Did we really have to nuke Japan?

[SAYIT]

Disagreeing with Truman's dropping of the A bombs has nothing to do with one's political persuasion or love of country. It has to do with morality and the truth.

What is strange is how many on the right defend Truman, yet he was a big gov progressive statist.

Horse crap. There is nothing moral or honest about twisting the truth to satisfy your hate for Truman or America.

Like so many myths in American history, the truth about the A bombs is difficult to accept and the truth sayers must be denigrated to protect the state.

"Truth Sayers?" You suffer from delusions of both grandeur and self-importance.

 

[gipper]

Disagreeing with Truman's dropping of the A bombs has nothing to do with one's political persuasion or love of country. It has to do with morality and the truth.

What is strange is how many on the right defend Truman, yet he was a big gov progressive statist.

Horse crap. There is nothing moral or honest about twisting the truth to satisfy your hate for Truman or America.

Like so many myths in American history, the truth about the A bombs is difficult to accept and the truth sayers must be denigrated to protect the state.

Seems the truth is that we fought Japan for three and a half years and then we dropped two bombs and in a few days the war was over. Truth or myth, a lot of Americans and Japanese were able to live their full lives out because of the truth or myth.

No doubt dropping the bombs saved American lives and treasure and may well have saved Japanese lives. How many Japanese would have died had the war continued conventionally?

Round and round you go...and you guys have lost your minds.

You justify the mass murder of hundreds of thousands of defenseless women, children, and old men.

How does one get so murderous and uncaring?

 

[Syriusly]

Disagreeing with Truman's dropping of the A bombs has nothing to do with one's political persuasion or love of country. It has to do with morality and the truth.

What is strange is how many on the right defend Truman, yet he was a big gov progressive statist.

Horse crap. There is nothing moral or honest about twisting the truth to satisfy your hate for Truman or America.

Like so many myths in American history, the truth about the A bombs is difficult to accept and the truth sayers must be denigrated to protect the state.

Seems the truth is that we fought Japan for three and a half years and then we dropped two bombs and in a few days the war was over. Truth or myth, a lot of Americans and Japanese were able to live their full lives out because of the truth or myth.

No doubt dropping the bombs saved American lives and treasure and may well have saved Japanese lives. How many Japanese would have died had the war continued conventionally?

Round and round you go...and you guys have lost your minds.

You justify the mass murder of hundreds of thousands of defenseless women, children, and old men.

How does one get so murderous and uncaring?

I think we are fairly clear that we believe that dropping the bomb saved more lives than it cost. Of course those deaths were horrible- all deaths- women, children, old men- and soldiers are horrible.

We cannot know what would have happened if we had not dropped the bomb- we do know that the result today is that Japan is a vibrant modern Democracy that has no imperial ambitions.

 

[gipper]

Horse crap. There is nothing moral or honest about twisting the truth to satisfy your hate for Truman or America.

Like so many myths in American history, the truth about the A bombs is difficult to accept and the truth sayers must be denigrated to protect the state.

Seems the truth is that we fought Japan for three and a half years and then we dropped two bombs and in a few days the war was over. Truth or myth, a lot of Americans and Japanese were able to live their full lives out because of the truth or myth.

No doubt dropping the bombs saved American lives and treasure and may well have saved Japanese lives. How many Japanese would have died had the war continued conventionally?

Round and round you go...and you guys have lost your minds.

You justify the mass murder of hundreds of thousands of defenseless women, children, and old men.

How does one get so murderous and uncaring?

I think we are fairly clear that we believe that dropping the bomb saved more lives than it cost. Of course those deaths were horrible- all deaths- women, children, old men- and soldiers are horrible.

We cannot know what would have happened if we had not dropped the bomb- we do know that the result today is that Japan is a vibrant modern Democracy that has no imperial ambitions.

So you believe mass murder of innocent defenseless civilians, to prevent the deaths of your soldiers, is okay.

 

[Vigilante]

Perhaps if we NUKED Mecca, we would have proof, either way, that NUKES prevent more war, or would the muslim scum, get all irate, and then we could do as we did with Japan and drop a second one on Medina..... after that, we certainly would have an indication of if it was necessary or not!

