Republicans Create Rider To Stop Net Neutrality

[shintao]

Read about airline regulation, son.

Everyone was "neutral" then.

Airline Deregulation: The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics | Library of Economics and Liberty

Airfares, when adjusted for inflation, have fallen 25 percent since 1991, and, according to Clifford Winston and Steven Morrison of the Brookings Institution, are 22 percent lower than they would have been had regulation continued (Morrison and Winston 2000). Since passenger deregulation in 1978, airline prices have fallen 44.9 percent in real terms according to the Air Transport Association. Robert Crandall and Jerry Ellig (1997) estimated that when figures are adjusted for changes in quality and amenities, passengers save $19.4 billion dollars per year from airline deregulation. These savings have been passed on to 80 percent of passengers accounting for 85 percent of passenger miles. The real benefits of airline deregulation are being felt today as never before, with LCCs increasingly gaining market share.

The dollar savings are a direct result of allowing airlines the freedom to innovate in routes and pricing. After deregulation, the airlines quickly moved to a hub-and-spoke system, whereby an airline selected some airport (the hub) as the destination point for flights from a number of origination cities (the spokes). Because the size of the planes used varied according to the travel on that spoke, and since hubs allowed passenger travel to be consolidated in “transfer stations,” capacity utilization (“load factors&#8221 increased, allowing fare reduction. The hub-and-spoke model survives among the legacy carriers, but the LCCs—now 30 percent of the market—typically fly point to point. The network hubs model offers consumers more convenience for routes, but point-to-point routes have proven less costly for airlines to implement. Over time, the legacy carriers and the LCCs will likely use some combination of point-to-point and network hubs to capture both economies of scope and pricing advantages.

Thank you & very informative & precise. Yet they still had to be bailed out by Bush. I was thinking the added passenger carrying capacity available today helps lower overall costs as well.

In my lil burg, we used to have a lot of private jets fly commuters to frisco. Don't know what happened to that, but it was a good thing. We are down to jet flights to Phoenix & Las Vegas, and the military uses the strip to teach jumbo jet touch and gos. Some day it will pick up again.

 

[DiveCon]

..snipped...

[off topic]

dude, that image in your sig is funny as hell
got a link to a full size version?

[/off topic]

 

[Revere]

Bailouts? So what? Government has bailed out railroads, automakers, and public employees.

Nothing more regulated than thoes.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Ok since you seem so convinced, how exactly will this legislation cause you to "pay more and get less"? Specifically.

I have a better question, not that I expect you to answer.

Why do we need rules to give us what we already have? If, as Genachowski claims, this is about keeping the Internet open, why is it that no one, including the FCC, can point to a single example of why this is needed? Other than your vague attempts to scare me.

 

[DiveCon]

Ok since you seem so convinced, how exactly will this legislation cause you to "pay more and get less"? Specifically.

I have a better question, not that I expect you to answer.

Why do we need rules to give us what we already have? If, as Genachowski claims, this is about keeping the Internet open, why is it that no one, including the FCC, can point to a single example of why this is needed? Other than your vague attempts to scare me.

the market itself says it isnt needed
as any ISP that started doing this would LOSE CUSTOMERS in DROVES

 

[Quantum Windbag]

All government regulation forces prices to go up faster.

Link?

What was the real (2010) cost of air travel when it was regulated? What was the real cost of long distance phone charges when it was regulated?

People keep telling me that phone company deregulation was a bad idea, yet I pay less per year for all 4 phone lines and 1 cell phone I have, all with unlimited long distance, per year than my parents paid per month for their single line. Yet, somehow, that is bad for me.

 

[shintao]

..snipped...

[off topic]

dude, that image in your sig is funny as hell
got a link to a full size version?

[/off topic]

Here is the original link. I changed the heading. Tinsel Toons #11 Simplify Christmas


If you put "Santa Toons" in your google "image" you will come up with a ton of good ones to chose from. I know this one I chose has been around a few years or so.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

there is nothing wrong with the internet, except that the federal gov. cannot find a way to get their mitts on it to make money; fees and taxes AND control, because thats what government does.

Mark my words- if this flys and the FCC get its hands into it, check your internet billing a year or so down the road, I guarantee you, that you will be paying more and getting less.

What has this regime done to make anyone more free or equal?

It removed FOIA restrictions Bush had in place.

Tech Dirt is not remotely impressed with the White House's performance in responding to FOIAs: The officials rules from the Obama Administration, when it comes to Freedom of Information requests, is that the default view should be the transparent one.
In practice, we've seen exactly the opposite.
Studies have shown that the Obama Administration has turned down FOIA requests at a greater rate than the previous administration (which was already pretty damn secretive) and often uses political reasons , rather than genuine secrecy reasons...

Blogs on: Obama's Disappointing Record on Transparency

You must be one of the idiots that voted for him because he made good speeches.

 

[Revere]

Link?

What was the real (2010) cost of air travel when it was regulated? What was the real cost of long distance phone charges when it was regulated?

People keep telling me that phone company deregulation was a bad idea, yet I pay less per year for all 4 phone lines and 1 cell phone I have, all with unlimited long distance, per year than my parents paid per month for their single line. Yet, somehow, that is bad for me.

But everyone was neutrall! Everyone had one of these:

 

[DiveCon]

..snipped...

[off topic]

dude, that image in your sig is funny as hell
got a link to a full size version?

