African Presence in Pre-Columbian Times

[Asclepias]

I hunted down the "Egyptians in Australia" information and it appears its most likely a hoax. It did get me thinking though about how the Islands like Hawaii and Polynesia became populated by those same Aborigine type people. How did this happen without them having some sort of sea going vessels?

 

[Pheonixops]

Interesting links:

Americas Settled by Two Groups of Early Humans, Study Says

http://austhrutime.com/aborigines_new_world.htm

 

[JWBooth]

My grand parents on both sides told me stories of Native American ancestors and also Africans that were here before Europeans found their way over. I am not descended from any of the original Blacks that I know of but I was wondering if anyone else was aware of this?

There is a tribe in Louisiana that won a US court case and was given some of their land back and they are Africans. Officially they are not recognized by the US despite this court case but are recognized by the UN.

RaceandHistory.com - BLACK CIVILIZATIONS OF ANCIENT AMERICA

The experience of the Washitaw Nation (or Ouchita Nation) of the Southern United States is another piece of solid evidence for the fact of pre-Columbian African presence and settlement in the Americas and specifically in the United States. According to an article carried in the magazine, 'The Freedom Press Newsletter, (Spring, 1996), reprinted from Earthways, The Newsleter of the Sojourner Truth Farm School (August, 1995), the Washitaw were
(and still are) a nation of Africans who existed in the Southern U.S. and Mississippi Valley region long before the 16th century Europeans arrived and even before there were "Native Americans" on the lands the Washitaw once occupied and still occupy today.

Old folks like to tell fairy tails to the young ones.

Here's another one:

THE WONDERFUL TAR BABY STORY


"Didn't the fox never catch the rabbit, Uncle Remus?" asked the little boy
the next evening.

"He come mighty nigh it, honey, sho's you born--Brer Fox did. One day atter
Brer Rabbit fool 'im wid dat calamus root, Brer Fox went ter wuk en got 'im
some tar, en mix it wid some turkentime, en fix up a contrapshun w'at he
call a Tar-Baby, en he tuck dish yer Tar-Baby en he sot 'er in de big road,
en den he lay off in de bushes fer to see what de news wuz gwine ter be. En
he didn't hatter wait long, nudder, kaze bimeby here come Brer Rabbit pacin'
down de road--lippity-clippity, clippity -lippity--dez ez sassy ez a
jay-bird. Brer Fox, he lay low. Brer Rabbit come prancin' 'long twel he spy
de Tar-Baby, en den he fotch up on his behime legs like he wuz 'stonished.
De Tar Baby, she sot dar, she did, en Brer Fox, he lay low.

"`Mawnin'!' sez Brer Rabbit, sezee - `nice wedder dis mawnin',' sezee.

"Tar-Baby ain't sayin' nuthin', en Brer Fox he lay low.

"`How duz yo' sym'tums seem ter segashuate?' sez Brer Rabbit, sezee.

"Brer Fox, he wink his eye slow, en lay low, en de Tar-Baby, she ain't
sayin' nuthin'.

"'How you come on, den? Is you deaf?' sez Brer Rabbit, sezee. 'Kaze if you
is, I kin holler louder,' sezee.

"Tar-Baby stay still, en Brer Fox, he lay low.

"'You er stuck up, dat's w'at you is,' says Brer Rabbit, sezee, 'en I;m
gwine ter kyore you, dat's w'at I'm a gwine ter do,' sezee.

"Brer Fox, he sorter chuckle in his stummick, he did, but Tar-Baby ain't
sayin' nothin'.

"'I'm gwine ter larn you how ter talk ter 'spectubble folks ef hit's de las'
ack,' sez Brer Rabbit, sezee. 'Ef you don't take off dat hat en tell me
howdy, I'm gwine ter bus' you wide open,' sezee.

"Tar-Baby stay still, en Brer Fox, he lay low.

"Brer Rabbit keep on axin' 'im, en de Tar-Baby, she keep on sayin' nothin',
twel present'y Brer Rabbit draw back wid his fis', he did, en blip he tuck
'er side er de head. Right dar's whar he broke his merlasses jug. His fis'
stuck, en he can't pull loose. De tar hilt 'im. But Tar-Baby, she stay
still, en Brer Fox, he lay low.

"`Ef you don't lemme loose, I'll knock you agin,' sez Brer Rabbit, sezee, en
wid dat he fotch 'er a wipe wid de udder han', en dat stuck. Tar-Baby, she
ain'y sayin' nuthin', en Brer Fox, he lay low.

