful if I did not put it all on the line"

Obama characterized business owners as arrogant.....and most of us arent.

It was a poor approach and whereas the criticism may be directed toward the wrong thing....he most certainly deserved the criticsm.

Alright, I'll accept that.

For many people, the comment was in bad taste, and perhaps delivered badly.

That's valid.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

For many people, the comment was in bad taste, and perhaps delivered badly.

That's valid.

Wow now that's an understatement. Barry had two communist parents and voted to the left of Bernie Sanders. He'll say anything to diminish business so the liberal socialists can tax it or take it over, just like in health care!

Remember the evil health insurance companies, and forget they do a lousy jobs because liberals made it illegal for them to compete.

 

[ConzHateUSA]

When Dale Earnhardt wins a race, a lot of the credit goes to the team, they DIRECTLY influence events.

figures, stupid redneck rightwing bigot bagger moron watches NASCAR

 

[Murf76]

First off... 20%+85% would be 105%. So, there's a problem right off the top with your math. But as we saw in Zombie's work-up earlier, even if the top 1% used the infrastructure and national defense exclusively... they're ALREADY paying more than enough for it at 37% of revenue.

Ummm, I said:

That's because the top 20% of the nation owns 85% of the wealth. And that's not even including the money they've been hiding overseas.

Where would adding 20 and 85 come into the equation?

None of that answers my question though... Washington has behaved with complete disregard toward its responsibility to spend our money wisely. We have no budget and no attempt to fix our broken entitlements. There's no equivocation on the word "unsustainable". It means what it means. Why should ANYONE have to pony up even one more red cent until politicians do their jobs?

We all know that wealth is not evenly distributed in this country. We accept that to some extent, that's just the nature of human beings... some will be more successful than others. But that doesn't mean that it has to be as lop-sided as it is now. The thing is though, that it's your ideology which creates the extremes of it. The more power that you give to politicians and bureaucrats, the more they can USE that power to enrich themselves and their friends. You CREATE the very crony capitalism that you hate.

No sir. The right is just as guilty as the left in that regard.

The left wants government to control business.

And the right wants business to control government.

Between the two, they have created a system where all politicians are on the corporate payroll, and all corporations are beholden to government to keep their immoral policies legal.

It's not possible to "redistribute the wealth" by means of government intervention. It's not possible, because they WILL skim the cream off the top. That's human nature too. Greed is as innate to us as compassion. Go back to kwc57's post #298 and consider that her example of "Jose the Tamale Salesman" could not engage the marketplace in today's business climate. He wouldn't be able to raise the start-up costs he'd need in order to be properly licensed, inspected, and insured. His opportunities are not limited by Big Business. They're limited by politicians and bureaucrats who are often politically indebted to Big Business, or who are useful idiots of the Nanny State.

It's not Wall Street which writes the rules. It's the politicians we send to Washington. Neuter them, and you neuter special influences. Big, bloated government is where cronyism is born. It's where opportunities for the poor and middle class are sacrificed.
LIMIT government, and wealth will redistribute organically as it was meant to.

It IS Wall Street that writes the rules. They just use politicians as puppets.

And if government were taken out of the equation completely, we would become a nation where corporations could do whatever they want, without any fear of retribution whatsoever.

At least with elected officials supposedly regulating industry, we can vote them out of office. With corporations, you need to have voting shares in order to have any say at all about what they do.

You have almost arrived upon a revelation. Almost.

I'll take your word for 20 and 85 percents. It's really here nor there as the lop-sided nature of wealth distribution is a given. The bone of contention is what we do about it.

Here, you say..

The left wants government to control business.

And the right wants business to control government.

But that is incorrect. What the right wants is for government to be smaller and limited to it's original constitutional constraints. When you limit what politicians have available to give, there's less point in buying them. They have no power to pick winners and losers at that point.

Now, you guys have spent the last couple of years demonizing the Tea Party as agents of the GOP. But that was never true. The Tea Party is actually a grass roots, unorganized rising of people who want Limited Government and Responsible Spending. The fact that Democrats take the brunt of that doesn't mean that RINOs don't get likewise excoriated, as we've seen in the primaries of 2010 and now.

Once you understand that we mean what we say about Limited Government, the rest will make sense to you. The "straw man" argument that we stand for anarchy is just not true. It doesn't meet the definition of "limited" So, we're not talking about letting corporations run roughshod, or allowing entrepreneurs to pollute the environment.

The key to understanding the nature of unalienable rights is to understand that freedom ends at your neighbor's chin. It's as simple as that. If you poison a stream on your property... it will cause a predictable loss of rights to other individuals who utilize that stream, thus you would NOT be free to poison the stream. I did a really long post on unalienable rights the other day, too long to repeat, so I'll link it HERE.




*started this post hours ago, but got interrupted.

 

[ConzHateUSA]

post above says this

The Tea Party is actually a grass roots, unorganized rising of people who want Limited Government and Responsible Spending.

nothing could be further from the truth, and this isnt a debate, the simple absolute fact is the tea party was created by dick armey and his billionaire owners freedomworks, to rebut healthcare reform

that some idiot white supremacists grabbed onto it, sure, but not grassroots, not in a million years...

again, this isnt debate, you are wrong, there is no question about this...

 

[The T]

For many people, the comment was in bad taste, and perhaps delivered badly.

That's valid.

Wow now that's an understatement. Barry had two communist parents and voted to the left of Bernie Sanders. He'll say anything to diminish business so the liberal socialists can tax it or take it over, just like in health care!

