MN man, guilty or not guilty

[jon_berzerk]

Here's a list of armed homeowners (the good guys) who defended themselves and their property against criminals who broke into their home or attempted to (the bad guys):

http://www.usmessageboard.com/firearms/349499-armed-good-guy-beats-armed-bad-guys.html

i believe in self defense

but i do not believe this is one of them

may have started out that way but

it ended much differently then that

 

[Esmeralda]

I have a TOTAL right to be the judge when someone breaks into my home. Since I don't know their intent I have to assume that their intent is to kill me. So I have EVERY right to kill them first. Period!!!

Not the way the man in the OP did. He shot and disabled them. He did not have the right to continue shooting and purposely kill them after they were not a threat. Answer this: why are you so gung ho to kill people? Sounds like you really get a thrill out of thinking and talking about how you would take so much delight and pleasure is murdering someone. Sounds like you would get a hell of a lot of satisfaction out of it.

You may or may not be right about them "not being a threat" after the first shot. We can't assume anything until we know all of the facts.

The bottom line is that the man had a right to defend himself and his property. The criminals were in his house ... he didn't shoot them in their house. The moral of the story?: If you don't want to get shot don't break into someone else's home.

P.S. I would never get satisfaction over killing anyone. However, I do get satisfaction when justice is served. There's a difference.

I don't believe this. You and the other pro-gun people are absolutely frothing at the mouth hoping to get a chance to blow someone away: every post you guys make on this issue echoes just that thought.

 

[R.D.]

Not the way the man in the OP did. He shot and disabled them. He did not have the right to continue shooting and purposely kill them after they were not a threat. Answer this: why are you so gung ho to kill people? Sounds like you really get a thrill out of thinking and talking about how you would take so much delight and pleasure is murdering someone. Sounds like you would get a hell of a lot of satisfaction out of it.

You may or may not be right about them "not being a threat" after the first shot. We can't assume anything until we know all of the facts.

The bottom line is that the man had a right to defend himself and his property. The criminals were in his house ... he didn't shoot them in their house. The moral of the story?: If you don't want to get shot don't break into someone else's home.

P.S. I would never get satisfaction over killing anyone. However, I do get satisfaction when justice is served. There's a difference.

I don't believe this. You and the other pro-gun people are absolutely frothing at the mouth hoping to get a chance to blow someone away: every post you guys make on this issue echoes just that thought.

I would convict him, and so would other "pro-gun" posters. Don't paint with such broad strokes

 

[DriftingSand]

Here's a list of armed homeowners (the good guys) who defended themselves and their property against criminals who broke into their home or attempted to (the bad guys):

http://www.usmessageboard.com/firearms/349499-armed-good-guy-beats-armed-bad-guys.html

i believe in self defense

but i do not believe this is one of them

may have started out that way but

it ended much differently then that

We'll have to wait until we know all of the facts. You and I know that the media will always spin a story in an anti-gun manner and that the criminal is almost always a "victim" of his circumstances. So, we simply can't trust what the media has chosen to report at this point.

 

[DriftingSand]

Not the way the man in the OP did. He shot and disabled them. He did not have the right to continue shooting and purposely kill them after they were not a threat. Answer this: why are you so gung ho to kill people? Sounds like you really get a thrill out of thinking and talking about how you would take so much delight and pleasure is murdering someone. Sounds like you would get a hell of a lot of satisfaction out of it.

You may or may not be right about them "not being a threat" after the first shot. We can't assume anything until we know all of the facts.

The bottom line is that the man had a right to defend himself and his property. The criminals were in his house ... he didn't shoot them in their house. The moral of the story?: If you don't want to get shot don't break into someone else's home.

P.S. I would never get satisfaction over killing anyone. However, I do get satisfaction when justice is served. There's a difference.

I don't believe this. You and the other pro-gun people are absolutely frothing at the mouth hoping to get a chance to blow someone away: every post you guys make on this issue echoes just that thought.

You've proven to me and the rest of the world that you live in a fantasy world and are quick to judge without having all of the facts. Run along now. I've owned guns since I was 12 years old and I own 14 right now. I've never shot anyone in all that time nor have I even pointed a gun at another person. You have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[jon_berzerk]

Here's a list of armed homeowners (the good guys) who defended themselves and their property against criminals who broke into their home or attempted to (the bad guys):

http://www.usmessageboard.com/firearms/349499-armed-good-guy-beats-armed-bad-guys.html

i believe in self defense

but i do not believe this is one of them

may have started out that way but

it ended much differently then that

We'll have to wait until we know all of the facts. You and I know that the media will always spin a story in an anti-gun manner and that the criminal is almost always a "victim" of his circumstances. So, we simply can't trust what the media has chosen to report at this point.

yes

my understanding of the situation comes only from media reports

the defense is up to bat now

i have not read one single court document

is there any out there by chance

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

He lived alone.

And okay, maybe it is just me. But this had happened several times before. If he was just looking to kill someone, wouldn't he have done so earlier?

