In Defense of God

[the_human_being]

Well, if you really had any capacity for understanding, you would realize that Man turned his back on God so God is allowing Man to make his own way until Man reaches the point of almost destroying himself and the planet. Christ will return.

What does that have to do with the point I made about how God allowed one of his tribes to be exterminated by other tribes over a gang rape one of his priests allowed?

Jesus isn't coming back because he never existed to start with. I'm so sorry to break that to you.

Even when Christ returns and sets up His earthly Kingdom and creates the utopia described in Isaiah 35, there will be Liberals who will rebel against Christ's rule. There will be many who simply will not comply with His rules.

Christians don't comply with his rules now. When was the last time you stoned your neighbors for working on Sunday?

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

 

[sealybobo]

Well, if you really had any capacity for understanding, you would realize that Man turned his back on God so God is allowing Man to make his own way until Man reaches the point of almost destroying himself and the planet. Christ will return.

What does that have to do with the point I made about how God allowed one of his tribes to be exterminated by other tribes over a gang rape one of his priests allowed?

Jesus isn't coming back because he never existed to start with. I'm so sorry to break that to you.

Even when Christ returns and sets up His earthly Kingdom and creates the utopia described in Isaiah 35, there will be Liberals who will rebel against Christ's rule. There will be many who simply will not comply with His rules.

Christians don't comply with his rules now. When was the last time you stoned your neighbors for working on Sunday?

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Josephus never met Jesus. That's hearsay.

No doubt the myth started back during josephus' time. We will give you that. But he never saw Jesus.

Records of his trial?

 

[the_human_being]

Well, if you really had any capacity for understanding, you would realize that Man turned his back on God so God is allowing Man to make his own way until Man reaches the point of almost destroying himself and the planet. Christ will return.

What does that have to do with the point I made about how God allowed one of his tribes to be exterminated by other tribes over a gang rape one of his priests allowed?

Jesus isn't coming back because he never existed to start with. I'm so sorry to break that to you.

Even when Christ returns and sets up His earthly Kingdom and creates the utopia described in Isaiah 35, there will be Liberals who will rebel against Christ's rule. There will be many who simply will not comply with His rules.

Christians don't comply with his rules now. When was the last time you stoned your neighbors for working on Sunday?

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Josephus never met Jesus. That's hearsay.

No doubt the myth started back during josephus' time. We will give you that. But he never saw Jesus.

Records of his trial?

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

 

[sealybobo]

Well, if you really had any capacity for understanding, you would realize that Man turned his back on God so God is allowing Man to make his own way until Man reaches the point of almost destroying himself and the planet. Christ will return.

What does that have to do with the point I made about how God allowed one of his tribes to be exterminated by other tribes over a gang rape one of his priests allowed?

Jesus isn't coming back because he never existed to start with. I'm so sorry to break that to you.

Even when Christ returns and sets up His earthly Kingdom and creates the utopia described in Isaiah 35, there will be Liberals who will rebel against Christ's rule. There will be many who simply will not comply with His rules.

Christians don't comply with his rules now. When was the last time you stoned your neighbors for working on Sunday?

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Josephus never met Jesus. That's hearsay.

No doubt the myth started back during josephus' time. We will give you that. But he never saw Jesus.

Records of his trial?

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

No doubt the stories spread far. Almost believable.

Hey, my wife got pregnant but she swears she didn't have sex. Do you believe that?

 

[the_human_being]

Well, if you really had any capacity for understanding, you would realize that Man turned his back on God so God is allowing Man to make his own way until Man reaches the point of almost destroying himself and the planet. Christ will return.

What does that have to do with the point I made about how God allowed one of his tribes to be exterminated by other tribes over a gang rape one of his priests allowed?

Jesus isn't coming back because he never existed to start with. I'm so sorry to break that to you.

Even when Christ returns and sets up His earthly Kingdom and creates the utopia described in Isaiah 35, there will be Liberals who will rebel against Christ's rule. There will be many who simply will not comply with His rules.

Christians don't comply with his rules now. When was the last time you stoned your neighbors for working on Sunday?

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Josephus never met Jesus. That's hearsay.

No doubt the myth started back during josephus' time. We will give you that. But he never saw Jesus.

Records of his trial?

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

No doubt the stories spread far. Almost believable.

Hey, my wife got pregnant but she swears she didn't have sex. Do you believe that?

Sounds to me like you have a problem.

 

[sealybobo]

What does that have to do with the point I made about how God allowed one of his tribes to be exterminated by other tribes over a gang rape one of his priests allowed?

Jesus isn't coming back because he never existed to start with. I'm so sorry to break that to you.

Christians don't comply with his rules now. When was the last time you stoned your neighbors for working on Sunday?

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Josephus never met Jesus. That's hearsay.

No doubt the myth started back during josephus' time. We will give you that. But he never saw Jesus.

Records of his trial?

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

No doubt the stories spread far. Almost believable.

Hey, my wife got pregnant but she swears she didn't have sex. Do you believe that?

Sounds to me like you have a problem.

