Is health care a right?

[hunarcy]

Is life a right?

Life is a right. And health care is not necessarily needed to sustain life. BUT, food and water is...so, why are those items not provided to everyone?

 

[g5000]

"Poor treatment of vets is an epidemic in the US, and has been since I can remember" is now the stupidest statement of the week.

My government healh care as a young child, on active duty, and from the VA has all been excellent.

I think many, if not, most veterans would rate their care at 4 or 5 on a 1 to 5 scale, 1 being the lowest.

I would rate the veteran health care system a 2. I could literally go on for over an hour about what is broken. I have spent hundreds, if not thousands, of hours in the past few years trying to do something about it, buttonholing every politician and government bureaucrat I can get my hands on and shaking them vigorously.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Is life a right?

Life is a right. And health care is not necessarily needed to sustain life. BUT, food and water is...so, why are those items not provided to everyone?

We have a food stamp program, dumbass.

 

[g5000]

THERE IS NO RIGHT to anything that requires an endeavor from other people to provide it.

Bingo.

That's why we have a right to BEAR arms, not a right to arms. We have to provide our own arms for ourselves.

So it is for health care. We have to provide it for ourselves with our own exertions.

 

[NYcarbineer]

I happened to post this somewhere else earlier today. I agree with it 100%, and have stated the same principles here many a time, although not quite this eloquently.

Winston Churchill:

"The discoveries of healing science must be the inheritance of all. That is clear. Disease must be attacked, whether it occurs in the poorest or the richest man or woman simply on the grounds that it is the enemy; and it must be attacked just in the same way as the fire brigade will give its full assistance to the humblest cottage as readily as to the most important mansion.

Our policy is to create a national health service in order to ensure that everybody in the country, irrespective of means, age, sex, or occupation, shall have equal opportunities to benefit from the best and most up-to-date medical and allied services available."

 

[NYcarbineer]

THERE IS NO RIGHT to anything that requires an endeavor from other people to provide it.

That includes food, water, housing, clothing or anything else.

PERIOD.

So abortion is a right.

And guns are only a right if you build your own?

 

[JakeStarkey]

"Poor treatment of vets is an epidemic in the US, and has been since I can remember" is now the stupidest statement of the week.

My government healh care as a young child, on active duty, and from the VA has all been excellent.

I think many, if not, most veterans would rate their care at 4 or 5 on a 1 to 5 scale, 1 being the lowest.

I would rate the veteran health care system a 2. I could literally go on for over an hour about what is broken. I have spent hundreds, if not thousands, of hours in the past few years trying to do something about it, buttonholing every politician and government bureaucrat I can get my hands on and shaking them vigorously.

Then you personal experience is quite different than mine. In East Texas, I would rate a 7 of 10, Houston 6 of 10, and Salt Lake City a 9 of 10.

 

[g5000]

"Poor treatment of vets is an epidemic in the US, and has been since I can remember" is now the stupidest statement of the week.

My government healh care as a young child, on active duty, and from the VA has all been excellent.

I think many, if not, most veterans would rate their care at 4 or 5 on a 1 to 5 scale, 1 being the lowest.

I would rate the veteran health care system a 2. I could literally go on for over an hour about what is broken. I have spent hundreds, if not thousands, of hours in the past few years trying to do something about it, buttonholing every politician and government bureaucrat I can get my hands on and shaking them vigorously.

Then you personal experience is quite different than mine. In East Texas, I would rate a 7 of 10, Houston 6 of 10, and Salt Lake City a 9 of 10.

I am not talking about the VA. And if you live near a military base, I'm sure vet care for retired vets is great. But if you don't live anywhere near a military base, then you are fucked. Congress changed the health care rules for vets who don't live near bases a couple years ago. While everyone was screaming over Obama's lie that "If you like you doctor, you can keep your doctor, period", the Republicans in Congress were making sure vets who don't live near bases lost their doctors.

Up to two years ago, a retired vet with Tricare Prime could go to any civilian doctor who accepted Tricare insurance. Then, Paul Ryan and the GOP took that away.

Strangely enough (not really), Fox News and all the usual suspects have been completely silent on the fucking over of retired vets in the Tricare system. Because Paul Ryan and the GOP were complicit in fucking them over.

 

[JakeStarkey]

G5000, my apologies, it was Votto who wrote that. The VA, overall, is pretty good. However, yes, Congress fucked over the vets who live outside the zone of VA hospitals. Some clinics like Lufkin, Texas, are pretty good, and Tyler, Texas, has an outstanding patient care clinic.

The system can be improved easily if Congress wants to do right by ALL vets.

 

[kaz]

Depends on where you live. Some countries have written it into their Constitutions. Guess it's a right there.

We are guaranteed a right to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness". It could be argued that it falls in there somewhere.

Was it a slow news day that the "is healthcare a right" "go to" had to be gone to? This is the "is it raining where you are" question.

Actually, the Constitution says "life, liberty and property." You're quoting the Declaration of Independence. And property means you have the right to your own property, not someone else's property

Oh the irony of you CONSTANTLY accusing others of reading comprehension issues...

I didn't say I was quoting our Constitution. I said other countries had it in theirs.

I said that we are guaranteed life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness as an inalienable right.

You said "we are guaranteed a right to 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.' " Which is in the Declaration of Independence. You are saying you think the Declaration of Independence is what exactly then? It's not the Constitution, but it guarantees rights?

that's just stupid. You should have stuck with that you don't have reading comprehension, that's better than that you think the Declaration of Independence "guarantee(s)" a right to health care

Life is listed as an inalienable right...exactly as I stated, Hack.

Yes, but you don't know what that means.

That does mean that government cannot take your life without due process of law (the fifth amendment).