I'm going to assume the multiple break ins caused the guy emotional trauma akin to PTSD

It's one thing to think you're safe in your home and another to know it's only a matter of time before some piece of shit breaks in and possibly does you harm.

Here's the thing people if someone will break into your home while you are there they are prepared to hurt you. If they weren't they would wait until your house was empty.

Exactly. I voted he is innnocent. The two perps would be alive had they not entered the mans home.

 

[Esmeralda]

He lived alone.

And okay, maybe it is just me. But this had happened several times before. If he was just looking to kill someone, wouldn't he have done so earlier?

I'm going to assume the multiple break ins caused the guy emotional trauma akin to PTSD

It's one thing to think you're safe in your home and another to know it's only a matter of time before some piece of shit breaks in and possibly does you harm.

Here's the thing people if someone will break into your home while you are there they are prepared to hurt you. If they weren't they would wait until your house was empty.

Exactly. I voted he is innnocent. The two perps would be alive had they not entered the mans home.

In the US the penalty for breaking and entering is not death. The penalty for burglary is not death. In both cases especially if you are not armed. So, taking satisfaction in blowing someone away because they are in your house is not okay. You are deeming yourself executioner beyond what the State itself does.

 

[DriftingSand]

i believe in self defense

but i do not believe this is one of them

may have started out that way but

it ended much differently then that

We'll have to wait until we know all of the facts. You and I know that the media will always spin a story in an anti-gun manner and that the criminal is almost always a "victim" of his circumstances. So, we simply can't trust what the media has chosen to report at this point.

yes

my understanding of the situation comes only from media reports

the defense is up to bat now

i have not read one single court document

is there any out there by chance

The man may very well be guilty of breaking his State's laws and as I said earlier, I don't believe I could have shot a teenage girl unless I determined that she was a true threat. I hope, for the homeowner's sake, that he had justification for his actions. The girl would still be alive had she not broken the law and entered another person's home. But I have a soft spot in my heart for females and I'm naturally defensive of children and teens so it would be really easy to vilify the homeowner. I just don't have enough information to make an unbiased call.

 

[Esmeralda]

You may or may not be right about them "not being a threat" after the first shot. We can't assume anything until we know all of the facts.

The bottom line is that the man had a right to defend himself and his property. The criminals were in his house ... he didn't shoot them in their house. The moral of the story?: If you don't want to get shot don't break into someone else's home.

P.S. I would never get satisfaction over killing anyone. However, I do get satisfaction when justice is served. There's a difference.

I don't believe this. You and the other pro-gun people are absolutely frothing at the mouth hoping to get a chance to blow someone away: every post you guys make on this issue echoes just that thought.

You've proven to me and the rest of the world that you live in a fantasy world and are quick to judge without having all of the facts. Run along now. I've owned guns since I was 12 years old and I own 14 right now. I've never shot anyone in all that time nor have I even pointed a gun at another person. You have no idea what you're talking about.

And denial is not just a river in Egypt. You may be lying to yourself; I'm not buying it.

 

[DriftingSand]

I'm going to assume the multiple break ins caused the guy emotional trauma akin to PTSD

It's one thing to think you're safe in your home and another to know it's only a matter of time before some piece of shit breaks in and possibly does you harm.

Here's the thing people if someone will break into your home while you are there they are prepared to hurt you. If they weren't they would wait until your house was empty.

Exactly. I voted he is innnocent. The two perps would be alive had they not entered the mans home.

In the US the penalty for breaking and entering is not death. The penalty for burglary is not death. In both cases especially if you are not armed. So, taking satisfaction in blowing someone away because they are in your house is not okay. You are deeming yourself executioner beyond what the State itself does.

Wow. So you wouldn't be opposed to someone breaking in and kidnapping someone's child? Or raping a sleeping woman? Or hacking an old man to death? Here in the real world we have to assume that if someone is willing to actually break into a home then that person could very well be willing to harm the inhabitants of that home. We certainly can't assume that they only broke in to make some chicken soup.

 

[DriftingSand]

I don't believe this. You and the other pro-gun people are absolutely frothing at the mouth hoping to get a chance to blow someone away: every post you guys make on this issue echoes just that thought.

You've proven to me and the rest of the world that you live in a fantasy world and are quick to judge without having all of the facts. Run along now. I've owned guns since I was 12 years old and I own 14 right now. I've never shot anyone in all that time nor have I even pointed a gun at another person. You have no idea what you're talking about.

And denial is not just a river in Egypt. You may be lying to yourself; I'm not buying it.

I don't give a hoot what you're buying. You've proven to me that you're cuckoo.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

I'm going to assume the multiple break ins caused the guy emotional trauma akin to PTSD

It's one thing to think you're safe in your home and another to know it's only a matter of time before some piece of shit breaks in and possibly does you harm.

Here's the thing people if someone will break into your home while you are there they are prepared to hurt you. If they weren't they would wait until your house was empty.

Exactly. I voted he is innnocent. The two perps would be alive had they not entered the mans home.

