Is Home-Schooling a Fundamental Right?

[Crackerjaxon]

why is it christians are always so unchristian

Most likely because you are rude and obnoxious toward them.

 

[Foxfyre]

1. "Barack Obama’s Department of Justice ...considers a German homeschooling family a threat to America’s future.AG Eric Holder’s DOJ is arguing against providing asylum for Uwe and Hannelore Romeike, German parents who fled from Germany after they were threatened with jail, fines and the forcible removal of their children from their home. What was their crime? They were homeschooling their children!

2. The Germany family was initially granted asylum, but then the Obama Administration appealed the case to the Board of Immigration Appeals.

3. This case will not only impact this German home schooling family, but ... the right of parents to bring up their children without government intrusion.

4. The Obama DOJ is arguing in this case that there is no fundamental Constitutional right to homeschool children anywhere – including the U.S. The DOJ is also claiming that there is no such thing as an “individual right” to religious liberty and conscience.


5. AG Eric Holder and his gang of thugs at the DOJ believe that there are only “group” rights. If you belong to a group, you’re protected; if you don’t, you can’t expect any legal protection.

6. “The United States Supreme Court has made it very clear in the past that religious freedom is an individual right. Yet our current government does not seem to understand this. They only think of us as members of groups and factions. It is an extreme form of identity politics that directly threatens any understanding of individual liberty.”

7. ...the Obama DOJ is rejecting the fundamental principles of our Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which clearly deal with individual rights of religious liberty and conscience.

8. This isn’t surprising, given the collectivist mentality of Obama and his minions running the White House and the U.S. Senate. They are totalitarians – and they will do whatever they can to undermine our fundamental individual rights."
Obama ?Justice? Department Seeks To Block Asylum For German Homeschooling Family

I feel certain that even our Liberal friends will see this attack on individual liberty is a line that no democracy should cross.

Wait...aren't German schools frequently held up as being better than U.S. schools in educating students? Now they are bad?

Wait...."Vanilla is the most popular ice cream flavor, with 29 percent liking it the best. Chocolate is liked the best by only 8 percent!"
Do more people in the world like chocolate ice cream or vanilla ice cream? | ChaCha

You must believe that the government should mandate that only vanilla be sold.

What do you have against individual rights?

It is a fact that most European countries, Germany included, are doing a better job of teaching Math and Science than are their American counterparts.

But it was not the quality of education the parents were protesting re their children, but the subject matter. If I had ANY other choice, there is no way I would put my child in public schools here for the very same reason. And because we have a large ministry (more than 400 kids) in one of our church programs, almost all of whom are homeschooled, I have a LOT of contact with homeschooled kids. And so far, I have not found one of these who does not prefer homeschooling and/or who wants to go to public school. Further they are socially smart, all seem to have talents that they have nurtured, they are outgoing, polite, courteous, caring, remarkably wonderful young people.

My own great nephew was homeschooled. When he was ready for 10th grade, his parents sent him to public school for the expanded social scene. Within two weeks he was begging to come home and continue homeschooling. They waste so much time there, he said, and so much of it is so stupid. He finished out his schooling through 12th grade at home. (Incidentally his mother, who did not have a college degree, was the one who homeschooled him.)

The nephew went on to college and graduated last year in four years with a B.A. with honors.

 

[bodecea]

1. "Barack Obama’s Department of Justice ...considers a German homeschooling family a threat to America’s future.AG Eric Holder’s DOJ is arguing against providing asylum for Uwe and Hannelore Romeike, German parents who fled from Germany after they were threatened with jail, fines and the forcible removal of their children from their home. What was their crime? They were homeschooling their children!




2. The Germany family was initially granted asylum, but then the Obama Administration appealed the case to the Board of Immigration Appeals.

3. This case will not only impact this German home schooling family, but ... the right of parents to bring up their children without government intrusion.




4. The Obama DOJ is arguing in this case that there is no fundamental Constitutional right to homeschool children anywhere – including the U.S. The DOJ is also claiming that there is no such thing as an “individual right” to religious liberty and conscience.

