Republicans - Rich vs. Rubes

[Mertex]

ALL CANCERS DEATH RATE BY COUNTRY


Seems like we do better than most of Europe on Cancer survival rates.....




BTW my Son in Law died from cancer about 4 hours ago...........

Sorry to hear that. My condolences to you and your family.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Why do you keep spreading that 48 million unisured lie? people are unisured because they want to be. They want that money to buy, I dont know, like FOOD or vacations. they dont want to be taxed to death like Canada is.

That's true, a lot of 20 and 30 year olds figure they don't need to waste money on health insurance. they are supermen and never get sick.

and when they get sick, they go to emergency rooms, get treated at six times the cost of what it should be, and the rest of us end up paying for it.

But most of the uninsured are uninsured because they can't afford it.

They can't afford it because of rising premiums and co-pays resulting from flawed healthcare initiatives, aka Obamacare.

 

[Mertex]

That's true, a lot of 20 and 30 year olds figure they don't need to waste money on health insurance. they are supermen and never get sick.

and when they get sick, they go to emergency rooms, get treated at six times the cost of what it should be, and the rest of us end up paying for it.

But most of the uninsured are uninsured because they can't afford it.

They can't afford it because of rising premiums and co-pays resulting from flawed healthcare initiatives, aka Obamacare.

Shows how much you know. Obamacare hasn't been fully implemented, and it's supposed to stop the rising premiums.

To be fair, most of the provisions of Obamacare don’t get implemented till 2014.
ObamaCareACA » All About ObamaCare and the ACA

 

[JoeB131]

That's true, a lot of 20 and 30 year olds figure they don't need to waste money on health insurance. they are supermen and never get sick.

and when they get sick, they go to emergency rooms, get treated at six times the cost of what it should be, and the rest of us end up paying for it.

But most of the uninsured are uninsured because they can't afford it.

They can't afford it because of rising premiums and co-pays resulting from flawed healthcare initiatives, aka Obamacare.

Premiums were shooting up long before ObamaCare.

And frankly, when you have insurance companies denying cancer as a "pre-existing" condition when someone had acne as a child, you probably needed regulation.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Obamacare will do nothing about raising premiums. That Idea was destroyed behind closed doors early in the deliberations... They totally forgot that the idea was to make healthcare more affordable and instead made it mandatory........ And of course more expensive than ever.........

 

[AmazonTania]

As an innovator in a different field, I can guarantee you that the innovators are not the ones pushing the rates into the stratosphere. It's the goddamned greedy executives and administrators.

Maybe you should re-read what you responded to.

Well granted, I was trying to read between the lines but I thought your message was that the reason that US medical care is more expensive than anywhere else is because we do all the innovation here. No?

It's not expensive because we do all of the innovation. It's expensive because whoever develops a drug has monopoly privileges on the drugs they innovate. The FDA charges hundreds of millions of dollars in this drug evaluation which takes years to compete. Pharmaceutical companies have to be able to make up the cost in between this time. So how do they make it up? They shift the cost over to the consumer in the form of high priced drugs. While patent rights are in effect, no other developer in the marketplace is allowed to develop a generic to compete with the monopoly.

We develop majority of the drugs for the world, and that's good. But there is too much regulation when it comes to the marketplace on innovating drugs, and that's bad. All it does is create higher cost for everyone.

 

[SFC Ollie]

If a company spends a billion dollars developing a new life saving drug shouldn't they be protected while they make their money back on it?

 

[JoeNormal]

Maybe you should re-read what you responded to.

Well granted, I was trying to read between the lines but I thought your message was that the reason that US medical care is more expensive than anywhere else is because we do all the innovation here. No?

It's not expensive because we do all of the innovation. It's expensive because whoever develops a drug has monopoly privileges on the drugs they innovate. The FDA charges hundreds of millions of dollars in this drug evaluation which takes years to compete. Pharmaceutical companies have to be able to make up the cost in between this time. So how do they make it up? They shift the cost over to the consumer in the form of high priced drugs. While patent rights are in effect, no other developer in the marketplace is allowed to develop a generic to compete with the monopoly.

We develop majority of the drugs for the world, and that's good. But there is too much regulation when it comes to the marketplace on innovating drugs, and that's bad. All it does is create higher cost for everyone.

You have a good point when you say that approval and testing costs a lot of money but I don't think I share your apparent enthusiasm for cutting corners on that aspect of development.

 

[JoeB131]

Obamacare will do nothing about raising premiums. That Idea was destroyed behind closed doors early in the deliberations... They totally forgot that the idea was to make healthcare more affordable and instead made it mandatory........ And of course more expensive than ever.........

Actually, what it did was make it accessable.

You do have a point. If you had a public option that wasn't paying obscene overhead to stockholders and executives making eight figures, that would create competition to bring costs down.