In the US the penalty for breaking and entering is not death. The penalty for burglary is not death. In both cases especially if you are not armed. So, taking satisfaction in blowing someone away because they are in your house is not okay. You are deeming yourself executioner beyond what the State itself does.

Georgia law is different. We have the castle law which allows for deadly force in a break in. The message being - if you want to do a home invasion? Don't do it in Georgia.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

I don't believe this. You and the other pro-gun people are absolutely frothing at the mouth hoping to get a chance to blow someone away: every post you guys make on this issue echoes just that thought.

You've proven to me and the rest of the world that you live in a fantasy world and are quick to judge without having all of the facts. Run along now. I've owned guns since I was 12 years old and I own 14 right now. I've never shot anyone in all that time nor have I even pointed a gun at another person. You have no idea what you're talking about.

And denial is not just a river in Egypt. You may be lying to yourself; I'm not buying it.

I have yet to hear of any gun owner frothing at the mouth in anticipation of a home invasion. That scenario is hard to imagine for even the most avid gun rights opposer.

 

[BDBoop]

And one other thing...how are you going to PROVE that I wasn't afraid for my life? If I say I'm afraid for my life when someone BREAKS INTO MY HOME, I think you're just going to have to give me the benefit of the doubt, even if I do call people "bitch" or whatever as I shoot them. That's just adrenaline, you know.

And apparently none of you have seen the movies where the good guy shoots the bad guy, and the bad guy, laying on the floor apparently no longer a threat, GRABS the good guy by the ankle and pulls him down.

No, I have the right to finish the job to the point that I feel totally safe from these fucking intruders.

And if this would happen more often maybe people would start thinking twice about breaking into people's homes.

That's been my lean through this entire thread. They wouldn't want me on the jury, because I am so sure that the minute they dipped tootsie in his humble abode, all bets were off. No. It is NOT okay. I don't care what happened after, I would likely snap as well. That's why at the beginning of the thread I was saying 'psych eval' because no. What happened after the first shot was fired wasn't normal.

But neither is it normal to find out that your safe place isn't safe, the hard way.

 

[Wry Catcher]

I'm kind of surprised he's even being tried. They were IN his HOUSE.

The jurors heard the dramatic audio recordings Tuesday involving the homeowner who said he feared for his life after several previous break-ins.

Byron Smith, 65, is charged with first-degree premeditated murder in the slayings of cousins Nick Brady, 17, and Haile Kifer, 18, on Thanksgiving Day 2012. The retired State Department security engineer told police that, after the repeated break-ins, he was so fearful that he installed recording devices in his house.

Glass breaking and footsteps could be heard on the recordings. According to Pam Louwagie, a reporter with the Minneapolis Star Tribune, the tapes captured the moments of the fatal shootings.

“The first couple of gunshots you hear are just two loud bangs, and then you hear Nick Brady groaning,” Louwagie said.

After another bang, Smith’s voice could be heard.

“You’re dead,” he said.

“And soon after that, you can hear a tarp rustling, and it sounds like he’s dragging Nick Brady across the carpet,” Louwagie said.

Minutes later, when Kifer went into the basement, perhaps looking for Brady, Smith apparently shot her too, then quickly said, “Oh, sorry about that.”

But, prosecutors said, he didn’t stop there, firing amid Kifer’s screams.

And how can it possibly be premedited?? He didn't know there would be another break-in; how could he? Wouldn't the prosecution have to prove that he knew they would be breaking in?

'You're Dead,' Minn. Man Said After Shooting Teen Intruder - ABC News

After listening to some of the evidence released to the media I need to change my vote to first degree murder. That SOB shot an 18 yo female, six times, and reportedly said, "the last one was a clean shot". I hope hell exists!

 

[BDBoop]

Read this article.

Byron Smith's monologue revealed in audio recordings | BrainerdDispatch.com | Brainerd, Minnesota

Does it not sound like he had come undone?

 

[Pop23]

Read this article.

Byron Smith's monologue revealed in audio recordings | BrainerdDispatch.com | Brainerd, Minnesota

Does it not sound like he had come undone?

After reading this thread several times I would have to go not guilty. None of this happens, none of it, had the teenagers thought enough of other human beings, to not break into their homes.

What he did may not have been the right "thing", but if a not guilty verdict accomplishes anything, it will be to serve notice to other would be criminals one thing.

If you break into someone's home, you should have zero expectation that you will leave in anything less than a body bag.

 

[kiwiman127]

He had the right to defend his home, so he had the right to shoot them. But then they were incapacitated and he should have called the police. Instead he chose to taunt them and then to execute them.
That's very, very wrong.

 

[DriftingSand]

Read this article.

Byron Smith's monologue revealed in audio recordings | BrainerdDispatch.com | Brainerd, Minnesota

Does it not sound like he had come undone?

It's probably posted somewhere but I'm curious as to the man's age and I would also be interested to know if he was on any prescribed medications. We know that he was on edge due to the fact that his house had been broken into before so it's quite possible that he didn't sleep well at night fearing another breakin. If that's the case fatigue may have played a role in his mental state and subsequent actions.