McDonald's may be liable for worker lawsuits

[JoeB131]

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Absolute bullshit. You can lie all you want, but neither Skull Pilot nor I have advocated anything that is designed to screw employees, to say nothing of doing it every chance we get.

You mean other than wanting to keep people at starvation wages if they don't have the level of education you think is appropriate...

Oh, so expecting people to be responsible for their own lives and take responsibility for bad choices is the same as screwing them at every opportunity?

Weren't you the one screaming "No Second Chances!"?

Why is choosing to work at a job you consider "beneath" you be a "bad decision".

You know, there are just some people out there where bagging burgers is going to be the highlight of their career.

And they should get a living wage for doing so.

Period.

Now, yeah, the fact that we have so many able-bodied people on the dole, that's actually bad decisions.

 

[JoeB131]

Oh, so now who is the one lacking compassion? If it didn't happen to you it doesn't matter and you don't care? What a selfish prick.

1) I have no real proof they happened.
2) I could probably list all the good things done by Hitler.. Which would make him sound like a nice guy if you ignore all the bad things he did. You can't excuse the Holocaust by mentioning how nice the Autobahn is.

The fact that you compare employers to Hitler shows that you are delusional.

Funny, I've seen guys in management where getting promoted brought out their Inner Hitler.

 

[WinterBorn]

You mean other than wanting to keep people at starvation wages if they don't have the level of education you think is appropriate...

Oh, so expecting people to be responsible for their own lives and take responsibility for bad choices is the same as screwing them at every opportunity?

Weren't you the one screaming "No Second Chances!"?

Why is choosing to work at a job you consider "beneath" you be a "bad decision".

You know, there are just some people out there where bagging burgers is going to be the highlight of their career.

And they should get a living wage for doing so.

Period.

Now, yeah, the fact that we have so many able-bodied people on the dole, that's actually bad decisions.

Have I ever said it was beneath me? No, I have not.

I have no problem with people working whatever sort of job makes them happy. I know for a fact that making more money is not always the key to happiness.

But when someone demands that they be paid more than the job is worth, I have an issue with it.

You said $500 a week was poverty level. But if the minimum wage is raised to $15 an hour, they will take home $510 (if they have no state income tax).

For that money the franchisee will replace them with machines.

 

[WinterBorn]

1) I have no real proof they happened.
2) I could probably list all the good things done by Hitler.. Which would make him sound like a nice guy if you ignore all the bad things he did. You can't excuse the Holocaust by mentioning how nice the Autobahn is.

The fact that you compare employers to Hitler shows that you are delusional.

Funny, I've seen guys in management where getting promoted brought out their Inner Hitler.

You've seen guys promoted to mgmt that suddenly wanted to kill millions of people, wanted to breed an aryan race, and wanted to dominate the world??

Wow, must be a weird place you work.

 

[WinterBorn]

You mean other than wanting to keep people at starvation wages if they don't have the level of education you think is appropriate...

As opposed to you wanting workers to be replaced by robots?

Cuz that's all that forcing fast food restaurants to raise wages is going to accomplish, bub.

Yeah, right.

If they could replace people with robots that don't piss off the customers, they'd do that now.

Right now the employees are cheaper or the same price as the machines. Change that and the machines will be in.

There is a Taco Bell in Tuscaloosa that has had touch screens to take your order since 2002.

 

[JoeB131]

[

I have no problem with people working whatever sort of job makes them happy. I know for a fact that making more money is not always the key to happiness.

But when someone demands that they be paid more than the job is worth, I have an issue with it.

You said $500 a week was poverty level. But if the minimum wage is raised to $15 an hour, they will take home $510 (if they have no state income tax).

For that money the franchisee will replace them with machines.

You know what, the douchebags have been threatening to replace people with machines since the 1980's.

No one wants to eat food a machine produced.

Here's an interesting article. The jist of it is that the CEO of McDonald's is actually in FAVOR of an increase in the minimum wage, not because it would cut into his profitability, but because it would hurt his competitors more.

Why McDonald's Favors Raising The Minimum Wage To $10.10 Per Hour - Investors.com

For example, the process used to create French fries — a fast-food staple — can vary significantly, each using different amounts of labor. McDonald's uses a highly efficient process whereby machines clean and cut thousands of potatoes at a time. They are then fried, flash-frozen, bagged, and sent to restaurants where employees finish the cooking process.

Meanwhile, employees at much smaller restaurants, such as Five Guys, hand-cut and fry potatoes on-location. So, McDonald's churns out huge amounts of product with its machines, while Five Guys uses people — resulting in more time to produce fewer fries.

