More proof that US gun laws make the US more dangerous than every country in Europe.

[2aguy]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

And take away the violence from the gangs in other countries and those other countries are even safer.

It's amazing what you can see when you cheat.

No.....the only difference...their criminals don't commit murder as often as easily.....out of a country of 320,000,000 people....there were 9,616 gun murders....

Doesn't even register .....since 70-80% of the victims are criminals......

There is more violent crime in Britain....way more violence.....they just don't commit murder...

Here....Americans stop that bullshit violence 1,500,000 times a year with our guns.....and save 25,000 lives a year.....

so in reality...we have 1,923 gun murders in 2015 of actual, innocent people...out of a country with over 320,000,000 people......with over 400 million guns in private hands.....and over 15 million people carrying guns for self defense...

And we stop 1,500,000 crimes each year...

Your numbers don't add up...ours do...

 

[2aguy]

The dishonesty that resides in the left is because they don't differentiate gun violence between different groups of people. To them, someone shot in a drug deal gone bad by felons not even legally allowed to own a gun is the same as a bad guy getting shot breaking into someones house or a teenager tired of being bullied at school splatting their brain matter all over their bedroom wall.

Until the left is willing to differentiate those groups of people and not lump all "gun violence" into the same category, you'll never have an honest debate with them.

The problem with the right is they separate different groups of people to justify not doing anything, not helping anyone.

Why do you think Europe doesn't have a ghetto problem like the US has? Oh, forgot to include that thought process in there, didn't you?

Are you kidding.....what about No Go Zones you dumb twit......? Did you forget about those problems.....? You really are stupid......their problems are about to make ours look like child's play....

 

[2aguy]

The dishonesty that resides in the left is because they don't differentiate gun violence between different groups of people. To them, someone shot in a drug deal gone bad by felons not even legally allowed to own a gun is the same as a bad guy getting shot breaking into someones house or a teenager tired of being bullied at school splatting their brain matter all over their bedroom wall.

Until the left is willing to differentiate those groups of people and not lump all "gun violence" into the same category, you'll never have an honest debate with them.

The problem with the right is they separate different groups of people to justify not doing anything, not helping anyone.

Why do you think Europe doesn't have a ghetto problem like the US has? Oh, forgot to include that thought process in there, didn't you?

No....we help more people around the world than Europe does......we protect Europe...and Asia......with our people and our money........while you create social welfare dependents and strut around like you actually value people.....

Our guns keep you safe as well........Europe sits back and shelters under the protection of American guns....and then has the balls to complain about America.........

 

[Wry Catcher]

You can rank the table by gun homicides per capita.
Obviously Honduras and various third world places top the chart. The US isnt in the top 20 coming in at 3.2%

Way down the list, amongst all the countries of "falling apart Europe" comes the UK on 0.07%

In the period under review there were 41 gun murders in the UK all year. That is a horrific figure but in the US its really just a saturday night.

That you gun nuts are even trying to debate this shows how deluded that you are.

The OP is not under dispute. All of Europe is safer than gun crazy America.

Yes the OP is under dispute. And this article destroys it.

Comparing murder rates and gun ownership across countries - Crime Prevention Research Center

You don't even need that article to destroy your OP article. The article merely is counting guns per country. And then you're comparing it with strictly GUN Crime. And then YOU are cherry picking the countries that only help your point, while ignoring the ones that blatantly go against your point. There is no correlation, and its proved by your own article. On top of that you article isnt comparing crime rates over time, or crime rates without gun control vs with gun control in those countries. Again in Switzerland you are issued a full auto assault rifle (if you choose to keep it) and it's the safest place on earth. And on the other hand countries with the strictest gun laws are also some of the most dangerous places on earth (look at our southern neighbor). So where's the correlation??? Here's the facts, England is a freaking island, that does not have constant drug and cartel wars raging in our cities and across our boarders. Since they've instituted their gun ban, their gun crime had doubled in a decade. If we were to cease our governments war on drugs, the crime rate in America practically evaporates.

