Slavery reparations?

[Toddsterpatriot]

I have no problem with all people that were enslaved being paid reparations. If you can locate the whites that had ancestors that were enslaved have at it. They are not my concern nor did they suffer the generations of slavery Black people endured. I'm speaking strictly about Black people. Other people can represent their own ethnicity.

Yes the forty acres and a mule did include a mule. Why do you think it was named that? However that is just another diversionary tactic. Lets stick to the point. Without that failed promise the US is still on the hook for back wages plus interest. The slaves were never compensated. The US owes. Disagree if you must but you have not shown anything that would invalidate the debt.

Without that failed promise the US is still on the hook for back wages plus interest.

Sorry, the US didn't hire the slaves and doesn't owe them wages.

Wages are merely an acceptable starting point for allowing the heinous behavior in contradiction to the constitution. If you want to dicker about the wording have at it but you will be talking to yourself.

The US didn't own the slaves, the US didn't owe them wages.
If you want to trace the families that owned your ancestors, and sue them for back wages, feel free.
Or you could keep whining.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You being uncomfortable with the facts is not a valid excuse for being ridiculous. Why don't you take your whining to another country? My ancestors built this one so I have more claim to it than you as a white person ever will.

The fact that you're a whiner doesn't make me uncomfortable.

My ancestors built this one

What did they build? Be specific.

This country. Now lets get back on point. Why is the debt not owed to the descendants of slaves? You have to be specific and rational. Can you do that?

This country.

I said be specific.
Picking cotton isn't building this country.

Why is the debt not owed to the descendants of slaves?

What debt? Be specific and rational. Can you do that?

 

[Asclepias]

Without that failed promise the US is still on the hook for back wages plus interest.

Sorry, the US didn't hire the slaves and doesn't owe them wages.

Wages are merely an acceptable starting point for allowing the heinous behavior in contradiction to the constitution. If you want to dicker about the wording have at it but you will be talking to yourself.

The US didn't own the slaves, the US didn't owe them wages.
If you want to trace the families that owned your ancestors, and sue them for back wages, feel free.
Or you could keep whining.

People in the US owned slaves against the tenets of the constitution. It was allowed and laws were made to enable this. The US is at fault for allowing this. Please tell me you are aware of this? Your claims of whining only make your position weak. Please try and be logical not emotional.

 

[Asclepias]

The fact that you're a whiner doesn't make me uncomfortable.

My ancestors built this one

What did they build? Be specific.

This country. Now lets get back on point. Why is the debt not owed to the descendants of slaves? You have to be specific and rational. Can you do that?

This country.

I said be specific.
Picking cotton isn't building this country.

Why is the debt not owed to the descendants of slaves?

What debt? Be specific and rational. Can you do that?

I dont really care what you said. Deal with the answer I gave you on your diversionary question or not.

The debt called reparations. Have you been paying attention to the thread?

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Without that failed promise the US is still on the hook for back wages plus interest.

Sorry, the US didn't hire the slaves and doesn't owe them wages.

Wages are merely an acceptable starting point for allowing the heinous behavior in contradiction to the constitution. If you want to dicker about the wording have at it but you will be talking to yourself.

The US didn't own the slaves, the US didn't owe them wages.
If you want to trace the families that owned your ancestors, and sue them for back wages, feel free.
Or you could keep whining.

The United States also went to war largely to end the damn institution of slavery, costing lots of its fighting men their lives and or their limbs.

But the U.S. was not the slave owner of any of the Africans who got put into slavery. The U.S. certainly does not owe them wages, not having been their owners.

And sadly, the Constitution did NOT prohibit slavery. In fact, quite the contrary is true. Still and all, the U.S. did forcefully terminate the institution.

So, there is no articulated basis (clearly none offered by AssClapius) for the notion of "reparations."

Application DENIED.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Asclepias:
Work Hard Play Hard Argue Unintelligibly.

The latter he has DOWN.

 

[Asclepias]

Wages are merely an acceptable starting point for allowing the heinous behavior in contradiction to the constitution. If you want to dicker about the wording have at it but you will be talking to yourself.

The US didn't own the slaves, the US didn't owe them wages.
If you want to trace the families that owned your ancestors, and sue them for back wages, feel free.
Or you could keep whining.