What this amounts to is that McDonald's can more easily substitute machinery for labor due to its massive scale: It operates more than 14,000 restaurants in the U.S. alone and is, therefore, able to split the cost of new machinery and technology across many locations.

k

 

[JoeB131]

As opposed to you wanting workers to be replaced by robots?

Cuz that's all that forcing fast food restaurants to raise wages is going to accomplish, bub.

Yeah, right.

If they could replace people with robots that don't piss off the customers, they'd do that now.

Right now the employees are cheaper or the same price as the machines. Change that and the machines will be in.

There is a Taco Bell in Tuscaloosa that has had touch screens to take your order since 2002.

Uh-huh. And oddly enough, all the other Taco Smells haven't implemented it.

Hmmmm.

That kind of sounds like someone developed something that didn't catch on.

 

[WinterBorn]

Yeah, right.

If they could replace people with robots that don't piss off the customers, they'd do that now.

Right now the employees are cheaper or the same price as the machines. Change that and the machines will be in.

There is a Taco Bell in Tuscaloosa that has had touch screens to take your order since 2002.

Uh-huh. And oddly enough, all the other Taco Smells haven't implemented it.

Hmmmm.

That kind of sounds like someone developed something that didn't catch on.

Once again, an employee is cheaper and needs no tech repairs.

 

[JoeB131]

Right now the employees are cheaper or the same price as the machines. Change that and the machines will be in.

There is a Taco Bell in Tuscaloosa that has had touch screens to take your order since 2002.

Uh-huh. And oddly enough, all the other Taco Smells haven't implemented it.

Hmmmm.

That kind of sounds like someone developed something that didn't catch on.

Once again, an employee is cheaper and needs no tech repairs.

And they still won't after they get a living wage.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I see the need for charities to be a profound failure.

Exactly the government and the country have failed the very people they put in harm's way and yet you still wave the flag.

Uh, yeah, guy. That's what it means to be an American.

If being a blind mindless sheep is being an American.

But I'm sure Somalia would happily welcome you and your copy of Atlas Shrugged.

Never read it.

It means we have all that human potential out there that we are wasting.

You mean like settling for bagging burgers for the rest of your life and whining that you are entitled to more but don't actually do anything about it?

Maybe some people are just meant to bag burgers.

Yeah if you have an IQ of 10.

Here's the thing. If I'm putting that burger in my body, I want the person who bagged it to be happy with his lot in life.

Then give the burger bagger a big fat tip out of your own pocket.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Here's the thing. If I'm putting that burger in my body, I want the person who bagged it to be happy with his lot in life.

Then give the burger bagger a big fat tip out of your own pocket.

OR we could just change the laws and make the people he works for pay him a fair wage.

Oh, fuck. Democracy. We can't have that.

 

[Skull Pilot]

[

Here's the thing. If I'm putting that burger in my body, I want the person who bagged it to be happy with his lot in life.

Then give the burger bagger a big fat tip out of your own pocket.

OR we could just change the laws and make the people he works for pay him a fair wage.

Oh, fuck. Democracy. We can't have that.

You have yet to define fair.

And we don't have a democracy we have a republic. That is 8th grade history.

The one thing you always seem to forget is that no one is forced to work at a job they don't like.

If you are still making minimum wage after 1 year on a job then it is because that's what you want.

I say that because obviously you have done nothing to improve your salary.

Why should anyone who refuses to improve be given more pay?

 

[JoeB131]

[



Then give the burger bagger a big fat tip out of your own pocket.

OR we could just change the laws and make the people he works for pay him a fair wage.

Oh, fuck. Democracy. We can't have that.

You have yet to define fair.

And we don't have a democracy we have a republic. That is 8th grade history.

The one thing you always seem to forget is that no one is forced to work at a job they don't like.

If you are still making minimum wage after 1 year on a job then it is because that's what you want.

I say that because obviously you have done nothing to improve your salary.

Why should anyone who refuses to improve be given more pay?

I don't know, maybe because i'm tired of subsidizing slave labor for billionaires with my tax dollars.

Who do you think pays for the food stamps, medicaid and public housing for these burger baggers?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

 

[Star]

OR we could just change the laws and make the people he works for pay him a fair wage.

Oh, fuck. Democracy. We can't have that.

You have yet to define fair.

And we don't have a democracy we have a republic. That is 8th grade history.

The one thing you always seem to forget is that no one is forced to work at a job they don't like.

If you are still making minimum wage after 1 year on a job then it is because that's what you want.

I say that because obviously you have done nothing to improve your salary.

Why should anyone who refuses to improve be given more pay?

I don't know, maybe because i'm tired of subsidizing slave labor for billionaires with my tax dollars.

Who do you think pays for the food stamps, medicaid and public housing for these burger baggers?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

.​

 

[Skull Pilot]

OR we could just change the laws and make the people he works for pay him a fair wage.