In EVERY single instance of a country enacted gun control, the murder rates (as well as crime rates) in that country go up. EVERY SINGLE INSTANT. Look it up yourself if you do not believe me.

Gun Facts | Gun Control and Crime in non-US Countries

Harvard gun study concludes gun bans don’t reduce the murder rate - Hot Air

You are deflecting. All of Europe is safer than the US. Why is that ? We are not as heavily armed as you are.

There may be other minor factors but in general family rows in civilised Europe dont end in a body count and neither do our toddlers outkill terrorists. Every European country has a lower gun murder rate than the US. Every fucking one.

GUN murder rate! Thanks for proving my point! And how am I deflecting?!?! I am directly addressing your OP and even citing your own article. You're the one deflecting, again how do you explain how the Swiss are walking around with full autos, and yet they're in the safest place on earth????

80% of our gun murder rates a directly gang related. And those are only the ones we've proven to be gang related genius. You're ignoring you're own article. Gun crime doubled in the U.K. since gun control was implemented...why is that. The murder rate in Australia went up 10% after gun control was implemented why is that? And Switzerland still remains the safest country on earth, with citizens being issued FULL AUTO (I trust you know what that means) assault rifles left and right. All of these countries that have implemented gun control ALWAYS ALWAYS see a spike in gun murder rates, regular murder rates, and crime.

48% of US citizens are law abiding gun owners, and 99% of them get along swimmingly with everyone around them. Gun control only applies to people who follow the law. And responsible gun owners are thwarting crimes and murders multiple times a day. But yea let's ignore all of those stories. There are more guns in the US than there are illegal immigrants, and you'd probably agree it's impossible to round up all illegals, what makes you think we'll be able to round up all the guns in this country, from criminals who we don't even know have them. It's ludicrous.

You are cherry picking info from your article, when you're own article is contradicting you!! Did you even read it? The data is right there. And then I posted numerous articles about how your article doesn't even come close to giving an accurate full picture, and then you deflect and ignore it. You are incapable of having an honest conversation about guns, if you're only looking at the gun murder rate, you're putting on the narrowest of blinders. If that's what you need to do, whatever, the rest of us are going to keep being gun owners, and I'll keep shooting the coons going after my chickens at night. Because a gun is a tool, nothing else, I can use for hunting or self defense, or I can use it to kill my wife. A knife is a tool, I can use it to slice tomatoes, or I can use it to stab my wife. I can drive my car to work, or I can use it to plow through crowds of people. I can clean myself in my bathtub, or drown somebody in it.

I have directly addressed your OP, you chose to ignore it and claim that I'm deflecting. Have honestly if you really want conversation, if you want to wave a flag with ear muffs on, I'm done with this thread.

Given your opinion, let's do this. Anyone who breaks a law by using a gun, goes to prison for life. That means any law, not only murder.

 

[2aguy]

You can rank the table by gun homicides per capita.
Obviously Honduras and various third world places top the chart. The US isnt in the top 20 coming in at 3.2%

Way down the list, amongst all the countries of "falling apart Europe" comes the UK on 0.07%

In the period under review there were 41 gun murders in the UK all year. That is a horrific figure but in the US its really just a saturday night.

That you gun nuts are even trying to debate this shows how deluded that you are.

The OP is not under dispute. All of Europe is safer than gun crazy America.

Yes the OP is under dispute. And this article destroys it.

Comparing murder rates and gun ownership across countries - Crime Prevention Research Center

You don't even need that article to destroy your OP article. The article merely is counting guns per country. And then you're comparing it with strictly GUN Crime. And then YOU are cherry picking the countries that only help your point, while ignoring the ones that blatantly go against your point. There is no correlation, and its proved by your own article. On top of that you article isnt comparing crime rates over time, or crime rates without gun control vs with gun control in those countries. Again in Switzerland you are issued a full auto assault rifle (if you choose to keep it) and it's the safest place on earth. And on the other hand countries with the strictest gun laws are also some of the most dangerous places on earth (look at our southern neighbor). So where's the correlation??? Here's the facts, England is a freaking island, that does not have constant drug and cartel wars raging in our cities and across our boarders. Since they've instituted their gun ban, their gun crime had doubled in a decade. If we were to cease our governments war on drugs, the crime rate in America practically evaporates.

