Are Some Cultures Superior to Others?

[Pheonixops]

Wry asked how do you define "culture".

I think it's a pretty dumb question.

How many definitions does culture have in regards to human society?



cul·ture
noun \ˈkəl-chər\

: the beliefs, customs, arts, etc., of a particular society, group, place, or time

: a particular society that has its own beliefs, ways of life, art, etc.

: a way of thinking, behaving, or working that exists in a place or organization (such as a business)

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Wry asked how do you define "culture".

I think it's a pretty dumb question.

How many definitions does culture have in regards to human society?



cul·ture
noun \ˈkəl-chər\

: the beliefs, customs, arts, etc., of a particular society, group, place, or time

: a particular society that has its own beliefs, ways of life, art, etc.

: a way of thinking, behaving, or working that exists in a place or organization (such as a business)

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Liberalism has changed from what it was 200+ years ago.

Liberals today do not support limited government and unrestricted free market as our Founders did.

 

[katsteve2012]

Wry asked how do you define "culture".

I think it's a pretty dumb question.

How many definitions does culture have in regards to human society?



cul·ture
noun \ˈkəl-chər\

: the beliefs, customs, arts, etc., of a particular society, group, place, or time

: a particular society that has its own beliefs, ways of life, art, etc.

: a way of thinking, behaving, or working that exists in a place or organization (such as a business)

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Wry asked how do you define "culture".

I think it's a pretty dumb question.

How many definitions does culture have in regards to human society?



cul·ture
noun \ˈkəl-chər\

: the beliefs, customs, arts, etc., of a particular society, group, place, or time

: a particular society that has its own beliefs, ways of life, art, etc.

: a way of thinking, behaving, or working that exists in a place or organization (such as a business)

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

 

[Asclepias]

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

Not from white controlled institutions. I have a strong suspicion that they are lying just like they seem to lie about a lot of things. Historically this has always happened in the Black community. It has a negative affect on perceptions of Black people. I wonder why the vast majority of Black people I know don't conform to the stats?

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

Not from white controlled institutions. I have a strong suspicion that they are lying just like they seem to lie about a lot of things. Historically this has always happened in the Black community. It has a negative affect on perceptions of Black people. I wonder why the vast majority of Black people I know don't conform to the stats?

Suspicion doesn't mean squat.

These are the facts.

History isn't on your side.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Wry asked how do you define "culture".

I think it's a pretty dumb question.

How many definitions does culture have in regards to human society?



cul·ture
noun \ˈkəl-chər\

: the beliefs, customs, arts, etc., of a particular society, group, place, or time

: a particular society that has its own beliefs, ways of life, art, etc.

: a way of thinking, behaving, or working that exists in a place or organization (such as a business)

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Liberalism has changed from what it was 200+ years ago.

Liberals today do not support limited government and unrestricted free market as our Founders did.

Don't reveal your ignorance by equating "unrestricted free market" with wanting to trade with our nations, bub. The various colonies had market restrictions on each other.

Where did you go to school?

 

[Asclepias]

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

Not from white controlled institutions. I have a strong suspicion that they are lying just like they seem to lie about a lot of things. Historically this has always happened in the Black community. It has a negative affect on perceptions of Black people. I wonder why the vast majority of Black people I know don't conform to the stats?

Suspicion doesn't mean squat.

These are the facts.

History isn't on your side.

Suspicion means everything. I dont believe the data points. Those are not facts. They only become facts when someone is dumb enough to believe in them.

 

[katsteve2012]

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

For starters, based on my calculations, 1 out 3 imprisoned does not equal a majority, nor does 12.6% equal a majority of those you are able to join the workforce.

Besides that, I base much of what I say and believe on my personal contact with a large circle of successful, college educated family oriented black people.

I don't usually read or respond to what you post, however I did notice once where you commented that you came in contact with blacks while in prison, so like me, much of what you believe may be based on what you have been exposed to, which is normal.

That's human nature.

 

[Pheonixops]

Wry asked how do you define "culture".

I think it's a pretty dumb question.

How many definitions does culture have in regards to human society?



cul·ture
noun \ˈkəl-chər\

: the beliefs, customs, arts, etc., of a particular society, group, place, or time

: a particular society that has its own beliefs, ways of life, art, etc.