5. AG Eric Holder and his gang of thugs at the DOJ believe that there are only “group” rights. If you belong to a group, you’re protected; if you don’t, you can’t expect any legal protection.

6. “The United States Supreme Court has made it very clear in the past that religious freedom is an individual right. Yet our current government does not seem to understand this. They only think of us as members of groups and factions. It is an extreme form of identity politics that directly threatens any understanding of individual liberty.”




7. ...the Obama DOJ is rejecting the fundamental principles of our Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which clearly deal with individual rights of religious liberty and conscience.

8. This isn’t surprising, given the collectivist mentality of Obama and his minions running the White House and the U.S. Senate. They are totalitarians – and they will do whatever they can to undermine our fundamental individual rights."
Obama ?Justice? Department Seeks To Block Asylum For German Homeschooling Family




I feel certain that even our Liberal friends will see this attack on individual liberty is a line that no democracy should cross.

Wait...aren't German schools frequently held up as being better than U.S. schools in educating students? Now they are bad?

I'm sure German schools are better than US schools. That's not saying much considering how abysmal US public schools are.

This has nothing to do with how good or bad German schools are. The issue is the parents should have the right to choose their children's education.

Is that a guaranteed right in Germany? Link?

 

[PoliticalChic]

And, of course, there was the demand by OccupyWallStreet that home schooling be made illegal....

"Allow workers to elect their supervisors.

Lower the retirement age to 55. Increase Social Security benefits.

Create a 5% annual wealth tax for the very rich.

Ban the private ownership of land.

Make homeschooling illegal. Religious fanatics use it to feed their children propaganda.

Reduce the age of majority to 16.

Abolish the death penalty and life in prison. We call for the immediate release of all death row inmates from death row and transferred to regular prisons.

Release all political prisoners immediately.

Immediate withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan.

Abolish the debt limit.

Ban private gun ownership."
Occupy Wall Street Proposes a List of Demands | Are We Aware Yet? Political News Blog-Current News Political News Blog


Hmmm....
...except for the correct spelling....it sounds suspiciously like Ms. Truthie....

 

[PoliticalChic]

Doesn't make him a religionist.

Religionist - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

No wonder you don't agree with me....you don't understand your own link.

Religionist: " a person adhering to a religion;"

"especially : a religious zealot " (Which of course, the president is not.)

Why did you post only half of Websters?

Zealous Conservative who posts half-sies?

Two reasons.

1. It clearly supported what I posted.

2. There was a semicolon.
Do you know what that is?
"A semicolon is used when a sentence could have been ended, but it wasn’t."
Semicolon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Aren't you happy to be able to come here for an education?

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Wait...aren't German schools frequently held up as being better than U.S. schools in educating students? Now they are bad?

I'm sure German schools are better than US schools. That's not saying much considering how abysmal US public schools are.

This has nothing to do with how good or bad German schools are. The issue is the parents should have the right to choose their children's education.

Is that a guaranteed right in Germany? Link?

why do you care....?

 

[Chassit]

And, of course, there was the demand by OccupyWallStreet that home schooling be made illegal....

"Allow workers to elect their supervisors.

Lower the retirement age to 55. Increase Social Security benefits.

Create a 5% annual wealth tax for the very rich.

Ban the private ownership of land.

Make homeschooling illegal. Religious fanatics use it to feed their children propaganda.

Reduce the age of majority to 16.

Abolish the death penalty and life in prison. We call for the immediate release of all death row inmates from death row and transferred to regular prisons.

Release all political prisoners immediately.

Immediate withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan.

Abolish the debt limit.

Ban private gun ownership."
Occupy Wall Street Proposes a List of Demands | Are We Aware Yet? Political News Blog-Current News Political News Blog


Hmmm....
...except for the correct spelling....it sounds suspiciously like Ms. Truthie....

Occupy people, what a bunch of idiots...

That being said, you (and I for that matter) should be allowed to teach our children whatever we feel is right. This includes teaching our children religious precepts, if that is what we believe.

As far as the German couple is concerned, I do not believe they have done anything wrong and are deserving of asylum. I couldn't care less if Germany gets offended.

