Is this a parody???

[TemplarKormac]

Again, there is no speculation to the allegations. They exist. There is no disputing that.

The idle speculation exists. Accusations are speculation until they are proven with concrete evidence. That's it, that's all.

No, accusations are accusations until they are proven.

They're not "speculation".

Okay, define it however you wish. But when I say something false about you or make an accusation against you, am I not speculating?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

We should ignore that before we know anything about this person?

Yes. Because this "someone" doesn't even exist, not by the name of Katie anyway. Simply lying about your name on the suit is perjury. And, in further reading this person filed this suit without the aid of an attorney. Just how far does this person expect to get in legal proceedings?

There's no evidence that "Katie" isn't a real person.

There is evidence that the phone number and address listed on the complaint are fake. That's all.

ETA: Stating definitively that "Katie" is not a real person is an example of "speculation".

 

[TemplarKormac]

Well, under your definition the accusations against Bill Clinton are nothing more than idle speculation

They were proven true, they ceased to be "speculation" and became concrete fact.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Again, there is no speculation to the allegations. They exist. There is no disputing that.

The idle speculation exists. Accusations are speculation until they are proven with concrete evidence. That's it, that's all.

No, accusations are accusations until they are proven.

They're not "speculation".

Okay, define it however you wish. But when I say something false about you or make an accusation against you, am I not speculating?

No, you'd be lying, not speculating.

 

[Avatar4321]

We should ignore that before we know anything about this person?

Yes. Because this "someone" doesn't even exist, not by the name of Katie anyway. Simply lying about your name on the suit is perjury. And, in further reading this person filed this suit without the aid of an attorney. Just how far does this person expect to get in legal proceedings?

How do you know this? Until the person comes forward this is just idle speculation

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Well, under your definition the accusations against Bill Clinton are nothing more than idle speculation

They were proven true, they ceased to be "speculation" and became concrete fact.

I don't think Camp is talking about Lewinsky.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Family jokes are still off limits I believe

Grampa is correct. "Your mom" jokes are violations of our "no family" rule. Now you know.

 

[Camp]

Well, under your definition the accusations against Bill Clinton are nothing more than idle speculation

They were proven true, they ceased to be "speculation" and became concrete fact.

No, they weren't. He has never even been charged, let alone found guilty in a court.

 

[Camp]

Well, under your definition the accusations against Bill Clinton are nothing more than idle speculation

They were proven true, they ceased to be "speculation" and became concrete fact.

I don't think Camp is talking about Lewinsky.

Lewinsky never accused Clinton or rape. She admitted she was a willing consensual adult.

 

[Avatar4321]

We should ignore that before we know anything about this person?

Yes. Because this "someone" doesn't even exist, not by the name of Katie anyway. Simply lying about your name on the suit is perjury. And, in further reading this person filed this suit without the aid of an attorney. Just how far does this person expect to get in legal proceedings?

There's no evidence that "Katie" isn't a real person.

There is evidence that the phone number and address listed on the complaint are fake. That's all.

ETA: Stating definitively that "Katie" is not a real person is an example of "speculation".

It's also settled fact that someone filed these documents. Whether they are actually Katie johnson is speculation but this person whether legit or a fraud exists

 

[TemplarKormac]

We should ignore that before we know anything about this person?

Yes. Because this "someone" doesn't even exist, not by the name of Katie anyway. Simply lying about your name on the suit is perjury. And, in further reading this person filed this suit without the aid of an attorney. Just how far does this person expect to get in legal proceedings?

There's no evidence that "Katie" isn't a real person.

There is evidence that the phone number and address listed on the complaint are fake. That's all.

ETA: Stating definitively that "Katie" is not a real person is an example of "speculation".

She doesn't exist. Definitively. Let's take for example Epstein's 2006 case where he was accused by the Feds of abusing 40 underage girls, those girls never implicated Trump in any wrongdoing. None of them were named "Katie Johnson." In fact, those accusations led to an 11-month police investigation of Epstein's home. None of the evidence investigators found implicated Trump in any wrongdoing. Let's also take a little black book that was seized from Epstein in 2010, listing all of the girls he had abused. It never mentioned Trump, or his accuser. That serves as sufficient cause for me to dismiss this accusation out of hand... as idle speculation.

 

[Avatar4321]

Well, under your definition the accusations against Bill Clinton are nothing more than idle speculation

They were proven true, they ceased to be "speculation" and became concrete fact.

No, they weren't. He has never even been charged, let alone found guilty in a court.

If I shoot someone dead and my case is acquitted because the police illegally gathered evidence, did I not commit the murder? Or did I just skirt the criminal consequences.

OJ Simpson was acquitted of murder. Does that mean he didn't kill his ex wife or just that the state didn't present the evidence in a way to convict twelve people?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Until the person comes forward this is just idle speculation

My case, in not so many words. Until she comes forward, she doesn't exist, Katie doesn't exist, and this lawsuit is full of holes. It is in fact idle speculation.

 

[Camp]

Well, under your definition the accusations against Bill Clinton are nothing more than idle speculation

They were proven true, they ceased to be "speculation" and became concrete fact.

No, they weren't. He has never even been charged, let alone found guilty in a court.

If I shoot someone dead and my case is acquitted because the police illegally gathered evidence, did I not commit the murder? Or did I just skirt the criminal consequences.

