GUNS must GO

[KittenKoder]

If someone broke into my home or attacked a member of my family of course I would take the appropriate action necessary to defend them. But that isn't why the homicide rate in the USA is so high. People can carry concealed handguns and they use them when they are angered because most of them are, I believe, are mentally unstable to begin with. It's what I call the Rambo syndrome - weakling wimps trying to be tough.

What happened to the good old "fist fight" to settle disputes?

No, it's because the criminals know most law abiding citizens won't go through the trouble (or can't) to get a gun so they only fear the cops.

 

[Harry Dresden]

If someone broke into my home or attacked a member of my family of course I would take the appropriate action necessary to defend them. But that isn't why the homicide rate in the USA is so high. People can carry concealed handguns and they use them when they are angered because most of them are, I believe, are mentally unstable to begin with. It's what I call the Rambo syndrome - weakling wimps trying to be tough.

What happened to the good old "fist fight" to settle disputes?

Yuke.....you take out GANG-BANGING homicides,since they occur daily,and constitute a big chunk of those stats,and the US homicide rate falls immensely,and the US would now be considered one of the safest countries on the planet.....and thats a fact....

 

[LiveUninhibited]

You can’t keep guns out of the nation any more than you can keep drugs out. Even if you have total trust in the government (I don’t) and make guns illegal, the black market is simply going to sell more guns making them rich. And who are they going to sell guns to? People who violate the law, the very last people you want to have them. And guess what? They’re going to be secure in the fact that their victims will be unarmed. So I can see where you might try to argue for the regulation of guns, but trying to get rid of them completely simply cannot and should not happen.

 

[Yukon]

Hairry,

You are correct, but if handguns are removed it would also lower the crime rate to within the reach of other civilized nations.

 

[Burp]

Yukon...

Post 180.

 

[Yukon]

My remarks are contained within the original post below in capital lettering.

This is what you don't understand. You want to punish the responsible people who learn how to use a handgun and train to fine tune that knowledge because of the "mentally unstable" people who believe they are Rambo.

I NEVER PROFESSED THAT ANYONE BE PUNISHED.

I took proper classes, received my concealed carry permit, and continue to train (in a safe environment) and fine tune my ability with my handgun so if I am ever forced to use it, I am able to eliminate the threat in a way that doesn't cause injury to anyone else.

IN MY OPINION YOU'RE JUST ANOTHER GI JOE/RAMBO WANNABE

There are people who have a driver's license who have no business on the road. They are careless in their driving and don't care about anyone around them. Just as there are people who are carless about how they treat weapons.

MURDERING PEOPLE GOES BEYOND "CARELESS"

Imagine the rate of deaths from auto accidents rising to an unbelievable level. All the licensing and training and reviewing of licenses to make sure the right people are driving has done no good - accidents levels are outrageous. The government, in their infinite wisdom, now says the only way to prevent any more deaths is to ban the use of automobiles.

THE SCENARIO YOU PORTRAY IS OUTRAGEOUS TO SAY THE LEAST. I'M A GENTLEMAN THEREFORE I WILL SAY NO MORE.

Would this be acceptable to you?

 

[Burp]

You can't murder someone with an automobile?

Why is it outrageous? Guns don't kill - some people have used guns that resulted in a death. Automobiles don't kill - some people have used automobiles the resulted in a death.

Neither object can act freely - someone is controlling it. Controlling it irresponsibly could result in a death (or deaths).

 

[Gunny]

Hairry,

You are correct, but if handguns are removed it would also lower the crime rate to within the reach of other civilized nations.

That is absurd. I suppose you are volunteering to be one of those defenseless folk that become statistics?

Only people like you, and the criminals who would love nothing better than a disarmed society support your bullshit. You think those criminals are going to turn in their guns?

And there is NO data to support your assertion. We have a lawless, rebellious society. We aren't freakin' sheeple like you. Crimes would just be committed by other means.

 

[Yukon]

And there is NO data to support your assertion. We have a lawless, rebellious society. We aren't freakin' sheeple like you. Crimes would just be committed by other means.

There is lots of data. Here's an example:

Handguns and Homicide​

On the average, if someone gets shot and killed, four out of five times it will be with a handgun. In 1997, for example, handguns were used in 79.4 percent of all firearm homicides.10

From 1990 to 1997, handguns were used in a majority (55.6 percent) of all homicides; that is, they were used in murder more than all other weapons combined.11

From 1990 to 1997, there were 293,781 firearm deaths—homicides, suicides, and unintentional shootings.12

From 1990 to 1997 in the United States there were more than—


160,000 homicides

110,000 firearm homicides

89,000 handgun homicides13

Handgun homicides hit record highs in the early 1990s, peaking in 1993. That year there were 13,258 such killings—out of a total of 16,120 firearm homicides.14
As part of an overall drop in crime, in 1997 handgun homicides fell to 8,503.15

VPC - Handgun Ban Fact Sheet

 

[KittenKoder]

And there is NO data to support your assertion. We have a lawless, rebellious society. We aren't freakin' sheeple like you. Crimes would just be committed by other means.

