Gosnell... Abortion Atrocities

[AmyNation]

No, he's on trial for killing babies, babies born alive, who breathed and moved before he killed them. Last I checked that was still illegal.

 

[JoeB131]

No, he's on trial for killing babies, babies born alive, who breathed and moved before he killed them. Last I checked that was still illegal.

Then why isn't it prosecuted all the time?

Why has it been 11 years since the Federal "Born Alive Infant Protection Act" was passed, and the Federal Government has yet to bring ONE PROSECUTION under this law?

Would Gosnell have been prosecuted if he hadn't killed an adult patient and dealt a bunch of drugs out of his clinic?

 

[AmyNation]

What are you talking about? I'm not getting led down the rabbit hole on this. This isn't about all abortions, or past abortion doctors.

The man is charged with the murder of living breathing viable babies. It's up to the state to prove he murdered them, and having read about the long list of witnesses and evidence, I believe the man will be found guilty.

 

[BlueGin]

No, he's on trial for killing babies, babies born alive, who breathed and moved before he killed them. Last I checked that was still illegal.

Joe also glosses over the mother he killed.

 

[JoeB131]

What are you talking about? I'm not getting led down the rabbit hole on this. This isn't about all abortions, or past abortion doctors.

The man is charged with the murder of living breathing viable babies. It's up to the state to prove he murdered them, and having read about the long list of witnesses and evidence, I believe the man will be found guilty.

You can believe what you want.

The prosecution has probably already committed reversable error. They introduced a lot of evidence about the three fetuses who the judge threw out the charges on. (Even though the judge seemed a bit confused himself as to which fetuses he was throwing out. NOpe, it wasn't "baby C" it was "baby F".)

So how do you really say the jury considered the four fetuses he was being tried on after three others were mentioned and hundreds were talked about and not really proven.

The coroner himself admitted -

He was unable to provide birth certificates for these fetuses.
He was unable to provide death certificats for these fetuses or even determine how they died.
He was unable to tell if they were alive or dead when they left the womb.

Now, here's the thing. Do I think that he probably terminated already dying fetuses outside the womb? Probably. But the whole argument is so artificial it bends logic.

"Oh, wait, I just injected this fetus with a bunch of drugs to kill it IN the womb, but now that it's out of the womb fatally poisoned, I have to heroically try to save it!"

Seriously?

It's the problem with artificial standards and definitions and no enforcement.

 

[JoeB131]

No, he's on trial for killing babies, babies born alive, who breathed and moved before he killed them. Last I checked that was still illegal.

Joe also glosses over the mother he killed.

When did I do that?

I never disputed he was guilty of third degree manslaughter in the case of Mrs. Mognar, a legally alive human being he killed through negligence.

But 96,000 AMericans are killled through medical negligence EVERY FREAKIN' YEAR.

And the Right Wing's answer to controlling medical costs? Tort Reform. Some of those people getting killed are getting money, DAMMIT!

 

[rdean]

Come on people. If Republicans get their way and continue to close abortion clinics, you will see a lot worse than this. Women go to buchers when they have no place else to go.

Republicans might as well say, "Die bitch, suffer and then die". Seems like that's what they want.

I just think the government needs to cease with funding Planned Parenthood and any other abortion clinics. They can stay open just pay for your own abortion and not with my tax dollars.

Course, don't pay for the kids once they are born, right?

 

[BlueGin]

No, he's on trial for killing babies, babies born alive, who breathed and moved before he killed them. Last I checked that was still illegal.

Joe also glosses over the mother he killed.

When did I do that?

I never disputed he was guilty of third degree manslaughter in the case of Mrs. Mognar, a legally alive human being he killed through negligence.

But 96,000 AMericans are killled through medical negligence EVERY FREAKIN' YEAR.

And the Right Wing's answer to controlling medical costs? Tort Reform. Some of those people getting killed are getting money, DAMMIT!

He is also guilty of performing illegal abortions of viable babies. Third trimester abortions are Illegal. Why? because...again... the babies are viable at that point.

The man did not know how to do abortions anyway he had never finished an obstetrics/gynecology residency. And had unlicensed staff illegally performing them as well. Which would be why several patients settled malpratice lawsuits with this man and 46 others are pending, not to mention the fact that several of his staff were also brought up on charges.

So, sure other people may be killed due to medical negligence. That doesn't negate the claims of negligence due to abortions that are botched in THIS case or any other.

 

[BlueGin]

What are you talking about? I'm not getting led down the rabbit hole on this. This isn't about all abortions, or past abortion doctors.

The man is charged with the murder of living breathing viable babies. It's up to the state to prove he murdered them, and having read about the long list of witnesses and evidence, I believe the man will be found guilty.

You can believe what you want.

The prosecution has probably already committed reversable error. They introduced a lot of evidence about the three fetuses who the judge threw out the charges on. (Even though the judge seemed a bit confused himself as to which fetuses he was throwing out. NOpe, it wasn't "baby C" it was "baby F".)