Remember the evil health insurance companies, and forget they do a lousy jobs because liberals made it illegal for them to compete.

Obama also had a friend he called 'FRANK' and referred to in his book 22 times.

Frank Marshall Davis...Known Communist...

The Communist: Frank Marshall Davis: The Untold Story of Barack Obama’s Mentor

The Communist Part II: Why Obama’s Mentor Went From Republican to Devout Marxist

The Communist Part III: How Obama Discovered ‘Hope,‘ ’Change‘ and ’Forward!’

 

[Murf76]

We recognize sports as a collaborative effort.

The whole "Gipper" meme was lost on you then? SOCIETY, done right, is a collaborative effort.

Too simplistic. In order for a society to function harmoniously, the natural rights of Individuals MUST be respected. Otherwise, predictable tumult will result. The Founders knew that.

 

[Bfgrn]

What has the Marxist in the White House done to this country???


Obama's accomplishments on Fiscal Responsibility

Within days after taking office, he signed an Executive Order ordering an audit of government contracts, and combating waste and abuse. Executive Order -- Economy in Government Contracting | The White House

Created the post of Chief Performance Officer, whose job it is to make operations more efficient to save the federal government money. Obama Names Chief Performance Officer : NPR

On his first full day, he froze White House salaries. http://on.msnbc.com/ewJUIx

He appointed the first Federal Chief Information Officer to oversee federal IT spending. Chief Information Officers Council

He committed to phasing out unnecessary and outdated weapons systems, and also signed the Weapons Systems Acquisition Reform Act to stop waste, fraud and abuse in the defense procurement and contracting system. Gates announces major Pentagon priority shifts - CNN.com http://bit.ly/fz8GAd

Through an executive order, he created the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform. President orders debt panel, names chairmen - Feb. 18, 2010

The great enemy of truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived and dishonest – but the myth – persistent, persuasive, and unrealistic. Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought.
President John F. Kennedy

 

[The T]

We recognize sports as a collaborative effort.

The whole "Gipper" meme was lost on you then? SOCIETY, done right, is a collaborative effort.

Too simplistic. In order for a society to function harmoniously, the natural rights of Individuals MUST be respected. Otherwise, predictable tumult will result. The Founders knew that.

Indeed.

See The writings of John Locke

 

[edthecynic]

We recognize sports as a collaborative effort.

The whole "Gipper" meme was lost on you then? SOCIETY, done right, is a collaborative effort.

Too simplistic. In order for a society to function harmoniously, the natural rights of Individuals MUST be respected. Otherwise, predictable tumult will result. The Founders knew that.

So basically you are saying that Obama got it right!

The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.

 

[Zander]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwWW2DQS_DU]"The More Context You Get, The Worse It Sounds" - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Bfgrn]

But larger corporations, on the most part, are public companies. The stockholders dont know the empoloyees nor do they care about them. They care about returns and the executive branch of the company has the responsibility to maximize that return.

You have pinpointed exactly what is the fatal flaw with the private health insurance industry.

The 'employees' are the patients, and the Wall Street stockholders don't care if they live or die.

I have offered this before, so far not one conservative will watch it.

Profits Before Patients

WENDELL POTTER
With almost 20 years inside the health insurance industry, Wendell Potter saw for-profit insurers hijack our health care system and put profits before patients.

 

[Papageorgio]

When Dale Earnhardt wins a race, a lot of the credit goes to the team, they DIRECTLY influence events.

figures, stupid redneck rightwing bigot bagger moron watches NASCAR

another stupid intolerant left wing bigot, know it all moron makes an ignorant comment.

 

[rightwinger]

Context, conservatives.....context

. If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.

Where did business build roads and bridges?

 

[Murf76]

The whole "Gipper" meme was lost on you then? SOCIETY, done right, is a collaborative effort.

Too simplistic. In order for a society to function harmoniously, the natural rights of Individuals MUST be respected. Otherwise, predictable tumult will result. The Founders knew that.

Indeed.

See The writings of John Locke

Exactly. I just did a really long post on that the other day, linked above. If people would just take the time and start at the beginning, with the question of "what makes certain rights unalienable"... we wouldn't have the horrible division we have in this country. It's not enough to read a copy of the U.S. Constitution. We have to think about what it means and why it says what it does.

 

[The T]

"The More Context You Get, The Worse It Sounds" - YouTube

And now he's backpeddling. Too late for him. He's pissed off the American electorate.

 

[Dr.House]

All of a sudden context matters to liberals...


Barry says what he says and libs say he didn't...

That'll play well in Peoria....

 

[The T]

Context, conservatives.....context

. If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.

Where did business build roads and bridges?

Go back and re look Sewerboy.

Nicde try. Obama screwed himself. And this won't be the last time. He has a string of hits. THIS TIME he took off the last mask.

 

[edthecynic]

"The More Context You Get, The Worse It Sounds" - YouTube

Again the worthless lying Romney scum left out this most important contextual part: "The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together." Romney scum can't stop themselves from lying just like their lying leader.

 

[Murf76]

Context, conservatives.....context

. If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.

Where did business build roads and bridges?

When they pay their share and more of the taxes. We've been through this... again, and again, and again. These people aren't getting something for nothing. They're ALREADY paying. The "context" is that Obama wants more. And the worst part of it is... that giving him more wouldn't be a drop in the bucket and he KNOWS it. This is just a political game to him in order to create division and solidify his base.
How sick is that?