In EVERY single instance of a country enacted gun control, the murder rates (as well as crime rates) in that country go up. EVERY SINGLE INSTANT. Look it up yourself if you do not believe me.

Gun Facts | Gun Control and Crime in non-US Countries

Harvard gun study concludes gun bans don’t reduce the murder rate - Hot Air

You are deflecting. All of Europe is safer than the US. Why is that ? We are not as heavily armed as you are.

There may be other minor factors but in general family rows in civilised Europe dont end in a body count and neither do our toddlers outkill terrorists. Every European country has a lower gun murder rate than the US. Every fucking one.

GUN murder rate! Thanks for proving my point! And how am I deflecting?!?! I am directly addressing your OP and even citing your own article. You're the one deflecting, again how do you explain how the Swiss are walking around with full autos, and yet they're in the safest place on earth????

80% of our gun murder rates a directly gang related. And those are only the ones we've proven to be gang related genius. You're ignoring you're own article. Gun crime doubled in the U.K. since gun control was implemented...why is that. The murder rate in Australia went up 10% after gun control was implemented why is that? And Switzerland still remains the safest country on earth, with citizens being issued FULL AUTO (I trust you know what that means) assault rifles left and right. All of these countries that have implemented gun control ALWAYS ALWAYS see a spike in gun murder rates, regular murder rates, and crime.

48% of US citizens are law abiding gun owners, and 99% of them get along swimmingly with everyone around them. Gun control only applies to people who follow the law. And responsible gun owners are thwarting crimes and murders multiple times a day. But yea let's ignore all of those stories. There are more guns in the US than there are illegal immigrants, and you'd probably agree it's impossible to round up all illegals, what makes you think we'll be able to round up all the guns in this country, from criminals who we don't even know have them. It's ludicrous.

You are cherry picking info from your article, when you're own article is contradicting you!! Did you even read it? The data is right there. And then I posted numerous articles about how your article doesn't even come close to giving an accurate full picture, and then you deflect and ignore it. You are incapable of having an honest conversation about guns, if you're only looking at the gun murder rate, you're putting on the narrowest of blinders. If that's what you need to do, whatever, the rest of us are going to keep being gun owners, and I'll keep shooting the coons going after my chickens at night. Because a gun is a tool, nothing else, I can use for hunting or self defense, or I can use it to kill my wife. A knife is a tool, I can use it to slice tomatoes, or I can use it to stab my wife. I can drive my car to work, or I can use it to plow through crowds of people. I can clean myself in my bathtub, or drown somebody in it.

I have directly addressed your OP, you chose to ignore it and claim that I'm deflecting. Have honestly if you really want conversation, if you want to wave a flag with ear muffs on, I'm done with this thread.

Given your opinion, let's do this. Anyone who breaks a law by using a gun, goes to prison for life. That means any law, not only murder.

Yeah....and you show you are an irrational nut job...

We want people who actually use a gun to commit a crime to go to jail for a long time...how long...at least 30 years....if not longer.....

You want people who have a 30 round magazine to go to jail for life....as a law abiding citizen who has not used their gun to commit any crime..other than having more bullets than you want them to have....

You are insane......

You want the guy who makes a mistake on his federal background check form to go to jail for life....

You are insane....

 

[Wry Catcher]

The dishonesty that resides in the left is because they don't differentiate gun violence between different groups of people. To them, someone shot in a drug deal gone bad by felons not even legally allowed to own a gun is the same as a bad guy getting shot breaking into someones house or a teenager tired of being bullied at school splatting their brain matter all over their bedroom wall.

Until the left is willing to differentiate those groups of people and not lump all "gun violence" into the same category, you'll never have an honest debate with them.

What is missing from your opinion is the common factor, the gun. Murder has been committed by non criminals, men and women who have no prior arrests or convictions. Murders are not limited to gang violence, though an argument can be made that they contribute to a larger volume of murders in the US each year.