 

[elektra]

Disagreeing with Truman's dropping of the A bombs has nothing to do with one's political persuasion or love of country. It has to do with morality and the truth.

What is strange is how many on the right defend Truman, yet he was a big gov progressive statist.

Horse crap. There is nothing moral or honest about twisting the truth to satisfy your hate for Truman or America.

Like so many myths in American history, the truth about the A bombs is difficult to accept and the truth sayers must be denigrated to protect the state.

Seems the truth is that we fought Japan for three and a half years and then we dropped two bombs and in a few days the war was over. Truth or myth, a lot of Americans and Japanese were able to live their full lives out because of the truth or myth.

No doubt dropping the bombs saved American lives and treasure and may well have saved Japanese lives. How many Japanese would have died had the war continued conventionally?

Round and round you go...and you guys have lost your minds.

You justify the mass murder of hundreds of thousands of defenseless women, children, and old men.

How does one get so murderous and uncaring?

False premise or an outright lie.

Defenseless, hardly. Murder? A stretch of the imagination, a moral argument?

Murder, The Japanese Army is guilty of the murder of over 10,000,000 people, during the Murder spree the Japanese went on.

The Japanese Army and Navy began the murder of Chinese, Burmese, and Philippine people long before they began Murdering defenseless Americans.

The Japanese made the decision to Murder abroad while at the same time they assured the civilians in Japan they could protect them, at the same time.

How are we guilty for the Japanese mistakes? We are to let the Murderers go? Just forget about the tens of millions the Japanese murdered and raped.

The Japanese murdered millions, murdered millions from a half a dozen countries, and more, while being defenseless?

OPERATION KETSU-GO

The sooner the Americans come, the better...One hundred million die proudly.

- Japanese slogan in the summer of 1945.

Japan was finished as a warmaking nation, in spite of its four million men still under arms. But...Japan was not going to quit. Despite the fact that she was militarily finished, Japan's leaders were going to fight right on. To not lose "face" was more important than hundreds and hundreds of thousands of lives. And the people concurred, in silence, without protest. To continue was no longer a question of Japanese military thinking, it was an aspect of Japanese culture and psychology.

- James Jones, WWII

Japanese Homeland Defense Strategy

With the greater part of Japan's troop strength overseas and industrial production suffering under constant American air attacks, the defense of the Japanese home islands presented an enormous challenge to the Japanese Imperial General Headquarters (IGHQ). On 8 April 1945, the Imperial General Headquarters issued orders, to be effective 15 April, activating the First and Second General Armies.(1) These two Armies would be responsible for the ground defense of the Japanese home islands. Also, on 8 April 1945, IGHQ issued an order activating the Air General Army, effective 15 April. The purpose of the new Air General Army was to coordinate the air defense of Japan, providing a single headquarters through which cooperation with the ground forces and the Navy could be expedited in implementing the defense of the home islands.(2) Simultaneously with the activation of the First and Second General Armies and the Air General Army, IGHQ issued orders for the implementation of Ketsu-Go(Decisive) Operation. Defensive in nature, the operation divided the Japanese home territory into seven zones from which to fight the final decisive battles of the Japanese empire.(3)

The strategy for Ketsu-Go was outlined in an 8 April 1945 Army Directive.(4) It stated that the Imperial Army would endeavor to crush the Americans while the invasion force was still at sea. They planned to deliver a decisive blow against the American naval force by initially destroying as many carriers as possible, utilizing the special attack forces of the Air Force and Navy. When the amphibious force approached within range of the homeland airbases, the entire air combat strength would be employed in continual night and day assaults against these ships. In conducting the air operations, the emphasis would be on the disruption of the American landing plans. The principal targets were to be the troop and equipment transports. Those American forces which succeeded in landing would be swiftly attacked by the Imperial Army in order to seek the decisive victory. The principal objective of the land operation was the destruction of the American landing force on the beach.

 

[JoeB131]

Seriously, you stated we consistently demanded that the Emperor be removed, and that is a flat out lie.

I posted the Surrender demand that you just failed to include in your quote, failed as in purposely deleted.

NO, I don't bother with it because it was irrelevent to the point. We didn't start being reasonable about the Emperor until the Soviets got into it, and we had a reasonably fear they might get to Tokyo first.