: a way of thinking, behaving, or working that exists in a place or organization (such as a business)

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Liberalism has changed from what it was 200+ years ago.

Liberals today do not support limited government and unrestricted free market as our Founders did.

Liberalism is about "change" so to speak and thank God in some respects that it has changed, but the ideals are still there. How many people that support "big government" today are calling themselves Liberals? Do you think that conservative politicians support an unrestricted free-market? Was this country more "conservative" or "Liberal" in 1890 when :
"The Sherman Antitrust Act of 1890 was the first measure passed by the U.S. Congress to prohibit trusts. It was named for Senator John Sherman of Ohio, who was a chairman of the Senate finance committee and the Secretary of the Treasury under President Hayes. Several states had passed similar laws, but they were limited to intrastate businesses. The Sherman Antitrust Act was based on the constitutional power of Congress to regulate interstate commerce. (For more background, see previous milestone documents: the Constitution, Gibbons v. Ogden, and the Interstate Commerce Act.) The Sherman Anti-Trust Act passed the Senate by a vote of 51–1 on April 8, 1890, and the House by a unanimous vote of 242–0 on June 20, 1890. President Benjamin Harrison signed the bill into law on July 2, 1890."

As for "limited government", I think that's another word that different people have different interpretations and definitions. For instance some people may thing that Public Education is not "limited government" and that the Founding Fathers may have frowned upon, until they realize that:

George Washington " Washington was a Federalist, so he favored a strong central government."


Thomas Jefferson put forth a bill that has become one of his most enduring works on the subject of education: Bill 79, "A Bill for the More General Diffusion of Knowledge."

"The Bill was presented in the House of Delegates in 1778 and 1780, but was not passed; James Madison presented the bill several more times to the state legislature while Jefferson was serving in Paris as Minister to France. A much-revised version was finally passed into law in 1796 as an "Act to Establish Public Schools."


" Adams was a Federalist, and, as such, he held a more elitist view of government than his Republican rivals.

The first truly defense-minded president, Adams built the U.S. Navy to the point where it could compete with that of any nation.

Probably his most enduring political legacy was that he appointed John Marshall as Supreme Court Chief Justice. His most ignominious political legacy was his signing of the “Alien and Sedition Acts,” which made it a crime to criticize the government (violators could be imprisoned)."

"Hamilton was the one who most advocated an elitist political vision. He believed that the intellectual aristocracy should rule the nation.

Hamilton’s political legacy is embodied in the Federal Bank. He led the effort to establish the first such bank, which he saw as critical for sustaining the government’s fragile finances. His opponents saw the bank as an evil tool for expanding the power of the federal government, at the expense of the states. Hamilton is regarded as the “Father of the National Debt” because he felt that a national debt was really a “blessing.”
Founding Fathers, Constitution Day Materials, Pocket Constitution Book, US Constitution, Bill of Rights
etc, etc.

 

[Asclepias]

I believe most of the population is either in denial or they just don't know whats is going on. These concepts of culture, liberalism, conservatism, etc are just that concepts. Only one thing matters and that is truth. Your commitment to discovering the truth in this day and age is constantly disrupted by WMD's. Every since the beginning of feudalism in Europe where true slavery begin, the power structure has seen the benefit of creating a you vs me mentality in the common people. That system has been refined and redefined over the centuries culminating in the environment we now presently have. The playbook has been written and the people that control the money and knowledge are running the show with it.

 

[Pheonixops]

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

For starters, based on my calculations, 1 out 3 imprisoned does not equal a majority, nor does 12.6% equal a majority of those you are able to join the workforce.

Besides that, I base much of what I say and believe on my personal contact with a large circle of successful, college educated family oriented black people.

I don't usually read or respond to what you post, however I did notice once where you commented that you came in contact with blacks while in prison, so like me, much of what you believe may be based on what you have been exposed to, which is normal.

That's human nature.