My post (above) suggests the war on drugs created a problem, an unintended consequence much like the killing of the border guards during fast and furious.

Without pointing partisan fingers at anyone, it's time to have an honest and open discussion on drug use and distribution in America, gun violence and gun distribution in America, and immigration in America.,

How do we develop a sane, cost effective and humane response to addicts; those who are in our country illegally; and a fair, cost effective and humane discussion on the ownership, possession or custody and control of a gun in America?

 

[Harry Dresden]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Data?

I don't necessarily disagree, given the data in the Chart of the OP. Central America's gun violence is high too, and drugs are likely a cause of the high rates of homicide. Clearly more guns is not the answer.

That said, the War on Drugs is a failure, and has created gangs and gun violence in the US.

read post 8 wry....

 

[2aguy]

The dishonesty that resides in the left is because they don't differentiate gun violence between different groups of people. To them, someone shot in a drug deal gone bad by felons not even legally allowed to own a gun is the same as a bad guy getting shot breaking into someones house or a teenager tired of being bullied at school splatting their brain matter all over their bedroom wall.

Until the left is willing to differentiate those groups of people and not lump all "gun violence" into the same category, you'll never have an honest debate with them.

What is missing from your opinion is the common factor, the gun. Murder has been committed by non criminals, men and women who have no prior arrests or convictions. Murders are not limited to gang violence, though an argument can be made that they contribute to a larger volume of murders in the US each year.

My post (above) suggests the war on drugs created a problem, an unintended consequence much like the killing of the border guards during fast and furious.

Without pointing partisan fingers at anyone, it's time to have an honest and open discussion on drug use and distribution in America, gun violence and gun distribution in America, and immigration in America.,

How do we develop a sane, cost effective and humane response to addicts; those who are in our country illegally; and a fair, cost effective and humane discussion on the ownership, possession or custody and control of a gun in America?

You don't know what you are talking about....

4/28/16

breakdown of the 90% of murderers have records..really good...

JURIST - The Criminology of Firearms


In 2004, the National Academy of Sciences reviewed 253 journal articles, 99 books, 43 government publications and some empirical research of its own about guns. The Academy could not identify any gun restriction that had reduced violent crime, suicide or gun accidents.

Why don't gun bans work? Because they rely on voluntary compliance by gun-using criminals. Prohibitionists never see this absurdity because they deceive themselves into thinking that, as Katherine Christoffel has said: "[M]ost shootings are not committed by felons or mentally ill people, but are acts of passion that are committed using a handgun that is owned for home protection."

Christoffel, et al., are utterly wrong. The whole corpus of criminological research dating back to the 1890'sshows murderers "almost uniformly have a long history of involvement in criminal behavior," and that "[v]irtually all" murderers and other gun criminals have prior felony records — generally long ones.

While only 15 percent of Americans have criminal records, roughly 90 percent of adult murderers have prior adult records — exclusive of their often extensive juvenile records — with crime careers of six or more adult years including four major felonies. Gerald D. Robin, writing for the Academy of Criminal Justice Sciences,notes that, unlike ordinary gun owners, "the average murderer turns out to be no less hardened a criminal than the average robber or burglar."

 

[2aguy]

The dishonesty that resides in the left is because they don't differentiate gun violence between different groups of people. To them, someone shot in a drug deal gone bad by felons not even legally allowed to own a gun is the same as a bad guy getting shot breaking into someones house or a teenager tired of being bullied at school splatting their brain matter all over their bedroom wall.

Until the left is willing to differentiate those groups of people and not lump all "gun violence" into the same category, you'll never have an honest debate with them.

What is missing from your opinion is the common factor, the gun. Murder has been committed by non criminals, men and women who have no prior arrests or convictions. Murders are not limited to gang violence, though an argument can be made that they contribute to a larger volume of murders in the US each year.

My post (above) suggests the war on drugs created a problem, an unintended consequence much like the killing of the border guards during fast and furious.

Without pointing partisan fingers at anyone, it's time to have an honest and open discussion on drug use and distribution in America, gun violence and gun distribution in America, and immigration in America.,

How do we develop a sane, cost effective and humane response to addicts; those who are in our country illegally; and a fair, cost effective and humane discussion on the ownership, possession or custody and control of a gun in America?

What you posted....

gun violence and gun distribution in America

You don't want to have that discussion...because it doesn't go where you want it to go........here is the truth, the facts and the reality...that you don't care about because you just want to punish gun owners...

We went from 200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s and 4.7 million people carrying guns for self defense in 1997...to close to 400 million guns in private hands and over 15 million people carrying guns for self defense in 2016...guess what happened...


-- gun murder down 49%
--gun crime down 75%
--violent crime down 72%

http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2013/05/07/gun-homicide-rate-down-49-since-1993-peak-public-unaware/

Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.

 

[Wry Catcher]

You can rank the table by gun homicides per capita.
Obviously Honduras and various third world places top the chart. The US isnt in the top 20 coming in at 3.2%

Way down the list, amongst all the countries of "falling apart Europe" comes the UK on 0.07%

In the period under review there were 41 gun murders in the UK all year. That is a horrific figure but in the US its really just a saturday night.

That you gun nuts are even trying to debate this shows how deluded that you are.

The OP is not under dispute. All of Europe is safer than gun crazy America.

Yes the OP is under dispute. And this article destroys it.

Comparing murder rates and gun ownership across countries - Crime Prevention Research Center

You don't even need that article to destroy your OP article. The article merely is counting guns per country. And then you're comparing it with strictly GUN Crime. And then YOU are cherry picking the countries that only help your point, while ignoring the ones that blatantly go against your point. There is no correlation, and its proved by your own article. On top of that you article isnt comparing crime rates over time, or crime rates without gun control vs with gun control in those countries. Again in Switzerland you are issued a full auto assault rifle (if you choose to keep it) and it's the safest place on earth. And on the other hand countries with the strictest gun laws are also some of the most dangerous places on earth (look at our southern neighbor). So where's the correlation??? Here's the facts, England is a freaking island, that does not have constant drug and cartel wars raging in our cities and across our boarders. Since they've instituted their gun ban, their gun crime had doubled in a decade. If we were to cease our governments war on drugs, the crime rate in America practically evaporates.

In EVERY single instance of a country enacted gun control, the murder rates (as well as crime rates) in that country go up. EVERY SINGLE INSTANT. Look it up yourself if you do not believe me.

Gun Facts | Gun Control and Crime in non-US Countries

Harvard gun study concludes gun bans don’t reduce the murder rate - Hot Air

You are deflecting. All of Europe is safer than the US. Why is that ? We are not as heavily armed as you are.

There may be other minor factors but in general family rows in civilised Europe dont end in a body count and neither do our toddlers outkill terrorists. Every European country has a lower gun murder rate than the US. Every fucking one.

GUN murder rate! Thanks for proving my point! And how am I deflecting?!?! I am directly addressing your OP and even citing your own article. You're the one deflecting, again how do you explain how the Swiss are walking around with full autos, and yet they're in the safest place on earth????

80% of our gun murder rates a directly gang related. And those are only the ones we've proven to be gang related genius. You're ignoring you're own article. Gun crime doubled in the U.K. since gun control was implemented...why is that. The murder rate in Australia went up 10% after gun control was implemented why is that? And Switzerland still remains the safest country on earth, with citizens being issued FULL AUTO (I trust you know what that means) assault rifles left and right. All of these countries that have implemented gun control ALWAYS ALWAYS see a spike in gun murder rates, regular murder rates, and crime.

48% of US citizens are law abiding gun owners, and 99% of them get along swimmingly with everyone around them. Gun control only applies to people who follow the law. And responsible gun owners are thwarting crimes and murders multiple times a day. But yea let's ignore all of those stories. There are more guns in the US than there are illegal immigrants, and you'd probably agree it's impossible to round up all illegals, what makes you think we'll be able to round up all the guns in this country, from criminals who we don't even know have them. It's ludicrous.

You are cherry picking info from your article, when you're own article is contradicting you!! Did you even read it? The data is right there. And then I posted numerous articles about how your article doesn't even come close to giving an accurate full picture, and then you deflect and ignore it. You are incapable of having an honest conversation about guns, if you're only looking at the gun murder rate, you're putting on the narrowest of blinders. If that's what you need to do, whatever, the rest of us are going to keep being gun owners, and I'll keep shooting the coons going after my chickens at night. Because a gun is a tool, nothing else, I can use for hunting or self defense, or I can use it to kill my wife. A knife is a tool, I can use it to slice tomatoes, or I can use it to stab my wife. I can drive my car to work, or I can use it to plow through crowds of people. I can clean myself in my bathtub, or drown somebody in it.

I have directly addressed your OP, you chose to ignore it and claim that I'm deflecting. Have honestly if you really want conversation, if you want to wave a flag with ear muffs on, I'm done with this thread.

Given your opinion, let's do this. Anyone who breaks a law by using a gun, goes to prison for life. That means any law, not only murder.

Yeah....and you show you are an irrational nut job...

We want people who actually use a gun to commit a crime to go to jail for a long time...how long...at least 30 years....if not longer.....

You want people who have a 30 round magazine to go to jail for life....as a law abiding citizen who has not used their gun to commit any crime..other than having more bullets than you want them to have....

You are insane......

You want the guy who makes a mistake on his federal background check form to go to jail for life....

You are insane....

Thanks once again for your opinion. You don't know how important and illuminating your opinions are to me.

 

[Wry Catcher]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

 

[Correll]

No...by criminals who are already legally barred from buying,owning or carrying guns.....and you banned guns and your gun murder rate did not change.....and in fact...your gun crime rate in London went up 42%......

And your kids...are knifing each other ....and soon they will be using guns.....since you can't keep them from getting the,....

All of Europe is safer. Every fucking country in Europe is safer. Whatever their gun laws. Because gun ownership is much lower than in America. And not just a bit safer. Safer by miles you stat spewing cretin.

Nope....we have a tiny area of our country that has the gun crime........and, of course, that is where there are the least number of guns and the strictest gun control......2% of our counties have the majority of all murder.......so most of America is even safer than Europe......

These states had a gun murder yesterday.30 odd murders which is quite typical. Seems to be quite widespread to me. There were no gun murders in the UK btw.


Utah

Louisiana

Delaware

Texas

Texas

Maryland

New York

Arizona

New York

Tennessee

New York

Arizona x 2

Ohio

California

Pennsylvania

Pennsylvania

Alabama x 2

California

Illinois

Alabama

Oklahoma

Arkansas

Texas

Illinois

Louisiana

Washington

Missisippi

Kansas

Nothing in that answers the multiple challenges made in this thread.

You are engaged in the Logical Fallacy of Proof by Assertion.

YOu are a propagandist and your point is invalidated.

You lose.

Megalolz !! The figures havent moved since I started the thread.

All of Europe is safer than the US. every fucking country.

All of your nitpicking and deflecting cannot alter that indisputable fact.

Pointing out that all you have done is repeat your position while dodging the many challenges to your position is hardly "nitpicking".

The US has many problems. Gun ownership is not one of them.

 

[2aguy]

Yes the OP is under dispute. And this article destroys it.

Comparing murder rates and gun ownership across countries - Crime Prevention Research Center

You don't even need that article to destroy your OP article. The article merely is counting guns per country. And then you're comparing it with strictly GUN Crime. And then YOU are cherry picking the countries that only help your point, while ignoring the ones that blatantly go against your point. There is no correlation, and its proved by your own article. On top of that you article isnt comparing crime rates over time, or crime rates without gun control vs with gun control in those countries. Again in Switzerland you are issued a full auto assault rifle (if you choose to keep it) and it's the safest place on earth. And on the other hand countries with the strictest gun laws are also some of the most dangerous places on earth (look at our southern neighbor). So where's the correlation??? Here's the facts, England is a freaking island, that does not have constant drug and cartel wars raging in our cities and across our boarders. Since they've instituted their gun ban, their gun crime had doubled in a decade. If we were to cease our governments war on drugs, the crime rate in America practically evaporates.