"`Tu'n me loose, fo' I kick de natal stuffin' outen you,' sez Brer Rabbit,
sezee, but de Tar-Baby, she ain't sayin' nuthin'. She des hilt on, en de
Brer Rabbit lose de use er his feet in de same way. Brer Fox, he lay low.
Den Brer Rabbit squall out dat ef de Tar-Baby don't tu'n 'im loose he butt
'er cranksided. En den he butted, en his head got stuck. Den Brer Fox, he
sa'ntered fort', lookin' dez ez innercent ez wunner yo' mammy's
mockin'-birds.

"`Howdy, Brer Rabbit,' sez Brer Fox, sezee. `You look sorter stuck up dis
mawnin',' sezee, en den he rolled on de groun', en laft en laft twel he
couldn't laff no mo'. `I speck you'll take dinner wid me dis time, Brer
Rabbit. I done laid in some calamus root, en I ain't gwineter take no
skuse,' sez Brer Fox, sezee."

Here Uncle Remus paused, and drew a two-pound yam out of the ashes.

"Did the fox eat the rabbit?" asked the little boy to whom the story had
been told.

"Dat's all de fur de tale goes," replied the old man. "He mout, an den agin
he moutent. Some say Judge B'ar come 'long en loosed 'im - some say he
didn't. I hear Miss Sally callin'. You better run 'long."

 

[Pheonixops]

An interesting read from a book printed in the early 1920's:

Africa and the Discovery of America - Leo Wiener - Google Books

 

[Asclepias]

An interesting read from a book printed in the early 1920's:

Africa and the Discovery of America - Leo Wiener - Google Books

There is lots of evidence. This guy Leo Weiner being just one of many that have found evidence that simply cannot be disputed but is instead buried. However, people still whine about Black people being revisionists when white guys like this found the same things long ago.

 

[Godboy]

An interesting read from a book printed in the early 1920's:

Africa and the Discovery of America - Leo Wiener - Google Books

There is lots of evidence. This guy Leo Weiner being just one of many that have found evidence that simply cannot be disputed but is instead buried. However, people still whine about Black people being revisionists when white guys like this found the same things long ago.

Yes, the evidence is so overwhelming that literally only a handful of quacks believe it.

 

[Asclepias]

An interesting read from a book printed in the early 1920's:

Africa and the Discovery of America - Leo Wiener - Google Books

There is lots of evidence. This guy Leo Weiner being just one of many that have found evidence that simply cannot be disputed but is instead buried. However, people still whine about Black people being revisionists when white guys like this found the same things long ago.

Yes, the evidence is so overwhelming that literally only a handful of quacks believe it.

Sort of like the people he knew the earth was round instead of flat.

You or the others still have nothing disputing these findings. Why is that?

 

[Uncensored2008]

Interesting links:

Americas Settled by Two Groups of Early Humans, Study Says

The suggested origin of the pre-Clovis Australoid population of the Americas

Thanks.

The fact that Aborigine peoples very similar to Australian Aborigines inhabited America well before the Mongol invasion (Indians) is well documented. That the Indians engaged in virtual genocide of these people is also well documented.

Kind of kills the whole "evil European" meme, though. Culturally and technologically advanced people conquer more backward people. The Indians conquered the Aborigines and in turn were conquered by the Europeans.

 

[Pheonixops]

Interesting links:

Americas Settled by Two Groups of Early Humans, Study Says

The suggested origin of the pre-Clovis Australoid population of the Americas

Thanks.

The fact that Aborigine peoples very similar to Australian Aborigines inhabited America well before the Mongol invasion (Indians) is well documented. That the Indians engaged in virtual genocide of these people is also well documented.

Kind of kills the whole "evil European" meme, though. Culturally and technologically advanced people conquer more backward people. The Indians conquered the Aborigines and in turn were conquered by the Europeans.

Yeah, I have been trying to find a documentary that featured that premise. I don't know if it was on NatGeo or Discovery,etc. They showed actual cave or rock drawings that depicted the conflict between a darker people (Aborigines or Africans or some native race) and the lighter assailants (most likely Asian conquerors). I do think that some Africans may have gone there (The Americas) on purpose or by accident. The coast of Brazil is pretty close to the continent of Africa, the statues of the Olmecs are quite interesting, and one of the E-books I cited has an interesting theory with a lot of citations. "Proposed claims for an African presence in Mesoamerica rest on attributes of the Olmec culture, the presence of an African plant species in the Americas, and interpretations of certain European and Arabic historical accounts.

