Do You Think The Fast & Furious Scandal Is Worse Than Watergate Scandal?

[Quantum Windbag]

Actually Jillian, quite a number of people finished Jr. High, thus exceeding your educational prowess.



Did you fail 2nd grade grammar, whilst they taught of capitalization and punctuation?

You should have stuck it out through 7th grade, it really would have helped you...

Oh, wow! We have an English teacher in our midst..

The sure sign of a failed argument...picking on grammar...whoops!

i rarely use caps when i post.

i'm sorry english is too difficult for him to follow.

Just a side note, if you aren't following the rules of English grammar you can't claim you are using English.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

There is no cover-up. There is no conspircy. It's a political witch hunt in an election year to stir the shit pot and inflame the ditto-base.

There is definitely a cover-up. Is there an attempt to use this scandal in an election year to inflame people against this Administration? Of course. Does that mean that the investigation is unwarranted? Hardly.

The bottom line is that Fast & Furious was an ill advised (and that's being charitable!) plan run by Eric Holder's DOJ, which blew up in the faces of the Obama Administration and they have been doing everything they can to dodge the falling debris.

But being honest, don't you think - from what I have seen - that Holder is furious. Not about people trying to 'get' him, but that this went ahead. I reckon he knew bugger-all about this and has been on the back foot ever since....

Honest question. If he is furious about this now why wasn't he furious about it before it blew up because whistle blowers made it public? He knew about it long before Terry was killed, but did nothing to stop it until after Issa got wind of it. His timing to claim righteous indignation sucks.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

How many guns travel to mexico without this program?

Is that the best defense you can come up with? Why not argue it is about voter suppression, like Pelosi?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You bet your ass I think FF is worse than Watergate.

Fast & Furious leaves hundreds of dead in its wake. One of whom was a US Border Patrol Agent.

I hope heads roll on this.

I thought guns don't kill people, only people kill people. Since guns don't kill people, this border patrol agent would have been killed regardless of where the gun came from, because guns don't kill people. Yes I am being a bit facetious, but the fact is that is what many gun toting Americans will claim, and yet these are the same people jumping all over F&F. As for the border patrol agent who was killed, yes he most likely would have been killed regardless of where the gun came from. It seems most people have lost sight of that fact.

I have mentioned the bolded part at least twice in this thread....

And I have pointed out how absurd it is to use that as a defense of the program. In fact, I think that the fact that people have to resort to that as a defense is indicative of just how bad the idea was in the first place, which is why I give kudos to whoever stopped the program under Bush when it was obvious that it wasn't working to keep weapons out of the hands of the bad guys.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I think it's a very interesting question. Most were very willing to crucify the President over Watergate. So what about 'Fast & Furious?' What do you think?

What about Operation Wide Receiver? Bush placed 450 guns into the hands of drug dealers. Those guns were never recovered. God only knows what crimes they have been used in for the past 6 years.

I think it's a very interesting question.

I think the fact that the program was killed after they lost track of the guns, and that the people running Fast and Furious knew that the guns were unrecoverable, says more about the people who ran Fast and Furious than it does the people who ran Wide Receiver.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The Mexican gangs have plenty of guns from the US without F+F, dupes- thanks to Pub policy. At least F+F resulted in arrests and convictions. More than 40k have been killed since 2006, and the ATF chief has said neither the Bush or Obama administrations were kept in the loop. Change the channel.

you're Jrunk go sleep it off.

 

[Oldstyle]

I think it's a very interesting question. Most were very willing to crucify the President over Watergate. So what about 'Fast & Furious?' What do you think?

What about Operation Wide Receiver? Bush placed 450 guns into the hands of drug dealers. Those guns were never recovered. God only knows what crimes they have been used in for the past 6 years.

I think it's a very interesting question.

Operation Wide Receiver was a joint Mexican/US effort to trace and arrest those trafficking weapons across the border. It was a program that was halted BECAUSE they found they couldn't keep track of the weapons and were losing them. For that reason the program was halted by the Bush Department of Justice.