One other point, a lie is only a lie if you believe it is.

 

[bodecea]

why is it christians are always so unchristian

Most likely because you are rude and obnoxious toward them.

Oh. Does that make it ok for Christians to be rude back? What part of the catechism is that?

 

[BlindBoo]

No wonder you don't agree with me....you don't understand your own link.

Religionist: " a person adhering to a religion;"

"especially : a religious zealot " (Which of course, the president is not.)

Why did you post only half of Websters?

Zealous Conservative who posts half-sies?

Two reasons.

1. It clearly supported what I posted.

2. There was a semicolon.
Do you know what that is?
"A semicolon is used when a sentence could have been ended, but it wasn’t."
Semicolon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Aren't you happy to be able to come here for an education?

Yeah it's fun to learn how pseudo-conservatives come to believe in half truths. President is a Christian Zealot. Wow, wonders never cease on this wacky board.

 

[Againsheila]

1. "Barack Obama’s Department of Justice ...considers a German homeschooling family a threat to America’s future.AG Eric Holder’s DOJ is arguing against providing asylum for Uwe and Hannelore Romeike, German parents who fled from Germany after they were threatened with jail, fines and the forcible removal of their children from their home. What was their crime? They were homeschooling their children!




2. The Germany family was initially granted asylum, but then the Obama Administration appealed the case to the Board of Immigration Appeals.

3. This case will not only impact this German home schooling family, but ... the right of parents to bring up their children without government intrusion.




4. The Obama DOJ is arguing in this case that there is no fundamental Constitutional right to homeschool children anywhere – including the U.S. The DOJ is also claiming that there is no such thing as an “individual right” to religious liberty and conscience.

5. AG Eric Holder and his gang of thugs at the DOJ believe that there are only “group” rights. If you belong to a group, you’re protected; if you don’t, you can’t expect any legal protection.

6. “The United States Supreme Court has made it very clear in the past that religious freedom is an individual right. Yet our current government does not seem to understand this. They only think of us as members of groups and factions. It is an extreme form of identity politics that directly threatens any understanding of individual liberty.”




7. ...the Obama DOJ is rejecting the fundamental principles of our Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which clearly deal with individual rights of religious liberty and conscience.

8. This isn’t surprising, given the collectivist mentality of Obama and his minions running the White House and the U.S. Senate. They are totalitarians – and they will do whatever they can to undermine our fundamental individual rights."
Obama ?Justice? Department Seeks To Block Asylum For German Homeschooling Family




I feel certain that even our Liberal friends will see this attack on individual liberty is a line that no democracy should cross.

I don't think their homeschooling really has anything to do with it. They are German. It's almost impossible for anybody from Europe to immigrate here unless they marry and American citizen. If they were from Mexico or some country in Africa or even Russia, our government would be pushing to get them here.

 

[bendog]

And, of course, there was the demand by OccupyWallStreet that home schooling be made illegal....

"Allow workers to elect their supervisors.

Lower the retirement age to 55. Increase Social Security benefits.

Create a 5% annual wealth tax for the very rich.

Ban the private ownership of land.

Make homeschooling illegal. Religious fanatics use it to feed their children propaganda.

Reduce the age of majority to 16.

Abolish the death penalty and life in prison. We call for the immediate release of all death row inmates from death row and transferred to regular prisons.

Release all political prisoners immediately.

Immediate withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan.

Abolish the debt limit.

Ban private gun ownership."
Occupy Wall Street Proposes a List of Demands | Are We Aware Yet? Political News Blog-Current News Political News Blog


Hmmm....
...except for the correct spelling....it sounds suspiciously like Ms. Truthie....

Occupy people, what a bunch of idiots...

That being said, you (and I for that matter) should be allowed to teach our children whatever we feel is right. This includes teaching our children religious precepts, if that is what we believe.

As far as the German couple is concerned, I do not believe they have done anything wrong and are deserving of asylum. I couldn't care less if Germany gets offended.

One other point, a lie is only a lie if you believe it is.

why would you think these people deserving of political asylum?

