Slavery reparations?

[protectionist]

Based on a test designed by a white guy. Everyone else knows its BS.

Are you saying black people have to have a different test to pass in order for it to be fair? Is that honestly what you are saying?

I'm saying the present test is not a true measure of intelligence. No one can test that unless you can ID all the factors that go into getting the right answer. You may be interested to know the test was modeled on the research of a known eugenicist. How can you tell me I am less intelligent because I resent a question on your test that white people dont find offensive?

Very easily. IQ tests have to do with KNOWLEDGE, not what is or isn't offensive. Any more little BS ploys you'd like to try to pass here ?

 

[Foxfyre]

Are you saying black people have to have a different test to pass in order for it to be fair? Is that honestly what you are saying?

I'm saying the present test is not a true measure of intelligence. No one can test that unless you can ID all the factors that go into getting the right answer. You may be interested to know the test was modeled on the research of a known eugenicist. How can you tell me I am less intelligent because I resent a question on your test that white people dont find offensive?

Very easily. IQ tests have to do with KNOWLEDGE, not what is or isn't offensive. Any more little BS ploys you'd like to try to pass here ?

Actually competent IQ tests are designed specifically to avoid cultural or language biases and measure ability to reason critically and do problem solving. Those administered by a skilled technician are probably the most accurate as some could be skewed by differences in reading comprehension skills; i.e. a Frenchman or Mexican whose second language is English might not score as highly on a test administered in English and he/she would score on one administered in his own language.

In my opinion, a large number of special ed kids are there purely because of reading dysfunction and not because they aren't as bright as 'normal' kids.

 

[Unkotare]

I'm saying the present test is not a true measure of intelligence. No one can test that unless you can ID all the factors that go into getting the right answer. You may be interested to know the test was modeled on the research of a known eugenicist. How can you tell me I am less intelligent because I resent a question on your test that white people dont find offensive?

Very easily. IQ tests have to do with KNOWLEDGE, not what is or isn't offensive. Any more little BS ploys you'd like to try to pass here ?

Actually competent IQ tests are designed specifically to avoid cultural or language biases and measure ability to reason critically and do problem solving. Those administered by a skilled technician are probably the most accurate as some could be skewed by differences in reading comprehension skills; i.e. a Frenchman or Mexican whose second language is English might not score as highly on a test administered in English and he/she would score on one administered in his own language.

In my opinion, a large number of special ed kids are there purely because of reading dysfunction and not because they aren't as bright as 'normal' kids.

If there are different skill levels between technicians, that would also factor into the results.

 

[freedombecki]

I just read it. It clearly specifies that since the payment is being made there is a expiration date. The question I asked you was if the payment was not paid out would a descendant be disallowed from claiming it? The payment was made so no one can now come and make a claim. The ex-slaves reparations payments were never made. Therefore any reparations granted would go to descendents just like in the case of the Japanese.

Well no, that's not what it says. It specifies that only immediate children, spouses and parents are included. An amendment in 1992 added non-asian spouses to the compensation list. Nothing anywhere about descendants. And there's also a cut off date. And out of 120,000 people interned, only 81,000 or so were compensated. $20K payout. No interest mentioned. The word "descendant" doesn't appear once. Sorry.

The Bible says that the sins of the fathers shall be visited upon the children even unto the fourth and fifth generations. Interpretation: what happens in previous generations can have very long term consequences..

The problem when it comes to reparations is who owes somebody else a debt? Again, I lost ancesters in a war that freed the slaves. I had no ancesters who had any part in enslaving anybody. So should I be held liable and be required to help pay reparations for people living now, almost 150 years after that war ended? Or should black people be required to compensate me for what happened to my ancesters on their behalf?

Ascepias said if a person can prove he descended from slaves he should be compensated. But by whom?

The black Africans who captured and sold people into slavery?
The British slave traders?
Those who bought or inherited the slaves in Mexico? Canada? The USA? Elsewhere including black people who owned slaves?
And should those black people who did not descend from slaves be required to pay reparations for those who did?

It all becomes quite absurd after awhile. And I think is perpetuated by silly greedy people, both black and white, who just want others to pay whether deserved or not.

The people who made a profit off of selling their own constituents to slavers with ships actually were just using them to avoid genocides that still go on today of one tribe killing off as many members of the rival tribes in the region as they can. It's a culture of murder and genocide. Those who purchased slaves over here may have been informed of that and decided it was safer to keep slaves for generations rather than letting people with the ingrained practice of murdering "other tribes" lest they turn on whites and view their former owners as "enemies."

Oh, my goodness. Obama called Republicans his "enemies," and even saying they should sit on the back of the bus. The more the print presses run, the more the tabloid foamer journalists make. Does remembering him saying that make me a racist?

[ame=http://youtu.be/z0YH6UQNbBo]Obama Racism. Calls Republicans "Enemies" & says that "they can ride in the BACK" (of the Car)! - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Pop23]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

 

[Asclepias]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

No. Enough is not said. The poll is a reflection of what side people choose. It has nothing to do with the merit of the argument for or against reparations. No one has come close to putting a dent in the arguments for reparations. Everyone against just has some vague comments about things that have nothing to do with the facts.