The United States also went to war largely to end the damn institution of slavery, costing lots of its fighting men their lives and or their limbs.

But the U.S. was not the slave owner of any of the Africans who got put into slavery. The U.S. certainly does not owe them wages, not having been their owners.

And sadly, the Constitution did NOT prohibit slavery. In fact, quite the contrary is true. Still and all, the U.S. did forcefully terminate the institution.

So, there is no articulated basis (clearly none offered by AssClapius) for the notion of "reparations."

Application DENIED.

Thank you for backing up my point in that the US allowed the institution of slavery and even made laws to enable it. Reparations are (once again) to right a wrong. Slavery was wrong as many presidents have espoused. The debt is there. You dont have any power so I will ignore your declaration of denial. Get me to someone that has at least a little say so.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Wages are merely an acceptable starting point for allowing the heinous behavior in contradiction to the constitution. If you want to dicker about the wording have at it but you will be talking to yourself.

The US didn't own the slaves, the US didn't owe them wages.
If you want to trace the families that owned your ancestors, and sue them for back wages, feel free.
Or you could keep whining.

People in the US owned slaves against the tenets of the constitution. It was allowed and laws were made to enable this. The US is at fault for allowing this. Please tell me you are aware of this? Your claims of whining only make your position weak. Please try and be logical not emotional.

People in the US owned slaves

You should go after those people then.

Your claims of whining only make your position weak.

Your whining does not make my position weak. Or your position strong.

 

[Asclepias]

Asclepias:
Work Hard Play Hard Argue Unintelligibly.

The latter he has DOWN.

Thats called avoiding the point. Please offer something of substance and cease avoiding the issue.

 

[Asclepias]

The US didn't own the slaves, the US didn't owe them wages.
If you want to trace the families that owned your ancestors, and sue them for back wages, feel free.
Or you could keep whining.

People in the US owned slaves against the tenets of the constitution. It was allowed and laws were made to enable this. The US is at fault for allowing this. Please tell me you are aware of this? Your claims of whining only make your position weak. Please try and be logical not emotional.

People in the US owned slaves

You should go after those people then.

Your claims of whining only make your position weak.

Your whining does not make my position weak. Or your position strong.

Thats correct people in the US owned slaves. The government allowed this and profited by it. I dont need to go after anyone. Reparations are to be paid by the government for allowing it and profiting from it. Besides you could not afford to pay even one person by yourself.

Your claims of whining show how weak your position is and how strong mine is. Only people with no argument resort to the whining claim. its a useful tool to use in order to get someone off the point. Fail.

 

[MaryL]

What is the worth of a human life? Estimated 160000 people lost their lives to free slaves. A vast majority of whites never had anything to do with blacks slaves, ever. My grandparents immigrated here in the 1880s long past the issue. So, here we are. Who is going to determine whom owes WHO WHAT TO whom. Sounds rather crass…My parents
were white, they never owned slaves and, besides, blacks were deeply involved in the slave industry as well. Sooo..how do we go about defining WHO owes WHAT to WHOM?

 

[Asclepias]

What is the worth of a human life? Estimated 160000 people lost their lives to free slaves. A vast majority of whites never had anything to do with blacks slaves, ever. My grandparents immigrated here in the 1880s long past the issue. So, here we are. Who is going to determine whom owes WHO WHAT TO whom. Sounds rather crass…My parents
were white, they never owned slaves and, besides, blacks were deeply involved in the save industry as well. Sooo..how do we go about defining WHO owes WHAT to WHOM?

Good question. The life of a Black person is beyond the scope of this discussion. Essentially the US would be broke if they paid for all the Black people that died due to slavery. Military service for whites is just that...military service. No special compensation other than the satisfaction of doing their duty. Anything else would make them mercenaries. That is an invalid argument. I have repeatedly said it is a government issue that you will pay via your taxes. Very similar to how you pay for pricey wars.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Asclepias:
Work Hard Play Hard Argue Unintelligibly.

The latter he has DOWN.

Thats called avoiding the point. Please offer something of substance and cease avoiding the issue.

Practice what you preach. Your hypocritical "lecture" is ugly and shallow, even by your miserable standards.

YOU refuse to support your silly position.

You fail to rise to the challenges before you for a reason: It's clear. You know you have nothing. This is why you HAVE argued quite unintelligibly.