 

[JoeB131]

False premise or an outright lie.

Defenseless, hardly. Murder? A stretch of the imagination, a moral argument?

Murder, The Japanese Army is guilty of the murder of over 10,000,000 people, during the Murder spree the Japanese went on.

The Japanese Army and Navy began the murder of Chinese, Burmese, and Philippine people long before they began Murdering defenseless Americans.

The Japanese made the decision to Murder abroad while at the same time they assured the civilians in Japan they could protect them, at the same time.

the women and children of Hiroshima and Nagasaki weren't killing people.

 

[Syriusly]

Like so many myths in American history, the truth about the A bombs is difficult to accept and the truth sayers must be denigrated to protect the state.

Seems the truth is that we fought Japan for three and a half years and then we dropped two bombs and in a few days the war was over. Truth or myth, a lot of Americans and Japanese were able to live their full lives out because of the truth or myth.

No doubt dropping the bombs saved American lives and treasure and may well have saved Japanese lives. How many Japanese would have died had the war continued conventionally?

Round and round you go...and you guys have lost your minds.

You justify the mass murder of hundreds of thousands of defenseless women, children, and old men.

How does one get so murderous and uncaring?

I think we are fairly clear that we believe that dropping the bomb saved more lives than it cost. Of course those deaths were horrible- all deaths- women, children, old men- and soldiers are horrible.

We cannot know what would have happened if we had not dropped the bomb- we do know that the result today is that Japan is a vibrant modern Democracy that has no imperial ambitions.

So you believe mass murder of innocent defenseless civilians, to prevent the deaths of your soldiers, is okay.

I believe that if we are going to be 'murdering' human beings, that fewer is better than more.

And the decision to drop the bomb resulted in fewer deaths than the alternative that was going to happen.

 

[Syriusly]

Seriously, you stated we consistently demanded that the Emperor be removed, and that is a flat out lie.

I posted the Surrender demand that you just failed to include in your quote, failed as in purposely deleted.

NO, I don't bother with it because it was irrelevent to the point. We didn't start being reasonable about the Emperor until the Soviets got into it, and we had a reasonably fear they might get to Tokyo first.

We never feared that the Soviets would get to Tokyo first.

The Soviets at best could do what they did- gobble up mainland Asian territories previously occupied by Japan- they had no way to invade Japan at all.

 

[Syriusly]

Perhaps if we NUKED Mecca, we would have proof, either way, that NUKES prevent more war, or would the muslim scum, get all irate, and then we could do as we did with Japan and drop a second one on Medina..... after that, we certainly would have an indication of if it was necessary or not!

Well that would make as much sense as if we nuked Hiroshima in order to get India to surrender to us.......

 

[JoeB131]

We never feared that the Soviets would get to Tokyo first.

The Soviets at best could do what they did- gobble up mainland Asian territories previously occupied by Japan- they had no way to invade Japan at all.

Actually, it wouldn't have been a problem at all for them.

A couple of airborne divisions in Hokkaido, take a major port, start offloading troops ships from Vladivostock. Easy-peasy.

 

[SAYIT]

We cannot know what would have happened if we had not dropped the bomb- we do know that the result today is that Japan is a vibrant modern Democracy that has no imperial ambitions.

So you believe mass murder of innocent defenseless civilians, to prevent the deaths of your soldiers, is okay.

Murder? You're an idiot, Gipper, and I mean that with all do respect.

 

[Jarlaxle]

I love America more than most. I do know that American pols lie and I hate lying and I am the opposite of a leftist.
Let's see...the Japanese people who were starving were going to inflict 500k casualties on a battle hardened US military who controlled air and sea, with pitchforks.

Stop believing in fairy tales and lying progressive statists.

You wouldn't know a fact if it bit your scrotum. 500,000 casualties were probably a bit high...but an invasion would have been a bloodbath. The Japanese KNEW where the invasion would be (there are only a few places where it is practical), and were ready. They had amassed thousands of suicide boats, kamikaze planes, rocket bombs (basically, manned cruise missiles), and kaiten manned torpedoes.