"The Olmec culture existed from roughly 1200 BCE to 400 BCE. The idea that the Olmecs are related to Africans was suggested by José Melgar, who discovered the first colossal head at Hueyapan (now Tres Zapotes) in 1862.[66] More recently, Ivan van Sertima has argued that these statues depict settlers or explorers from Africa, but his views have been the target of severe scholarly criticism.[67]

North African sources describe what some consider to be visits to the New World by a Mali fleet in 1311.[68] According to these sources, 400 ships from the Mali Empire discovered a land across the ocean to the West after being swept off course by ocean currents. Only one ship returned, and the captain reported the discovery of a western current to Prince Abubakari II; the off-course Mali fleet of 400 ships is said to have conducted both trade and warfare with the peoples of the western lands. It is claimed that Abubakari II abdicated his throne and set off to explore these western lands. In 1324, the Mali king Mansa Musa is said to have told the Arabic historian, Al-Umari that "his predecessors had launched two expeditions from West Africa to discover the limits of the Atlantic Ocean."

According to the abstract of Columbus' log made by Bartolomé de las Casas, the purpose of Columbus’ third voyage was to test both the claims of King John II of Portugal that “canoes had been found which set out from the coast of Guinea [West Africa] and sailed to the west with merchandise” as well as the claims of the native inhabitants of Hispaniola that “from the south and the southeast had come black people whose spears were made of a metal called guanín...from which it was found that of 32 parts: 18 were gold, 6 were silver, and 8 copper.”
Bartolomé de las Casas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Asclepias]

They have a video on youtube from the BBC talking about the Aborigines in the ancient Americas.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6IrMjfbh6E]First Americans were Black Aborigines - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Asclepias]

North African sources describe what some consider to be visits to the New World by a Mali fleet in 1311.[68] According to these sources, 400 ships from the Mali Empire discovered a land across the ocean to the West after being swept off course by ocean currents. Only one ship returned, and the captain reported the discovery of a western current to Prince Abubakari II; the off-course Mali fleet of 400 ships is said to have conducted both trade and warfare with the peoples of the western lands. It is claimed that Abubakari II abdicated his throne and set off to explore these western lands. In 1324, the Mali king Mansa Musa is said to have told the Arabic historian, Al-Umari that "his predecessors had launched two expeditions from West Africa to discover the limits of the Atlantic Ocean."

This is the one that caught my attention. Specifically because I met a young lady from South America that claimed to be related to some of the people in this fleet. There are a lot of citations regarding this voyage by people from Mali. Its already known they were traders, extremely wealthy, and had the seafaring knowledge to make the trip. I think however even they were preceded by other African civilizations even before the Egyptian dynasties.

 

[Pheonixops]

They have a video on youtube from the BBC talking about the Aborigines in the ancient Americas.

First Americans were Black Aborigines - YouTube

Thank you very much! This was the video that I was referring to. I went and joined Natgeo to no avail, then you have it right here! Notice that this find was in Brazil, now I don't know what part of Brazil these discoveries were found in yet, but it's no coincidence that Brazil is closer to Africa. If it was in Peru, Ecuador, or Chile, I can definitely see the Australian Aboriginal connection. Now I am going to check out the movie and try to kick my wife's ass in final Jeopardy at the same time.

 

[Pheonixops]

They have a video on youtube from the BBC talking about the Aborigines in the ancient Americas.

First Americans were Black Aborigines - YouTube

Thank you very much! This was the video that I was referring to. I went and joined Natgeo to no avail, then you have it right here! Notice that this find was in Brazil, now I don't know what part of Brazil these discoveries were found in yet, but it's no coincidence that Brazil is closer to Africa. If it was in Peru, Ecuador, or Chile, I can definitely see the Australian Aboriginal connection. Now I am going to check out the movie and try to kick my wife's ass in final Jeopardy at the same time.

Ok, it was in Northeast Brazil, I think that makes the case;check out these Trade Wind Patterns:

 

[Asclepias]

They have a video on youtube from the BBC talking about the Aborigines in the ancient Americas.

First Americans were Black Aborigines - YouTube

Thank you very much! This was the video that I was referring to. I went and joined Natgeo to no avail, then you have it right here! Notice that this find was in Brazil, now I don't know what part of Brazil these discoveries were found in yet, but it's no coincidence that Brazil is closer to Africa. If it was in Peru, Ecuador, or Chile, I can definitely see the Australian Aboriginal connection. Now I am going to check out the movie and try to kick my wife's ass in final Jeopardy at the same time.

