Passion of the Christ: Most Beautiful Love Story of all time

[JenT]

JenT

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LOLOLOLOLOL somebody at my office printed up the conversation at "what do you think of tha mal" thread and left a copy at my desk



LOL it's a good thing they love me so much here

oh man there will be no living with them now

gotta love it



http://www.usmessageboard.com/the-flame-zone/81166-seans-noobies-13.html#post1331212



TFF! At least we here at USMB can choose to read or not read Jent's daffy posts but those folks where she works must have to listen to her prattle all day long.

Ang, yeah they're so upset by my prattle that (as you just provided) they print up what I say and pass it around to read it as well! In fact, specifically for my co-workers, STOP LOOKING OVER MY SHOULDER! I KNOW YOU"RE THERE!

 

[eagleseven]

Again, the scriptures themselves argue against Yeshua. therefore, if jesus is god, then he has refuted and contradicted himself.

The scriptures argue against Yeshua? How so? The authors of the Gospels went to great trouble to ensure the connection between Jewish scripture and Jesus. Thus, the constant refrain of Elijah, Isaiah, and the prophets.

It fits almost too nicely.

I've got some catching up to do but this one I had to comment on now

eagle, ever wonder why God almost seems to orchestrate a rift between Jews and Christians?

10 And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that

‘ Seeing they may not see,
And hearing they may not understand.’

WHY was that?

And then when I was trying to go over things with a Jew, I realized how the two beliefs support each other to the whole world.

If all of Judaism accepted Christ as Savior and everything flowed seamlessly, the rest of the world would have pointed at all the prophesies and claim they were added in after the fact.

Because of the rift, NOBODY is going to believe the Jews changed the Scriptures to support Jesus Christ's fulfillment of them.

And the Jews maintained the original Scriptures that the early church could not change in attempts to villify the Jews.

Every way I look at it, it seems so obvious. God went through great lengths that all would know that Jesus Christ is Lord, from the prophesies seeming to contradict themselves, naming both Bethlehem and Egypt (I think it's Egypt or perhaps Nazareth) as where the Messiah came from...how could one man fulfill both? and yet Christ does.

You're right, it all fits perfectly. And only the Messiah could in so many ways. God is not only concerned with the heavenly position of the Jews and the Christians, but the whole world, for God so loved the world...

I'd argue that the reason the New Testament fits the Old Testament so well is because it was intentionally written that way by the authors, in order to convert the Jews. The rift occurred because the Jewish leadership was not happy that the Apostles were busy converting Jews to Christianity.

Hence my line, "It fits almost too nicely."

But you already know I'm not a believer

 

[AllieBaba]

eagle, ever wonder why God almost seems to orchestrate a rift between Jews and Christians?

10 And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that

‘ Seeing they may not see,
And hearing they may not understand.’

WHY was that?

And then when I was trying to go over things with a Jew, I realized how the two beliefs support each other to the whole world.

If all of Judaism accepted Christ as Savior and everything flowed seamlessly, the rest of the world would have pointed at all the prophesies and claim they were added in after the fact.

Because of the rift, NOBODY is going to believe the Jews changed the Scriptures to support Jesus Christ's fulfillment of them.

Could she get any goofier?

If she were you.
Only she'd have to be mean-spirited as well. Oh well.

 

[AllieBaba]

The scriptures argue against Yeshua? How so? The authors of the Gospels went to great trouble to ensure the connection between Jewish scripture and Jesus. Thus, the constant refrain of Elijah, Isaiah, and the prophets.

It fits almost too nicely.

I've got some catching up to do but this one I had to comment on now

eagle, ever wonder why God almost seems to orchestrate a rift between Jews and Christians?

10 And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that

‘ Seeing they may not see,
And hearing they may not understand.’

WHY was that?

And then when I was trying to go over things with a Jew, I realized how the two beliefs support each other to the whole world.

If all of Judaism accepted Christ as Savior and everything flowed seamlessly, the rest of the world would have pointed at all the prophesies and claim they were added in after the fact.

Because of the rift, NOBODY is going to believe the Jews changed the Scriptures to support Jesus Christ's fulfillment of them.

And the Jews maintained the original Scriptures that the early church could not change in attempts to villify the Jews.

Every way I look at it, it seems so obvious. God went through great lengths that all would know that Jesus Christ is Lord, from the prophesies seeming to contradict themselves, naming both Bethlehem and Egypt (I think it's Egypt or perhaps Nazareth) as where the Messiah came from...how could one man fulfill both? and yet Christ does.

You're right, it all fits perfectly. And only the Messiah could in so many ways. God is not only concerned with the heavenly position of the Jews and the Christians, but the whole world, for God so loved the world...