In EVERY single instance of a country enacted gun control, the murder rates (as well as crime rates) in that country go up. EVERY SINGLE INSTANT. Look it up yourself if you do not believe me.

Gun Facts | Gun Control and Crime in non-US Countries

Harvard gun study concludes gun bans don’t reduce the murder rate - Hot Air

You are deflecting. All of Europe is safer than the US. Why is that ? We are not as heavily armed as you are.

There may be other minor factors but in general family rows in civilised Europe dont end in a body count and neither do our toddlers outkill terrorists. Every European country has a lower gun murder rate than the US. Every fucking one.

GUN murder rate! Thanks for proving my point! And how am I deflecting?!?! I am directly addressing your OP and even citing your own article. You're the one deflecting, again how do you explain how the Swiss are walking around with full autos, and yet they're in the safest place on earth????

80% of our gun murder rates a directly gang related. And those are only the ones we've proven to be gang related genius. You're ignoring you're own article. Gun crime doubled in the U.K. since gun control was implemented...why is that. The murder rate in Australia went up 10% after gun control was implemented why is that? And Switzerland still remains the safest country on earth, with citizens being issued FULL AUTO (I trust you know what that means) assault rifles left and right. All of these countries that have implemented gun control ALWAYS ALWAYS see a spike in gun murder rates, regular murder rates, and crime.

48% of US citizens are law abiding gun owners, and 99% of them get along swimmingly with everyone around them. Gun control only applies to people who follow the law. And responsible gun owners are thwarting crimes and murders multiple times a day. But yea let's ignore all of those stories. There are more guns in the US than there are illegal immigrants, and you'd probably agree it's impossible to round up all illegals, what makes you think we'll be able to round up all the guns in this country, from criminals who we don't even know have them. It's ludicrous.

You are cherry picking info from your article, when you're own article is contradicting you!! Did you even read it? The data is right there. And then I posted numerous articles about how your article doesn't even come close to giving an accurate full picture, and then you deflect and ignore it. You are incapable of having an honest conversation about guns, if you're only looking at the gun murder rate, you're putting on the narrowest of blinders. If that's what you need to do, whatever, the rest of us are going to keep being gun owners, and I'll keep shooting the coons going after my chickens at night. Because a gun is a tool, nothing else, I can use for hunting or self defense, or I can use it to kill my wife. A knife is a tool, I can use it to slice tomatoes, or I can use it to stab my wife. I can drive my car to work, or I can use it to plow through crowds of people. I can clean myself in my bathtub, or drown somebody in it.

I have directly addressed your OP, you chose to ignore it and claim that I'm deflecting. Have honestly if you really want conversation, if you want to wave a flag with ear muffs on, I'm done with this thread.

Given your opinion, let's do this. Anyone who breaks a law by using a gun, goes to prison for life. That means any law, not only murder.

Yeah....and you show you are an irrational nut job...

We want people who actually use a gun to commit a crime to go to jail for a long time...how long...at least 30 years....if not longer.....

You want people who have a 30 round magazine to go to jail for life....as a law abiding citizen who has not used their gun to commit any crime..other than having more bullets than you want them to have....

You are insane......

You want the guy who makes a mistake on his federal background check form to go to jail for life....

You are insane....

Thanks once again for your opinion. You don't know how important and illuminating your opinions are to me.

Anytime I can help an dumb asshole like you see the actual truth on an issue...I will help out....sadly...you are so dumb....you have to be corrected way too often....

 

[Harry Dresden]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

maybe 3-4 years ago?...

 

[Tommy Tainant]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

Why do you need any details ? It is obvious that if you discount people doing bad things then all that will be left is good.

 

[Wry Catcher]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

maybe 3-4 years ago?...