Yep, based on those stats that means that an overwhelming majority of "them" are employed at a rate of 87.4% and 2/3 of "them" don't go to prison even though the deck in the justice system is stacked against them. Ron Paul addressed it here:
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6Cn4svUfd0]Busted! Ron Paul racist rant caught on tape! - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Pheonixops]

It's a valid question because some people tend to use words to define people or an ideology in an ignorant way. The word "Liberal" is a prime example, especially when some conservatives us it as a word of disparagement as well as forgetting that this country was Founded by Liberals and that the very Constitution they claim to hold in high regard , is a Liberal document.Many of the positive changes in this society were enacted by people with a Liberal mindset and ideology.

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

LOL, it's real "fun" to post a headline that supports your position, but it's even more fun to
analyze the report and find facts like this:

"We remain frustratingly short of our best ambitions
in this work. But in the matter of graduating
our kids, especially our African American male
students, we have made enormous strides. In the
period from 2006-07 to 2010-11, the dropout
rate for all students in the district declined from
9.4% to 4.2% — a 55% decrease. Our Black male
students were an engine for this progress, with
dropouts declining from 11.9% to 5.0% in the
same timeframe: a decrease of 58%. In 2010-
11, the first year that Maryland reported cohort
graduation rates that tracked every individual
student over time, 87% of our students who had
entered high school in 2007-08 had either graduated
or were still in school."

"Over the past nine years, there has been progress in the national graduation rate for male
students across the board. The national graduation rate for Black males has increased by 10
percentage points, from 42% in 2001-02 to 52% in 2009-10. This is the first year that more than half of the nation’s Black males in Grade 9 graduated with regular diplomas four years later."

Alaska 71%
Arizona 84%
Idaho 73%
Maine 97%
Oregon 72%
Utah 76%
Vermont 82%

There are plenty of other states that have over 52%, I thought that some conservatives and republicans claim that they "don't see color" and "don't break people up into groups (unless it's Blacks obviously)" , as well as "concentrate on the individual"?


"As Table 2 indicates, states with conspicuously large gaps between their graduation rates
for Black and White, non-Latino male students include the District of Columbia (50%),
Iowa (49%), Nebraska (43%) and New York (42%). As in previous years, states with relatively small Black populations achieve high graduation rates for Black male students (Maine, Utah,Vermont, Idaho). This seems to indicate that Black males, on average, perform better in places and spaces where they are not relegated to under-resourced districts or schools. When provided similar opportunities they are more likely to produce similar or better outcomes as their White male peers."

"On average, states with low graduation rates for Black male students (New York, Nebraska,
South Carolina, Delaware, Illinois, Florida) tend to have concentrations of those students in under-resourced districts (New York City, Charleston, Duval County, FL and Chicago) where both Black and White male students perform poorly."

The funny thing about the study, is how they saw certain people "coming" when they closed with this:

"Historically, a common reaction to these data outcomes has been to make a leap from poor graduation outcomes for Black males to the formation and promotion of negative public perceptions of Black males’ abilities and roles in society. Let us be clear: The Schott Foundation firmly believes that these data are not indicative of a character flaw in Black boys and men, but rather they are evidence of an unconscionable level of willful neglect and disparate resource allocations by federal, state and local entities and a level of indifference by too many community leaders. Yet, despite these challenges, many Black males progress to further education and work in communities across the nation making positive impacts— accomplishments given not nearly as much public attention as the negative perceptions are given."

 

[katsteve2012]

Excellent summation. Just to add to what you state, so called "black culture" is often defined on this board by certain individuals as a "violent, hip- hop" loving, culture that disdains education and work ethic.

When on the other hand, more than less black people over 35 are employed, religious, do not like hip hop, disdain violence and desire to live peacefully.

Just as the majority of white people are not Aryan supremacists, who believe in "master race" theories.

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

LOL, it's real "fun" to post a headline that supports your position, but it's even more fun to
analyze the report and find facts like this:

"We remain frustratingly short of our best ambitions
in this work. But in the matter of graduating
our kids, especially our African American male
students, we have made enormous strides. In the
period from 2006-07 to 2010-11, the dropout
rate for all students in the district declined from
9.4% to 4.2% — a 55% decrease. Our Black male
students were an engine for this progress, with
dropouts declining from 11.9% to 5.0% in the
same timeframe: a decrease of 58%. In 2010-
11, the first year that Maryland reported cohort
graduation rates that tracked every individual
student over time, 87% of our students who had
entered high school in 2007-08 had either graduated
or were still in school."