There is lots of data. Here's an example:

Handguns and Homicide​

On the average, if someone gets shot and killed, four out of five times it will be with a handgun. In 1997, for example, handguns were used in 79.4 percent of all firearm homicides.10

From 1990 to 1997, handguns were used in a majority (55.6 percent) of all homicides; that is, they were used in murder more than all other weapons combined.11

From 1990 to 1997, there were 293,781 firearm deaths—homicides, suicides, and unintentional shootings.12

From 1990 to 1997 in the United States there were more than—


160,000 homicides

110,000 firearm homicides

89,000 handgun homicides13

Handgun homicides hit record highs in the early 1990s, peaking in 1993. That year there were 13,258 such killings—out of a total of 16,120 firearm homicides.14
As part of an overall drop in crime, in 1997 handgun homicides fell to 8,503.15

VPC - Handgun Ban Fact Sheet

Those statistics are inaccurate, sensationalized to scare people, which is worse than using a gun illegally. You can't believe everything you read.

Yukon, use logic for once, not just propaganda. Really, you have to have at least a few active brain cells or you wouldn't be posting here.

 

[Yukon]

Kitty,

The figures are accurate for the stated time intervals. You just wont accept the facts. You probably believe there were WMD's in Iraq too ?

 

[KittenKoder]

Kitty,

The figures are accurate for the stated time intervals. You just wont accept the facts. You probably believe there were WMD's in Iraq too ?

Actually, no I don't.

But your statistics are not accurate.
Here's violent crimes in the US: Bureau of Justice Statistics Violent Crime Rate Trends
Murder: Bureau of Justice Statistics Homicide Trends
More detail: Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime Characteristics <- Scroll down to "Weapon Used".

"In 2005, 24% of the incidents of violent crime, a weapon was present.

Offenders had or used a weapon in 48% of all robberies, compared with 22% of all aggravated assaults and 7% of all rapes/sexual assaults in 2005.

Homicides are most often committed with guns, especially handguns. In 2005, 55% of homicides were committed with handguns, 16% with other guns, 14% with knives, 5% with blunt objects, and 11% with other weapons."

... also our laws on guns have not become any stricter since the declines started. These are REAL facts, the problem with your sensationalized ones that really sets up a red flag, they neglect to mention that our total violent crime rate in the US has dropped significantly in the last 10 years. So, 55% is an increase only because those without guns are realizing people are no longer such easy targets, while those with guns still believe that fewer people are carrying. Factoring in the number of violent crimes, the total number of gun related homicides is actually down.

 

[KittenKoder]

As I said Yukon, use those few brain cells for more than just inflating your head.

 

[BrianH]

If someone broke into my home or attacked a member of my family of course I would take the appropriate action necessary to defend them. But that isn't why the homicide rate in the USA is so high. People can carry concealed handguns and they use them when they are angered because most of them are, I believe, are mentally unstable to begin with. It's what I call the Rambo syndrome - weakling wimps trying to be tough.

What happened to the good old "fist fight" to settle disputes?

Yuke.....you take out GANG-BANGING homicides,since they occur daily,and constitute a big chunk of those stats,and the US homicide rate falls immensely,and the US would now be considered one of the safest countries on the planet.....and thats a fact....

Also to mention, is that they include "Justifiable Homicide" in the statistics.

 

[BrianH]

If someone broke into my home or attacked a member of my family of course I would take the appropriate action necessary to defend them. But that isn't why the homicide rate in the USA is so high. People can carry concealed handguns and they use them when they are angered because most of them are, I believe, are mentally unstable to begin with. It's what I call the Rambo syndrome - weakling wimps trying to be tough.

What happened to the good old "fist fight" to settle disputes?

How do you have a fistfight with the "mentally unstable" badguys who have guns?

This is what you don't understand. You want to punish the responsible people who learn how to use a handgun and train to fine tune that knowledge because of the "mentally unstable" people who believe they are Rambo.

I took proper classes, received my concealed carry permit, and continue to train (in a safe environment) and fine tune my ability with my handgun so if I am ever forced to use it, I am able to eliminate the threat in a way that doesn't cause injury to anyone else.

There are people who have a driver's license who have no business on the road. They are careless in their driving and don't care about anyone around them. Just as there are people who are carless about how they treat weapons.

Imagine the rate of deaths from auto accidents rising to an unbelievable level. All the licensing and training and reviewing of licenses to make sure the right people are driving has done no good - accidents levels are outrageous. The government, in their infinite wisdom, now says the only way to prevent any more deaths is to ban the use of automobiles.

