Elizabeth Warren Fights Back Against the "Magical Accounting" of Trickle-Down Economics

[Billy000]

[


Man you're very dumb. Government employees pay taxes on money they earn. So do private sector employees. Some private sector employees are paid by the government, and they too are taxed on their income.

Then we have the Romney's, they put the money they earn by laying off workers, selling of a business assets and putting their profit in off shore accounts.

That is the business of the Romney's, not mine. Stop being so greedy. If you are going to bother yourself with class envy then look at John Kerry. That is a rich bastard. I don't see you bitching about the filthy Kennedys or that asshole George Soros, who has more overseas accounts than Carter has Liver Pills.

Every cent paid to every government employee is either taken from a person who earned it or taken from our children if borrowed money.

The money would have been used in the productive economy or used by however the person that earned wanted it to be used.

You don't create jackshit by taking money out of one pocket and putting it in another. That simple fact of economics seems to escape the mind of all Moon Bats.

"John Kerry,Kennedys, George Soros"


Those guys supporting going back to higher tax rates? How horrible of them.

They must want 'class warfare' right? They must be envious too? lol

Warren Buffett’s:

Actually, there’s been class warfare going on for the last 20 years, and my class has won. We’re the ones that have gotten our tax rates reduced dramatically. If you look at the 400 highest taxpayers in the United States in 1992, the first year for figures, they averaged about $40 million of [income] per person. In the most recent year, they were $227 million per person — five for one. During that period, their taxes went down from 29 percent to 21 percent of income. So, if there’s class warfare, the rich class has won.

There rsquo s been class warfare for the last 20 years and my class has won rsquo - The Plum Line - The Washington Post


HE MUST BE ENVIOUS TOO RIGHT? lol

The top 1% now pay 40% of all federal income tax while the bottom 55% pay nothing.
How stupid is it to take so much from the very people who grow our economy and so llittle from those who do not? Its 100% backwards and stupid and liberal.

You mean as they went from 6%-9% of ALL US income 1945-1980 to 23% by 2007?

Federal income taxes? Oh that share of the piu near post WW 2 lows as share of incomes


Bottom half of US who file income taxes yet make LESS THAN $15,000 PER FAMILY? Please, how much SHOULD they pay? IF they had the same piece of the pie they had in 1980, they'd have almost $5,000 PER family more. Could they do it then??? lol

Non-Partisan Congressional Tax Report Debunks Core Conservative Economic Theory

The conclusion?

Lowering the tax rates on the wealthy and top earners in America do not appear to have any impact on the nation’s economic growth.

This paragraph from the report says it all—

“The reduction in the top tax rates appears to be uncorrelated with saving, investment and productivity growth. The top tax rates appear to have little or no relation to the size of the economic pie. However, the top tax rate reductions appear to be associated with the increasing concentration of income at the top of the income distribution.”


Non-Partisan Congressional Tax Report Debunks Core Conservative Economic Theory-GOP Suppresses Study - Forbes

It's kind of remarkable that article came from Forbes...

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Adding deficits DOESN'T amount to US debt

Yes it does.

Gawd you're a moron.

"Clinton’s large budget surpluses also owe much to the Social Security tax on payrolls. Social Security taxes now bring in more than the cost of current benefits, and the "Social Security surplus" makes the total deficit or surplus figures look better than they would if Social Security wasn’t counted."

The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton


BUDGET

$100 A YEAR COMING IN

$101 GOING OUT

Deficit of $1 , BUT if $10 of the money coming in was PAYROLL taxes to pay for SS let's say, you grew your debt by $11 dollars. Have a 5th grader explain it to you Bubba

BUDGET

$100 A YEAR COMING IN

$101 GOING OUT

Deficit of $1 , BUT if $10 of the money coming in was PAYROLL taxes to pay for SS let's say, you grew your debt by $11 dollars. Have a 5th grader explain it to you Bubba

In your simplistic example, $90 came in thru income, business, import taxes and fees, etc.
$10 came in thru payroll taxes.
Spending was $101.
Your debt increased by $1, because your spending was more than your income.
Get an unrelated 5th grader to explain it to you. Doofus.

And the $10 that went into the budget BUT actually bought US treasury bonds (debt)? lol

And the $10 that went into the budget BUT actually bought US treasury bonds (debt)? lol

Still hilarious that you somehow think the government doesn't spend the money they raise by selling Treasury bonds.

Do you think the proceeds of bonds are simply put in a mattress? What do you think should be the purpose of Treasury Bonds, municipal bonds and private sector bonds?