OJ Simpson was acquitted of murder. Does that mean he didn't kill his ex wife or just that the state didn't present the evidence in a way to convict twelve people?

In both examples, charges were brought. The person was at least charged and brought to court, and in Simpson's case, he was found guilty in a civil case.
The claim I responded to was that Clinton had been proven guilty crimes, which he was not, nor will Trump be if he beats the charge.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Okay, I had four cans of ginger ale in the period of about 1 hour at a concert I just got back from, that's well over 120g of sugar. I'm posting on a sugar high and now have realized what I've been doing for the past 45 minutes. Please disregard anything I've said thus far.

 

[TemplarKormac]

In both examples, charges were brought. The person was at least charged and brought to court, and in Simpson's case, he was found guilty in a civil case.
The claim I responded to was that Clinton had been proven guilty crimes, which he was not.

On the other hand, I'm not dismissing the accusation, I'm dismissing the substance of the accusation in question. The substance of which I consider to be speculation. Accusations are always serious.

Sigh, note to self, never argue while hyped up on obscene amounts of sugar.

 

[Camp]

Okay, I had four cans of ginger ale in the period of about 1 hour at a concert I just got back from, that's well over 120g of sugar. I'm posting on a sugar high and now have realized what I've been doing for the past 45 minutes. Please disregard anything I've said thus far.

You didn't do bad. You were zeroing in but maybe forgot to adjust your windage.
Check out what Breitbart is reporting. I don't trust them but they give some leads and clues.

 

[TemplarKormac]

You didn't do bad. You were zeroing in but maybe forgot to adjust your windage.

That seems about right.

 

[Camp]

Is the MSM paying any attention to this story or are they holding off for more substantive evidence?

 

[Silhouette]

I had posted a similar thread last night to which the night-watch moderator simply disappeared. But not without first telling me I was trolling and perpetuating a hoax. And before this thread is disappeared again (I've saved it and will repost BECAUSE IT'S NEWS AND POLITICAL), ponder this: What if this lawsuit was filed against Ted Cruz three days ago? Or John Kasich? Or Paul Ryan? Or Marco Rubio?

Would it disappear then?

Since a case was actually filed and bears the initials of a clerk in Riverside County, CA, we have to assume that the claimant 1. exists and 2. is hard to find because she says in her complaint that Trump made threats to harm her and her family if she ever told anyone.

So, you be the judge. First brought to my attention by Tyrone here #156: Eric Trump: My Dad Is Going to Go After Hillary in a Way That No One Has Ever Gone After Her Before

*********
Donald Trump Accused of Rape and "Depraved Sex Acts" in Civil Lawsuit

In a lawsuit filed in the federal court in the Central District of California, a plaintiff filing under the name Katie Johnson accuses Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein of having forced her to "engage in various perverted and depraved sex acts" and threatening to harm her and her family. The complaint states that the defendants committed "forcible rape" against her in 1994, when she was 13. The lawsuit describes four incidents with Trump: On the first, Johnson claims, she had to "manually stimulate" Trump with her hand until he ejaculated. On the second, she had to "orally copulate" him until orgasm. On the third, she allegedly had to "engage in an unnatural lesbian sex act with her fellow minor and sex slave, Maria Doe." The suit claims both girls "orally copulated" Trump at once, after which he pushed them away and berated their "poor" performance.

On a fourth incident described in the suit, Johnson claims Trump tied her to a bed and raped her in a "savage sexual attack" during which she pleaded for him to wear a condom but he refused. The suit alleges he struck her in the face, and when she asked through tears what would happen if she were pregnant, he allegedly threw money at her and told her to "get a fucking abortion." Epstein is a disgraced Palm Beach money manager who was accused of engaging in sexual acts with underage girls. Following his criminal case, in which he took a plea deal and served 13 months of an 18-month sentence, alleged victims filed civil suits that accused Prince Andrew.

The suit says that Epstein and Trump also got full body massages from the underage girls, and that they argued over who would take Johnson's virginity, with Trump yelling at Epstein that he was a "fucking Jew." It says that Epstein tried to sodomize her and became enraged upon learning Trump had taken her virginity. The lawsuit says that Johnson was told she and her family would face "certain death" if details of the incidents were revealed. It says that a woman named Tiffany Doe worked for Epstein as a "party planner" and arranged the sex parties, and that she would testify as a witness.

**************

Here's the link to the actual complaint filed in Riverside County CA with the clerk's initials and signature of the complainant:
http://images.browardpalmbeach.com/media/pdf/donald_trump_sex_lawsuit_complaint.pdf

And, like I said in the other OP and will say here, for any reporters heading to the area to check out whether or not the complaint has veracity, or who the girl is, or who the clerk is who signed off on the complaint, stop in Twentynine Palms because the dates they sell there and in Indio are delicious! Buy a crate or ten.

And tell us what you find out when you get the facts gathered.

For other reference:

Donald Trump Rape Lawsuit Claims Trump Forced 12- And 13-Year-Old Girls To Peform Oral Sex On Him
Trump lawyer: Rape lawsuit is a HOAX, plaintiff may not actually exist
Donald Trump Named in Lawsuit Alleging Rape of Teen Girl | RedState
Possibly Hoax Lawsuit Claims Donald Trump Molested Teen Girl
New details released on the $100 million lawsuit claiming Donald Trump molested teen girl
Donald Trump has denied allegations he raped a 13-year-old girl