Would this be acceptable to you?

And speaking of a driver's license....the only reason you have to be registered/liscensed to drive, is because driving is not a right garaunteed by the Constitution. The government wants to "owning guns" like driver's liscense, but they fail to see that the Constitution grants you the right to own a gun, but not the right to drive. Which is precisely the reason why your driver's liscense can be taken from you if you break the law.

 

[Harry Dresden]

There is lots of data. Here's an example:

Handguns and Homicide​

On the average, if someone gets shot and killed, four out of five times it will be with a handgun. In 1997, for example, handguns were used in 79.4 percent of all firearm homicides.10

From 1990 to 1997, handguns were used in a majority (55.6 percent) of all homicides; that is, they were used in murder more than all other weapons combined.11

From 1990 to 1997, there were 293,781 firearm deaths—homicides, suicides, and unintentional shootings.12

From 1990 to 1997 in the United States there were more than—


160,000 homicides

110,000 firearm homicides

89,000 handgun homicides13

Handgun homicides hit record highs in the early 1990s, peaking in 1993. That year there were 13,258 such killings—out of a total of 16,120 firearm homicides.14
As part of an overall drop in crime, in 1997 handgun homicides fell to 8,503.15

VPC - Handgun Ban Fact Sheet

your saying that in a 7 year period there were 293 thousand homicides by firearms....thats 41,968 per year avg.....take away about 60 % or more due to the gangs and drug related shit and that leaves about 16,000 or so per year from the rest of the non-evolved......out of a pop. at that time of around 290 mill.......thats not bad.....compared to some of those other SAVAGE countries out there....

 

[BrianH]

If someone broke into my home or attacked a member of my family of course I would take the appropriate action necessary to defend them. But that isn't why the homicide rate in the USA is so high. People can carry concealed handguns and they use them when they are angered because most of them are, I believe, are mentally unstable to begin with. It's what I call the Rambo syndrome - weakling wimps trying to be tough.

What happened to the good old "fist fight" to settle disputes?

No, it's because the criminals know most law abiding citizens won't go through the trouble (or can't) to get a gun so they only fear the cops.

Same reason you don't see your Columbine, V-Tech, and other crazed gunmen going into police stations or military barracks and trying to kill a bunch of people, because they know they'll get shot at, so they pick "gun-free" zones like schools, colleges, malls, stores, etc.......

 

[Meister]

There is lots of data. Here's an example:

Handguns and Homicide​

On the average, if someone gets shot and killed, four out of five times it will be with a handgun. In 1997, for example, handguns were used in 79.4 percent of all firearm homicides.10

From 1990 to 1997, handguns were used in a majority (55.6 percent) of all homicides; that is, they were used in murder more than all other weapons combined.11

From 1990 to 1997, there were 293,781 firearm deaths—homicides, suicides, and unintentional shootings.12

From 1990 to 1997 in the United States there were more than—


160,000 homicides

110,000 firearm homicides

89,000 handgun homicides13

Handgun homicides hit record highs in the early 1990s, peaking in 1993. That year there were 13,258 such killings—out of a total of 16,120 firearm homicides.14
As part of an overall drop in crime, in 1997 handgun homicides fell to 8,503.15

VPC - Handgun Ban Fact Sheet

your saying that in a 7 year period there were 293 thousand homicides by firearms....thats 41,968 per year avg.....take away about 60 % or more due to the gangs and drug related shit and that leaves about 16,000 or so per year from the rest of the non-evolved......out of a pop. at that time of around 290 mill.......thats not bad.....compared to some of those other SAVAGE countries out there....

If Yukon lives in canada, why is he worried about our laws. Is Canada a utopia??

 

[Harry Dresden]

bottom line for me Yuke....if the US would start actually throwing away the key for people using guns on other people,like use a gun to commit a CRIME...NOT SELF DEFENCE...A CRIME....,EVEN if no one is hurt,you get 25 years,no chance of parole,you serve every friggin minute of it.....if some is hurt or killed of course the sentence goes up....i think there would be less crime with guns.....

 

[BrianH]

bottom line for me Yuke....if the US would start actually throwing away the key for people using guns on other people,like use a gun to commit a CRIME...NOT SELF DEFENCE...A CRIME....,EVEN if no one is hurt,you get 25 years,no chance of parole,you serve every friggin minute of it.....if some is hurt or killed of course the sentence goes up....i think there would be less crime with guns.....

That's right, stiff punishments cause less crimes. Not that I agree with muslim law, but my brother-in-law spent 8 months in Bahrain on deployment, and he said there's really no crime there...because the punishment for committing them are so severe. If the punishment was getting stoned to death, there'd be less crime here I'm sure.