Do you actually think persecution occurs when a western democracy forces secular public education on citizens?

USCIS - Asylum

 

[ScreamingEagle]

why is it christians are always so unchristian

Most likely because you are rude and obnoxious toward them.

Oh. Does that make it ok for Christians to be rude back? What part of the catechism is that?

what part of your atheistic/Secular belief system makes it OK for you to to be rude.....?

oh wait.....it just depends on how you feeeeeeeeel at the moment....

 

[ScreamingEagle]

1. "Barack Obama’s Department of Justice ...considers a German homeschooling family a threat to America’s future.AG Eric Holder’s DOJ is arguing against providing asylum for Uwe and Hannelore Romeike, German parents who fled from Germany after they were threatened with jail, fines and the forcible removal of their children from their home. What was their crime? They were homeschooling their children!




2. The Germany family was initially granted asylum, but then the Obama Administration appealed the case to the Board of Immigration Appeals.

3. This case will not only impact this German home schooling family, but ... the right of parents to bring up their children without government intrusion.




4. The Obama DOJ is arguing in this case that there is no fundamental Constitutional right to homeschool children anywhere – including the U.S. The DOJ is also claiming that there is no such thing as an “individual right” to religious liberty and conscience.

5. AG Eric Holder and his gang of thugs at the DOJ believe that there are only “group” rights. If you belong to a group, you’re protected; if you don’t, you can’t expect any legal protection.

6. “The United States Supreme Court has made it very clear in the past that religious freedom is an individual right. Yet our current government does not seem to understand this. They only think of us as members of groups and factions. It is an extreme form of identity politics that directly threatens any understanding of individual liberty.”




7. ...the Obama DOJ is rejecting the fundamental principles of our Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which clearly deal with individual rights of religious liberty and conscience.

8. This isn’t surprising, given the collectivist mentality of Obama and his minions running the White House and the U.S. Senate. They are totalitarians – and they will do whatever they can to undermine our fundamental individual rights."
Obama ?Justice? Department Seeks To Block Asylum For German Homeschooling Family




I feel certain that even our Liberal friends will see this attack on individual liberty is a line that no democracy should cross.

I don't think their homeschooling really has anything to do with it. They are German. It's almost impossible for anybody from Europe to immigrate here unless they marry and American citizen. If they were from Mexico or some country in Africa or even Russia, our government would be pushing to get them here.

yet BO and his lapdog DOJ are taking it up in order to cancel that individual/religious right here in America....

 

[Erand7899]

Home schooling is a very complicated subject to debate.
Is homeschooling credible? Certainly it is when it is done in a correct manner and if it is diligently performed by those in charge.
If it is done in a half-hearten manner the ones that suffer are, of course the children.
Who holds the Homeschooling Association to credentials? Do you feel it is necessary to make them be accountable for the education of their children?
Public educators are held to a standard, so why should not the home educators.

All things are credible, if they are done in a correct manner and diligently performed.

To be held to a standard, the people who fail to meet the standard must be held accountable. Who is being held accountable in the public schools? Who is being held accountable for 40% drop out rates in some public schools? What happens to the education of those dropouts?

Address your concerns to the real problems and leave other parents alone to decide what is the best course for their children.

In Alaska, a good percentage of children receive their lessons through radio, TV, or the internet, and are tutored by their parents. Year after year, these students score higher on the end of year tests than their counterparts who attend public schools. Parents are not the problem.

 

[Chassit]

And, of course, there was the demand by OccupyWallStreet that home schooling be made illegal....

"Allow workers to elect their supervisors.

Lower the retirement age to 55. Increase Social Security benefits.

Create a 5% annual wealth tax for the very rich.

Ban the private ownership of land.

Make homeschooling illegal. Religious fanatics use it to feed their children propaganda.

Reduce the age of majority to 16.

Abolish the death penalty and life in prison. We call for the immediate release of all death row inmates from death row and transferred to regular prisons.

Release all political prisoners immediately.

Immediate withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan.

Abolish the debt limit.