Repeating your silly claim in a loop (as you do all the time) is not actual "debate;" it is not a good or logical form of argument; and you lack the manhood required to admit that you have failed.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

The US didn't own the slaves, the US didn't owe them wages.
If you want to trace the families that owned your ancestors, and sue them for back wages, feel free.
Or you could keep whining.

The United States also went to war largely to end the damn institution of slavery, costing lots of its fighting men their lives and or their limbs.

But the U.S. was not the slave owner of any of the Africans who got put into slavery. The U.S. certainly does not owe them wages, not having been their owners.

And sadly, the Constitution did NOT prohibit slavery. In fact, quite the contrary is true. Still and all, the U.S. did forcefully terminate the institution.

So, there is no articulated basis (clearly none offered by AssClapius) for the notion of "reparations."

Application DENIED.

Thank you for backing up my point in that the US allowed the institution of slavery and even made laws to enable it. Reparations are (once again) to right a wrong. Slavery was wrong as many presidents have espoused. The debt is there. You dont have any power so I will ignore your declaration of denial. Get me to someone that has at least a little say so.

Except you are caught lying again.

That was not your "argument."

What YOU (being the idiot that you are) contended was that the U.S. permitted slavery in contravention of the Constitution.

Are you completely unable to be honest?

You are a bad joke, Assclapius.

 

[Asclepias]

Asclepias:
Work Hard Play Hard Argue Unintelligibly.

The latter he has DOWN.

Thats called avoiding the point. Please offer something of substance and cease avoiding the issue.

Practice what you preach. Your hypocritical "lecture" is ugly and shallow, even by your miserable standards.

YOU refuse to support your silly position.

You fail to rise to the challenges before you for a reason: It's clear. You know you have nothing. This is why you HAVE argued quite unintelligibly.

Repeating your silly claim in a loop (as you do all the time) is not actual "debate;" it is not a good or logical form of argument; and you lack the manhood required to admit that you have failed.

I do practice what I preach and stay on point. You are reduced to calling names. Sad state of affairs.

My position is supported but you have yet to mount an valid rebuttal and you keep avoiding the questions. Are you waiting for someone to rescue you?

When you provide a challenge then we can discuss it. So far I see no challenge from you at all.

I agree you repeating yourself is not debate. Answer the questions I put forth so we can debate. What are you afriad of? I fear you have nothing at all and are only a waste of time. I will check back later. Try not to be such a time sink. You are sorely disappointing.

 

[History]

Well I will put it to you like this, they are getting their "Reparations" from the tax payer already, because if you look at the statistics of the percentage of people receiving benefits, then you will know exactly why I say this. A staggering 39% of total recipients. And the population of them is wayyyyyy less than whites, even lower than Hispanics.

What about Abortion Reparations to all those innocent babies that have been killed?? Well apparently we can't help those beautiful human creatures because they have passed on. To my knowledge today, there are no living slaves in America and haven't been for a long time.

Speaking of Abortion, do you know the true purpose of Abortion when started back in the day by liberals?? It was used for the sole purpose to kill off the black population.. And yet here you are in the 21st century and absolutely uneducated about "History". Republicans fought for 100 years for your civil rights. Democrats founded the KKK and the White Knights. Democrats passed Jim Crow laws and they were behind the assassinations of MLK Jr. and Malcolm X. But for some reason, giving you that "Free Stuff" is a whole lot more important to you than the true history of your Party of choice and their "True intentions". Hell, now they are about to start receiving "Free Healthcare" there again, paid by the Tax Payer..

The question is, when will you liberals understand the History you learned in school and understand that History repeats itself time and time again.

 

[CaféAuLait]

Yes I am aware other people were enslaved. What does this have to do with reparations for African Americans?

Obviously you missed the point entirely. Not to mention that at first you said it was other countries who enslaved white. It was the colonies as well. My point was quite simple as Gates pointed out Blacks, not only enslaved other blacks they also enslaved whites. Of course the reverse holds true and in greater numbers for whites.

If you wish to pay reparations then, they all must be paid. Blacks must repay blacks they enslaved and the whites they enslaved. Whites must repay blacks.

Now you need to find ONLY those families who were proven to have held slaves, which means whites and blacks need to PAY former black and white slaves.