I'd argue that the reason the New Testament fits the Old Testament so well is because it was intentionally written that way by the authors, in order to convert the Jews. The rift occurred because the Jewish leadership was not happy that the Apostles were busy converting Jews to Christianity.

Hence my line, "It fits almost too nicely."

But you already know I'm not a believer

It was written by various men spaced over millenia and separated by thousands of miles.

 

[JenT]

eagle, ever wonder why God almost seems to orchestrate a rift between Jews and Christians?

10 And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that

‘ Seeing they may not see,
And hearing they may not understand.’

WHY was that?

And then when I was trying to go over things with a Jew, I realized how the two beliefs support each other to the whole world.

If all of Judaism accepted Christ as Savior and everything flowed seamlessly, the rest of the world would have pointed at all the prophesies and claim they were added in after the fact.

Because of the rift, NOBODY is going to believe the Jews changed the Scriptures to support Jesus Christ's fulfillment of them.

Could she get any goofier?

WHOOPS I forgot to point out that the second quote was Isaiah's prophesy that that would be so and Jesus demonstrated it. Self-fulfilling? That could be claimed on that particular instance. But there are dozens (some say 300+) prophesies in the Torah that Jesus fulfilled and Judaism certainly didn't rewrite their Scriptures to support Jesus as the Christ.

Does that express it better? I know, sometimes I don't have the time to express myself as well as others, my apologies.

 

[eagleseven]

Here's what I don't understand.

I disagree with both Jen and you, Alliebaba. Yet, I don't feel the need to clobber you over the head every time you post, nor do I feel the need to shove my thoughts down your throat.

Now, if you are curious and ask, I'll explain what I believe and why I believe it, and let you come to your own conclusions.

 

[JenT]

The scriptures argue against Yeshua? How so? The authors of the Gospels went to great trouble to ensure the connection between Jewish scripture and Jesus. Thus, the constant refrain of Elijah, Isaiah, and the prophets.

It fits almost too nicely.

I've got some catching up to do but this one I had to comment on now

eagle, ever wonder why God almost seems to orchestrate a rift between Jews and Christians?

10 And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that

‘ Seeing they may not see,
And hearing they may not understand.’

WHY was that?

And then when I was trying to go over things with a Jew, I realized how the two beliefs support each other to the whole world.

If all of Judaism accepted Christ as Savior and everything flowed seamlessly, the rest of the world would have pointed at all the prophesies and claim they were added in after the fact.

Because of the rift, NOBODY is going to believe the Jews changed the Scriptures to support Jesus Christ's fulfillment of them.

And the Jews maintained the original Scriptures that the early church could not change in attempts to villify the Jews.

Every way I look at it, it seems so obvious. God went through great lengths that all would know that Jesus Christ is Lord, from the prophesies seeming to contradict themselves, naming both Bethlehem and Egypt (I think it's Egypt or perhaps Nazareth) as where the Messiah came from...how could one man fulfill both? and yet Christ does.

You're right, it all fits perfectly. And only the Messiah could in so many ways. God is not only concerned with the heavenly position of the Jews and the Christians, but the whole world, for God so loved the world...

I'd argue that the reason the New Testament fits the Old Testament so well is because it was intentionally written that way by the authors, in order to convert the Jews. The rift occurred because the Jewish leadership was not happy that the Apostles were busy converting Jews to Christianity.

Hence my line, "It fits almost too nicely."

But you already know I'm not a believer

and I would argue that the reason it fits so well is because the Old Testament was written by God through men foretelling what would come, and it did. The rift occured because Jewish leadership didn't appreciate the Messiah showing up and correcting them, chastising them for making it all but impossible for the common man to enter the Temple.

But you already know I am a believer

 

[JenT]

eagle, ever wonder why God almost seems to orchestrate a rift between Jews and Christians?

10 And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that

‘ Seeing they may not see,
And hearing they may not understand.’

WHY was that?

And then when I was trying to go over things with a Jew, I realized how the two beliefs support each other to the whole world.

If all of Judaism accepted Christ as Savior and everything flowed seamlessly, the rest of the world would have pointed at all the prophesies and claim they were added in after the fact.

Because of the rift, NOBODY is going to believe the Jews changed the Scriptures to support Jesus Christ's fulfillment of them.

Could she get any goofier?

If she were you.
Only she'd have to be mean-spirited as well. Oh well.

GAK! Thanks Allie

but now what will happen when I get...well "mean" is a nice word for it

(I hate falling off my soapbox)

 

[eagleseven]

I'd argue that the reason the New Testament fits the Old Testament so well is because it was intentionally written that way by the authors, in order to convert the Jews. The rift occurred because the Jewish leadership was not happy that the Apostles were busy converting Jews to Christianity.

