Biden on forgiving student loan debt

[Slade3200]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


View attachment 458304

The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

I don't need a mortgage. I was asked how it would affect me. All the same, I've already disputed the accusation that when banks were paying 7% that home loans were 15% so dismissed.

Ooh boy, you sure showed me... you win. I guess thats all your looking for instead of a substantive debate. Good day

You wanted an example. I provided quite a few. So what do you consider a debate? Answering your question doesn't qualify?

You provided some examples yes and then I asked about the examples. Like the interest rates. Why do you think the national debt effected the interest rates? They were obviously lowered to encourage borrowing. Why would we want to encourage borrowing? Because that creates new money and stimulates the economy. It also give people the opportunity to own houses and start new businesses. Those are the real reasons why interest rates have changed. If you disagree and still think it is because of the national debt then please explain why and how

 

[Slade3200]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


View attachment 458304

The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

I don't need a mortgage. I was asked how it would affect me. All the same, I've already disputed the accusation that when banks were paying 7% that home loans were 15% so dismissed.

Ooh boy, you sure showed me... you win. I guess thats all your looking for instead of a substantive debate. Good day

He is a typical leftist. There are many on this board. Zero financial acumen.

Well its interesting because he was speaking out against the national debt, which I'm in total agreement with, however I like to dive into the details and test my and others understanding of it. So the simple question of "What effects of the national debt have you actually felt in your lifetime" I've found to be a very interesting. And its find to say "I don't know" if you don't know. Just want an honest conversation. But he avoided the answer and then when for some cheap word game thing to chalk up a win. He can have a win if thats all he wants. I don't really care, I don't think anybody else does either.

I answered your question. You did nothing to touch it. As a retiree I could conceivably live on 7% interest which would be near zero risk. Because of the debt the interest rates on savings have been driven down to near zero.

Put your money in a mutual fund and earn 8-10% on the conservative side. Put it in an annuity if you want guaranteed growth. In the mean time people can borrow money for cheap to buy homes, go to school and start businesses.

 

[Slade3200]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


View attachment 458304

The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

I don't need a mortgage. I was asked how it would affect me. All the same, I've already disputed the accusation that when banks were paying 7% that home loans were 15% so dismissed.

Ooh boy, you sure showed me... you win. I guess thats all your looking for instead of a substantive debate. Good day

He is a typical leftist. There are many on this board. Zero financial acumen.

Well its interesting because he was speaking out against the national debt, which I'm in total agreement with, however I like to dive into the details and test my and others understanding of it. So the simple question of "What effects of the national debt have you actually felt in your lifetime" I've found to be a very interesting. And its find to say "I don't know" if you don't know. Just want an honest conversation. But he avoided the answer and then when for some cheap word game thing to chalk up a win. He can have a win if thats all he wants. I don't really care, I don't think anybody else does either.

I answered your question. You did nothing to touch it. As a retiree I could conceivably live on 7% interest which would be near zero risk. Because of the debt the interest rates on savings have been driven down to near zero.

I don't mean to pick on you, I just get testy when it feels like somebody is not being direct in conversations.

 

[pknopp]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


View attachment 458304

The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

I don't need a mortgage. I was asked how it would affect me. All the same, I've already disputed the accusation that when banks were paying 7% that home loans were 15% so dismissed.

Ooh boy, you sure showed me... you win. I guess thats all your looking for instead of a substantive debate. Good day

You wanted an example. I provided quite a few. So what do you consider a debate? Answering your question doesn't qualify?

You provided some examples yes and then I asked about the examples. Like the interest rates. Why do you think the national debt effected the interest rates? They were obviously lowered to encourage borrowing. Why would we want to encourage borrowing? Because that creates new money and stimulates the economy. It also give people the opportunity to own houses and start new businesses. Those are the real reasons why interest rates have changed. If you disagree and still think it is because of the national debt then please explain why and how

Please. If you want a debate, either don't pretend to not understand or educate yourself.

 

[Brain357]

I hope he doesn’t. It will just promote schools to charge more.

If you want to solve that issue then stop guaranteeing student loan debt. A student who gets a business degree is a lot more likely to pay off debts than one who gets a degree in music and ends up working at Burger King. Paying $100k for a degree in music is nuts but its even more nuts if you take out $100k worth of debt to pay for it. Colleges charge it because of Gov't approved loans. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

gotta disagree with you there. Music is one of mankind greatest inventions. Its not necessary to go to school for it but for those with the talent and passion school is where they can take it to the next level and make an impression that may impact the world for centuries to come

And what is the average salary for music degree holders?

Why does that matter?

Because they are borrowing to go to school. Isn’t it irresponsible to let people borrow if they will be in debt forever?

Who said they are being irresponsible? You are the one making the leap. Show where music majors are not paying their loans.

I know a lot of people with regrets about going to school and how much they still owe. A LOT of people.

 

[Brain357]

I hope he doesn’t. It will just promote schools to charge more.

If you want to solve that issue then stop guaranteeing student loan debt. A student who gets a business degree is a lot more likely to pay off debts than one who gets a degree in music and ends up working at Burger King. Paying $100k for a degree in music is nuts but its even more nuts if you take out $100k worth of debt to pay for it. Colleges charge it because of Gov't approved loans. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

gotta disagree with you there. Music is one of mankind greatest inventions. Its not necessary to go to school for it but for those with the talent and passion school is where they can take it to the next level and make an impression that may impact the world for centuries to come

And what is the average salary for music degree holders?

I got no clue. Why does that matter?

Because people who take forever to repay seems to have lots of regrets.

 

[bendog]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


View attachment 458304

The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

I don't need a mortgage. I was asked how it would affect me. All the same, I've already disputed the accusation that when banks were paying 7% that home loans were 15% so dismissed.

Ooh boy, you sure showed me... you win. I guess thats all your looking for instead of a substantive debate. Good day

He is a typical leftist. There are many on this board. Zero financial acumen.

Well its interesting because he was speaking out against the national debt, which I'm in total agreement with, however I like to dive into the details and test my and others understanding of it. So the simple question of "What effects of the national debt have you actually felt in your lifetime" I've found to be a very interesting. And its find to say "I don't know" if you don't know. Just want an honest conversation. But he avoided the answer and then went for some cheap word game thing to chalk up a win. He can have a win if thats all he wants. I don't really care, I don't think anybody else does either.

It is interesting in that the debt in theory shoudl have weakened the dollar and caused inflation, and it did neither. Possibly because the imports were cheap.

 

[pknopp]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


View attachment 458304

The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

I don't need a mortgage. I was asked how it would affect me. All the same, I've already disputed the accusation that when banks were paying 7% that home loans were 15% so dismissed.

Ooh boy, you sure showed me... you win. I guess thats all your looking for instead of a substantive debate. Good day

He is a typical leftist. There are many on this board. Zero financial acumen.

Well its interesting because he was speaking out against the national debt, which I'm in total agreement with, however I like to dive into the details and test my and others understanding of it. So the simple question of "What effects of the national debt have you actually felt in your lifetime" I've found to be a very interesting. And its find to say "I don't know" if you don't know. Just want an honest conversation. But he avoided the answer and then when for some cheap word game thing to chalk up a win. He can have a win if thats all he wants. I don't really care, I don't think anybody else does either.

I answered your question. You did nothing to touch it. As a retiree I could conceivably live on 7% interest which would be near zero risk. Because of the debt the interest rates on savings have been driven down to near zero.

Put your money in a mutual fund and earn 8-10% on the conservative side. Put it in an annuity if you want guaranteed growth. In the mean time people can borrow money for cheap to buy homes, go to school and start businesses.

You asked me how it affected me, not those who wish to take out a mortgage.

Forgiving loans will cause costs to rise but ultra low interest rates won't?

Annuity rates are 2-3%.

 

[Brain357]

Most of these people hoping for loan forgiveness must regret spending so much for school.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


View attachment 458304

The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

I don't need a mortgage. I was asked how it would affect me. All the same, I've already disputed the accusation that when banks were paying 7% that home loans were 15% so dismissed.

Ooh boy, you sure showed me... you win. I guess thats all your looking for instead of a substantive debate. Good day

He is a typical leftist. There are many on this board. Zero financial acumen.

Well its interesting because he was speaking out against the national debt, which I'm in total agreement with, however I like to dive into the details and test my and others understanding of it. So the simple question of "What effects of the national debt have you actually felt in your lifetime" I've found to be a very interesting. And its find to say "I don't know" if you don't know. Just want an honest conversation. But he avoided the answer and then went for some cheap word game thing to chalk up a win. He can have a win if thats all he wants. I don't really care, I don't think anybody else does either.

