All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss

[RoccoR]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

There is no Customary or IHL that nullifies a the Oslo Accords. A 'treaty' means an international agreement concluded between States in written form and governed by international law, whether embodied in a single instrument or in two or more related instruments and whatever its particular designation. And that is what the Oslo Accords are.

Look it up. Rules if occupation.

(COMMENT)

You are so full of crap... The Oslo Accords and the establishment of Area "C" one distinct area which contains the Israeli settlements, is administered by Israel. It was signed by all the appropriate people. Mahmoud Abbas was there as one of the principal negotiators.

What gives strength to the Accords is that in all this time, not only has the Arab Palestinians recognized (albeit begrudgingly) the distinction between Areas "A", "B", and "C," The Arab Palestinians, the Palestinian Authority, and the PLO ("the sole and legitimate representative of the Palestinian people") is that none of them have activated the dispute resolution process (Article XV Oslo I - or - Article XXI Oslo II). Nor have any of them activate Declaration on Principles of International Law concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States [A/RES/25/2625 (XXV)]:

Every State has the duty to refrain from the threat or use of force to violate the existing international boundaries of another State or as a means of solving international disputes, including territorial disputes and problems concerning frontiers of States.
​

One might ask why the Arab Palestinians have not activated either of these processes? (RHETORICAL) That is simply because they might actually lose; just like HAMAS lost in The Court of Justice of the European Union (CJEU) on the matter of being labeled a terrorist organization.

The Hostile Arab Palestinian is very boastful matter which they say the law back them. But they're very short on citations. It is just like the :

So-called ‘Palestinian’ leadership says: “We have the right to kill Israelis”

• July 17, 2018 by BareNakedIslam •

“And paying the terrorists who have killed them and their families hundreds of millions of dollars (using money received from the U.S. before Trump ended this funding) is a sacred national obligation of the ‘Palestinian’ people.”
​

Anyone who believes that the Palestinians have the RIGHT to KILL Israelis well is just plain foolish → simply just plain foolish.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Billo_Really]

That is a song for John's son.

"Hey Jude" is a song by English rock band the Beatles, written by Paul McCartney and credited to Lennon–McCartney. The ballad evolved from "Hey Jules", a song McCartney wrote to comfort John Lennon's son, Julian, during his parents' divorce.

Hey Jude - Wikipedia

Hatikvah, the Hope, is the correct Anthem for Israel. Thank you.

Creative impression. I like to think he's saying, "Hey Jew".

And if I had to pick a Beatles song that I would dedicate to you, this is the one I'd pick...

 

[Billo_Really]

I already laughed the first time You mentioned the UN resolutions were non-binding.

Some are, some aren't. 242 is binding, 181 is not. However, together they make up the opinion of the world community. And Israel is a pariah in that community.

Now I laugh even more seeing how You pedal back to it for the basis for Your claim.

WTF are you talking about? I didn't mention a resolution in that response.

Prove that Arabs didn't start the war against Palestinian Jews before Zionism.

I don't have to, you already did by not being able to post any incidence of major violence between the 1830's and 1920's.

 

[Billo_Really]

Ok, JUST ONE MORE TIME for Billo's sake.

"If Israel is so great, why does it have over 200 UN resolutions against it?"

Since 1948, the UN has been taken over by Christian and Muslim governments hostile to Jews and therefore to Israel.

Resolutions are non binding, not legal, because if they were, all of the other resolutions against all other countries would be enforceable as well.

The UN wastes thousands of hours attempting to cripple Israel, just as the BDS movement does.

They use hatred for Jews, with endlessly invented stories about Jews from any time, since Abraham, to incite people against the Jews and Israel.

All we have to look at are the endless attacks by Muslims and Christians against Jewish people, businesses, synagogues, schools, etc which does not happen against any other people on the planet.

And all we need to look at is the history of hostility against Jews since Christianity was founded, to see that the Jews have been used as scapegoats every time since that founding just as cults/tribes used to killed their first born in order to appease their gods.

Christians want to appease Jesus and the Christian belief that the Jews killed Jesus, that the Jews have cost all Christians their "salvation", and the fact that the Jews refuse to convert to Christianity. Jews must be humiliated and treated as inferior until they convert to Christianity.

Muslims want to make the Jews pay for not accepting Allah as their god. The Jews must be humiliated and treated as inferior until they come to Allah.

There is no Palestinian/Israeli conflict.

There is a Muslims/Christians vs the Jews.

As it has been for the past 1700 years since Rome took over Christianity and continued in its horrendous ways of conquest.