"Over the past nine years, there has been progress in the national graduation rate for male
students across the board. The national graduation rate for Black males has increased by 10
percentage points, from 42% in 2001-02 to 52% in 2009-10. This is the first year that more than half of the nation’s Black males in Grade 9 graduated with regular diplomas four years later."

Alaska 71%
Arizona 84%
Idaho 73%
Maine 97%
Oregon 72%
Utah 76%
Vermont 82%

There are plenty of other states that have over 52%, I thought that some conservatives and republicans claim that they "don't see color" and "don't break people up into groups (unless it's Blacks obviously)" , as well as "concentrate on the individual"?


"As Table 2 indicates, states with conspicuously large gaps between their graduation rates
for Black and White, non-Latino male students include the District of Columbia (50%),
Iowa (49%), Nebraska (43%) and New York (42%). As in previous years, states with relatively small Black populations achieve high graduation rates for Black male students (Maine, Utah,Vermont, Idaho). This seems to indicate that Black males, on average, perform better in places and spaces where they are not relegated to under-resourced districts or schools. When provided similar opportunities they are more likely to produce similar or better outcomes as their White male peers."

"On average, states with low graduation rates for Black male students (New York, Nebraska,
South Carolina, Delaware, Illinois, Florida) tend to have concentrations of those students in under-resourced districts (New York City, Charleston, Duval County, FL and Chicago) where both Black and White male students perform poorly."

The funny thing about the study, is how they saw certain people "coming" when they closed with this:

"Historically, a common reaction to these data outcomes has been to make a leap from poor graduation outcomes for Black males to the formation and promotion of negative public perceptions of Black males’ abilities and roles in society. Let us be clear: The Schott Foundation firmly believes that these data are not indicative of a character flaw in Black boys and men, but rather they are evidence of an unconscionable level of willful neglect and disparate resource allocations by federal, state and local entities and a level of indifference by too many community leaders. Yet, despite these challenges, many Black males progress to further education and work in communities across the nation making positive impacts— accomplishments given not nearly as much public attention as the negative perceptions are given."

Thanks for posting this Pheonix. I was looking at some of the same statistics. Obviously, you have a lot more patience than I do.

 

[Pheonixops]

I'm curious to see where you got your stats.

The violent, hip hop, disdains education, lacks work ethics and lets add criminal behavior, isn't a stereotype that someone just made up out of thin air.

You have 72 percent of blacks babies born out of wedlock, you have black unemployment at a five year low is 12.6 percent almost twice as much as the national average.

One in three black men can expect to go to prison in their lifetime according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Only 52 percent of black males graduate high school.

LOL, it's real "fun" to post a headline that supports your position, but it's even more fun to
analyze the report and find facts like this:

"We remain frustratingly short of our best ambitions
in this work. But in the matter of graduating
our kids, especially our African American male
students, we have made enormous strides. In the
period from 2006-07 to 2010-11, the dropout
rate for all students in the district declined from
9.4% to 4.2% — a 55% decrease. Our Black male
students were an engine for this progress, with
dropouts declining from 11.9% to 5.0% in the
same timeframe: a decrease of 58%. In 2010-
11, the first year that Maryland reported cohort
graduation rates that tracked every individual
student over time, 87% of our students who had
entered high school in 2007-08 had either graduated
or were still in school."

"Over the past nine years, there has been progress in the national graduation rate for male
students across the board. The national graduation rate for Black males has increased by 10
percentage points, from 42% in 2001-02 to 52% in 2009-10. This is the first year that more than half of the nation’s Black males in Grade 9 graduated with regular diplomas four years later."

Alaska 71%
Arizona 84%
Idaho 73%
Maine 97%
Oregon 72%
Utah 76%
Vermont 82%

There are plenty of other states that have over 52%, I thought that some conservatives and republicans claim that they "don't see color" and "don't break people up into groups (unless it's Blacks obviously)" , as well as "concentrate on the individual"?


"As Table 2 indicates, states with conspicuously large gaps between their graduation rates
for Black and White, non-Latino male students include the District of Columbia (50%),
Iowa (49%), Nebraska (43%) and New York (42%). As in previous years, states with relatively small Black populations achieve high graduation rates for Black male students (Maine, Utah,Vermont, Idaho). This seems to indicate that Black males, on average, perform better in places and spaces where they are not relegated to under-resourced districts or schools. When provided similar opportunities they are more likely to produce similar or better outcomes as their White male peers."