Do you think the proceeds of bonds are simply put in a mattress?

No I don't. I think the proceeds are spent. Sometimes on useful things. Sometimes on wasteful things.

 

[Dad2three]

You can't refute Dubya's tax cuts that were SUPPOSED to create jobs, created a single one

Can you try that again, in English?

Dubya's tax cuts didn't create a single job, other than his!

That's an interesting claim. I'd like to see your proof.

Well we can only go on job creation right? Like Reagan's MYTH that tax cuts created jobs? lol

Bureau of Labor Statistics Data

DUBYA LOST 1+ MILLION JOBS IN 8 YEARS, EVEN BEFORE THE CRASH HE ONLY HAD 4 MILLION PRIVATE SECTOR JOBS IN 7 YEARS, LOL

 

[Dad2three]

Sure Bubba, they spend it. Funny how you can't admit adding up deficits DOESN'T get you the debt, lol

If the deficit is $500 billion this year, that won't add $500 billion to the debt?
Please explain further. I'll be making some popcorn in anticipation.

ONCE MORE FOR THE LOW INFO RIGHTY


Social Security taxes now bring in more than the cost of current benefits, and the "Social Security surplus" makes the total deficit or surplus figures look better than they would if Social Security wasn’t counted.

The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton


NO DEBT ISN'T JUST ADDING UP THE DEFICITS DUMMY

the total deficit or surplus figures look better than they would if Social Security wasn’t counted.
Exactly! Never claimed otherwise.

NO DEBT ISN'T JUST ADDING UP THE DEFICITS DUMMY

Since the annual deficit numbers that are published already took the SS surplus into account, new deficits really do add to the debt.

Still playing games shocking. YOUR posit was just add up the deficits and you get debt. FALSE. STOP BEING A POS LIAR

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Tell me again about the 60%. Moron.

Yes, when Ronnie increased SS taxes in 1983, when he doubled SS taxes on the self employed, the overall total increase in SS tax revenues was 60%,

Yes, when Ronnie increased SS taxes in 1983, when he doubled SS taxes on the self employed, the overall total increase in SS tax revenues was 60%

So you're done with your previous lie?

Since Reagan increased SS taxes 60%

That's a relief! One step at a time.
I guess you can prove your new lie, I mean claim?

Care to disprove ANYTHING I've posited Bubba? lol

You already admitted your claim that Reagan increased SS taxes 60% was a lie.
Now you want me to prove that 1984 SS tax revenue was not 60% higher than 1983 SS tax revenue?

Never did that Bubba, IF you posit it, PROVE it

How many jobs did Dubya's tax cuts for the rich create?

How about Reagan's?

PROVE IT!

Never did that Bubba

You never claimed Reagan increased SS taxes by 60%? LOL!
Take your meds, you're making less than you do normally.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

You mean as they went from 6%-9% of ALL US income 1945-1980 to 23% by 2007?

In 1980 top 1% paid 20% of all personal income tax and now they pay 40%. This is obviously stupid as we are taxing investment capital whereas when you tax the bottom 55% you are taxing more trivial stuff like $200 sneakers. Plus when the bottom 55% don't pay their only incentive to always raise taxes since they don't pay them.

Libcommies always get everything backwards. Dumbt3 is a lib commie

 

[Dad2three]

Yes, when Ronnie increased SS taxes in 1983, when he doubled SS taxes on the self employed, the overall total increase in SS tax revenues was 60%,

Yes, when Ronnie increased SS taxes in 1983, when he doubled SS taxes on the self employed, the overall total increase in SS tax revenues was 60%

So you're done with your previous lie?

Since Reagan increased SS taxes 60%

That's a relief! One step at a time.
I guess you can prove your new lie, I mean claim?

Care to disprove ANYTHING I've posited Bubba? lol

You already admitted your claim that Reagan increased SS taxes 60% was a lie.
Now you want me to prove that 1984 SS tax revenue was not 60% higher than 1983 SS tax revenue?

Never did that Bubba, IF you posit it, PROVE it

How many jobs did Dubya's tax cuts for the rich create?

How about Reagan's?

PROVE IT!

Never did that Bubba

You never claimed Reagan increased SS taxes by 60%? LOL!
Take your meds, you're making less than you do normally.

Got it, you'll continue your lie

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Explain why intra-Gov't debt worries you.

You mean how debt increases when payroll taxes hide the REAL cost of Gov't and conservatives push the costs down the road to be paid for by their kids/grandkids???

Thanks for agreeing, debt ISN'T deficits added up and HW Bush increased debt by about 60% (over $1.5+ trillion) in his 4 years!