As it has been for the past 1400 years when an Arab decided that he was not going to allow Christians to convert any of his people in Arabia into that religion.
So...he created his own, Islam, with Christians and Jews being inferior, and all other non Muslims as well.


End of lesson.

This is not a religious issue and has nothing to do with Judaism. Ergo, this issue has nothing to do with Jews. So no, you didn't answer the question, you tried to mis-direct it into that same, lame, mantra rap, because you have no argument with which to defend Israel for all the resolutions it has against it.

There are several resolutions telling Israel to stop doing business with apartheid South Africa. WTF does that have to do with antisemitism?

There are many resolutions telling Israel it must respect human rights. WTF does that have to do with Jew hate?

Is the Balfour Declaration proof the UN (or its previous LoN's) hates Jews?

And what about the endless attacks by Israelis against Palestinians? Why don't you have the balls to read or discuss those?

 

[Billo_Really]

Because each UN member state does 100 times worse than Israel, and they need to cover for that.

What are you getting a Palestinian for Christmas? Enquirering minds want to know.

 

[Billo_Really]

Stop lying like a street whore, You know full well Palestinian Jews didn't raise arms until Arab pogroms.

Man-whores are called gigolo's. And Palestinian-Jews did not raise arms against their neighbor's, migrating Zionists did.

Wasn't it You who just recently suggested that murdering Jews was justifiable

In the words of Oliver North, "I cannot recall saying that."

if You accused the victim of narcissism? Guess, under which category this puts Your stupid head?

In the words of Mohammed Ali,

"I was told once, a great man knows his faults. My only fault is, I don't know how truly great I am!"​

 

[Billo_Really]

What's wrong can't discuss Arab pogroms before Zionism?
You only know to blame Jews like the rest of the antisemitic garbage.

I'm not afraid to discuss anything.

You wanna talk about why the Rams can't get any decent linebackers?

 

[Billo_Really]

Sure agha, it's even better than the American apartheid,
and on top of that we also have 5 different climate zones.

What we did to native Americans will always be a black mark on this country.

Okay, you got me on climate zones.

 

[Billo_Really]

Wait, what?! So, the Jewish people claiming their own history is cause to massacre them? Disgusting.

No, just the part of Muslim history Zionists were claiming was theirs. Why can't you just "share" the wall?

What about them? Doesn't excuse the massacre that not everyone participated.

No it doesn't.

What are you getting a Palestinian for Christmas?

 

[Billo_Really]

Truer words have never been spoken with respect to the Arab Palestinians.

Thank you. I am the absolute definition of respect.

 

[Coyote]

The conventional wisdom is that the best chance for peace in the Middle East between Israel and the Palestinian Arabs is the Two-State Solution. Failing that, there is the One-State Solution.

The problem, of course, is that decades of pursuing the Two-State Solution has produced nothing except period increases in violence.

On the other hand, it has the advantage of allowing people half a world away of being able to spout off about what is best for Israel and the Arabs without having to live in the region, having a grasp of the situation nor having to live with the consequences of their unsolicited advice.

Actually, there are ideas out there for peace that are being discussed between the people who are affected, between Israelis and Palestinians, and those solutions are not about a One-State Solution or Two-State Solution.

--------------------------
The idea is to create the potential to start to integrate Palestinians into Israel not as enemies but as contributing members and tie their destiny to Israel.

It is a long-term idea that has the benefit of involving the people who will be directly affected by the plan, bypassing the politicians -- both in Israel, the territories and in the West -- who do not have to deal with the consequences of their actions.

Maybe now is not the time for such a plan, but at the very least it is the start of an idea that can grow to something bigger.

(full article online)

Forget About The Two-State Solution: Thinking Outside The Box About Israeli-Palestinian Peace (Daled Amos) ~ Elder Of Ziyon - Israel News

That is an interesting idea....you could start it with Area C.

 

[Coyote]

Here is something anti-Israelers don’t discuss and I am surprised they don’t. Rather than the hyperbole of non existent genocide and Gaza concentration camps how about focusing on the real injustices?

The people who live in Area C are under two different systems of justice. That means if you are a Palestinian you are tried under the military court system. If you are Israeli you are tried in the civil system despite the fact you are not in Israel.. Guess which one has far more rights, especially for minors?

Do West Bank Israelis, Palestinians live under different set of laws?

How many Palestinians WANT to live under Israeli law and jurisdiction? Answer is -- a small minority. So why is it an issue? Can't force them to accept Israeli sovereignty or law so work to get them WHAT THEY WANT. Which is autonomy of SOME form with their own security and justice.