So did you want to take a crack at explaining why the Obama Department of Justice started Fast & Furious? Sheer stupidity or an "ends justify the means" ideology are your only real choices with Fast & Furious...which is the one you want, G5000?

 

[bigrebnc1775]

First video pin points what to listen for
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L54gOgJxIRQ]Obama knew about Gun Walking in March, 2009 - YouTube[/ame]

This is the unedited video
U.S.-Mexico Border Security Policy - C-SPAN Video Library

Do not tell me obama and holder did not know what was going on.

 

[The T]

First video pin points what to listen for
Obama knew about Gun Walking in March, 2009 - YouTube

This is the unedited video
U.S.-Mexico Border Security Policy - C-SPAN Video Library

Do not tell me obama and holder did not know what was going on.

They knew damed well.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

First video pin points what to listen for
Obama knew about Gun Walking in March, 2009 - YouTube

This is the unedited video
U.S.-Mexico Border Security Policy - C-SPAN Video Library

Do not tell me obama and holder did not know what was going on.

They knew damed well.

Thanks to this thread I would not have thought to find the cspan video

http://www.usmessageboard.com/5493600-post1.html

 

[oreo]

I think it's a very interesting question. Most were very willing to crucify the President over Watergate. So what about 'Fast & Furious?' What do you think?

What about Operation Wide Receiver? Bush placed 450 guns into the hands of drug dealers. Those guns were never recovered. God only knows what crimes they have been used in for the past 6 years.

I think it's a very interesting question.

I think the fact that the program was killed after they lost track of the guns, and that the people running Fast and Furious knew that the guns were unrecoverable, says more about the people who ran Fast and Furious than it does the people who ran Wide Receiver.

Agreed--what's in everyone's face though that the Obama administration in 2010 actually was prosecuting the known gun runners coming out of Wide Receiver--and still went ahead with Fast n Furious--the exact same thing as Wide Receiver only on a much bigger scale. Obama/Holder knew that wide receiver was stopped in 2007 because guns got loose in Mexico--but went right ahead with F & F--and now they're all trying to blame BOOOOOSH for it.

 

[The T]

First video pin points what to listen for
Obama knew about Gun Walking in March, 2009 - YouTube

This is the unedited video
U.S.-Mexico Border Security Policy - C-SPAN Video Library

Do not tell me obama and holder did not know what was going on.

They knew damed well.

Thanks to this thread I would not have thought to find the cspan video

http://www.usmessageboard.com/5493600-post1.html

Good deal. Means we have alot of eyes...

This does not bode well for Obama at all.

Some have called this a distraction and even some have advised Romney to steer clear of this issue...

Why would he? Congress is doing thier job...and Romney is going to have to work with them.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

They knew damed well.

Thanks to this thread I would not have thought to find the cspan video

http://www.usmessageboard.com/5493600-post1.html

Good deal. Means we have alot of eyes...

This does not bode well for Obama at all.

Some have called this a distraction and even some have advised Romney to steer clear of this issue...

Why would he? Congress is doing thier job...and Romney is going to have to work with them.

Because my friend Romney is the same as obama. that is why. That is the simple truth. Just watch if Romney doesn't say something on this you can believe what I say is true.

 

[oreo]

I think it's a very interesting question. Most were very willing to crucify the President over Watergate. So what about 'Fast & Furious?' What do you think?

What about Operation Wide Receiver? Bush placed 450 guns into the hands of drug dealers. Those guns were never recovered. God only knows what crimes they have been used in for the past 6 years.

I think it's a very interesting question.

Operation Wide Receiver was a joint Mexican/US effort to trace and arrest those trafficking weapons across the border. It was a program that was halted BECAUSE they found they couldn't keep track of the weapons and were losing them. For that reason the program was halted by the Bush Department of Justice.