Ban private gun ownership."
Occupy Wall Street Proposes a List of Demands | Are We Aware Yet? Political News Blog-Current News Political News Blog


Hmmm....
...except for the correct spelling....it sounds suspiciously like Ms. Truthie....

Occupy people, what a bunch of idiots...

That being said, you (and I for that matter) should be allowed to teach our children whatever we feel is right. This includes teaching our children religious precepts, if that is what we believe.

As far as the German couple is concerned, I do not believe they have done anything wrong and are deserving of asylum. I couldn't care less if Germany gets offended.

One other point, a lie is only a lie if you believe it is.

why would you think these people deserving of political asylum?

Do you actually think persecution occurs when a western democracy forces secular public education on citizens?

USCIS - Asylum

I believe that persecution occurs anytime anybody FORCES anything onto anybody else due to the recipients belief system. In this case, that the government knows better for their children than they do.

per·se·cu·tion noun \ˌpər-si-ˈkyü-shən\

Definition of PERSECUTION

1
: the act or practice of persecuting especially those who differ in origin, religion, or social outlook
2
: the condition of being persecuted, harassed, or annoyed
See persecution defined for kids »
First Known Use of PERSECUTION

Definition of PERSECUTE

1
: to harass or punish in a manner designed to injure, grieve, or afflict; specifically : to cause to suffer because of belief
2
: to annoy with persistent or urgent approaches (as attacks, pleas, or importunities) : pester
— per·se·cu·tee noun
— per·se·cu·tive adjective
— per·se·cu·tor noun
— per·se·cu·to·ry adjective
Examples of PERSECUTE

Persecuting - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

 

[ScreamingEagle]

1. "Barack Obama’s Department of Justice ...considers a German homeschooling family a threat to America’s future.AG Eric Holder’s DOJ is arguing against providing asylum for Uwe and Hannelore Romeike, German parents who fled from Germany after they were threatened with jail, fines and the forcible removal of their children from their home. What was their crime? They were homeschooling their children!




2. The Germany family was initially granted asylum, but then the Obama Administration appealed the case to the Board of Immigration Appeals.

3. This case will not only impact this German home schooling family, but ... the right of parents to bring up their children without government intrusion.




4. The Obama DOJ is arguing in this case that there is no fundamental Constitutional right to homeschool children anywhere – including the U.S. The DOJ is also claiming that there is no such thing as an “individual right” to religious liberty and conscience.

5. AG Eric Holder and his gang of thugs at the DOJ believe that there are only “group” rights. If you belong to a group, you’re protected; if you don’t, you can’t expect any legal protection.

6. “The United States Supreme Court has made it very clear in the past that religious freedom is an individual right. Yet our current government does not seem to understand this. They only think of us as members of groups and factions. It is an extreme form of identity politics that directly threatens any understanding of individual liberty.”




7. ...the Obama DOJ is rejecting the fundamental principles of our Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which clearly deal with individual rights of religious liberty and conscience.

8. This isn’t surprising, given the collectivist mentality of Obama and his minions running the White House and the U.S. Senate. They are totalitarians – and they will do whatever they can to undermine our fundamental individual rights."
Obama ?Justice? Department Seeks To Block Asylum For German Homeschooling Family




I feel certain that even our Liberal friends will see this attack on individual liberty is a line that no democracy should cross.

I don't think their homeschooling really has anything to do with it. They are German. It's almost impossible for anybody from Europe to immigrate here unless they marry and American citizen. If they were from Mexico or some country in Africa or even Russia, our government would be pushing to get them here.

yet BO and his lapdog DOJ are taking it up in order to cancel that individual/religious right here in America....

pretty sneaky way to do it too.....using foreign problems to make an ANTI-CONSTITUTIONAL ruling........

 

[bendog]

1. "Barack Obama’s Department of Justice ...considers a German homeschooling family a threat to America’s future.AG Eric Holder’s DOJ is arguing against providing asylum for Uwe and Hannelore Romeike, German parents who fled from Germany after they were threatened with jail, fines and the forcible removal of their children from their home. What was their crime? They were homeschooling their children!




2. The Germany family was initially granted asylum, but then the Obama Administration appealed the case to the Board of Immigration Appeals.