Seems a waste of time to call this apartheid or bias when it's really not..
Need to SUPPORT solutions to getting some autonomy for the Palis both within Israel and in the WORSE conditions elsewhere.

How many Palestinians want ti live under MILITARY LAW? How about ONE SET of laws for all in that one area? Put them ALL under military law.

 

[Coyote]

The people who live in Area C are under two different systems of justice. That means if you are a Palestinian you are tried under the military court system. If you are Israeli you are tried in the civil system despite the fact you are not in Israel..

That is because a State can not compel non-citizens to its own laws. A State can't force its own laws upon non-citizens. (That would be an egregious breech of human rights, wouldn't you agree?!)

In Area C, Israeli citizens can avail themselves of the protection of the State of Israel as Israeli citizens and are compelled to follow Israeli law. Citizens of Palestine are under a complex set of laws including: Palestinian law, Jordanian law, pre-existing Ottoman law and military law of the State legally in control of the territory for concerns of security and safety according to treaties. In other words, Israeli citizens are governed by Israeli law and Palestinian citizens are governed by Palestinian/Jordanian/Ottoman law and security under military law.

But somehow, in your rush to demonize Israel, you not only ignore current norms of international law, you attempt to suggest that Israel is somehow to be vilified for following this norm.

Yeah, there are two different systems of justice in Area C -- because there are two different groups of citizens in Area C. It would be wrong to impose one system on both peoples.

Then shouldnt Palestinians have the right to avail themselves of Palestinian law for the same types of crimes Israeli's have that get prosecuted under Israeli civil law. I posted an article where it shows how differently the same crimes get handled.

Maybe in your haste to defend all things Israel you should step back a moment and consider maybe this is not right.

 

[Sixties Fan]

5. Deutscher Israelkongress - Hillel Neuer

 

[Sixties Fan]

Haaretz Removes Erroneous Reference to 'Illegal' Settlements

 

[Sixties Fan]

Sweden’s Ugly Ultraliberalism and the Jews

 

[RoccoR]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Coyote, Shusha, et al,

Ideally, that is what would normally happen. But there is a flaw.

The general line of thought is that Israel was (if possible) "respecting unless absolutely prevented, the laws in force in the country." What the laws that were in place at the time were Israeli Laws when in November 1988 Yassar Arafat declared Independence. And with that Declaration of Independence, no real laws → in and by the citizens of the newly declared independence were brought forth.

Then shouldnt Palestinians have the right to avail themselves of Palestinian law for the same types of crimes Israeli's have that get prosecuted under Israeli civil law. I posted an article where it shows how differently the same crimes get handled.

Maybe in your haste to defend all things Israel you should step back a moment and consider maybe this is not right.

(COMMENT)

There was not "Arab Palestinian Law" to fall back on. In 1988 (July) the Sovereignty of the West Bank was abandoned by the Hashemite King. The law that was in place on 31 July 1988, was gone on 1 August 1988. It then fell to the Civil Administration from the Government of Israel.

The Lawless West Bank became ever more lawless as time goes on. But the Arab Palestinian never righted itself in all this time. They have been fighting and squabbling for so long that they forgot where they put their Rules of Law (RoL).

And in the time since November 1988, while there is such a thing as a "Basic Law," there has only been one election; they couldn't even follow that first simple transition from one government administration --- to --- the next.

​

This accurately describes the (so-called) State of Palestine. It was never able to establish any sovereignty until the Oslo Accords gave them Area A with exclusively administered by the Palestinian Authority; supplemented by the Gaza Strip in 2005. And even that is not something that all Arab Palestinians can agree upon. One group says one thing --- and then they argue.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Coyote]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Coyote, Shusha, et al,

Ideally, that is what would normally happen. But there is a flaw.

The general line of thought is that Israel was (if possible) "respecting unless absolutely prevented, the laws in force in the country." What the laws that were in place at the time were Israeli Laws when in November 1988 Yassar Arafat declared Independence. And with that Declaration of Independence, no real laws → in and by the citizens of the newly declared independence were brought forth.

Then shouldnt Palestinians have the right to avail themselves of Palestinian law for the same types of crimes Israeli's have that get prosecuted under Israeli civil law. I posted an article where it shows how differently the same crimes get handled.

Maybe in your haste to defend all things Israel you should step back a moment and consider maybe this is not right.

(COMMENT)

There was not "Arab Palestinian Law" to fall back on. In 1988 (July) the Sovereignty of the West Bank was abandoned by the Hashemite King. The law that was in place on 31 July 1988, was gone on 1 August 1988. It then fell to the Civil Administration from the Government of Israel.