So did you want to take a crack at explaining why the Obama Department of Justice started Fast & Furious? Sheer stupidity or an "ends justify the means" ideology are your only real choices with Fast & Furious...which is the one you want, G5000?

EXACTLY:

The first known ATF "gunwalking" operation to Mexican drug cartels, named Operation Wide Receiver, began in early 2006 and ran into late 2007. Licensed dealer Mike Detty informed the ATF of a suspicious gun purchase that took place in February 2006 in Tucson, Arizona. In March he was hired as a confidential informant working with the ATF's Tucson office, part of their Phoenix, Arizona field division.[23] With the use of surveillance equipment, ATF agents monitored additional sales by Detty to straw purchasers. With assurance from ATF "that Mexican officials would be conducting surveillance or interdictions when guns got to the other side of the border",[24] Detty would sell a total of about 450 guns during the operation.[22] These included AR-15s, semi-automatic AK-pattern rifles, and Colt .38s. The vast majority of the guns were eventually lost as they moved into Mexico.[7][23][25]At the time, under the Bush administration Department of Justice (DOJ), no arrests or indictments were made. After President Barack Obama took office in 2009, the DOJ reviewed Wide Receiver and found that guns had been allowed into the hands of suspected gun traffickers. Indictments began in 2010, over three years after Wide Receiver concluded.

ATF gunwalking scandal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[NYcarbineer]

Let's call this sequel

"Fast and Furious, Kenyan Drift"

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

We've had the Truthers and the Birthers. We need a catchy nickname for the Fast and Furious conspiracists.

How about the F'ers?

What's the conspiracy? We know that there was wrongdoing and we're pretty sure that the Obama regime is covering things up without legal authority. You don't think that the government should be accountable?

And frankly the nicknames are just immature. Get over yourself already.

But it serves their purpose to make this a 'conspiracy' and an out of there premise. Not to be taken seriously, even though hundreds died. Keep in mind, these our the folks that claim to be 'our conscience.'

Spot on.

 

[Too Tall]

Watergate was worse, though not as bad as the Bush admin lying to the american people with the fabricated "they have WMD's and we know where they are" BS to go to war with Iraq.

Bullshit. NO ONE GOT KILLED in Watergate.

IDIOT.

That's why I said the Bush admin lying to go to war with Iraq was the worst. Over 4,000 US troops dead because of the scumbag Bush and the GOP shitheads.

Nobody asked about Iraq you dumb pissant.

 

[The T]

Thanks to this thread I would not have thought to find the cspan video

http://www.usmessageboard.com/5493600-post1.html

Good deal. Means we have alot of eyes...

This does not bode well for Obama at all.

Some have called this a distraction and even some have advised Romney to steer clear of this issue...

Why would he? Congress is doing thier job...and Romney is going to have to work with them.

Because my friend Romney is the same as obama. that is why. That is the simple truth. Just watch if Romney doesn't say something on this you can believe what I say is true.

So far? No word from Romney. I'd be interested to see his thoughts. So far? he's staying on message on the Economy.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Good deal. Means we have alot of eyes...

This does not bode well for Obama at all.

Some have called this a distraction and even some have advised Romney to steer clear of this issue...

Why would he? Congress is doing thier job...and Romney is going to have to work with them.

Because my friend Romney is the same as obama. that is why. That is the simple truth. Just watch if Romney doesn't say something on this you can believe what I say is true.

So far? No word from Romney. I'd be interested to see his thoughts. So far? he's staying on message on the Economy.

This will be the make or break issue with me and Romney.

 

[The T]

Because my friend Romney is the same as obama. that is why. That is the simple truth. Just watch if Romney doesn't say something on this you can believe what I say is true.

So far? No word from Romney. I'd be interested to see his thoughts. So far? he's staying on message on the Economy.

This will be the make or break issue with me and Romney.

I have every reason to belive he'll see the issue similiar as I do...WE will see.