Hence my line, "It fits almost too nicely."

But you already know I'm not a believer

It was written by various men spaced over millenia and separated by thousands of miles.

Indeed. And if you read all the Prophets, you can identify the development of Judaism as a religion.

Thus, the Gospel of Matthew was written to conform to the most popular Jewish Scriptures of the time, those of Isaiah and Daniel. Why were Isaiah and Daniel popular? Because the Jewish Kingdom had been smashed by the Roman Empire (and the Greeks before them), and so the Jewish people found solace in the promises of Isaiah and Daniel.

Remember, the Gospels were written soon after the sacking of the Temple of Solomon. The Jews were disheartened, their holy places destroyed, and they needed a Savior. The author of Matthew provided that Savior, in the form of Jesus. Why else would there be a page-long genealogy at the start of Matthew?

 

[Anguille]

eagle, ever wonder why God almost seems to orchestrate a rift between Jews and Christians?

10 And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that

‘ Seeing they may not see,
And hearing they may not understand.’

WHY was that?

And then when I was trying to go over things with a Jew, I realized how the two beliefs support each other to the whole world.

If all of Judaism accepted Christ as Savior and everything flowed seamlessly, the rest of the world would have pointed at all the prophesies and claim they were added in after the fact.

Because of the rift, NOBODY is going to believe the Jews changed the Scriptures to support Jesus Christ's fulfillment of them.

Could she get any goofier?

WHOOPS I forgot to point out that the second quote was Isaiah's prophesy that that would be so and Jesus demonstrated it. Self-fulfilling? That could be claimed on that particular instance. But there are dozens (some say 300+) prophesies in the Torah that Jesus fulfilled and Judaism certainly didn't rewrite their Scriptures to support Jesus as the Christ.

Does that express it better? I know, sometimes I don't have the time to express myself as well as others, my apologies.

No. I still can't figure out if you're giving the Jews a pass for not wanting to convert to your religion because you found some use for them or if you're trying to explain away why they had the goosd sense not to.

 

[AllieBaba]

Or, a lot more simple explanation: It was the fulfillment of prophesy, and because it was that fulfillment it jibes with the OT. No conspiracies.

Conspiracies aren't that successful, nor do they last so long.

 

[JenT]

I'd argue that the reason the New Testament fits the Old Testament so well is because it was intentionally written that way by the authors, in order to convert the Jews. The rift occurred because the Jewish leadership was not happy that the Apostles were busy converting Jews to Christianity.

Hence my line, "It fits almost too nicely."

But you already know I'm not a believer

It was written by various men spaced over millenia and separated by thousands of miles.

Indeed. And if you read all the Prophets, you can identify the development of Judaism as a religion.

Thus, the Gospel of Matthew was written to conform to the most popular Jewish Scriptures of the time, those of Isaiah and Daniel. Why were Isaiah and Daniel popular? Because the Jewish Kingdom had been smashed by the Roman Empire (and the Greeks before them), and so the Jewish people found solace in the promises of Isaiah and Daniel.

Remember, the Gospels were written soon after the sacking of the Temple of Solomon. The Jews were disheartened, their holy places destroyed, and they needed a Savior. The author of Matthew provided that Savior, in the form of Jesus. Why else would there be a page-long genealogy at the start of Matthew?

Conform? I don't believe Matthew tried to manipulate anything, he just reported what was.

 

[eagleseven]

Or, a lot more simple explanation: It was written about the fulfillment of prophesy, and it fulfills prophesy because it was that fulfillment. No conspiracies.

Conspiracies aren't that successful, nor do they last so long.

It's not a conspiracy.

I have no doubts that the author of Matthew sincerely believed in Jesus Christ. He believed in Jesus Christ so much, that he felt embellishing Jesus's story, in order to win more converts, was justified. The authors of Gospels were human, after all.

Read the "historical" account of the 14th Dalai Llama. Even though the story is only 60 years old, millions believe that the young Dalai Llama was performing miracles in the late 1940s, before China invaded.

 

[eagleseven]

It was written by various men spaced over millenia and separated by thousands of miles.

Indeed. And if you read all the Prophets, you can identify the development of Judaism as a religion.

Thus, the Gospel of Matthew was written to conform to the most popular Jewish Scriptures of the time, those of Isaiah and Daniel. Why were Isaiah and Daniel popular? Because the Jewish Kingdom had been smashed by the Roman Empire (and the Greeks before them), and so the Jewish people found solace in the promises of Isaiah and Daniel.

Remember, the Gospels were written soon after the sacking of the Temple of Solomon. The Jews were disheartened, their holy places destroyed, and they needed a Savior. The author of Matthew provided that Savior, in the form of Jesus. Why else would there be a page-long genealogy at the start of Matthew?