The Lawless West Bank became ever more lawless as time goes on. But the Arab Palestinian never righted itself in all this time. They have been fighting and squabbling for so long that they forgot where they put their Rules of Law (RoL).

And in the time since November 1988, while there is such a thing as a "Basic Law," there has only been one election; they couldn't even follow that first simple transition from one government administration --- to --- the next.

View attachment 234883
​

This accurately describes the (so-called) State of Palestine. It was never able to establish any sovereignty until the Oslo Accords gave them Area A with exclusively administered by the Palestinian Authority; supplemented by the Gaza Strip in 2005. And even that is not something that all Arab Palestinians can agree upon. One group says one thing --- and then they argue.

Most Respectfully,
R

Why not put ALL people in that territory under military law. That was the case until something like 20 years ago when the Knesset passed a law changing things was it not?

 

[Sixties Fan]

The employment rate of the Arab women in Israel surged almost 20 percent by the end of September, according to data published by the Central Bureau of Statistics on Sunday.

Compared with 128,000 in the second quarter of 2017, about 154,000 Arab women in Israel, or 40 percent of all Arab-Israeli women aged 25-64, were employed in the second and third quarter of 2018, just a step away from the 41-percent employment target set for 2020.

(full article online)

“Apartheid” Fail: Israeli Arab Female Employment Surges

 

[RoccoR]

RE: All The News Anti-Israel Posters Will Not Read Or Discuss
⁜→ Coyote, Shusha, et al,

Well, that would actually be taking a step backward.

Why not put ALL people in that territory under military law. That was the case until something like 20 years ago when the Knesset passed a law changing things was it not?

(COMMENT)

The normal jurisdiction life cycle goes from "Military Occupation" → to → "Civil Administration." This is where the transitional phase for the establishment of a self-governing institution to stand alone. The UN Palestine Commission helped Israel establish all manner of institutions (Banking, Postal Service, local civil service for police/fire services/utilities, mail and telecommunications, passports and travel documentation by counselor services, judicial, legislative and foreign service operations, etc, etc, etc)... All the things behind the curtain of government that are the gears and sprockets of self-governing institutions were assembled so when the Jews declared independence - it was a turnkey activation.

The Arab Palestinians chose not to participate. What is there to say about that? They turned it down three times before the Treaty of Lausanne was in place. And they got mad, stomped their feet, threw a little tantrum and here we are. And they wonder why they have a mess. A little cooperation goes a long way.

"Military Occupation" → to → "Civil Administration" → to → "self-government"

There still might have been a Civil War and a War of Independence. There might still have been a Six-Day War and the Yom Kipper War. But we will never know because they flatly stated in 1948:

In conclusion, the Arab Higher Committee Delegation wishes to stress the following:

• 
  (a) The Arabs of Palestine will never recognise the validity of the extorted partition recommendations or the authority of the United Nations to make them.
  
  (b) The Arabs of Palestine consider that any attempt by the Jews or any power group of powers to establish a Jewish state in Arab territory is an act of aggression which will be resisted in self-defense.
  
  (c) It is very unwise and fruitless to ask any commission to proceed to Palestine because not a single Arab will cooperate with the said Commission.
  
  (d) The United Nations or its Commission should not be misled to believe that its efforts in the partition plan will meet with any success. It will be far better for the eclipsed prestige of this organization not to start on this adventure.
  
  (e) The United Nations prestige will be better served by abandoning, not enforcing such an injustice.
  
  (f) The determination of every Arab in Palestine is to oppose in every way the partition of that country.
  
  (g) The Arabs of Palestine made a solemn declaration before the United Nations, before God and history, that they will never submit or yield to any power going to Palestine to enforce partition. The only way to establish partition is first to wipe them out — man, woman and child.

You can't build a peace, with an attitude like that. The Jewish Nation Home was going to happen. It could be done the easy way, or it could be done the hard way. The Arab Palestinians chose the hard way.

Armed struggle is the only way to liberate Palestine.
Thus it is the overall strategy, not merely a tactical phase.
The Palestinian Arab people assert their absolute determination and firm resolution
to continue their armed struggle
and to work for an armed popular revolution for
the liberation of their country and their return to it.
They also assert their right to normal life in Palestine and to exercise
their right to self-determination and sovereignty over it.
​

Remember, it was the Arab Palestinian that chose NOT TO exercise their right to self-determination and sovereignty. No one stoped them or prevented them from doing so. But when two peoples claim independence over the same territory and there is no room for compromise (total absence of participation) then there is going to be a fight.

Most Respectfully,
R