Oh, fuck. Democracy. We can't have that.

You have yet to define fair.

And we don't have a democracy we have a republic. That is 8th grade history.

The one thing you always seem to forget is that no one is forced to work at a job they don't like.

If you are still making minimum wage after 1 year on a job then it is because that's what you want.

I say that because obviously you have done nothing to improve your salary.

Why should anyone who refuses to improve be given more pay?

I don't know, maybe because i'm tired of subsidizing slave labor for billionaires with my tax dollars.

Who do you think pays for the food stamps, medicaid and public housing for these burger baggers?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

You are subsidizing sloth on the part of those who refuse to better themselves.

Let's place the blame where it belongs.

 

[JoeB131]

You have yet to define fair.

And we don't have a democracy we have a republic. That is 8th grade history.

The one thing you always seem to forget is that no one is forced to work at a job they don't like.

If you are still making minimum wage after 1 year on a job then it is because that's what you want.

I say that because obviously you have done nothing to improve your salary.

Why should anyone who refuses to improve be given more pay?

I don't know, maybe because i'm tired of subsidizing slave labor for billionaires with my tax dollars.

Who do you think pays for the food stamps, medicaid and public housing for these burger baggers?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

You are subsidizing sloth on the part of those who refuse to better themselves.

Let's place the blame where it belongs.

I do. I put it on big corporations that are exploiting loopholes in the system.

 

[Star]

You have yet to define fair.

And we don't have a democracy we have a republic. That is 8th grade history.

The one thing you always seem to forget is that no one is forced to work at a job they don't like.

If you are still making minimum wage after 1 year on a job then it is because that's what you want.

I say that because obviously you have done nothing to improve your salary.

Why should anyone who refuses to improve be given more pay?

I don't know, maybe because i'm tired of subsidizing slave labor for billionaires with my tax dollars.

Who do you think pays for the food stamps, medicaid and public housing for these burger baggers?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

You are subsidizing sloth on the part of those who refuse to better themselves.

Let's place the blame where it belongs.

Upward mobility in America is a myth and-----and less likely than "in most European countries". If you want place to blame where it belongs, you first have to ask yourself; when what little Horatio Alger dream we had, began it's dramatic decline and-----and ask yourself, what happened 30-40 years ago that started the downward spiral of what little upward mobility/increase in standard of living Americans had gained in the post-war era?


The Mobility Myth
March 03, 2014

By James Surowiecki


<snip>

...but there’s a catch: there wasn’t that much mobility to begin with. According to Chetty, “Social mobility is low and has been for at least thirty or forty years.” This is most obvious when you look at the prospects of the poor. Seventy per cent of people born into the bottom quintile of income distribution never make it into the middle class, and fewer than ten per cent get into the top quintile. Forty per cent are still poor as adults. What the political scientist Michael Harrington wrote back in 1962 is still true: most people who are poor are poor because “they made the mistake of being born to the wrong parents.” The middle class isn’t all that mobile, either: only twenty per cent of people born into the middle quintile ever make it into the top one. And although we think of U.S. society as archetypally open, mobility here is lower than in most European countries.





This wasn’t always the case. As the economist Joseph P. Ferrie has shown, in the late nineteenth century U.S. society was far more mobile than Great Britain’s—a child in the U.S. was much more likely to move into a higher-class profession than that of his father—and much more mobile than it became later. It was possible for Andrew Carnegie to start as a bobbin boy in a cotton factory at a dollar-twenty a week and end up one of the world’s richest men. This legacy left a deep imprint on American culture. The sociologist Werner Sombart noted in 1906 that the average American worker felt he had a good chance of rising out of his class. That feeling has persisted: Americans are less concerned than Europeans about inequality and more confident that society is meritocratic. The problem is that, over time, the American dream has become increasingly untethered from American reality.

<snip>

More important, in any capitalist society most people are bound to be part of the middle and working classes; public policy should focus on raising their standard of living, instead of raising their chances of getting rich. What made the U.S. economy so remarkable for most of the twentieth century was the fact that, even if working people never moved into a different class, over time they saw their standard of living rise sharply. Between the late nineteen-forties and the early nineteen-seventies, median household income in the U.S. doubled. That’s what has really changed in the past forty years. The economy is growing more slowly than it did in the postwar era, and average workers’ share of the pie has been shrinking. It’s no surprise that people in Washington prefer to talk about mobility rather than about this basic reality. Raising living standards for ordinary workers is hard: you need to either get wages growing or talk about things that scare politicians, like “redistribution” and “taxes.” But making it easier for some Americans to move up the economic ladder is no great triumph if most can barely hold on.