Conform? I don't believe Matthew tried to manipulate anything, he just reported what was.

That is what makes you a believer, and me a skeptic.

 

[JenT]

Remember, the Gospels were written soon after the sacking of the Temple of Solomon. The Jews were disheartened, their holy places destroyed, and they needed a Savior. The author of Matthew provided that Savior, in the form of Jesus. Why else would there be a page-long genealogy at the start of Matthew?

I agree that the Temple was destroyed and the Jews were disheartened, but Christ had already come and gone and had quite the following already. So many that many had to flee the land and thus the Word was spread, copies of letters taken with them, copies of letters that were much later brought back together when it was safe and determined, by confirmation, which were authentic and which were not.

The page long genealogy was provided because it was necessary to establish the fraternal lineage of Christ as well as the maternal. God knew all the fights over Christ's lineage were coming, why wouldn't He provide it?

 

[JenT]

How come all my breaks from chores turn into all day internet addict behavior? SHEESH

(because I love this stuff)

Back to the grind

bbl

OH WAIT! What did JB say? I"m running and hiding my head, I forgot

 

[JenT]

Or, a lot more simple explanation: It was written about the fulfillment of prophesy, and it fulfills prophesy because it was that fulfillment. No conspiracies.

Conspiracies aren't that successful, nor do they last so long.

It's not a conspiracy.

I have no doubts that the author of Matthew sincerely believed in Jesus Christ. He believed in Jesus Christ so much, that he felt embellishing Jesus's story, in order to win more converts, was justified. The authors of Gospels were human, after all.

Read the "historical" account of the 14th Dalai Llama. Even though the story is only 60 years old, millions believe that the young Dalai Llama was performing miracles in the late 1940s, before China invaded.

eagle, once you've established a relationship with Him, why would chase after counterfeits? I know that's what intellects worship, trying to know all things, opening the mind to every belief...but I've already been down that road dabbling in witchcraft, Tarot cards, astrology, I'm just not interested.

There is only One that has the Words of Life, and that has been the most amazing walk for me. God is a jealous God. I don't like to entertain other gods. But thanks

 

[AllieBaba]

Or, a lot more simple explanation: It was written about the fulfillment of prophesy, and it fulfills prophesy because it was that fulfillment. No conspiracies.

Conspiracies aren't that successful, nor do they last so long.

It's not a conspiracy.

I have no doubts that the author of Matthew sincerely believed in Jesus Christ. He believed in Jesus Christ so much, that he felt embellishing Jesus's story, in order to win more converts, was justified. The authors of Gospels were human, after all.

Read the "historical" account of the 14th Dalai Llama. Even though the story is only 60 years old, millions believe that the young Dalai Llama was performing miracles in the late 1940s, before China invaded.

Fact of the matter is, no dissenters came forward. People who were alive during the life of Christ, who were not converts. They saw the miracles, and did not contest the gospels when they first started circulating.

Likewise, nobody contested that Jesus performed miracles, and nobody claimed what the disciples preached was untrue. Doesn't that strike you as odd, if as you say it was all a conspiracy?

And then there's the little fact that the disciples sans one died horrible deaths. Few people who are perpetuating lies are willing to go to that extreme. The current Dahli Lama was perfectly happy to leave his country when things got hot. In another 60 years, nobody will remember the miracle thing.

 

[eagleseven]

Or, a lot more simple explanation: It was written about the fulfillment of prophesy, and it fulfills prophesy because it was that fulfillment. No conspiracies.

Conspiracies aren't that successful, nor do they last so long.

It's not a conspiracy.

I have no doubts that the author of Matthew sincerely believed in Jesus Christ. He believed in Jesus Christ so much, that he felt embellishing Jesus's story, in order to win more converts, was justified. The authors of Gospels were human, after all.

Read the "historical" account of the 14th Dalai Llama. Even though the story is only 60 years old, millions believe that the young Dalai Llama was performing miracles in the late 1940s, before China invaded.

eagle, once you've established a relationship with Him, why would chase after counterfeits? I know that's what intellects worship, trying to know all things, opening the mind to every belief...but I've already been down that road dabbling in witchcraft, Tarot cards, astrology, I'm just not interested.

There is only One that has the Words of Life, and that has been the most amazing walk for me. God is a jealous God. I don't like to entertain other gods. But thanks

I'm quite certain that I don't know anything about the supernatural. And I'm ok with that. If there is a God, and he is jealous as you say, there is no way a person like me could please him. But I don't know if your God is the right one. But I'm not going to stop you from walking happily with your God.

Just out of curiosity, have you considered becoming Muslim?

 

[Anguille]

....but I've already been down that road dabbling in witchcraft, Tarot cards, astrology,

No big surprise.