Approve school vouchers as a way to fight “woke” public schools

[Unkotare]

... they sure all knew how victimized they all are! ...

How do you know that?

 

[EMH]

I'll tell anyone who says stupid things to stop being stupid.

So a parent who has a kid who was homo-raped by a public education homo employee is stupid for what

Not thanking Zionism for the rape?

 

[Sixties Fan]

So the answer is to keep the children of the working class, whose parents can’t afford private school, locked into the “woke” public school system where they are falling miserably behind? They won’t stand a chance against the affluent private school kids when applying to college.

You have not proven any of what you just posted. They are just words.

Which are the failing schools, where and why?

Your examples show none of it.

 

[Lisa558]

I don't really have a problem with most of the stuff you're complaining about. But it should be up to the parents, and not a matter of "majority rules". Government doesn't need to get involved in raising our kids.

Of course it should be up to the parents. They should have a choice of whether to use a school voucher to put little Lisa in private school, or to keep her in public school.

By not allowing that, and locking parents into the public school system where their kids are being indoctrinated, IS getting the government involved.

We are fully on the same page here.

 

[Sixties Fan]

And that is why we see the leftist on the thread fighting against it, and regurgitating stuff about how I need to learn more about Black history, how oppressed they were in the past by whites, and the 1619 project.

He made my point PERFECTLY. Parents don’t want their kids spending time learning MORE about the history of black oppression, and learning to see contemporary blacks as victims, while we are falling further and further behind other developed countries in the world. Parents want their kids proficient in academics and prepared for college, or another career-prep route, and not become little social warriors who get taught about oral sex, have to endure boys in the girls locker room, and grow up to vote for reparations.

Teaching about Black history and how students are doing in school have NOTHING to do with each other. None of your examples have ANYTHING to do with a good curriculum in schools and why students are not learning as they should, in some schools, better than they should.

 

[Lisa558]

You have not proven any of what you just posted. They are just words.

Which are the failing schools, where and why?

Your examples show none of it.

It’s not specific schools. It’s the education across the board. Have you not heard how dismally unprepared our kids are? In the high school where I went, and where 90% went on to college, the school has been so dumbed down - partially by the illegals but also but the liberal curriculum - that only 13% scored proficient in the state-wide math exam.

 

[dblack]

Teaching about Black history and how students are doing in school have NOTHING to do with each other. None of your examples have ANYTHING to do with a good curriculum in schools and why students are not learning as they should, in some schools, better than they should.

The point is, who decides what constitutes a "good curriculum"? Parents, or the state?

 

[Sixties Fan]

Of course it should be up to the parents. They should have a choice of whether to use a school voucher to put little Lisa in private school, or to keep her in public school.

By not allowing that, and locking parents into the public school system where their kids are being indoctrinated, IS getting the government involved.

We are fully on the same page here.

What is the effect of voucher programs on education?


Vouchers do not reduce public education costs

Actually, they increase costs, by requiring taxpayers to fund two school systems, one public and one private. The result is that public schools, which educate 90 percent of students, wind up with less funding.

Vouchers | NEA - National Education Association​

Why do people oppose vouchers?


At the same time, these programs cost taxpayers millions of dollars and increase bureaucratic and administrative costs. That's why California voters overwhelmingly rejected voucher initiatives in 2000 and in 1993.
[URL='https://www.cta.org/our-advocacy/vouchers']

Vouchers - California Teachers Association​

What are the cons of vouchers?


School vouchers funnel money away from already-struggling public schools and children and redistribute tax dollars to private schools and middle-class children. School vouchers fail to accommodate and support disabled and special-needs students. School vouchers do not improve students' academic performance.
[URL='https://www.britannica.com/story/pro-and-con-school-vouchers']

Pro and Con: School Vouchers | Britannica​

Four recent rigorous studies—in the District of Columbia, Louisiana, Indiana, and Ohio—used different research designs and reached the same result: on average, students that use vouchers to attend private schools do less well on tests than similar students that do not attend private schools. The Louisiana and Indiana studies offer some hints that negative effects may diminish over time. Whether effects ever will become positive is unclear.

https://www.brookings.edu/research/more-findings-about-school-vouchers-and-test-scores-and-they-are-still-negative/[/URL][/URL]

 

[Sixties Fan]

It’s not specific schools. It’s the education across the board. Have you not heard how dismally unprepared our kids are? In the high school where I went, and where 90% went on to college, the school has been so dumbed down - partially by the illegals but also but the liberal curriculum - that only 13% scored proficient in the state-wide math exam.

I just posted the results of previous uses of Vouchers.

 

[Lisa558]

Teaching about Black history and how students are doing in school have NOTHING to do with each other. None of your examples have ANYTHING to do with a good curriculum in schools and why students are not learning as they should, in some schools, better than they should.

WE ALREADY TEACH ABOUT BLACK HISTORY! You leftists act as if kids don’t learn about slavery and Jim Crow.

And you say it’s not enough. They need to learn MORE about blacks. Too bad. These kids need to focus on basic academics or we are setting them up for failure - and a continuation of the decline of America.

P.S. I am more angry at you than any other person on this forum. You are the very person who my Jewish Republican Pro-Israel group is fighting against: Jews who vote for the anti-Israel policy.