I know, $1.5 trillion in new debt, in 4 years, is awful!!!

$7.4 trillion in new debt, so far, doesn't seem to bother you as much.

Good you agree, despite your earlier posit that HW Bush grew the debt by less than $1 trillion was a LIE

Yes, Weird how that debt piled up on Obama right? Went on a UNFUNDED tax cutting, UNFUNDED war invading, UNFUNDED Medicare expansion WHILE he ignored regulator warnings AND cheered on the Banksters. Oh wait, no

despite your earlier posit that HW Bush grew the debt by less than $1 trillion was a LIE

Well, it was based on budget numbers from the White House website, but I'm willing to use Debt-to-the-Penny numbers going forward.

So NO, you will not be honest and recognize (the) BUDGET deficits have nothing to do with actual debt. Shocking

You know the W/H website you used? .lol

So NO, you will not be honest and recognize (the) BUDGET deficits have nothing to do with actual debt.

OMG! STFU!
When the deficit this year comes in at $X billion, will that add $X billion to last year's debt? Why not?

You know the W/H website you used?

Right here.---> Historical Tables The White House

Table 1.1

 

[Dad2three]

You mean as they went from 6%-9% of ALL US income 1945-1980 to 23% by 2007?

In 1980 they paid 20% of all personal income tax and now they pay 40%. This is obviously stupid as we are taxing investment capital whereas when you tax the bottom 55% you are taxing more trivial stuff like $200 sneakers. Plus when the bottom 55% don't pay their only incentive to always raise taxes since they don't pay them.

Libcommies always get everything backwards. Dumbt3 is a lib commie

AND THEY'VE INCREASED THEIR 'SHARE' OF THE PIE BY NEARLY 300% WHILE PAYROLL TAXES, THOSE HEAVILY BORN BY THE BOTTOM 90% HAS GROWN TO BE THE SECOND BIGGEST GOV'T FUNDER, WHERE ALMOST $4 TRILLION WAS PUT AWAY IN GOV'T BONDS, TO HIDE THE TRUE COSTS OF REAGAN/BUSH TAX CUTS. Go figure

It's NOT the bottom 55% dummy/liar, it WAS 47%, now it's closer to 44%, AND the vast majority of them are seniors/kids in college. In other words PAST or future tax payers!


Poor Americans Pay Double The State, Local Tax Rates Of Top One Percent



Nearly every U.S. state taxes the poor more than the rich, according to a 2009 report by the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy. Overall, the poorest 20 percent of households paid an average 10.9 percent of their incomes in state and local taxes in 2007, while the top 1 percent on average paid just 5.2 percent of their incomes in state and local taxes,


Poor Americans Pay Double The State Local Tax Rates Of Top One Percent

 

[Dad2three]

You mean how debt increases when payroll taxes hide the REAL cost of Gov't and conservatives push the costs down the road to be paid for by their kids/grandkids???

Thanks for agreeing, debt ISN'T deficits added up and HW Bush increased debt by about 60% (over $1.5+ trillion) in his 4 years!

I know, $1.5 trillion in new debt, in 4 years, is awful!!!

$7.4 trillion in new debt, so far, doesn't seem to bother you as much.

Good you agree, despite your earlier posit that HW Bush grew the debt by less than $1 trillion was a LIE

Yes, Weird how that debt piled up on Obama right? Went on a UNFUNDED tax cutting, UNFUNDED war invading, UNFUNDED Medicare expansion WHILE he ignored regulator warnings AND cheered on the Banksters. Oh wait, no

despite your earlier posit that HW Bush grew the debt by less than $1 trillion was a LIE

Well, it was based on budget numbers from the White House website, but I'm willing to use Debt-to-the-Penny numbers going forward.

So NO, you will not be honest and recognize (the) BUDGET deficits have nothing to do with actual debt. Shocking

You know the W/H website you used? .lol

So NO, you will not be honest and recognize (the) BUDGET deficits have nothing to do with actual debt.

OMG! STFU!
When the deficit this year comes in at $X billion, will that add $X billion to last year's debt? Why not?

You know the W/H website you used?

Right here.---> Historical Tables The White House

Table 1.1

Yes, YOU lie. I'm shocked YOU still want to argue about YOUR premise that adding up all the deficits in HW's term equaled the debt, lol

LEAVING OUT THAT EXCESS PAYROLL TAXES SHRUNK THE DEFICITS BUT GREW DEBT!!!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Sure Bubba, they spend it. Funny how you can't admit adding up deficits DOESN'T get you the debt, lol

If the deficit is $500 billion this year, that won't add $500 billion to the debt?
Please explain further. I'll be making some popcorn in anticipation.