.

 

[WinterBorn]

I don't know, maybe because i'm tired of subsidizing slave labor for billionaires with my tax dollars.

Who do you think pays for the food stamps, medicaid and public housing for these burger baggers?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

You are subsidizing sloth on the part of those who refuse to better themselves.

Let's place the blame where it belongs.

I do. I put it on big corporations that are exploiting loopholes in the system.

Not sure what "loopholes" you mean, but I am all for changing the US tax structure to be more fair and to leave fewer loopholes.

Laws like those can be changed if we push the right politicians.

 

[Star]

First of all, because you still have not defined "living wage".

Second, because the unskilled ARE paid a decent wage, for what they bring, as I have shown. However, you decided to spout off about it being below the poverty line, so I am engaging you so you will learn something.

And because I am still waiting to hear what you are hoping the judiciary will do for your union thugs. You know, the ones you want to be above the law.

Keep trying to take the subject off topic, because you can't defend your position.

you work for a living, you should get a living wage. Period.

Or we can just let everyone go on welfare.

What you guys don't seem to get is that when you pay someone below living wage, they get food stamps, they get Section 8 housing, they get ObamaPhones (er... ReaganPhones, but nevermind) they get MedicAid.

All stuff you are paying for, anyway.

Again, if you aren't capable of decency, you should be capable of common sense.

$26k a year is not a living wage (still undefined btw)? I looked up some apartments and you can get one for under $700 a month in Tampa. There is a public transportation system. So someone could rent an apt for $700, keep the power bill around $100 a month, spend $200 on transportation, have a couple of misc bills for $75 each and even save $100 a month. All that on $2,000 a month. (net of $1700, after losing 15% to federal taxes)

Looks like a single wage earned making $500 a week could live on it. Get a Roommate and it would be even cheaper.

You're being way, way to simplistic in your request of JoeB to do your research for you - a living wage isn't a single, one size fits all number, a living wage is a calculation based on many factors. I would've thought you would know that?



Living Wage Calculator

<snip>

The living wage varies based on the cost of living and taxes where families live. Families of four (with two working adults, two children) in the North ($56,179) and West ($53,505) have higher median living wages before taxes than the South ($49,167), and Midwest ($48,496). Within region, the largest variation is between Southern states, where the living wage ranges from $45,655 in South Carolina to $69,820 in the District of Columbia.

In most metropolitan areas, where the US economy and jobs are increasingly concentrated, the living wage is higher than the national median. Consistent with overall regional variation, of the most populous 100 metropolitan areas, Honolulu ($66,554), New York ($67,323), and Washington DC ($69,709) have the highest living wages for the typical family of four.


And here's a link to the Living Wage Calculation for Tampa city, Hillsborough County, Florida
.

 

[Star]

First of all, because you still have not defined "living wage".

Second, because the unskilled ARE paid a decent wage, for what they bring, as I have shown. However, you decided to spout off about it being below the poverty line, so I am engaging you so you will learn something.

And because I am still waiting to hear what you are hoping the judiciary will do for your union thugs. You know, the ones you want to be above the law.

Keep trying to take the subject off topic, because you can't defend your position.

you work for a living, you should get a living wage. Period.

Or we can just let everyone go on welfare.

What you guys don't seem to get is that when you pay someone below living wage, they get food stamps, they get Section 8 housing, they get ObamaPhones (er... ReaganPhones, but nevermind) they get MedicAid.

All stuff you are paying for, anyway.

Again, if you aren't capable of decency, you should be capable of common sense.

That stupid argument? Please...
Until you define what is a 'living wage' you are posting nonsense.
BTW, time and time again it has been proven beyond all refute that the vast majority of unskilled or low skill workers are NOT supporting a family or even themselves.

Beyond refute? LOL!
Washington state has had the highest minimum wage for a while now and-----and Seattle will soon have the highest minimum wage of any city in the country, so you might want to ask yourself howzit Seattle can be fastest growing big city in the country and-----and have a booming economy


Seattle's New Minimum Wage Is The Highest In America, And Double The Federal Limit

Lauren Barbato
06.03.2014

<snip>

A comfortable living wage for an adult living in Seattle is $9.64 an hour, according to MIT’s Living Wage Calculator. For an adult with one child, the hourly wage jumps to $20.53. Meanwhile, the estimated living wage for a Seattle household with two adults is just under $15 an hour. About 14 percent of Seattle residents live below the poverty level.


According to the workers’ rights group 15 Now, 75 percent of minimum-wage workers are older than age 19, debunking the myth that low-wage jobs are mostly for teens looking for summer work. Nearly two-thirds of low-wage workers are women, and a majority of minimum-wage employees are the primary providers of their households.
.