So how do you really say the jury considered the four fetuses he was being tried on after three others were mentioned and hundreds were talked about and not really proven.

The coroner himself admitted -

He was unable to provide birth certificates for these fetuses.
He was unable to provide death certificats for these fetuses or even determine how they died.
He was unable to tell if they were alive or dead when they left the womb.

Now, here's the thing. Do I think that he probably terminated already dying fetuses outside the womb? Probably. But the whole argument is so artificial it bends logic.

"Oh, wait, I just injected this fetus with a bunch of drugs to kill it IN the womb, but now that it's out of the womb fatally poisoned, I have to heroically try to save it!"

Seriously?

It's the problem with artificial standards and definitions and no enforcement.

Duh...even the grand jury stated that the records at this facility were falsified and/or completely missing. The reason he was charged with the murders of the other babies was because they had eye witnesses that saw them breathe after birth.

How exactly does it bend logic? The list is long as to patient abuse by this man ( see the malpractice cases he had already settled and the 46 more pending). The only "logic bending" going on is you trying to put a rah rah pro abortion spin on the situation.

 

[Darkwind]

they do wish they could sweep this away..

this might take Sandy hook off the front page and they can't use this for anything because they support abortion

Well, we could talk about how the attempts by the right to drive legitmate practioners out of the abortion business by killing them, threatening them, cutting funding to poor women trying to get abortions in the first trimester, and so on has created guys like Gosnell.

Or that if we were talking about rich white women, they never had problems like this, because they could always get a nice safe abortion if they wanted one.

But you guys will just show your fetus porn and wag your fingers and try to pretend this is an important story when it really isn't.

Why don't you just talk about Gosnell and his little house of horrors he was running down there in Philly....

Were you aware that this is the same Gosnell that was responsible for the mothers day massacre?

 

[auditor0007]

Come on people. If Republicans get their way and continue to close abortion clinics, you will see a lot worse than this. Women go to buchers when they have no place else to go.

Republicans might as well say, "Die bitch, suffer and then die". Seems like that's what they want.

I just think the government needs to cease with funding Planned Parenthood and any other abortion clinics. They can stay open just pay for your own abortion and not with my tax dollars.

Course, don't pay for the kids once they are born, right?

That's not their job, and they are correct in stating that it is not their job. What they fail to understand is that many of these women do not and will never have the ability or capacity to support those children, and somebody has to, so the cost is passed on to the taxpayer, but then they call these people and their kids leeches.

 

[auditor0007]

Joe also glosses over the mother he killed.

When did I do that?

I never disputed he was guilty of third degree manslaughter in the case of Mrs. Mognar, a legally alive human being he killed through negligence.

But 96,000 AMericans are killled through medical negligence EVERY FREAKIN' YEAR.

And the Right Wing's answer to controlling medical costs? Tort Reform. Some of those people getting killed are getting money, DAMMIT!

He is also guilty of performing illegal abortions of viable babies. Third trimester abortions are Illegal. Why? because...again... the babies are viable at that point.

The man did not know how to do abortions anyway he had never finished an obstetrics/gynecology residency. And had unlicensed staff illegally performing them as well. Which would be why several patients settled malpratice lawsuits with this man and 46 others are pending, not to mention the fact that several of his staff were also brought up on charges.

So, sure other people may be killed due to medical negligence. That doesn't negate the claims of negligence due to abortions that are botched in THIS case or any other.

I read in one article that at least one of the babies that was allegedly killed was aborted at 30 weeks. I do not know if this is true, but if it is that is plain outright murder, if the child was born alive. My youngest son was born at 30 weeks, and all he needed was oxygen and monitoring to make certain he didn't stop breathing. At 30 weeks, not only is the baby viable, it is cognizant of feelings, emotions, and pain. My son will be 16 this year and is normal and healthy.

 

[SuMar]

Come on people. If Republicans get their way and continue to close abortion clinics, you will see a lot worse than this. Women go to buchers when they have no place else to go.

Republicans might as well say, "Die bitch, suffer and then die". Seems like that's what they want.

I just think the government needs to cease with funding Planned Parenthood and any other abortion clinics. They can stay open just pay for your own abortion and not with my tax dollars.

Course, don't pay for the kids once they are born, right?

If you can't afford to raise a child, once again adoption...Funny how libs gloss over that fact.

 

[Lumpy 1]

I just think the government needs to cease with funding Planned Parenthood and any other abortion clinics. They can stay open just pay for your own abortion and not with my tax dollars.

Course, don't pay for the kids once they are born, right?

That's not their job, and they are correct in stating that it is not their job. What they fail to understand is that many of these women do not and will never have the ability or capacity to support those children, and somebody has to, so the cost is passed on to the taxpayer, but then they call these people and their kids leeches.

People that work and take responsibility for their lives rarely have time for screwing around and getting or causing women to get knocked up.. put people to work, change the dynamics of the failed liberal freeloading policy repercussions.