 

[Sixties Fan]

The point is, who decides what constitutes a "good curriculum"? Parents, or the state?

Who is doing it across the US, now?

 

[Lisa558]

What is the effect of voucher programs on education?


Vouchers do not reduce public education costs

Actually, they increase costs, by requiring taxpayers to fund two school systems, one public and one private. The result is that public schools, which educate 90 percent of students, wind up with less funding.

Vouchers | NEA - National Education Association​

Why do people oppose vouchers?
At the same time, these programs cost taxpayers millions of dollars and increase bureaucratic and administrative costs. That's why California voters overwhelmingly rejected voucher initiatives in 2000 and in 1993.
[URL='https://www.cta.org/our-advocacy/vouchers']

Vouchers - California Teachers Association​

What are the cons of vouchers?
School vouchers funnel money away from already-struggling public schools and children and redistribute tax dollars to private schools and middle-class children. School vouchers fail to accommodate and support disabled and special-needs students. School vouchers do not improve students' academic performance.
[URL='https://www.britannica.com/story/pro-and-con-school-vouchers']

Pro and Con: School Vouchers | Britannica​

Four recent rigorous studies—in the District of Columbia, Louisiana, Indiana, and Ohio—used different research designs and reached the same result: on average, students that use vouchers to attend private schools do less well on tests than similar students that do not attend private schools. The Louisiana and Indiana studies offer some hints that negative effects may diminish over time. Whether effects ever will become positive is unclear.
https://www.brookings.edu/research/more-findings-about-school-vouchers-and-test-scores-and-they-are-still-negative/[/URL][/URL]

Damn! The intent of vouchers isn’t to reduce the cost of public education. It is to give a choice to parents who don’t want their kids indoctrinated by the Democrats.

 

[dblack]

Who is doing it across the US, now.

Mostly the state. I should have said who "should" decide? That's the core question, in my view.

 

[Lisa558]

The point is, who decides what constitutes a "good curriculum"? Parents, or the state?

Exactly. Liberals think a “good curriculum” teaches more about past black oppression, transgenderism, and oral sex techniques. Conservatives want the focus on basic academic subjects.

 

[Unkotare]

So a parent who has a kid who was homo-raped by a public education homo employee is stupid for what

Not thanking Zionism for the rape?

Making illogical statements like your bigoted ones is stupid no matter who is doing it.

 

[dblack]

Damn! The intent of vouchers isn’t to reduce the cost of public education. It is to give a choice to parents who don’t want their kids indoctrinated by the Democrats.

And it can go the other way. No one seems to think about that. If liberals are allowed to use public education to indoctrinate kids to their liking, conservatives can, and likely will, play the same game. I wonder what they'll say then?

 

[Sixties Fan]

WE ALREADY TEACH ABOUT BLACK HISTORY! You leftists act as if kids don’t learn about slavery and Jim Crow.

And you say it’s not enough. They need to learn MORE about blacks. Too bad. These kids need to focus on basic academics or we are setting them up for failure - and a continuation of the decline of America.

P.S. I am more angry at you than any other person on this forum. You are the very person who my Jewish Republican Pro-Israel group is fighting against: Jews who vote for the anti-Israel policy.

I have neer voted for any anti Israel Policy. I live in the US and I vote for what keeps Democracy alive in this country, including the right to vote for every citizens, and many other rights that too many just take for granted.

As I may have said to you, as I have said to other Jews, Israel's security does not depend on the US or any other country standing beside it. I have seen it happen again and again, as with Turkey and the boats, or the US not sending ammunition, where Israel took the high road and is now manufacturing its own. THAT is what Israel must do. Depend ONLY on itself and how to protect the population and the country.

Netanyahu did a lot to bring other countries to do business with Israel which eventually led to the Abraham Accords, which keeps growing in numbers of those who want to be part of it.

THAT is how I stand for the safety of Israel, the same way as I stand for the safety of the US, for both to remain democracies and not have to give up any of its safety rights, or its citizens rights.

 

[Winco]

EMH
Lisa558
Flash
Why won't you answer my question?

You just don't 'get it' and you never will.

This open enrollment that you are suggesting is logistically impossible.
If 300 student from schools A,B,C all want to go to school D with their voucher,
can you explain how this would be handled.

1). Staffing
2). Bussing
3). Facility Space

You care to address those and how school D would handle 900 additional students?

 

[Sixties Fan]

Exactly. Liberals think a “good curriculum” teaches more about past black oppression, transgenderism, and oral sex techniques. Conservatives want the focus on basic academic subjects.

I am not seeing any studies which say that all Democratic States, Cities, led by Democrats schools want to teach only what you are alleging they do.

Parents Differ Sharply by Party Over What Their K-12 Children Should Learn in School

Republican and Democratic parents differ widely over what their children should learn at school about gender identity, slavery and other topics.

www.pewresearch.org

 

[Sixties Fan]

Damn! The intent of vouchers isn’t to reduce the cost of public education. It is to give a choice to parents who don’t want their kids indoctrinated by the Democrats.

You continue to allege that all Public schools have a Democrat inclined curriculum. Without any evidence.