Also, the American troops would lose their biggest advantage- air cover-due to the monsoons.

 

[Jarlaxle]

My daughter is Japanese, makes my mother in-law Japanese, that makes you about the dumbest person here? Yes?

Oooookay, this just got weird. I'm done

Too many words, boy. You just needed to type, "I concede."

 

[Jarlaxle]

We never feared that the Soviets would get to Tokyo first.

The Soviets at best could do what they did- gobble up mainland Asian territories previously occupied by Japan- they had no way to invade Japan at all.

Actually, it wouldn't have been a problem at all for them.

A couple of airborne divisions in Hokkaido, take a major port, start offloading troops ships from Vladivostock. Easy-peasy.

Did they have the airlift and sea-lift capability for that?

 

[SAYIT]

I love America more than most. I do know that American pols lie and I hate lying and I am the opposite of a leftist.
Let's see...the Japanese people who were starving were going to inflict 500k casualties on a battle hardened US military who controlled air and sea, with pitchforks.

Stop believing in fairy tales and lying progressive statists.

You wouldn't know a fact if it bit your scrotum. 500,000 casualties were probably a bit high...but an invasion would have been a bloodbath. The Japanese KNEW where the invasion would be (there are only a few places where it is practical), and were ready. They had amassed thousands of suicide boats, kamikaze planes, rocket bombs (basically, manned cruise missiles), and kaiten manned torpedoes.

Also, the American troops would lose their biggest advantage- air cover-due to the monsoons.

Even if the casualty figure for America is halved consider the number of Japanese that would be dead. 500,000? 750,000? 1 million? The point is many lives and much treasure was saved and the war was brought to a speedy end allowing for the healing to begin sooner. In effect, a win-win-win. There is something wrong with those who desperately need to make America the bad guy in this matter.

 

[Camp]

We never feared that the Soviets would get to Tokyo first.

The Soviets at best could do what they did- gobble up mainland Asian territories previously occupied by Japan- they had no way to invade Japan at all.

Actually, it wouldn't have been a problem at all for them.

A couple of airborne divisions in Hokkaido, take a major port, start offloading troops ships from Vladivostock. Easy-peasy.

Did they have the airlift and sea-lift capability for that?

They maintained about 20 paratrooper brigades, but would quickly transform them into rifle brigades when needed. They had several major jumps and many smaller ones. The Tupolev TB 3 was the aircraft used.

youtube.com/watch?v=zzMb_ue4aG4

 

[whitehall]

Egghead responsibility? Pop history says that Oppenheimer and Einstein were "surprised" or "offended" or "angered" by the way the Truman administration dropped their creation on innocent civilians but history indicates that the scientists were the biggest proponents of testing their creation on society. When the nuclear shit hit the fan the eggheads ran for cover.

 

[elektra]

Seriously, you stated we consistently demanded that the Emperor be removed, and that is a flat out lie.

I posted the Surrender demand that you just failed to include in your quote, failed as in purposely deleted.

NO, I don't bother with it because it was irrelevent to the point. We didn't start being reasonable about the Emperor until the Soviets got into it, and we had a reasonably fear they might get to Tokyo first.

Lies, nothing more.

How in the hell was The USSR going to get to Tokyo before us, considering we were already there and the USSR was barely in Manchuria? You do realize that the USSR entry in the War was in China.

Not reasonable about the Emperor until the USSR got in the war.

Did you miss the date of the Potsdam declaration, that was before the USSR joined the war.

T

Potsdam Declaration - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
The Potsdam Declaration or the Proclamation Defining Terms for Japanese Surrender is a statement that called for the surrender of all Japanese armed forces during World War II. On July 26, 1945,

Seriously, you stated we consistently demanded that the Emperor be removed, and that is a flat out lie.

I posted the Surrender demand that you just failed to include in your quote, failed as in purposely deleted.

NO, I don't bother with it because it was irrelevent to the point. We didn't start being reasonable about the Emperor until the Soviets got into it, and we had a reasonably fear they might get to Tokyo first.

The soviets joined the war in august, the demand for surrender came in July.

Joeb131 is wrong again, thus far every post wrong, as proven with facts.

Joeb131 is perfectly wrong.

An accomplishment of sorts.