3. This case will not only impact this German home schooling family, but ... the right of parents to bring up their children without government intrusion.




4. The Obama DOJ is arguing in this case that there is no fundamental Constitutional right to homeschool children anywhere – including the U.S. The DOJ is also claiming that there is no such thing as an “individual right” to religious liberty and conscience.

5. AG Eric Holder and his gang of thugs at the DOJ believe that there are only “group” rights. If you belong to a group, you’re protected; if you don’t, you can’t expect any legal protection.

6. “The United States Supreme Court has made it very clear in the past that religious freedom is an individual right. Yet our current government does not seem to understand this. They only think of us as members of groups and factions. It is an extreme form of identity politics that directly threatens any understanding of individual liberty.”




7. ...the Obama DOJ is rejecting the fundamental principles of our Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which clearly deal with individual rights of religious liberty and conscience.

8. This isn’t surprising, given the collectivist mentality of Obama and his minions running the White House and the U.S. Senate. They are totalitarians – and they will do whatever they can to undermine our fundamental individual rights."
Obama ?Justice? Department Seeks To Block Asylum For German Homeschooling Family




I feel certain that even our Liberal friends will see this attack on individual liberty is a line that no democracy should cross.

I don't think their homeschooling really has anything to do with it. They are German. It's almost impossible for anybody from Europe to immigrate here unless they marry and American citizen. If they were from Mexico or some country in Africa or even Russia, our government would be pushing to get them here.

yet BO and his lapdog DOJ are taking it up in order to cancel that individual/religious right here in America....

You are operating under a misconception. Fundamental Rights are granted non-citizens here legally, except for voting.

http://scholarship.law.georgetown.e... rights available non citizens united states"

However, the only due process due in an immigration proceeding is the due process due in an administrative hearing, which is basically a hearing, representation by yourself or a private attorney, and equal treatment for all people, ie no arbitrary and capricious descions. Thus, unless the Germans can show they are "persecuted" they have right to be here, and they have no fundamental right to educate their kids here (at some expense to us, btw)

A previous poster hypothesized if they were from mexico or africa the admin would have a different tune. Setting aside the racism inherent in that view, considering there's a history of persecuting christians in some latin american and african countries, comparing germany to the third world is ignorant.

But, the bottom line is unless you think Germany is "persecuting" these people by forcing secular education and allowing them to practice the religion of their choice privately ... Obama should deport them.

 

[NYcarbineer]

The question is whether a German citizen in violation of German law can claim asylum for being 'persecuted'.

Homeschooling is illegal in Germany. Does the sovereign nation of Germany have the right to outlaw homeschooling?

Can Germans who don't happen to like that German law claim 'persecution' sufficient to qualify for asylum?

At first glance I'd say no. Someone convince me otherwise.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

The question is whether a German citizen in violation of German law can claim asylum for being 'persecuted'.

Homeschooling is illegal in Germany. Does the sovereign nation of Germany have the right to outlaw homeschooling?

Can Germans who don't happen to like that German law claim 'persecution' sufficient to qualify for asylum?

At first glance I'd say no. Someone convince me otherwise.

Asylum eligibility has three basic requirements.

First, an asylum applicant must establish that he or she fears persecution. met

[2] Second, the applicant must prove that he or she would be persecuted on account of one of five protected grounds: race, religion, nationality, political opinion, and social group. met

Third, an applicant must establish that the government is either involved in the persecution, or unable to control the conduct of private actors. met

Asylum in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Erand7899]

The question is whether a German citizen in violation of German law can claim asylum for being 'persecuted'.

Homeschooling is illegal in Germany. Does the sovereign nation of Germany have the right to outlaw homeschooling?

Can Germans who don't happen to like that German law claim 'persecution' sufficient to qualify for asylum?

At first glance I'd say no. Someone convince me otherwise.

They don't have to claim persecution, they can get a visitor's visa, come to the USA, and just stay here. Then, you liberal/socialists would go to war to insist they have a right to be here. You just don't like the idea that they are trying to do it the legal way.