I retired in '05, Two areas of our county (1,000,000 pop.) registered somewhere around 90% of the murders (a guess, but by serving on a Death Panel, where all deaths were discussed (juvenile and adult) it was pretty clear drugs, gangs and poverty were the secondary cause, followed of course by the primary cause of murders, the gun.

 

[Correll]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

maybe 3-4 years ago?...

I retired in '05, Two areas of our county (1,000,000 pop.) registered somewhere around 90% of the murders (a guess, but by serving on a Death Panel, where all deaths were discussed (juvenile and adult) it was pretty clear drugs, gangs and poverty were the secondary cause, followed of course by the primary cause of murders, the gun.

The inanimate object is the cause? NOt the social dysfunction? Was that a joke?

Plenty of guns in suburbia and they don't shoot each other like they do in the hood.

 

[2aguy]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

maybe 3-4 years ago?...

I retired in '05, Two areas of our county (1,000,000 pop.) registered somewhere around 90% of the murders (a guess, but by serving on a Death Panel, where all deaths were discussed (juvenile and adult) it was pretty clear drugs, gangs and poverty were the secondary cause, followed of course by the primary cause of murders, the gun.

And you come to the wrong conclusion....considering there are 400 million guns in the country and over 15 million law abiding people actually carrying guns for self defense.......in a country of over 320 million people...we had 9,616 gun murders in 2015....

Guns are not the issue.....criminals and their willingness to commit murder are.....since 399,990,384 or more guns were not used to commit murder....

And Americans used guns 1,500,000 times to stop violent criminals......

Your number is irrelevant...your analysis is blinded by your prejudice.......

 

[Harry Dresden]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

maybe 3-4 years ago?...

I retired in '05, Two areas of our county (1,000,000 pop.) registered somewhere around 90% of the murders (a guess, but by serving on a Death Panel, where all deaths were discussed (juvenile and adult) it was pretty clear drugs, gangs and poverty were the secondary cause, followed of course by the primary cause of murders, the gun.

so in whose hands were a lot of those guns and how many were killed by those?....

 

[2aguy]

take away gun violence by the gangs and the US is probably one of the safest places on the planet......

Reputable links, please

no link on this jake....i heard this on npr radio driving home from work when i was still in California,and this was a show about gun violence in California, the panelist were 4 police chiefs and the attorney general....and the AG said if you take away the gang shootings in this state and then look at the stats cals shootings drop a whole bunch of percentage points making it a pretty safe place comparatively...and they all felt there is no reason it should be any different in any other state....i reported this a couple of days after i heard this in one of our gun violence threads...so its out there in print....

Do you recall the date, not exact, but the year?

maybe 3-4 years ago?...

I retired in '05, Two areas of our county (1,000,000 pop.) registered somewhere around 90% of the murders (a guess, but by serving on a Death Panel, where all deaths were discussed (juvenile and adult) it was pretty clear drugs, gangs and poverty were the secondary cause, followed of course by the primary cause of murders, the gun.

And the actual truth about this shows you are wrong...again....

Murders in US very concentrated: 54% of US counties in 2014 had zero murders, 2% of counties have 51% of the murders - Crime Prevention Research Center

25 APR , 2017

You can examine the picture of the US counties in more detail by opening it in a new tab.

The Distribution of murders
The United States can really be divided up into three types of places. Places where there are no murders, places where there are a few murders, and places where murders are very common.

In 2014, the most recent year that a county level breakdown is available, 54% of counties (with 11% of the population) have no murders. 69% of counties have no more than one murder, and about 20% of the population. These counties account for only 4% of all murders in the country.

The worst 1% of counties have 19% of the population and 37% of the murders. The worst 5% of counties contain 47% of the population and account for 68% of murders. As shown in figure 2, over half of murders occurred in only 2% of counties.

Murders actually used to be even more concentrated. From 1977 to 2000, on average 73 percent of counties in any give year had zero murders. Possibly, this change is a result of the opioid epidemic’s spread to more rural areas. But that question is beyond the scope of this study. Lott’s book “More Guns, Less Crime” showed how dramatically counties within states vary dramatically with respect to murder and other violent crime rates.