 

[buckeye45_73]

No, he's on trial for killing babies, babies born alive, who breathed and moved before he killed them. Last I checked that was still illegal.

Joe also glosses over the mother he killed.

When did I do that?

I never disputed he was guilty of third degree manslaughter in the case of Mrs. Mognar, a legally alive human being he killed through negligence.

But 96,000 AMericans are killled through medical negligence EVERY FREAKIN' YEAR.

And the Right Wing's answer to controlling medical costs? Tort Reform. Some of those people getting killed are getting money, DAMMIT!

And tort reform wont effect those...but it will effect dumbasses who are wrongfully suing and hey tort reform makes you PROVE it in court....and not able to force settlements....what a concept.......take it to court.....wow!

 

[JoeB131]

[

He is also guilty of performing illegal abortions of viable babies. Third trimester abortions are Illegal. Why? because...again... the babies are viable at that point.

so. fucking. what. It's a stupid law that shouldn't be on the books, and is never prosecuted under most circumstances when done by a compentent doctor.

[
The man did not know how to do abortions anyway he had never finished an obstetrics/gynecology residency. And had unlicensed staff illegally performing them as well. Which would be why several patients settled malpratice lawsuits with this man and 46 others are pending, not to mention the fact that several of his staff were also brought up on charges.

True enough. But again. You Wingnuts are the ones who have driven credible abortion providers out of business, have cut funding to planned parenthood because your imaginary sky friend said they were bad, and generally think poor people of color shouldn't have the same access to good medicine white folks have. Socialized medicine? HOW DARE YOU! Poor people should take their chances with quacks. Serves them right for being poor!

[
So, sure other people may be killed due to medical negligence. That doesn't negate the claims of negligence due to abortions that are botched in THIS case or any other.

Well, it kind of does. There is a Tusla OK Dentist who has infected three of his patients with HIV due to his negligence.

Scores of Tulsa dental patients tested for hepatitis, HIV exposure - CNN.com

A teenage patient, who asked not to be named, told CNN he had a bad experience at Harrington's office a year ago.

During a surgery to remove three molars, he awoke momentarily to see profuse bleeding. He said he became alarmed but was told to "shut up" and hold gauze in place. When he awoke a second time, he was tied up on the floor. Harrington's staff explained that he had been "combative" during the operation, he said.

Why aren't you starting fifteen threads on THIS guy? Oh, that's right, because dentists aren't "evil" in the sight of your Sky Pixie the way abortionists are!

 

[JoeB131]

[

Duh...even the grand jury stated that the records at this facility were falsified and/or completely missing. The reason he was charged with the murders of the other babies was because they had eye witnesses that saw them breathe after birth.

How exactly does it bend logic? The list is long as to patient abuse by this man ( see the malpractice cases he had already settled and the 46 more pending). The only "logic bending" going on is you trying to put a rah rah pro abortion spin on the situation.

Again, his malpractice isn't at issue here.

It's whether fetuses count as people... and the judge has already thrown 3 of those 7 cases out.

The "eyewitnesses" are people who are all facing crimnal charges of their own and are pretty much willing to say anything to get lighter sentences.

The only "bending" going on here is trying to strap on an anti-Choice agenda on a malpractice and drug dealing case that was pretty clear cut.

 

[JoeB131]

[.

And the Right Wing's answer to controlling medical costs? Tort Reform. Some of those people getting killed are getting money, DAMMIT!

And tort reform wont effect those...but it will effect dumbasses who are wrongfully suing and hey tort reform makes you PROVE it in court....and not able to force settlements....what a concept.......take it to court.....wow!

Horseshit. Tort Reform is about making it harder for those maimed by inept doctors to get justice because big corporations don't want to pay out money.

Things the wealthy hate. Unions, Government agencies, Lawyers or a fair fight.

 

[Jroc]

On Tuesday, Minehart granted Gosnell an acquittal in the alleged murders of three of these babies--“Baby B,” “Baby C,” and “Baby G.”

But today, citing what he called a "clerical error," the judge switched Gosnell's acquittal in the murder of "Baby C" to an acquittal in the murder of "Baby F."

According to the grand jury report, "Baby C" was "moving and breathing for 20 minutes” before it was killed. "Baby F” jerked its leg before Gosnell severed his spinal cord, according to testimony.

Acquitting Gosnell for the alleged murdering of the wrong baby was “my error,” Judge Minehart said

.


Flip Flop: Murder Charge Back for 'Breathing' Baby, Dropped for 'Jerk and Move' Baby | CNS News

 

[koshergrl]

He didn't grant an acquital; the judge initially dismissed the charges for lack of evidence, after the defense requested they be dropped. If they're saying it's a clerical error, probably an order was submitted with the motion to dismiss, and he signed it.

Gosnell would have these women come in, and because it was easier, he would induce labor and then kill the babies.

That's abortion. That's what it's all about.