Probably not what you mean. You probably mean the tiresome Conservative Talking point that is we just make doctors immune to lawsuits, health care will magically get cheaper.

 

[JoeB131]

If a company spends a billion dollars developing a new life saving drug shouldn't they be protected while they make their money back on it?

NOt if they are gouging Americans while selling to the rest of the world at cost.

 

[Trajan]

The thing I've noticed in my 12 step recovery from being a Republican is that the GOP, since 1980 at least, has divided itself into Rich Issues vs. Rube Issues.

And it's really easy to tell them apart.

A Rich Issue is one where only the 1% really benefits, the rest of us are left holding the bag, but the GOP will act on these things like they are top priorities and their mouthpieces on Hate Radio and Faux News will spend a lot of time convincing you that you have a stake at the table.

Examples- Tax Cuts for Rich People. Free Trade. Right to Work. At Will Employment.


A Rube issue is one that people get emotionally invested in, but the GOP isn't really the least bit interested in changing things on them. Instead, these are issues that are meant to keep you truly upset about something and voting against your own economic issues, and they are never mentioned again until the next election-

Examples - Abortion. Gay Marriage. Creationism. Prayer in Schools. The needle hasn't moved one inch on most of these issues, or if it has moved (as in the case of gay marriage) its been in the opposite of the desired direction.

There are some cavaets, of course. Guns might seem on the surface to be a "Rube" issue, but it's really a "rich" issue. It's about the gun companies being able to sell to someone like Nancy Lanza, and screw the consequences. There wouldn't be as big a market for the rich to make money off the guns if the rubes weren't kept really scared all the time, so you have to make it easy for crooks to get guns.

Immigration is another one. ON the surface, you keep the rubes angry about "those people" wanting to take their jobs, but the Rich are the ones offering the jobs to "those people". Not just the 20 or so illegals who are already here, but the 1.25 million "legal" immigrants who get entry visas from employers because they claim up and down they can't find a qualified American. No, really.

When I stopped being a Republican is when I realized I had nothing in common with the "rich" and refused to be a "Rube".

The GOP base is now the yahoo hayseeds, bible thumpers backward southern slow witted slackjawed uneducated yokels who support and defend the few rich at the top who are pulling their strings

yea, what a bunch of bumpkins!!! hey, maybe you should fuck with them by auditing them or submarining their requests to register recognize their organizational status via the IRs...


I am part of their base, apparently I am more tolerant and a lot smarter than you, even when I sleep... what a dipshit post.

 

[Trajan]

The thing I've noticed in my 12 step recovery from being a Republican is that the GOP, since 1980 at least, has divided itself into Rich Issues vs. Rube Issues.

And it's really easy to tell them apart.

A Rich Issue is one where only the 1% really benefits, the rest of us are left holding the bag, but the GOP will act on these things like they are top priorities and their mouthpieces on Hate Radio and Faux News will spend a lot of time convincing you that you have a stake at the table.

Examples- Tax Cuts for Rich People. Free Trade. Right to Work. At Will Employment.


A Rube issue is one that people get emotionally invested in, but the GOP isn't really the least bit interested in changing things on them. Instead, these are issues that are meant to keep you truly upset about something and voting against your own economic issues, and they are never mentioned again until the next election-

Examples - Abortion. Gay Marriage. Creationism. Prayer in Schools. The needle hasn't moved one inch on most of these issues, or if it has moved (as in the case of gay marriage) its been in the opposite of the desired direction.

There are some cavaets, of course. Guns might seem on the surface to be a "Rube" issue, but it's really a "rich" issue. It's about the gun companies being able to sell to someone like Nancy Lanza, and screw the consequences. There wouldn't be as big a market for the rich to make money off the guns if the rubes weren't kept really scared all the time, so you have to make it easy for crooks to get guns.

Immigration is another one. ON the surface, you keep the rubes angry about "those people" wanting to take their jobs, but the Rich are the ones offering the jobs to "those people". Not just the 20 or so illegals who are already here, but the 1.25 million "legal" immigrants who get entry visas from employers because they claim up and down they can't find a qualified American. No, really.

When I stopped being a Republican is when I realized I had nothing in common with the "rich" and refused to be a "Rube".

racism, war on woman, the rich are too rich, racism, they want to poison the air and water, they want people to go hungry, they don't want people to get health care, racism,.....yea, no dog whistles there


you've become what you purportedly hate....

 

[JoeB131]

[

racism, war on woman, the rich are too rich, racism, they want to poison the air and water, they want people to go hungry, they don't want people to get health care, racism,.....yea, no dog whistles there


you've become what you purportedly hate....

Guy, the Rich are too rich.

And, yes, when you are calling women "Sluts" and thinking of clever adjectives to put in front of the word "Rape", you are waging a war on women.

Tell you what, the main reason I'm happy I stopped being Republican is that there is so much asshattery I don't have to defend anymore.