ONCE MORE FOR THE LOW INFO RIGHTY


Social Security taxes now bring in more than the cost of current benefits, and the "Social Security surplus" makes the total deficit or surplus figures look better than they would if Social Security wasn’t counted.

The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton


NO DEBT ISN'T JUST ADDING UP THE DEFICITS DUMMY

the total deficit or surplus figures look better than they would if Social Security wasn’t counted.
Exactly! Never claimed otherwise.

NO DEBT ISN'T JUST ADDING UP THE DEFICITS DUMMY

Since the annual deficit numbers that are published already took the SS surplus into account, new deficits really do add to the debt.

Still playing games shocking. YOUR posit was just add up the deficits and you get debt. FALSE. STOP BEING A POS LIAR

YOUR posit was just add up the deficits and you get debt.

It's true, if you add Bush's deficits, you'll see how much he added to the debt.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Yes, when Ronnie increased SS taxes in 1983, when he doubled SS taxes on the self employed, the overall total increase in SS tax revenues was 60%

So you're done with your previous lie?

Since Reagan increased SS taxes 60%

That's a relief! One step at a time.
I guess you can prove your new lie, I mean claim?

Care to disprove ANYTHING I've posited Bubba? lol

You already admitted your claim that Reagan increased SS taxes 60% was a lie.
Now you want me to prove that 1984 SS tax revenue was not 60% higher than 1983 SS tax revenue?

Never did that Bubba, IF you posit it, PROVE it

How many jobs did Dubya's tax cuts for the rich create?

How about Reagan's?

PROVE IT!

Never did that Bubba

You never claimed Reagan increased SS taxes by 60%? LOL!
Take your meds, you're making less than you do normally.

Got it, you'll continue your lie

I will continue to point out your lies. Got it?

 

[bripat9643]

So government leeches are entitled to more than the people who pay their salaries? Is that what you really wanted to admit? I would rather have money go to the 1% who earned it than the 5% who make up the government workforce.

You get what you pay for

Pay for bottom of the barrel employees you get bottom of the barrel employees

Wrong. The most you'll ever get is what you paid for. In the case of government employees, you get much less.

You just insulted all employees in the private sector by calling them "bottom of the barrel." It's no surprise that a tick on the ass of society like you would look down your nose at the people who pay your salary.

As usual, you're full of shit. The only difference between a civil servant and a private sector employee is who signs their check.

Your hate for government and government employees has history. If I had to guess, you applied for a civil service job and either failed the written test or couldn't meet the minimum qualifications (MQ's).

Right, in one case a criminal signs a check paid for with looted funds. In the other case a business owner signs a check paid for by producing goods and services that consumers purchase voluntarily.

You're right, the fact that you work for the government is a disgrace in my eyes. You're a looter and a usless tick on the ass of society.

You're entitled to your opinions, worthless that they may be. I suspect real conservatives, as well as the average American, recoils in embarrassment whenever you post. Your ignorance is only surpassed by your prejudices.

I'm not a conservative. I'm an anarcho-capitalist. My opinions are inspired by a profound understanding of government, not ignorance.

 

[Dad2three]

Sure Bubba, they spend it. Funny how you can't admit adding up deficits DOESN'T get you the debt, lol

If the deficit is $500 billion this year, that won't add $500 billion to the debt?
Please explain further. I'll be making some popcorn in anticipation.

ONCE MORE FOR THE LOW INFO RIGHTY


Social Security taxes now bring in more than the cost of current benefits, and the "Social Security surplus" makes the total deficit or surplus figures look better than they would if Social Security wasn’t counted.

The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton


NO DEBT ISN'T JUST ADDING UP THE DEFICITS DUMMY

the total deficit or surplus figures look better than they would if Social Security wasn’t counted.
Exactly! Never claimed otherwise.

NO DEBT ISN'T JUST ADDING UP THE DEFICITS DUMMY

Since the annual deficit numbers that are published already took the SS surplus into account, new deficits really do add to the debt.

Still playing games shocking. YOUR posit was just add up the deficits and you get debt. FALSE. STOP BEING A POS LIAR

YOUR posit was just add up the deficits and you get debt.

It's true, if you add Bush's deficits, you'll see how much he added to the debt.