Ok, it was in Northeast Brazil, I think that makes the case;check out these Trade Wind Patterns:

What makes me laugh is the European scholars insistence that Africans couldn't not have sailed to South America from West Africa but somehow the Aborigines originally from Africa could sail to the South America and the Melanesian, Fijian, and Polynesian Islands tens of thousands of years earlier. When you think about in those terms there either has to be a serious cover up or willful denial of the facts.

 

[Pheonixops]

Thank you very much! This was the video that I was referring to. I went and joined Natgeo to no avail, then you have it right here! Notice that this find was in Brazil, now I don't know what part of Brazil these discoveries were found in yet, but it's no coincidence that Brazil is closer to Africa. If it was in Peru, Ecuador, or Chile, I can definitely see the Australian Aboriginal connection. Now I am going to check out the movie and try to kick my wife's ass in final Jeopardy at the same time.

Ok, it was in Northeast Brazil, I think that makes the case;check out these Trade Wind Patterns:

What makes me laugh is the European scholars insistence that Africans couldn't not have sailed to South America from West Africa but somehow the Aborigines originally from Africa could sail to the South America and the Melanesian, Fijian, and Polynesian Islands tens of thousands of years earlier. When you think about in those terms there either has to be a serious cover up or willful denial of the facts.

Yep, it's actual quite sad, though there are people like that French lady in the video (approx 10:28 in the video) you posted that seemed to imply African origins there by bringing up the example of African fishermen who were blown off course and possibly arrived in Brazil. I'm pretty sure they were found close to where they were excavating and found those pictures. Here's what I think she was referring to:

Three African fishermen rescued in Brazilian waters. | HighBeam Business: Arrive Prepared

Check out Natal Brazil on the map and compare to those trade winds.

Another interesting article:
http://www.faculty.ucr.edu/~legneref/ethnic/ethnic1.htm

 

[Asclepias]

Ok, it was in Northeast Brazil, I think that makes the case;check out these Trade Wind Patterns:

What makes me laugh is the European scholars insistence that Africans couldn't not have sailed to South America from West Africa but somehow the Aborigines originally from Africa could sail to the South America and the Melanesian, Fijian, and Polynesian Islands tens of thousands of years earlier. When you think about in those terms there either has to be a serious cover up or willful denial of the facts.

Yep, it's actual quite sad, though there are people like that French lady in the video (approx 10:28 in the video) you posted that seemed to imply African origins there by bringing up the example of African fishermen who were blown off course and possibly arrived in Brazil. I'm pretty sure they were found close to where they were excavating and found those pictures. Here's what I think she was referring to:

Three African fishermen rescued in Brazilian waters. | HighBeam Business: Arrive Prepared

Check out Natal Brazil on the map and compare to those trade winds.

Yeah that's a lot of lost people accidently getting blown off course. I'm sure that did happen but not enough to account for all the evidence. Its what I call the WAD moving of the goal posts. Eventually someone will admit it in our lifetime but with a caveat like aliens guided them or a Kraken swallowed then spit them out on the Brazilian coast line. I dont know if you saw earlier in the thread regarding the Ra and Ra II. Some guys built a boat using Egyptian blue prints and made it across the Ethiopic ocean to South America on the second try.

Thor Heyerdahl - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The papyrus craft, Ra, sailed 5000 km (2700 nautical miles) in 56 days until storms and deficiencies in the construction caused the team to abandon their target only one week short of Barbados.

Ten months later, Heyerdahl tried the same voyage with the smaller (12 meter) Ra II. This vessel crossed the widest part of the Atlantic 6100 km (3270 nautical miles) in 57 days, from Safi to Barbados. Once again, this voyage showed that modern science under-estimated long-forgotten aboriginal technologies. The theory that Mediterranean vessels built prior to Columbus could not have crossed the Atlantic was thrown on its head.

 

[Pheonixops]

Interesting:

Dafuna Canoe; Africa?s Oldest Known Boat | Originalpeople.org

 

[Pheonixops]

Graveyard DNA rewrites African American history - life - 16 September 2010 - New Scientist

 

[Asclepias]

Graveyard DNA rewrites African American history - life - 16 September 2010 - New Scientist

I knew about this but never heard of scientific proof. I'm pretty convinced Columbus had some undisclosed knowledge from the Black Moors. One thing people forget is that Jan 2 1492 was the day the Moors were expelled from Europe. What happened later on that very year?

http://www.historyorb.com/events/date/1492

 

[Asclepias]

Well here is one of the African Moors that sailed with Columbus.

Pedro Alonso Niño - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia