Communist California to require Solar Panels on all new homes

[Flash]

In retirement occasional teach a college course in Environmental Science.

One of the class exercises is to determine if solar panels are economically feasible.

I have the class bring in their electric bill to figure out their cost of fossil fuel generated electricity.

I then have them research the complete cost of solar panel installation and maintenance. We look at all the cost including deterioration replacement.

We then so the economic analysis over a 30 year period.

It never pays for itself. Not by a long shot. That doesn't even include the hidden cost of government subsidies.

Solar panels are a joke. Nothing more than Moon Bat feel good bullshit. No connection to reality.

Only a stupid Commie state like Kalifornia would put in a $40K additional cost to a new home with no chance of ever recouping the cost.

Environmental wackos are morons.

Bullshit.

How about a sample of this analysis?

How about you signing up for the course so you can go through the exercise instead of making stupid statements that you can't back up?

If you think that is bullshit then that means you have done the analysis yourself. If solar panels are economical then go out and put them on your house right now. Everybody else would be doing the same. But you are not and everybody else is not. I wonder why?

A few rich environmental wackos will do it because they can afford to be idiots but most people can't afford the panels and the panels never pay for themselves.

You do know that panels start losing efficiency as soon as three years after they are installed don't you? There is a replacement cost that hardly any of the environmental wacko analysis ever looks at.

There is a reason why that filthy ass commie government in Kalifornia is forcing people to pout on the panels. the reason is simple. The panels are not economically feasible. Fossil fuels are cheaper.

By the way, I do have solar heat collectors at my home. I have a screened in swimming pool and even here in Florida the water is cool under a screen cover if you don't add a little heat. It is economical to put up solar collectors for something like that where you are raising the temperature of the water a few degrees. However, that same solar power is not going to run electricity for my home. Not by long shot and not cheaper than fossil fuels.

Another point. The environmental wackos never do a real analysis of the lower carbon foot print of solar panels. They don't look at the tremendous pollution associated with the manufacture and distribution of the panels. The same with wind turbines.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Hey, you get what you vote for. How long now have Californians been electing these clowns to run their state? Home prices are already some of the highest in the country. The middle class is being priced out. The state has had a net loss of 1,000,000 residents over the past decade, mostly due to the cost of housing. This will only accelerate it.

Democrats talk a good game about helping the poor, but when you look at what they actually do they cater to special interest groups first and foremost and hurt the poor as a result. They've been turning the state into a banana republic for a long time.

The FEUDAL SYSTEM. No middle class. The rich and the thoroughly screwed.

Yes. How dare they mandate that I never have an electric bill.

Now you're catching on.

I know, right?
I'm still hot that they require me to have functional toilets. I'm perfectly happy to shit in a bucket.

So you're trying to compare no indoor plumbing which can lead to diseases for you and your neighbors to solar panels?

No, I'm saying that everything that goes into new construction is required. Why is this any different and why do you care?

 

[martybegan]

No more free choice. They decide, you kneel.

Fortune: California to Require Solar Panels for All New Homes

What they forget to mention is that is also requires the switchgear and monitoring gear to make sure the power coming into your house and the power generated by the panels play nice with each other.

With housing prices as crazy as they already are in california, adding another 25-30k to the cost (and another maintenance item) seems like shooting yourself in the foot.

oh-----it costs that much? sheeeeeesh why so much?

it's not just plopping panels on a roof. The roof needs to be reinforced for the panel installation, wire and conduit needs to run from the panels to a master controller, and that controller needs to be tied into switchgear and automatic transfer switches to regulate the power from the panels and the power from the grid (power sources don't like running into each other).

Add in battery costs and you are looking at a sizable investment.

And the batteries need to be replaced. Depending on the battery it can be anywhere between 5 and 15 years. Solar batteries range from $5,000 to $7,000+ and from $400 dollars per kilowatt hour (kWh) to $750/kWh. These prices are only for the battery itself, not for the cost of installation or additional necessary equipment...

Plus it takes up square footage, thus requiring either a larger house to get the same usable area, or accepting less usable area in a given square footage.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Lithium mines....this is just one.
Note the entire city in the background...that is how big these massive holes in the earth are.
And there are many many just like it.

 

[eagle1462010]

The FEUDAL SYSTEM. No middle class. The rich and the thoroughly screwed.

Yes. How dare they mandate that I never have an electric bill.

Now you're catching on.

I know, right?
I'm still hot that they require me to have functional toilets. I'm perfectly happy to shit in a bucket.

So you're trying to compare no indoor plumbing which can lead to diseases for you and your neighbors to solar panels?

No, I'm saying that everything that goes into new construction is required. Why is this any different and why do you care?

Forced Acceptance

 

[eagle1462010]

SCOTUS will see this one

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Solar Panels add value to a home....much like it does keeping the wheels on your domicile sitting in your Alabama Trailer Park and out of a pawnshop.

Thanks for playing though.

No one is stopping you from buying them, douchebag.

No one is forcing you to buy a new home in CA either.

 

[AntonToo]

In retirement occasional teach a college course in Environmental Science.

One of the class exercises is to determine if solar panels are economically feasible.

I have the class bring in their electric bill to figure out their cost of fossil fuel generated electricity.

I then have them research the complete cost of solar panel installation and maintenance. We look at all the cost including deterioration replacement.

We then so the economic analysis over a 30 year period.

It never pays for itself. Not by a long shot. That doesn't even include the hidden cost of government subsidies.

Solar panels are a joke. Nothing more than Moon Bat feel good bullshit. No connection to reality.

Only a stupid Commie state like Kalifornia would put in a $40K additional cost to a new home with no chance of ever recouping the cost.

Environmental wackos are morons.

Bullshit.

How about a sample of this analysis?

How about you signing up for the course so you can go through the exercise instead of making stupid statements that you can't back up?

If you think that is bullshit then that means you have done the analysis yourself. If solar panels are economical then go out and put them on your house right now. Everybody else would be doing the same. But you are not and everybody else is not. I wonder why?

A few rich environmental wackos will do it because they can afford to be idiots but most people can't afford the panels and the panels never pay for themselves.

You do know that panels start losing efficiency as soon as three years after they are installed don't you? There is a replacement cost that hardly any of the environmental wacko analysis ever looks at.

There is a reason why that filthy ass commie government in Kalifornia is forcing people to pout on the panels. the reason is simple. The panels are not economically feasible. Fossil fuels are cheaper.

By the way, I do have solar heat collectors at my home. I have a screened in swimming pool and even here in Florida the water is cool under a screen cover if you don't add a little heat. It is economical to put up solar collectors for something like that where you are raising the temperature of the water a few degrees. However, that same solar power is not going to run electricity for my home. Not by long shot and not cheaper than fossil fuels.

Another point. The environmental wackos never do a real analysis of the lower carbon foot print of solar panels. They don't look at the tremendous pollution associated with the manufacture and distribution of the panels. The same with wind turbines.

In retirement occasional teach a college course in Environmental Science.

One of the class exercises is to determine if solar panels are economically feasible.

I have the class bring in their electric bill to figure out their cost of fossil fuel generated electricity.

I then have them research the complete cost of solar panel installation and maintenance. We look at all the cost including deterioration replacement.

We then so the economic analysis over a 30 year period.

It never pays for itself. Not by a long shot. That doesn't even include the hidden cost of government subsidies.

Solar panels are a joke. Nothing more than Moon Bat feel good bullshit. No connection to reality.

Only a stupid Commie state like Kalifornia would put in a $40K additional cost to a new home with no chance of ever recouping the cost.

Environmental wackos are morons.

Bullshit.

How about a sample of this analysis?

How about you signing up for the course so you can go through the exercise instead of making stupid statements that you can't back up?

If you think that is bullshit then that means you have done the analysis yourself. If solar panels are economical then go out and put them on your house right now. Everybody else would be doing the same. But you are not and everybody else is not. I wonder why?

A few rich environmental wackos will do it because they can afford to be idiots but most people can't afford the panels and the panels never pay for themselves.

You do know that panels start losing efficiency as soon as three years after they are installed don't you? There is a replacement cost that hardly any of the environmental wacko analysis ever looks at.

There is a reason why that filthy ass commie government in Kalifornia is forcing people to pout on the panels. the reason is simple. The panels are not economically feasible. Fossil fuels are cheaper.

By the way, I do have solar heat collectors at my home. I have a screened in swimming pool and even here in Florida the water is cool under a screen cover if you don't add a little heat. It is economical to put up solar collectors for something like that where you are raising the temperature of the water a few degrees. However, that same solar power is not going to run electricity for my home. Not by long shot and not cheaper than fossil fuels.

Another point. The environmental wackos never do a real analysis of the lower carbon foot print of solar panels. They don't look at the tremendous pollution associated with the manufacture and distribution of the panels. The same with wind turbines.

Hey asshole how about you put that up that analysis or just stop spreading your bullshit.

Solar doesn’t make sense for everyone everywhere, but your assertion that it can never pay for itself sounds more like politico dogma, not evidence based conclusion.

 

[MordechaiGoodbud]

No more free choice. They decide, you kneel.

Fortune: California to Require Solar Panels for All New Homes

I'm all for it. How is it communist?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Yes. How dare they mandate that I never have an electric bill.

Now you're catching on.

I know, right?
I'm still hot that they require me to have functional toilets. I'm perfectly happy to shit in a bucket.

So you're trying to compare no indoor plumbing which can lead to diseases for you and your neighbors to solar panels?

No, I'm saying that everything that goes into new construction is required. Why is this any different and why do you care?

Forced Acceptance

Get over it. Building codes are updated all of the time.

 

[Flash]

In retirement occasional teach a college course in Environmental Science.

One of the class exercises is to determine if solar panels are economically feasible.

I have the class bring in their electric bill to figure out their cost of fossil fuel generated electricity.

I then have them research the complete cost of solar panel installation and maintenance. We look at all the cost including deterioration replacement.

We then so the economic analysis over a 30 year period.

It never pays for itself. Not by a long shot. That doesn't even include the hidden cost of government subsidies.

Solar panels are a joke. Nothing more than Moon Bat feel good bullshit. No connection to reality.

Only a stupid Commie state like Kalifornia would put in a $40K additional cost to a new home with no chance of ever recouping the cost.

Environmental wackos are morons.

Bullshit.

How about a sample of this analysis?

How about you signing up for the course so you can go through the exercise instead of making stupid statements that you can't back up?

If you think that is bullshit then that means you have done the analysis yourself. If solar panels are economical then go out and put them on your house right now. Everybody else would be doing the same. But you are not and everybody else is not. I wonder why?

A few rich environmental wackos will do it because they can afford to be idiots but most people can't afford the panels and the panels never pay for themselves.

You do know that panels start losing efficiency as soon as three years after they are installed don't you? There is a replacement cost that hardly any of the environmental wacko analysis ever looks at.

There is a reason why that filthy ass commie government in Kalifornia is forcing people to pout on the panels. the reason is simple. The panels are not economically feasible. Fossil fuels are cheaper.

By the way, I do have solar heat collectors at my home. I have a screened in swimming pool and even here in Florida the water is cool under a screen cover if you don't add a little heat. It is economical to put up solar collectors for something like that where you are raising the temperature of the water a few degrees. However, that same solar power is not going to run electricity for my home. Not by long shot and not cheaper than fossil fuels.

Another point. The environmental wackos never do a real analysis of the lower carbon foot print of solar panels. They don't look at the tremendous pollution associated with the manufacture and distribution of the panels. The same with wind turbines.

In retirement occasional teach a college course in Environmental Science.

One of the class exercises is to determine if solar panels are economically feasible.

I have the class bring in their electric bill to figure out their cost of fossil fuel generated electricity.

I then have them research the complete cost of solar panel installation and maintenance. We look at all the cost including deterioration replacement.

We then so the economic analysis over a 30 year period.

It never pays for itself. Not by a long shot. That doesn't even include the hidden cost of government subsidies.

Solar panels are a joke. Nothing more than Moon Bat feel good bullshit. No connection to reality.

Only a stupid Commie state like Kalifornia would put in a $40K additional cost to a new home with no chance of ever recouping the cost.

Environmental wackos are morons.

Bullshit.

How about a sample of this analysis?

How about you signing up for the course so you can go through the exercise instead of making stupid statements that you can't back up?

If you think that is bullshit then that means you have done the analysis yourself. If solar panels are economical then go out and put them on your house right now. Everybody else would be doing the same. But you are not and everybody else is not. I wonder why?

A few rich environmental wackos will do it because they can afford to be idiots but most people can't afford the panels and the panels never pay for themselves.

You do know that panels start losing efficiency as soon as three years after they are installed don't you? There is a replacement cost that hardly any of the environmental wacko analysis ever looks at.

There is a reason why that filthy ass commie government in Kalifornia is forcing people to pout on the panels. the reason is simple. The panels are not economically feasible. Fossil fuels are cheaper.

By the way, I do have solar heat collectors at my home. I have a screened in swimming pool and even here in Florida the water is cool under a screen cover if you don't add a little heat. It is economical to put up solar collectors for something like that where you are raising the temperature of the water a few degrees. However, that same solar power is not going to run electricity for my home. Not by long shot and not cheaper than fossil fuels.

Another point. The environmental wackos never do a real analysis of the lower carbon foot print of solar panels. They don't look at the tremendous pollution associated with the manufacture and distribution of the panels. The same with wind turbines.

Hey asshole how about you put that up that analysis or just stop spreading your bullshit.

Solar doesn’t make sense for everyone everywhere, but your assertion that it can never pay for itself sounds more like politico dogma, not evidence based conclusion.

If you have solar panels in your home then show me the analysis that you did that proves that it was economical. Be specific and include everything. I know the right question to ask so be sure you have everything.

If you don't have solar panels then shut the fuck up Moon Bat..

 

[bendog]

Next the gummit is gonna tell me I can't put shit in the stream on my land. We're serfs of the communists.

 

[eagle1462010]

Now you're catching on.

I know, right?
I'm still hot that they require me to have functional toilets. I'm perfectly happy to shit in a bucket.

So you're trying to compare no indoor plumbing which can lead to diseases for you and your neighbors to solar panels?

No, I'm saying that everything that goes into new construction is required. Why is this any different and why do you care?

Forced Acceptance

Get over it. Building codes are updated all of the time.

Has nothing to do with structural integrity or safety. It is a Forced Purchase whether you agree with it or not.

What is the next law?? Forced to buy a Golf Cart??

 

[Redfish]

Solar panels are an investment, not a cost; they pay for themselves.
Solar panels last for decades.
Maintenance is laughably little; brush off the snow.
The best thing about solar, and the thing control freaks hate, is that it decentralizes power.

most honest solar brokers will tell you that the break even point is around 10 years for a new solar system and that most systems have a useful life of 15-18 years. the panels themselves are relatively maintenance free (unless you have a hail storm) but the electrical components are just like your AC, furnace, or stove, they break down, wear out, or require replacement parts.

Most honest brokers do a COST ANALYSIS of a specific house, with specific roof, in a specific state with specific weather, expected energy costs and tax incentives.

Break even point for me is just 2-3 years.

I don't believe that, but if you do, great. Lets see, $20,000 divided by 24 equals $833, so to break even in two years you need to save $833 per month on your electric bill. to do it in 3 years you need to save $555 per month.

you are kidding yourself.

 

[Flash]

Solar panels are an investment, not a cost; they pay for themselves.
Solar panels last for decades.
Maintenance is laughably little; brush off the snow.
The best thing about solar, and the thing control freaks hate, is that it decentralizes power.

most honest solar brokers will tell you that the break even point is around 10 years for a new solar system and that most systems have a useful life of 15-18 years. the panels themselves are relatively maintenance free (unless you have a hail storm) but the electrical components are just like your AC, furnace, or stove, they break down, wear out, or require replacement parts.

Most honest brokers do a COST ANALYSIS of a specific house, with specific roof, in a specific state with specific weather, expected energy costs and tax incentives.

Break even point for me is just 2-3 years.

I don't believe that, but if you do, great. Lets see, $20,000 divided by 24 equals $833, so to break even in two years you need to save $833 per month on your electric bill. to do it in 3 years you need to save $555 per month.

you are kidding yourself.

If the idiot thinks the payback for solar panels is 2-3 years then he is totally batshit crazy.

Of course he is a Libtard that thought Obama was a great President and that Crooked Hillary was honest. Very confused about everything.

30 years at best and that doesn't include the replacement cost or factor in the filthy ass government subsidies or the cost of the pollution for manufacturing and distribution.

Of course even at that 30 years payback is based upon best case scenarios for weather that the stupid solar panel industry uses and that is never the case.

If solar panels were feasible then everybody would have them. We wouldn't need the filthy ass government mandating them and we wouldn't need the despicable government subsidies and tax breaks.

The free market doesn't support the solar power generating industry because fossil fuels are cheaper by a significant amount. That is something these stupid Moon Bats have a hard time understanding.

Most of the stupid Moon Bats that promote solar panels don't have them in their homes. If they do then they are losing money and are too dishonest to admit it.

 

[Thinker101]

Solar panels are an investment, not a cost; they pay for themselves.
Solar panels last for decades.
Maintenance is laughably little; brush off the snow.
The best thing about solar, and the thing control freaks hate, is that it decentralizes power.

most honest solar brokers will tell you that the break even point is around 10 years for a new solar system and that most systems have a useful life of 15-18 years. the panels themselves are relatively maintenance free (unless you have a hail storm) but the electrical components are just like your AC, furnace, or stove, they break down, wear out, or require replacement parts.

Most honest brokers do a COST ANALYSIS of a specific house, with specific roof, in a specific state with specific weather, expected energy costs and tax incentives.

Break even point for me is just 2-3 years.

Wow, good for you. You may be the only one with a break even point that low. For the rest of the world:
Calculate Your Solar Panel Payback Period | EnergySage

 

[Hutch Starskey]

I know, right?
I'm still hot that they require me to have functional toilets. I'm perfectly happy to shit in a bucket.

So you're trying to compare no indoor plumbing which can lead to diseases for you and your neighbors to solar panels?

No, I'm saying that everything that goes into new construction is required. Why is this any different and why do you care?

Forced Acceptance

Get over it. Building codes are updated all of the time.

Has nothing to do with structural integrity or safety. It is a Forced Purchase whether you agree with it or not.

What is the next law?? Forced to buy a Golf Cart??

Has nothing to do with structural integrity or safety.

Who says it has to?

 

[Flash]

Solar panels are an investment, not a cost; they pay for themselves.
Solar panels last for decades.
Maintenance is laughably little; brush off the snow.
The best thing about solar, and the thing control freaks hate, is that it decentralizes power.

most honest solar brokers will tell you that the break even point is around 10 years for a new solar system and that most systems have a useful life of 15-18 years. the panels themselves are relatively maintenance free (unless you have a hail storm) but the electrical components are just like your AC, furnace, or stove, they break down, wear out, or require replacement parts.

Most honest brokers do a COST ANALYSIS of a specific house, with specific roof, in a specific state with specific weather, expected energy costs and tax incentives.

Break even point for me is just 2-3 years.

Wow, good for you. You may be the only one with a break even point that low. For the rest of the world:
Calculate Your Solar Panel Payback Period | EnergySage

That calculator is way off. It is far worse.

It assumes weather factors put out by the solar panel industry that is not even close to reality. Typically the panels will only get a half to 2/3rds of the solar energy assumed by the solar power industry and that has been parroted by the stupid government.

It doesn't include maintenance and replacement. Most solar panels start deteriorating after three years or so. Most of them only put out 30% of the power after ten years or so.

Also, solar panels detract from the cost of a home if the owner decides to sell. That money is never recouped and actually detracts from the value of a home..

If any of these stupid Moon Bats want to waste their money on silly worthless solar panels then let them be idiots. They deserve it. They think they are saving the Mother Earth or something but all they are really doing is flushing their money down the toilet.

 

[Thinker101]

Solar panels are an investment, not a cost; they pay for themselves.
Solar panels last for decades.
Maintenance is laughably little; brush off the snow.
The best thing about solar, and the thing control freaks hate, is that it decentralizes power.

most honest solar brokers will tell you that the break even point is around 10 years for a new solar system and that most systems have a useful life of 15-18 years. the panels themselves are relatively maintenance free (unless you have a hail storm) but the electrical components are just like your AC, furnace, or stove, they break down, wear out, or require replacement parts.

Most honest brokers do a COST ANALYSIS of a specific house, with specific roof, in a specific state with specific weather, expected energy costs and tax incentives.

Break even point for me is just 2-3 years.

Wow, good for you. You may be the only one with a break even point that low. For the rest of the world:
Calculate Your Solar Panel Payback Period | EnergySage

That calculator is way off. It is far worse.

It assumes weather factors put out by the solar panel industry that is not even close to reality. Typically the panels will only get a half to 2/3rds of the solar energy assumed by the solar power industry and that has been parroted by the stupid government.

It doesn't include maintenance and replacement. Most solar panels start deteriorating after three years or so. Most of them only put out 30% of the power after ten years or so.

Also, solar panels detract from the cost of a home if the owner decides to sell. That money is never recouped and actually detracts from the value of a home..

If any of these stupid Moon Bats want to waste their money on silly worthless solar panels then let them be idiots. They deserve it. They think they are saving the Mother Earth or something but all they are really doing is flushing their money down the toilet.

Ouch. Here in California it may have been a good deal at one point. Electric company caught on and the rules just recently got changed to where it's really not worth the investment.

 

[Flash]

Solar panels are an investment, not a cost; they pay for themselves.
Solar panels last for decades.
Maintenance is laughably little; brush off the snow.
The best thing about solar, and the thing control freaks hate, is that it decentralizes power.

most honest solar brokers will tell you that the break even point is around 10 years for a new solar system and that most systems have a useful life of 15-18 years. the panels themselves are relatively maintenance free (unless you have a hail storm) but the electrical components are just like your AC, furnace, or stove, they break down, wear out, or require replacement parts.

Most honest brokers do a COST ANALYSIS of a specific house, with specific roof, in a specific state with specific weather, expected energy costs and tax incentives.

Break even point for me is just 2-3 years.

Wow, good for you. You may be the only one with a break even point that low. For the rest of the world:
Calculate Your Solar Panel Payback Period | EnergySage

That calculator is way off. It is far worse.

It assumes weather factors put out by the solar panel industry that is not even close to reality. Typically the panels will only get a half to 2/3rds of the solar energy assumed by the solar power industry and that has been parroted by the stupid government.

It doesn't include maintenance and replacement. Most solar panels start deteriorating after three years or so. Most of them only put out 30% of the power after ten years or so.

Also, solar panels detract from the cost of a home if the owner decides to sell. That money is never recouped and actually detracts from the value of a home..

If any of these stupid Moon Bats want to waste their money on silly worthless solar panels then let them be idiots. They deserve it. They think they are saving the Mother Earth or something but all they are really doing is flushing their money down the toilet.

Ouch. Here in California it may have been a good deal at one point. Electric company caught on and the rules just recently got changed to where it's really not worth the investment.

I am a retired environmental engineer and have been doing these kinds of calculations for years.

Without massive government subsidies I have never seen it be a good deal. The economics have never been there. Not by a long shot.