It does not mean that government has to give you other people's money for your life.

Seriously, you're an American, you served in the military, now you work to support your family, and you never learned what the Constitution is?

You quote the Declaration of Independence thinking that's the Constitution, then you say no you didn't, which would mean you think the Declaration of Independence guarantees rights, and then you don't know what the right to life even means? Learn how your own country's laws work, it's just sad

 

[JakeStarkey]

Kaz, your constitutional interpretation is very limited and much of it wrong.

 

[Arianrhod]

Apparently we need numerous threads defining "pursuit of happiness." To some here, it seems to mean "I gots mine and fuck everyone else."

 

[kaz]

Apparently we need numerous threads defining "pursuit of happiness." To some here, it seems to mean "I gots mine and fuck everyone else."

Yes, charity only counts when government does it. Actually, charity is not an act you can perform with other people's money.

You forgot the rim shot

 

[Contumacious]

Well? If so why?

Healthcare is NOT a right under the Constitution (1787). Otherwise that would mean that the taxpayers and producers are compelled to provide it.


Healthcare is a right under the FDR bill of rights because from a socialist standpoint they can compel Taxpayers and producers to pay for it.


According to "justice" Roberts the socialists can enact any wealth redistribution scam so long as they call it a tax.


.

 

[MACAULAY]

I believe that the Left-Wing Loons want to use the preamble part "to promote the general welfare" as creating a "right" to any Free Shit they want to give their voters. The General Welfare now includes a "right" to an Obama Phone for every Porch-Sitter.

That's Bullshit of course, but the Democrat/Socialists are getting away with it for now, because the Very Much Pussified Republican Congress has let them borrow 19 trillion dollars to use to buy votes for the Democratic Party.

Promoting the General Welfare is doing what we can for the unfortunate with such money as we can afford. Well, we're broke, and its in part because we not only take care of those who can't take care of themselves, but the ones who don't take care of themselves as well, along with illegal freeloaders from other countries...because the Democratic Party wants their VOTES.

I almost hate the Republican Pussies worse than the Lying Socialists.

If sanity is what we've been getting from Washington D. C., then I want Bat-Shit Crazy.

That's why TRUMP.

It'd be a hell of a ride, we'd have to buckle our seat belts, but I'm a bit desperate. I have children.

 

[Centinel]

Well? If so why?

I think healthcare is a right. I think high functioning societies need to provide healthcare for everyone in some way or another. I think healthcare is a as fundamental as clean water and police services, however in the modern age we have been duped into turning it into a luxury. We provide healthcare to prisoners and to POWs exactly because it is a vital service. The reason healthcare has become so expensive is because we have made incentive for it to get expensive, there is no reason for private sellers to facilitate lower prices because people will pay through the teeth to be healthy and to survive. I would argue that every man alive would give away every cent to stay alive, we have allowed greed to take advantage of all of us. There was a time where a person could be sick and be cared for based upon higher reasons than money, but Americans are trained to perceive healthcare as a luxury. We however have not been trained to see the military in the same light, even though it is more likely you die from illness than a foreigner.

I think America have plenty of private industry to ensure a very strong capitalist basis, changing one critical industry into a non for profit, public system would not destroy the vast market that exists outside of the healthcare niche. I also think there still should be private options, furthermore I think the new system should be opt out and paid for through income tax.

If you consider healthcare a right, would you say that I have a right to come to your house as you're about to leave for work and demand that you, say, stitch up a wound I have, or demand money from you to pay for someone else to do it in your place?

 

[hunarcy]

Is life a right?

Life is a right. And health care is not necessarily needed to sustain life. BUT, food and water is...so, why are those items not provided to everyone?

We have a food stamp program, dumbass.

That's true, you stupid pile of pus. But, according to the Left, the government should provide for us, so ALL food should be free.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Is life a right?

Life is a right. And health care is not necessarily needed to sustain life. BUT, food and water is...so, why are those items not provided to everyone?

We have a food stamp program, dumbass.

That's true, you stupid pile of pus. But, according to the Left, the government should provide for us, so ALL food should be free.

Give us 10 prominent names in America who are demanding that all food be free.

 

[Norman]

If your real question is "should government forcibly take money from people to fund health care for everyone", then the answer is no.

I live in a country with public health care, it's a complete disaster, as would be expected. But once you say to a liberal regressive the magic words "free things", they just can't resist it.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Well? If so why?

I think healthcare is a right. I think high functioning societies need to provide healthcare for everyone in some way or another. I think healthcare is a as fundamental as clean water and police services, however in the modern age we have been duped into turning it into a luxury. We provide healthcare to prisoners and to POWs exactly because it is a vital service. The reason healthcare has become so expensive is because we have made incentive for it to get expensive, there is no reason for private sellers to facilitate lower prices because people will pay through the teeth to be healthy and to survive. I would argue that every man alive would give away every cent to stay alive, we have allowed greed to take advantage of all of us. There was a time where a person could be sick and be cared for based upon higher reasons than money, but Americans are trained to perceive healthcare as a luxury. We however have not been trained to see the military in the same light, even though it is more likely you die from illness than a foreigner.

I think America have plenty of private industry to ensure a very strong capitalist basis, changing one critical industry into a non for profit, public system would not destroy the vast market that exists outside of the healthcare niche. I also think there still should be private options, furthermore I think the new system should be opt out and paid for through income tax.

If you consider healthcare a right, would you say that I have a right to come to your house as you're about to leave for work and demand that you, say, stitch up a wound I have, or demand money from you to pay for someone else to do it in your place?

The right to healthcare means to me that all Americans will have access to basic healthcare regardless of their personal ability to pay,

much like public education is provided to children regardless of the ability of their families to pay.