Why? I'm blessed! She says the lord did it.

 

[the_human_being]

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Josephus never met Jesus. That's hearsay.

No doubt the myth started back during josephus' time. We will give you that. But he never saw Jesus.

Records of his trial?

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

No doubt the stories spread far. Almost believable.

Hey, my wife got pregnant but she swears she didn't have sex. Do you believe that?

Sounds to me like you have a problem.

Why? I'm blessed! She says the lord did it.

Well, good for the both of you.

 

[sealybobo]

Josephus never met Jesus. That's hearsay.

No doubt the myth started back during josephus' time. We will give you that. But he never saw Jesus.

Records of his trial?

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

No doubt the stories spread far. Almost believable.

Hey, my wife got pregnant but she swears she didn't have sex. Do you believe that?

Sounds to me like you have a problem.

Why? I'm blessed! She says the lord did it.

Well, good for the both of you.

You mean the 3 of us.

 

[JoeB131]

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Most serious scholars agree that the mention of Jesus in Josephus is a later insertion by Christians.

Josephus on Jesus | Forgery and Fraud? | Flavius Testimonium

Despite the best wishes of sincere believers and the erroneous claims of truculent apologists, the Testimonium Flavianum has been demonstrated continually over the centuries to be a forgery, likely interpolated by Catholic Church historian Eusebius in the fourth century. So thorough and universal has been this debunking that very few scholars of repute continued to cite the passage after the turn of the 19th century. Indeed, the TF was rarely mentioned, except to note that it was a forgery, and numerous books by a variety of authorities over a period of 200 or so years basically took it for granted that the Testimonium Flavianum in its entirety was spurious, an interpolation and a forgery. As Dr. Gordon Stein relates:

"...the vast majority of scholars since the early 1800s have said that this quotation is not by Josephus, but rather is a later Christian insertion in his works. In other words, it is a forgery, rejected by scholars."

Since you Fundi-Tards don't accept Scholars, you can always accept logic.

Flavius Josephus was a Jew, not a Christian. Why would he write something saying Jesus was the Messiah?

 

[jillian]

God Loves Us To Death!

Yes, you're going to die. I know the Democrats have promised us all a Utopia but even the Democrats haven't promised you eternal life. Only God has provisionally made us that promise.

thanks for your religious views. you understand that

a) G-d doesn't need your defense; and
b) He REALLY REALLY doesn't need *you* to speak for Him.

you make Him look very bad.

 

[JoeB131]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

 

[sealybobo]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

Bottom line is in Christians minds they think Josephus met and wrote about Jesus. He did not. He is simply one of the first writers to promote the myth he heard about. That's not proof. People swallow the story today so I'm not shocked that some guy name Jo swallowed it 2000 years ago.

 

[the_human_being]

Joe, you really do need to rethink your statement that Jesus never existed. The Jewish historian Josephus even wrote of him. There are even record of His trial.

Most serious scholars agree that the mention of Jesus in Josephus is a later insertion by Christians.

Josephus on Jesus | Forgery and Fraud? | Flavius Testimonium

Despite the best wishes of sincere believers and the erroneous claims of truculent apologists, the Testimonium Flavianum has been demonstrated continually over the centuries to be a forgery, likely interpolated by Catholic Church historian Eusebius in the fourth century. So thorough and universal has been this debunking that very few scholars of repute continued to cite the passage after the turn of the 19th century. Indeed, the TF was rarely mentioned, except to note that it was a forgery, and numerous books by a variety of authorities over a period of 200 or so years basically took it for granted that the Testimonium Flavianum in its entirety was spurious, an interpolation and a forgery. As Dr. Gordon Stein relates:

"...the vast majority of scholars since the early 1800s have said that this quotation is not by Josephus, but rather is a later Christian insertion in his works. In other words, it is a forgery, rejected by scholars."

Since you Fundi-Tards don't accept Scholars, you can always accept logic.

Flavius Josephus was a Jew, not a Christian. Why would he write something saying Jesus was the Messiah?

He was an historian. There are other historians who also mentioned Jesus.

 

[the_human_being]

God Loves Us To Death!

Yes, you're going to die. I know the Democrats have promised us all a Utopia but even the Democrats haven't promised you eternal life. Only God has provisionally made us that promise.

thanks for your religious views. you understand that

a) G-d doesn't need your defense; and
b) He REALLY REALLY doesn't need *you* to speak for Him.

you make Him look very bad.

I'll take my chance when I meet him. He may say "I had you fooled." He won't say, "You really put me down and made me look like a mass murderer."

 

[the_human_being]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

Bottom line is in Christians minds they think Josephus met and wrote about Jesus. He did not. He is simply one of the first writers to promote the myth he heard about. That's not proof. People swallow the story today so I'm not shocked that some guy name Jo swallowed it 2000 years ago.

I've never in my life hard any Christian say that Josephus met Jesus. Can you provide a link that supports your claim?