Yes...two parts. Entitlements and military spend. We need the military spend as it creates jobs in the corporate sector, helps keep us safe and is innovative. Entitlements are off the charts. We need to better control that. Debt doesn't impact our daily lives because we can print money and US innovation and overall safeness keeps USD as the primary currency but China is challenging that. This to me is the bigger risk. Currency devaluation vs. debt.

 

[pknopp]

I hope he doesn’t. It will just promote schools to charge more.

If you want to solve that issue then stop guaranteeing student loan debt. A student who gets a business degree is a lot more likely to pay off debts than one who gets a degree in music and ends up working at Burger King. Paying $100k for a degree in music is nuts but its even more nuts if you take out $100k worth of debt to pay for it. Colleges charge it because of Gov't approved loans. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

gotta disagree with you there. Music is one of mankind greatest inventions. Its not necessary to go to school for it but for those with the talent and passion school is where they can take it to the next level and make an impression that may impact the world for centuries to come

And what is the average salary for music degree holders?

Why does that matter?

Because they are borrowing to go to school. Isn’t it irresponsible to let people borrow if they will be in debt forever?

Who said they are being irresponsible? You are the one making the leap. Show where music majors are not paying their loans.

I know a lot of people with regrets about going to school and how much they still owe. A LOT of people.

So what? The small number of people you claim to know is irrelevant. I kinda doubt there are many lawyers, doctors, bankers, etc that wished they had skipped school and became a fry cook.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Most of these people hoping for loan forgiveness must regret spending so much for school.

Or didn't realize the magnitude. 18-year olds typically are not financially savvy.

 

[pknopp]

Most of these people hoping for loan forgiveness must regret spending so much for school.

Did GM regret being an auto manufacturer when they got their loans forgiven?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

I hope he doesn’t. It will just promote schools to charge more.

If you want to solve that issue then stop guaranteeing student loan debt. A student who gets a business degree is a lot more likely to pay off debts than one who gets a degree in music and ends up working at Burger King. Paying $100k for a degree in music is nuts but its even more nuts if you take out $100k worth of debt to pay for it. Colleges charge it because of Gov't approved loans. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

gotta disagree with you there. Music is one of mankind greatest inventions. Its not necessary to go to school for it but for those with the talent and passion school is where they can take it to the next level and make an impression that may impact the world for centuries to come

And what is the average salary for music degree holders?

Why does that matter?

Because they are borrowing to go to school. Isn’t it irresponsible to let people borrow if they will be in debt forever?

Who said they are being irresponsible? You are the one making the leap. Show where music majors are not paying their loans.

I know a lot of people with regrets about going to school and how much they still owe. A LOT of people.

So what? The small number of people you claim to know is irrelevant. I kinda doubt there are many lawyers, doctors, bankers, etc that wished they had skipped school and became a fry cook.

I agree with Brain. Same here. I was fortunate but many are not. Even now I wish I were more handy.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

Most of these people hoping for loan forgiveness must regret spending so much for school.

Did GM regret being an auto manufacturer when they got their loans forgiven?

GM got their loans forgiven? Link that please.

 

[pknopp]

Most of these people hoping for loan forgiveness must regret spending so much for school.

Did GM regret being an auto manufacturer when they got their loans forgiven?

GM got their loans forgiven? Link that please.

OMG, educate yourself. This has been covered so many times....................it really gets old.

 

[Brain357]

I hope he doesn’t. It will just promote schools to charge more.

If you want to solve that issue then stop guaranteeing student loan debt. A student who gets a business degree is a lot more likely to pay off debts than one who gets a degree in music and ends up working at Burger King. Paying $100k for a degree in music is nuts but its even more nuts if you take out $100k worth of debt to pay for it. Colleges charge it because of Gov't approved loans. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

gotta disagree with you there. Music is one of mankind greatest inventions. Its not necessary to go to school for it but for those with the talent and passion school is where they can take it to the next level and make an impression that may impact the world for centuries to come

And what is the average salary for music degree holders?

Why does that matter?

Because they are borrowing to go to school. Isn’t it irresponsible to let people borrow if they will be in debt forever?

Who said they are being irresponsible? You are the one making the leap. Show where music majors are not paying their loans.

I know a lot of people with regrets about going to school and how much they still owe. A LOT of people.

So what? The small number of people you claim to know is irrelevant. I kinda doubt there are many lawyers, doctors, bankers, etc that wished they had skipped school and became a fry cook.

Yes but there are lots of people asking for this loan forgiveness. If they are happy with their education and how much they paid it’s really dishonest to be asking for forgiveness.