"On average, states with low graduation rates for Black male students (New York, Nebraska,
South Carolina, Delaware, Illinois, Florida) tend to have concentrations of those students in under-resourced districts (New York City, Charleston, Duval County, FL and Chicago) where both Black and White male students perform poorly."

The funny thing about the study, is how they saw certain people "coming" when they closed with this:

"Historically, a common reaction to these data outcomes has been to make a leap from poor graduation outcomes for Black males to the formation and promotion of negative public perceptions of Black males’ abilities and roles in society. Let us be clear: The Schott Foundation firmly believes that these data are not indicative of a character flaw in Black boys and men, but rather they are evidence of an unconscionable level of willful neglect and disparate resource allocations by federal, state and local entities and a level of indifference by too many community leaders. Yet, despite these challenges, many Black males progress to further education and work in communities across the nation making positive impacts— accomplishments given not nearly as much public attention as the negative perceptions are given."

Thanks for posting this Pheonix. I was looking at some of the same statistics. Obviously, you have a lot more patience than I do.

Thanks Brother. I just trying to help some of the posters here who still carry this "baggage" written about below. As you can see, their same attitudes persist to this day. I will add that this was not just a "Southern" phenomena, it existed and still exists at many quarters thru-out this country.

"Other ex-slaves can relate many such cases as the Hawkins' case and such instances, in my opinion, have been the cause of the intense hatred of slaves against the poor whites of the South, and I believe that from such troubles originate the term "poor white trash". In many ways this unfortunate class of Southern people had but a few more privileges than the slaves. True, they were free, could go where they pleased without a "pass," but they could not, with impunity, dispute the word of the rich in anything, and obeyed their masters as did the slaves. It has been stated by many writers, and I accept it as true, that the Emancipation Proclamation issued by President Lincoln, not only freed the slaves, but the poor whites of the South as well, for they occupied a condition nearly approaching that of slavery.

They were nominally free, but that freedom was greatly restricted on account of the prejudice against them as a class. They were often employed by the ruling class to do small jobs of work and while so engaged were not allowed, even to eat with them at the same table, neither could they in any way associate or intermarry with the upper classes. Of course this unfortunate class of people had a vote, but it was always cast just as the master class directed, and not
Page 31

as the voter desired, if he had a desire. I recall very clearly the fact, that at each Country, State or National election the poor white people were hauled to the voting places in wagons belonging to the aristocratic class. They also furnished a prepared ballot for each man and woe unto that poor white man who failed to vote that ticket or come when sent for. Each one of the master class kept a strict lookout for every poor white man in his neighborhood and on election days sent his wagons and brought each one of these voters to the polls.

When the war of the Rebellion broke out this class of men constituted the rank and file of the Confederate army and rendered good service to their masters, who had only to speak a kind word to them when the would take the oath and obediently march to the front, officered by the aristocratic class. These poor people contributed their full share to the death roll of the Southern Army.

True to his low instinct, the poor white man is represented at the South as the enemy of the Colored people to-day, just as he was before the war, and is still as illiterate as he was then. He is not far enough up the scale to see the advantage of education, and will not send his children to school, nor allow the Colored child to go, if it is in his power to prevent it. It is this class who burn the school houses in the Southland to-day. The aristocracy and the Colored people of the South would get along splendidly, were it not for these poor whites, who are the leaders in all the disorders, lynchings and the like. The South will be the garden spot, the cradle of liberty, the haven of America, when the typical poor whites of that section shall have died off, removed, or become educated, and not till then."
Henry Clay Bruce, 1836-1902. The New Man. Twenty-Nine Years a Slave. Twenty-Nine Years a Free Man.

 

[katsteve2012]

LOL, it's real "fun" to post a headline that supports your position, but it's even more fun to
analyze the report and find facts like this:

"We remain frustratingly short of our best ambitions
in this work. But in the matter of graduating
our kids, especially our African American male
students, we have made enormous strides. In the
period from 2006-07 to 2010-11, the dropout
rate for all students in the district declined from
9.4% to 4.2% — a 55% decrease. Our Black male
students were an engine for this progress, with
dropouts declining from 11.9% to 5.0% in the
same timeframe: a decrease of 58%. In 2010-
11, the first year that Maryland reported cohort
graduation rates that tracked every individual
student over time, 87% of our students who had
entered high school in 2007-08 had either graduated
or were still in school."