 

[sealybobo]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

Bottom line is in Christians minds they think Josephus met and wrote about Jesus. He did not. He is simply one of the first writers to promote the myth he heard about. That's not proof. People swallow the story today so I'm not shocked that some guy name Jo swallowed it 2000 years ago.

I've never in my life hard any Christian say that Josephus met Jesus. Can you provide a link that supports your claim?

Then none of you seem to realize that's just hearsay and you shouldn't be using it as evidence of anything. But that is what you infer.

hear·say
ˈhirˌsā/
noun

1. information received from other people that one cannot adequately substantiate; rumor.
   "according to hearsay, Bob had managed to break his arm"
   synonyms: rumor, gossip, tittle-tattle, idle talk; More
   
   • LAW
     the report of another person's words by a witness, usually disallowed as evidence in a court of law.

 

[the_human_being]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

Bottom line is in Christians minds they think Josephus met and wrote about Jesus. He did not. He is simply one of the first writers to promote the myth he heard about. That's not proof. People swallow the story today so I'm not shocked that some guy name Jo swallowed it 2000 years ago.

I've never in my life hard any Christian say that Josephus met Jesus. Can you provide a link that supports your claim?

Then none of you seem to realize that's just hearsay and you shouldn't be using it as evidence of anything. But that is what you infer.

hear·say
ˈhirˌsā/
noun

1. information received from other people that one cannot adequately substantiate; rumor.
   "according to hearsay, Bob had managed to break his arm"
   synonyms: rumor, gossip, tittle-tattle, idle talk; More
   • LAW
     the report of another person's words by a witness, usually disallowed as evidence in a court of law.

Well, you really can't prove Plato ever lived. You can't prove Julius Caesar ever lived, Homer ever lived, nor that Bin Laden was actually ever killed either.

 

[peach174]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

Bottom line is in Christians minds they think Josephus met and wrote about Jesus. He did not. He is simply one of the first writers to promote the myth he heard about. That's not proof. People swallow the story today so I'm not shocked that some guy name Jo swallowed it 2000 years ago.

No they don't.
They know he was born in Jerusalem around 37 A.D. but he did know the disciples and the followers.
Why did he believe them?
Because they died horrible deaths rather than renounce Jesus. Every single one of them.

 

[sealybobo]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

Bottom line is in Christians minds they think Josephus met and wrote about Jesus. He did not. He is simply one of the first writers to promote the myth he heard about. That's not proof. People swallow the story today so I'm not shocked that some guy name Jo swallowed it 2000 years ago.

No they don't.
They know he was born in Jerusalem around 37 A.D. but he did know the disciples and the followers.
Why did he believe them?
Because they died horrible deaths rather than renounce Jesus. Every single one of them.

Many of you would die a horrible death rather than renounce Jesus. Doesn't mean the cause you die for is just or real.

Fact is, you believe a story about a virgin birth. I can't take you seriously.

 

[sealybobo]

Most historians never lived during all the periods of time they were writing about. That's why it's called "History". There were several historians that mentioned Jesus in their writings. There was a Roman document called "The Acts of Pontius Pilate" that told of Jesus appearing before him.

Again, the problem here is that the few of these "Histories" that survive only survive because Christians copied them.

The Acts of Pilate were not written until the Fourth Century, after Constantine made Christianity the Official Superstition of the Roman Empire. Overall it was part of the effort to mitigate Roman guilt for Jesus' execution and put all the blame on the Jews. (which in turn has given us 2000 years of anti-Semitism.)

Similarly, the mention of Jesus in Tacitus' annals (Written in the second century) appears to be a interpolation by later Christian Writers. There's no mention of this passage by Christian Scholars until the fifth century.

Also, Pliny mentions "Christians" in a letter to Trajan in 110, asking what to do with them. Now, keep in mind, if you buy the Tacitus account, Christians were blamed for the Great Fire of Rome in 66 AD.

It's like an american official in 2050 having no idea who Al Qaeda is.

Bottom line is in Christians minds they think Josephus met and wrote about Jesus. He did not. He is simply one of the first writers to promote the myth he heard about. That's not proof. People swallow the story today so I'm not shocked that some guy name Jo swallowed it 2000 years ago.

I've never in my life hard any Christian say that Josephus met Jesus. Can you provide a link that supports your claim?

Then none of you seem to realize that's just hearsay and you shouldn't be using it as evidence of anything. But that is what you infer.

hear·say
ˈhirˌsā/
noun

1. information received from other people that one cannot adequately substantiate; rumor.
   "according to hearsay, Bob had managed to break his arm"
   synonyms: rumor, gossip, tittle-tattle, idle talk; More
   • LAW
     the report of another person's words by a witness, usually disallowed as evidence in a court of law.

Well, you really can't prove Plato ever lived. You can't prove Julius Caesar ever lived, Homer ever lived, nor that Bin Laden was actually ever killed either.

Does anyone say I will burn in hell if I don't believe Bin Ladin was killed? Or that Plato was the son of god and performed miracles? Anyone say Ceasar walked on water? Anyone say god impregnated Homer's mom? I have no reason to deny those men existed.