 

[Brain357]

If people dont have regrets, there is no reason for loan forgiveness...

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

I hope he doesn’t. It will just promote schools to charge more.

If you want to solve that issue then stop guaranteeing student loan debt. A student who gets a business degree is a lot more likely to pay off debts than one who gets a degree in music and ends up working at Burger King. Paying $100k for a degree in music is nuts but its even more nuts if you take out $100k worth of debt to pay for it. Colleges charge it because of Gov't approved loans. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

gotta disagree with you there. Music is one of mankind greatest inventions. Its not necessary to go to school for it but for those with the talent and passion school is where they can take it to the next level and make an impression that may impact the world for centuries to come

And what is the average salary for music degree holders?

Why does that matter?

Because they are borrowing to go to school. Isn’t it irresponsible to let people borrow if they will be in debt forever?

Who said they are being irresponsible? You are the one making the leap. Show where music majors are not paying their loans.

I know a lot of people with regrets about going to school and how much they still owe. A LOT of people.

So what? The small number of people you claim to know is irrelevant. I kinda doubt there are many lawyers, doctors, bankers, etc that wished they had skipped school and became a fry cook.

Yes but there are lots of people asking for this loan forgiveness. If they are happy with their education and how much they paid it’s really dishonest to be asking for forgiveness.

Bingo! I would NEVER ask for a Gov't handout. I feel dirty even advising companies on the PPP process but that is my job and the Gov't made these rules.

 

[bendog]

And who does everyone thing will be picking up the tab??

Why we tax payers of course.

If you want to go to college, get a job or a loan and go. Just don't expect the tax payers to pay your college bill for you.

The same people who pick up the tab when a big corporation bails and raids the retirement funds the govt. insures.

Then that makes everything okay? I’m tired of every stupid decision someone makes, we pay for. Trillions in debt, and those that promised to pay need to be held accountable and quit sponging off the working middle class.

I'm not meaning to promote debt but I am curious... How has the trillions in debt that our country has accumulated impacted your life?

It's going to. The rest of the world isn't going to allow us to print, print, print to buy new cars and vacation homes while they struggle with basic needs forever. It may not affect me but it's going to greatly affect future generations and as I note many times, it's not just about me.

I get the "its going to" argument but we have carried a national debt for generations. So my question is what actual effects have you felt in your lifetime as a result of the national debt?

I told you. I care about future generations. It also makes me want to puke when one group getting billions a year complains about those below them getting a little help.

I know you care about future generations as do I. Like I said, im not dismissing the importance of fiscal responsibility but I am asking if you or anybody you know has actually been impacted from the National debt. And if so, how?

You simply dismiss concerns as not legit.

Such as I want UHC. Even though someone like Sanders promotes a plan largely paid for people scream BUT we are $28 trillion in debt.

I never said your concerns weren't legit, I actually shared your concerns, don't put words in my mouth. But, I'm asking very simple questions and you keep avoiding direct answers.

I've answered it more than once.

You are right you answered the question, but you did so indirectly. You didn't actually give a direct answer the question that I asked. It was a very simple yes or no question that would involve some details if yes. I'm guessing the answer is No, you haven't seen any effects in your lifetime but you are concerned about the future. Is that right? Too bad I need to play guessing games to get a straight answer. Hope you can do better in the future

I explained how it directly affects me. The debt affects nearly everything. Interest rates such as how a retiree used to be able to live off interest on their savings. Now there is no interest.

I was looking at an older pic yesterday. 50 years appx. Banks were advertising 7% on savings. A retiree could do pretty well on that. Now they can't.

But you realize back then mortages were near 15-20% right?

No they weren't. They were in the 80's. That's when we really started screwing things up.

Yes thats what they were in the 80's, they were between 8-12% in the 70's 50 years ago. What are you arguing about? My point is valid no matter what the interest rates are, I was speaking to what correlates with interest rates and I don't see how the national debt effected rates in the way that you claimed.


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The rates have been driven down to finance the debt.

Yes because new money is created from borrowing and borrowing is what circulates money and grows the economy. Do you want a 15% mortgage on your home loan in exchange for a 7% interest rate on your savings account? Would you make that deal?

There's no inflation. Unless there is inflation the Fed's job is to keep rates low.. And while the fed can increase the reserves in banks to facillitate lending, it's really the Treasury that can create money

Ask the person standing in line buying their groceries if there is inflation.

It's not 1972. Try for perspective. Something fundamentally changed in how the US econ can absorb budget defiits.