"Over the past nine years, there has been progress in the national graduation rate for male
students across the board. The national graduation rate for Black males has increased by 10
percentage points, from 42% in 2001-02 to 52% in 2009-10. This is the first year that more than half of the nation’s Black males in Grade 9 graduated with regular diplomas four years later."

Alaska 71%
Arizona 84%
Idaho 73%
Maine 97%
Oregon 72%
Utah 76%
Vermont 82%

There are plenty of other states that have over 52%, I thought that some conservatives and republicans claim that they "don't see color" and "don't break people up into groups (unless it's Blacks obviously)" , as well as "concentrate on the individual"?


"As Table 2 indicates, states with conspicuously large gaps between their graduation rates
for Black and White, non-Latino male students include the District of Columbia (50%),
Iowa (49%), Nebraska (43%) and New York (42%). As in previous years, states with relatively small Black populations achieve high graduation rates for Black male students (Maine, Utah,Vermont, Idaho). This seems to indicate that Black males, on average, perform better in places and spaces where they are not relegated to under-resourced districts or schools. When provided similar opportunities they are more likely to produce similar or better outcomes as their White male peers."

"On average, states with low graduation rates for Black male students (New York, Nebraska,
South Carolina, Delaware, Illinois, Florida) tend to have concentrations of those students in under-resourced districts (New York City, Charleston, Duval County, FL and Chicago) where both Black and White male students perform poorly."

The funny thing about the study, is how they saw certain people "coming" when they closed with this:

"Historically, a common reaction to these data outcomes has been to make a leap from poor graduation outcomes for Black males to the formation and promotion of negative public perceptions of Black males’ abilities and roles in society. Let us be clear: The Schott Foundation firmly believes that these data are not indicative of a character flaw in Black boys and men, but rather they are evidence of an unconscionable level of willful neglect and disparate resource allocations by federal, state and local entities and a level of indifference by too many community leaders. Yet, despite these challenges, many Black males progress to further education and work in communities across the nation making positive impacts— accomplishments given not nearly as much public attention as the negative perceptions are given."

Thanks for posting this Pheonix. I was looking at some of the same statistics. Obviously, you have a lot more patience than I do.

Thanks Brother. I just trying to help some of the posters here who still carry this "baggage" written about below. As you can see, their same attitudes persist to this day. I will add that this was not just a "Southern" phenomena, it existed and still exists at many quarters thru-out this country.

"Other ex-slaves can relate many such cases as the Hawkins' case and such instances, in my opinion, have been the cause of the intense hatred of slaves against the poor whites of the South, and I believe that from such troubles originate the term "poor white trash". In many ways this unfortunate class of Southern people had but a few more privileges than the slaves. True, they were free, could go where they pleased without a "pass," but they could not, with impunity, dispute the word of the rich in anything, and obeyed their masters as did the slaves. It has been stated by many writers, and I accept it as true, that the Emancipation Proclamation issued by President Lincoln, not only freed the slaves, but the poor whites of the South as well, for they occupied a condition nearly approaching that of slavery.

They were nominally free, but that freedom was greatly restricted on account of the prejudice against them as a class. They were often employed by the ruling class to do small jobs of work and while so engaged were not allowed, even to eat with them at the same table, neither could they in any way associate or intermarry with the upper classes. Of course this unfortunate class of people had a vote, but it was always cast just as the master class directed, and not
Page 31

as the voter desired, if he had a desire. I recall very clearly the fact, that at each Country, State or National election the poor white people were hauled to the voting places in wagons belonging to the aristocratic class. They also furnished a prepared ballot for each man and woe unto that poor white man who failed to vote that ticket or come when sent for. Each one of the master class kept a strict lookout for every poor white man in his neighborhood and on election days sent his wagons and brought each one of these voters to the polls.