Weird, YOU went from under $1 trillion to my figure of OVER $1.5 TRILLION now you want to go backwards? There is no hope for you Bubba

 

[bripat9643]

BUDGET

$100 A YEAR COMING IN

$101 GOING OUT

Deficit of $1 , BUT if $10 of the money coming in was PAYROLL taxes to pay for SS let's say, you grew your debt by $11 dollars. Have a 5th grader explain it to you Bubba

In your simplistic example, $90 came in thru income, business, import taxes and fees, etc.
$10 came in thru payroll taxes.
Spending was $101.
Your debt increased by $1, because your spending was more than your income.
Get an unrelated 5th grader to explain it to you. Doofus.

And the $10 that went into the budget BUT actually bought US treasury bonds (debt)? lol

That money was spent also. That $10 in treasury bonds is worthless to the taxpayers. They are the ones who have to pay them off.

What a moron.

Who do you think owns Treasury Bonds?

The taxpayers own them, which is why they are worthless. The taxpayers are the ones on the hook to pay them off.

Weird, you mean we use excess payroll taxes to hide the real cost of Gov't SO that the 'job creators' can keep their lowest sustained tax burden in 80+ years then???? To have FUTURE tax payers pay off current debt that conservatives/GOP created???

"United for a Fair Economy?" Is that a propaganda organ for the Communist Party?

BTW, doing business with the government doesn't come under the classification of "corporate welfare." If it did, then virtually every corporation in American accepts corporate welfare. Of course, that's exactly the kind of smear turds like you are trying to put over on the public.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Poor Americans Pay Double The State Local Tax Rates Of Top One Percent

the top 1% pay 40% of all the personal federal income tax and 50% of state budgets in many states including NY and CA. This of course is just another soviet mess wherein we waste our seed corn or investment capital. A liberal will lack the IQ to understand.

 

[Dad2three]

Care to disprove ANYTHING I've posited Bubba? lol

You already admitted your claim that Reagan increased SS taxes 60% was a lie.
Now you want me to prove that 1984 SS tax revenue was not 60% higher than 1983 SS tax revenue?

Never did that Bubba, IF you posit it, PROVE it

How many jobs did Dubya's tax cuts for the rich create?

How about Reagan's?

PROVE IT!

Never did that Bubba

You never claimed Reagan increased SS taxes by 60%? LOL!
Take your meds, you're making less than you do normally.

Got it, you'll continue your lie

I will continue to point out your lies. Got it?

Sure, THAT'S what you do

While you're at it, care to point the jobs created BECAUSE of supply side economics either under Ronnie OR Dubya? Pretty please?

 

[Dad2three]

And the $10 that went into the budget BUT actually bought US treasury bonds (debt)? lol

That money was spent also. That $10 in treasury bonds is worthless to the taxpayers. They are the ones who have to pay them off.

What a moron.

Who do you think owns Treasury Bonds?

The taxpayers own them, which is why they are worthless. The taxpayers are the ones on the hook to pay them off.

Weird, you mean we use excess payroll taxes to hide the real cost of Gov't SO that the 'job creators' can keep their lowest sustained tax burden in 80+ years then???? To have FUTURE tax payers pay off current debt that conservatives/GOP created???

"United for a Fair Economy?" Is that a propaganda organ for the Communist Party?

So you CAN'T refute facts, you'll go to ad homs Shocking

 

[Dad2three]

Poor Americans Pay Double The State Local Tax Rates Of Top One Percent

the top 1% pay 40% of all the personal federal income tax and 50% of state budgets in many states including NY and CA. This of course is just another soviet mess wherein we waste our seed corn or investment capital. A liberal will lack the IQ to understand.

U.S. workers' share of national income is at an ALL-TIME low:

Nonfarm Business Sector Labor Share - FRED - St. Louis Fed
FRED« Nonfarm Business Sector: Labor Share

But corporate profits are increasing:

Corporate Profits After Tax without IVA and CCAdj - FRED - St. Louis Fed
FRED« Corporate Profits After Tax

Mainly because of reduced wages and benefits:

"JPMorgan’s July 11, 2011, “Eye on the Market” newsletter put it, “Reductions in wages and benefits explain the majority of the net improvement in [profit] margins… US labor compensation is now at a 50-year low relative to both company sales and US GDP.”

Worker productivity has been increasing:

Graph Quarterly productivity in the nonfarm business sector
Graph: Quarterly productivity in the nonfarm business sector


CUT SOME MORE REGULATIONS/TAXES FOR THOSE 'JOB CREATORS', THAT'LL FIX IT RIGHT??? LOL

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

U.S. workers' share of national income is at an ALL-TIME low:

what else would you expect when liberal unions and taxes drove 30 million workers's jobs off shore?

See why we say liberalism is based in pure ignorance?