[/off topic]

Here is the original link. I changed the heading. Tinsel Toons #11 Simplify Christmas


If you put "Santa Toons" in your google "image" you will come up with a ton of good ones to chose from. I know this one I chose has been around a few years or so.

thanks, but it isnt a larger version
oh well

 

[DiveCon]

What was the real (2010) cost of air travel when it was regulated? What was the real cost of long distance phone charges when it was regulated?

People keep telling me that phone company deregulation was a bad idea, yet I pay less per year for all 4 phone lines and 1 cell phone I have, all with unlimited long distance, per year than my parents paid per month for their single line. Yet, somehow, that is bad for me.

But everyone was neutrall! Everyone had one of these:

and if you wanted a 2nd one(on the same line), you had to pay extra each month

 

[Revere]

Yeah, they tested the drop in your current to see if you had more than one phone, then charged you for it, because government told them to!

 

[shintao]

What has this regime done to make anyone more free or equal?

It removed FOIA restrictions Bush had in place.

Tech Dirt is not remotely impressed with the White House's performance in responding to FOIAs: The officials rules from the Obama Administration, when it comes to Freedom of Information requests, is that the default view should be the transparent one.
In practice, we've seen exactly the opposite.
Studies have shown that the Obama Administration has turned down FOIA requests at a greater rate than the previous administration (which was already pretty damn secretive) and often uses political reasons , rather than genuine secrecy reasons...

Blogs on: Obama's Disappointing Record on Transparency

You must be one of the idiots that voted for him because he made good speeches.

Ahh, you must be the idiot that voted for him in the primaries to pevent the Clinton team from coming back into office, because of one of limp-balls speeches.

 

[shintao]

[off topic]

dude, that image in your sig is funny as hell
got a link to a full size version?

[/off topic]

Here is the original link. I changed the heading. Tinsel Toons #11 Simplify Christmas


If you put "Santa Toons" in your google "image" you will come up with a ton of good ones to chose from. I know this one I chose has been around a few years or so.

thanks, but it isnt a larger version
oh well

How big would you like it? Easy to do. It is currently 476x352

640x480
800x600
1024x786
1920x1080

 

[DiveCon]

Here is the original link. I changed the heading. Tinsel Toons #11 Simplify Christmas


If you put "Santa Toons" in your google "image" you will come up with a ton of good ones to chose from. I know this one I chose has been around a few years or so.

thanks, but it isnt a larger version
oh well

How big would you like it? Easy to do. It is currently 476x352

640x480
800x600
1024x786
1920x1080

its cool
no worries

 

[Trajan]

Read the thread. It's been stated.

that tells me exactly squat, you commented, so I asked YOU.

So, you're commenting in a thread that you haven't actually read any of?

I never said that, read my entire quote not what you want to read.

 

[shintao]

Yeah, they tested the drop in your current to see if you had more than one phone, then charged you for it, because government told them to!

A serious problem for phones is availability of numbers. I just started up a new phone service and found out all the numbers have had previous users. They just recycle the freed up numbers again and again. Problem is, I get about 5 calls a day from creditors from the previous users who must have been fraudsters. And I put the do not call list on the phone as well, no help.


What I would like is a program where I could enter the only numbers that are allowed to contact me. All other numbers would be rejected until I personally add them to my phone. And the same idea of my email, only the addresses I enter, and the rest are rejected.

 

[DiveCon]

Yeah, they tested the drop in your current to see if you had more than one phone, then charged you for it, because government told them to!

A serious problem for phones is availability of numbers. I just started up a new phone service and found out all the numbers have had previous users. They just recycle the freed up numbers again and again. Problem is, I get about 5 calls a day from creditors from the previous users who must have been fraudsters. And I put the do not call list on the phone as well, no help.


What I would like is a program where I could enter the only numbers that are allowed to contact me. All other numbers would be rejected until I personally add them to my phone. And the same idea of my email, only the addresses I enter, and the rest are rejected.

that is actually a good idea
a blocked list of sorts
suggest it to your carrier

 

[Trajan]

there is nothing wrong with the internet, except that the federal gov. cannot find a way to get their mitts on it to make money; fees and taxes AND control, because thats what government does.

Mark my words- if this flys and the FCC get its hands into it, check your internet billing a year or so down the road, I guarantee you, that you will be paying more and getting less.

Ok since you seem so convinced, how exactly will this legislation cause you to "pay more and get less"? Specifically.

Oh so I get to answer your question and you don't make any specific comments on mine other than to say I don't know what I am talking about...got it.....


anyway, in the interest of comity;

We’ll start off with simple point- at&t and Comcast have already forecast revenue growth at approx. 5-7% over the next 5-7 years. Internet traffic is expected to run up additionally 25%.

They will of course have to invest approx 15-20% a year more on infrastructure to maintain current service. They have factored this into their present price points and service, however, IF they are forced to share or that is rate their services to other carriers whom they must allow to run content on their networks via an FCC dictate etc. their bus. model is in the toilet. With me so far?

So if the they cannot find growth in their own offerings via their networks and have to provide room for say netflix that do not add revenue to their bottom line on the same scale where do you think it will come from? How long before you and I start paying per Kb or MB? Instead of whats presently operating, which is one set fee for all you can link to at your contracted through put?


Okay, my turn; what is wrong with your internet service that needs fixing?

 

[edthecynic]

Seriously? Your're not old enough to remember long distance charges?

I'm old enough to remember long distance charges, but you had to make a long distance call to incur the charge back then. Now, if you don't make many long distance calls you are charged an UNDER USE FEE. That's Right, someone has to pay a long distance charge for NOT making long distance calls!!!!