When the war of the Rebellion broke out this class of men constituted the rank and file of the Confederate army and rendered good service to their masters, who had only to speak a kind word to them when the would take the oath and obediently march to the front, officered by the aristocratic class. These poor people contributed their full share to the death roll of the Southern Army.

True to his low instinct, the poor white man is represented at the South as the enemy of the Colored people to-day, just as he was before the war, and is still as illiterate as he was then. He is not far enough up the scale to see the advantage of education, and will not send his children to school, nor allow the Colored child to go, if it is in his power to prevent it. It is this class who burn the school houses in the Southland to-day. The aristocracy and the Colored people of the South would get along splendidly, were it not for these poor whites, who are the leaders in all the disorders, lynchings and the like. The South will be the garden spot, the cradle of liberty, the haven of America, when the typical poor whites of that section shall have died off, removed, or become educated, and not till then."
Henry Clay Bruce, 1836-1902. The New Man. Twenty-Nine Years a Slave. Twenty-Nine Years a Free Man.

Indeed the same attitudes exist today, and in some ways are more visible than they were in the 60's and 70's, and even though the south is where it was deeply ingrained as a part of THAT culture, it was not entirely a southern phenomena, then or now.

You might find an interest in the following book that a friend recommended to me and I just finished it. Very interesting read, and a true story. Joe Madison recently interviewed the author on his radio talk show.


Snow-Storm in August by Jefferson Morley - Book - eBook - Random House

 

[Pheonixops]

Thanks for posting this Pheonix. I was looking at some of the same statistics. Obviously, you have a lot more patience than I do.

Thanks Brother. I just trying to help some of the posters here who still carry this "baggage" written about below. As you can see, their same attitudes persist to this day. I will add that this was not just a "Southern" phenomena, it existed and still exists at many quarters thru-out this country.

"Other ex-slaves can relate many such cases as the Hawkins' case and such instances, in my opinion, have been the cause of the intense hatred of slaves against the poor whites of the South, and I believe that from such troubles originate the term "poor white trash". In many ways this unfortunate class of Southern people had but a few more privileges than the slaves. True, they were free, could go where they pleased without a "pass," but they could not, with impunity, dispute the word of the rich in anything, and obeyed their masters as did the slaves. It has been stated by many writers, and I accept it as true, that the Emancipation Proclamation issued by President Lincoln, not only freed the slaves, but the poor whites of the South as well, for they occupied a condition nearly approaching that of slavery.

They were nominally free, but that freedom was greatly restricted on account of the prejudice against them as a class. They were often employed by the ruling class to do small jobs of work and while so engaged were not allowed, even to eat with them at the same table, neither could they in any way associate or intermarry with the upper classes. Of course this unfortunate class of people had a vote, but it was always cast just as the master class directed, and not
Page 31

as the voter desired, if he had a desire. I recall very clearly the fact, that at each Country, State or National election the poor white people were hauled to the voting places in wagons belonging to the aristocratic class. They also furnished a prepared ballot for each man and woe unto that poor white man who failed to vote that ticket or come when sent for. Each one of the master class kept a strict lookout for every poor white man in his neighborhood and on election days sent his wagons and brought each one of these voters to the polls.

When the war of the Rebellion broke out this class of men constituted the rank and file of the Confederate army and rendered good service to their masters, who had only to speak a kind word to them when the would take the oath and obediently march to the front, officered by the aristocratic class. These poor people contributed their full share to the death roll of the Southern Army.

True to his low instinct, the poor white man is represented at the South as the enemy of the Colored people to-day, just as he was before the war, and is still as illiterate as he was then. He is not far enough up the scale to see the advantage of education, and will not send his children to school, nor allow the Colored child to go, if it is in his power to prevent it. It is this class who burn the school houses in the Southland to-day. The aristocracy and the Colored people of the South would get along splendidly, were it not for these poor whites, who are the leaders in all the disorders, lynchings and the like. The South will be the garden spot, the cradle of liberty, the haven of America, when the typical poor whites of that section shall have died off, removed, or become educated, and not till then."
Henry Clay Bruce, 1836-1902. The New Man. Twenty-Nine Years a Slave. Twenty-Nine Years a Free Man.

Indeed the same attitudes exist today, and in some ways are more visible than they were in the 60's and 70's, and even though the south is where it was deeply ingrained as a part of THAT culture, it was not entirely a southern phenomena, then or now.