This means Obama and his daughters since he and they are descendants of slave owners NEED to pay repatriations.

As I said before it is convoluted, everyone ancestry is so mixed up now, it would be impossible to find those responsible. No one who has entered the US since slavery was abolished should be required to pay a cent.

As for your 40 acres and a Mule argument. First, a mule was never mentioned, secondly, when Sherman decreed those freedmen marching with him needed land, this was a temporary solution for those marching with Sherman. He himself said it was a temporary solution for those misplaced marching with him.

Third, when congress did get involved the deal was for freedmen to PAY reduced rent for a period of three years until they could pay the correct price for the land after a three year period of time.

I have no problem with all people that were enslaved being paid reparations. If you can locate the whites that had ancestors that were enslaved have at it. They are not my concern nor did they suffer the generations of slavery Black people endured. I'm speaking strictly about Black people. Other people can represent their own ethnicity.

Yes the forty acres and a mule did include a mule. Why do you think it was named that? However that is just another diversionary tactic. Lets stick to the point. Without that failed promise the US is still on the hook for back wages plus interest. The slaves were never compensated. The US owes. Disagree if you must but you have not shown anything that would invalidate the debt.

( emphasis added)

You are wrong, again.

Special Field Order Number 15, a temporary plan granting each freed family 40 acres of land on the islands and coastal region of Georgia.

It NEVER mentioned a mule. Later troops lent mules to sharecroppers. The order never said a thing about mules and was meant to be strictly temporary.

From Henry Louis Gates Jr again ( and also evident in Special Field Order No. 15 written by Sherman) there was NO language ordering a mule.

We have been taught in school that the source of the policy of "40 acres and a mule" was Union General William T. Sherman's Special Field Order No. 15, issued on Jan. 16, 1865. (That account is half-right: Sherman prescribed the 40 acres in that Order, but not the mule.

40 Acres and a Mule Promise to Slaves: The Real Story - The Root

Again, such was NEVER promised by congress, but Sherman which was written by Sherman and was meant to be a temporary fix for those freedmen misplaced marching with Sherman.

You have not addressed the Obama's needing to pay reparations since both Michelle and Barack's decedents owned slaves.

Additionally, you can sit there and argue reparations are due for slavery. If that is the case, then it should be owed to each and every slave, white, black, orange, pink and purple.

If you demand fairness on how this country was built then ALL decedents of slave owners must equally PAY money to include the President and his family since their decedents owned slaves.

You say the "US is on the Hook", if you want equality then you can't demand that blacks only are paid and whites, Romani, Irish, etc. need to fight their own battle. The US would be on the hook to ALL slaves of any color. Since ALL slaves built and made this great nation according to you.

FYI a little trivia. Were you aware this "40 acres and a Mule " as tackled by congress, also meant white southern unionists as well?

 

[MaryL]

Many Black African tribes along with Arabic traders have been largely responsible for trading to the Europeans for slavery, ya know. How about that? In fact, I posit; Slavery was a African issue Americans inherited, something, granted, we never should have. But reparations ? No soup for YOU. Life isn’t and has never been fair. Please.

 

[freedombecki]

People in the US owned slaves against the tenets of the constitution. It was allowed and laws were made to enable this. The US is at fault for allowing this. Please tell me you are aware of this? Your claims of whining only make your position weak. Please try and be logical not emotional.

People in the US owned slaves

You should go after those people then.

Your claims of whining only make your position weak.

Your whining does not make my position weak. Or your position strong.

Thats correct people in the US owned slaves. The government allowed this and profited by it. I dont need to go after anyone. Reparations are to be paid by the government for allowing it and profiting from it. Besides you could not afford to pay even one person by yourself.

Your claims of whining show how weak your position is and how strong mine is. Only people with no argument resort to the whining claim. its a useful tool to use in order to get someone off the point. Fail.

Nobody today owned any slaves. Our parents did not own slaves our grand parents did not own slaves.

Why should I be enslaved by taxes to pay you?

I owe you exactly nothing.

 

[IlarMeilyr]

Expecting an honest, logical or fact-driven "argument" from AssClapius is like expecting coherence and rationality in a "discussion" between Joe Biden and a certain very "liberal" but utterly incoherent member of the USMB family whose username is presently out of bounds in large bold pink font....