You might find an interest in the following book that a friend recommended to me and I just finished it. Very interesting read, and a true story. Joe Madison recently interviewed the author on his radio talk show.


Snow-Storm in August by Jefferson Morley - Book - eBook - Random House

Thanks Bro, I am going to check out the preview/sample. If anyone else is interested, the preview is here:

Snow-Storm in August: Washington City, Francis Scott Key, and the Forgotten ... - Jefferson Morley - Google Books

 

[Luddly Neddite]

The superiority is in the eye of beholder.




.

 

[Pheonixops]

Thanks for posting this Pheonix. I was looking at some of the same statistics. Obviously, you have a lot more patience than I do.

Thanks Brother. I just trying to help some of the posters here who still carry this "baggage" written about below. As you can see, their same attitudes persist to this day. I will add that this was not just a "Southern" phenomena, it existed and still exists at many quarters thru-out this country.

"Other ex-slaves can relate many such cases as the Hawkins' case and such instances, in my opinion, have been the cause of the intense hatred of slaves against the poor whites of the South, and I believe that from such troubles originate the term "poor white trash". In many ways this unfortunate class of Southern people had but a few more privileges than the slaves. True, they were free, could go where they pleased without a "pass," but they could not, with impunity, dispute the word of the rich in anything, and obeyed their masters as did the slaves. It has been stated by many writers, and I accept it as true, that the Emancipation Proclamation issued by President Lincoln, not only freed the slaves, but the poor whites of the South as well, for they occupied a condition nearly approaching that of slavery.

They were nominally free, but that freedom was greatly restricted on account of the prejudice against them as a class. They were often employed by the ruling class to do small jobs of work and while so engaged were not allowed, even to eat with them at the same table, neither could they in any way associate or intermarry with the upper classes. Of course this unfortunate class of people had a vote, but it was always cast just as the master class directed, and not
Page 31

as the voter desired, if he had a desire. I recall very clearly the fact, that at each Country, State or National election the poor white people were hauled to the voting places in wagons belonging to the aristocratic class. They also furnished a prepared ballot for each man and woe unto that poor white man who failed to vote that ticket or come when sent for. Each one of the master class kept a strict lookout for every poor white man in his neighborhood and on election days sent his wagons and brought each one of these voters to the polls.

When the war of the Rebellion broke out this class of men constituted the rank and file of the Confederate army and rendered good service to their masters, who had only to speak a kind word to them when the would take the oath and obediently march to the front, officered by the aristocratic class. These poor people contributed their full share to the death roll of the Southern Army.

True to his low instinct, the poor white man is represented at the South as the enemy of the Colored people to-day, just as he was before the war, and is still as illiterate as he was then. He is not far enough up the scale to see the advantage of education, and will not send his children to school, nor allow the Colored child to go, if it is in his power to prevent it. It is this class who burn the school houses in the Southland to-day. The aristocracy and the Colored people of the South would get along splendidly, were it not for these poor whites, who are the leaders in all the disorders, lynchings and the like. The South will be the garden spot, the cradle of liberty, the haven of America, when the typical poor whites of that section shall have died off, removed, or become educated, and not till then."
Henry Clay Bruce, 1836-1902. The New Man. Twenty-Nine Years a Slave. Twenty-Nine Years a Free Man.

Indeed the same attitudes exist today, and in some ways are more visible than they were in the 60's and 70's, and even though the south is where it was deeply ingrained as a part of THAT culture, it was not entirely a southern phenomena, then or now.

You might find an interest in the following book that a friend recommended to me and I just finished it. Very interesting read, and a true story. Joe Madison recently interviewed the author on his radio talk show.


Snow-Storm in August by Jefferson Morley - Book - eBook - Random House

P.S. I'm reading the preview and it diverted me fro my other book. It's a good read, thank you! Just to add; ironically on page 12 of the book, I'm pretty sure that Yellow House used to confine and sell the slave was referenced in Solomon Winthrop's book called "12 Years a Slave".

 

[Meathead]

The superiority is in the eye of beholder.




.

Look at the statistics and get back to me. There is little left to the eye of the beholder in the USA or elsewhere.