 

[flacaltenn]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

No. Enough is not said. The poll is a reflection of what side people choose. It has nothing to do with the merit of the argument for or against reparations. No one has come close to putting a dent in the arguments for reparations. Everyone against just has some vague comments about things that have nothing to do with the facts.

Hows about ..... ??

Reparations would be like allowing a convicted murderer to collect $2Mill for an autobiography as long as the proceeds go to the victims. Are the victims gonna forgive and forget? Are they GLAD his story got a brand new movie to open their wounds?

All the purposes it serves are token and does not serve to provide relief to the original victims. And no relief from the grief is realized by anyone.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

He doesn't care that it would never get enough votes to be passed into law.
He'll just keep whining.

 

[Asclepias]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

No. Enough is not said. The poll is a reflection of what side people choose. It has nothing to do with the merit of the argument for or against reparations. No one has come close to putting a dent in the arguments for reparations. Everyone against just has some vague comments about things that have nothing to do with the facts.

Hows about ..... ??

Reparations would be like allowing a convicted murderer to collect $2Mill for an autobiography as long as the proceeds go to the victims. Are the victims gonna forgive and forget? Are they GLAD his story got a brand new movie to open their wounds?

All the purposes it serves are token and does not serve to provide relief to the original victims. And no relief from the grief is realized by anyone.

Not quite getting your analogy. Who is the convicted murder in this and why is he receiving 2 million dollars? The purpose of reparations would be token as well as provide real assets denied by the withholding of reparations. The victims will never forget but reparations would go a long way towards seeing that real progress is desired.

 

[Asclepias]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

He doesn't care that it would never get enough votes to be passed into law.
He'll just keep whining.

Dont call it whining it is a debt owed. Would you call it whining if you were not paid for the work you did?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

He doesn't care that it would never get enough votes to be passed into law.
He'll just keep whining.

Dont call it whining it is a debt owed. Would you call it whining if you were not paid for the work you did?

You worked as a slave?
Just how old are you?

 

[S.J.]

He doesn't care that it would never get enough votes to be passed into law.
He'll just keep whining.

Dont call it whining it is a debt owed. Would you call it whining if you were not paid for the work you did?

You worked as a slave?
Just how old are you?

I doubt if he's ever worked as anything.

 

[Pop23]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

No. Enough is not said. The poll is a reflection of what side people choose. It has nothing to do with the merit of the argument for or against reparations. No one has come close to putting a dent in the arguments for reparations. Everyone against just has some vague comments about things that have nothing to do with the facts.

92 of 101 would disagree with you

But you knew that

 

[Asclepias]

Since this is a poll we might just want to look at how effective the arguments have been

Against reparations: 92
For reparations: 9

Enough said?

No. Enough is not said. The poll is a reflection of what side people choose. It has nothing to do with the merit of the argument for or against reparations. No one has come close to putting a dent in the arguments for reparations. Everyone against just has some vague comments about things that have nothing to do with the facts.

92 of 101 would disagree with you

But you knew that

92 of 101 on this board. Out of those 92 that oppose how many are Black? That would be interesting to find out. My guess is maybe 2-5 lost souls. But you probably knew that and realized that doesnt impress me at all.

 

[Pop23]

No. Enough is not said. The poll is a reflection of what side people choose. It has nothing to do with the merit of the argument for or against reparations. No one has come close to putting a dent in the arguments for reparations. Everyone against just has some vague comments about things that have nothing to do with the facts.

92 of 101 would disagree with you

But you knew that

92 of 101 on this board. Out of those 92 that oppose how many are Black? That would be interesting to find out. My guess is maybe 2-5 lost souls. But you probably knew that and realized that doesnt impress me at all.

How many whites voted for Obama?

hmmmmmm

 

[Asclepias]

92 of 101 would disagree with you

But you knew that

92 of 101 on this board. Out of those 92 that oppose how many are Black? That would be interesting to find out. My guess is maybe 2-5 lost souls. But you probably knew that and realized that doesnt impress me at all.

How many whites voted for Obama?

hmmmmmm

What does that have to do with this poll? Are you topic surfing again?

 

[flacaltenn]

No. Enough is not said. The poll is a reflection of what side people choose. It has nothing to do with the merit of the argument for or against reparations. No one has come close to putting a dent in the arguments for reparations. Everyone against just has some vague comments about things that have nothing to do with the facts.

Hows about ..... ??

Reparations would be like allowing a convicted murderer to collect $2Mill for an autobiography as long as the proceeds go to the victims. Are the victims gonna forgive and forget? Are they GLAD his story got a brand new movie to open their wounds?

All the purposes it serves are token and does not serve to provide relief to the original victims. And no relief from the grief is realized by anyone.

Not quite getting your analogy. Who is the convicted murder in this and why is he receiving 2 million dollars? The purpose of reparations would be token as well as provide real assets denied by the withholding of reparations. The victims will never forget but reparations would go a long way towards seeing that real progress is desired.

The analogy is ackward, but it works. Usually a convicted murderer is as naturally destitute as Uncle Sam. Both are only allowed to raise money for noble causes and have no means of support except as prescribed by the law. So if a convict raises money by selling his story, the proceeds must go to the victims. That means that Uncle Sam would have to legally justify the appropriation in terms of its ability to raise money from its Constitutional allowance to tax. You didnt think the money would come from the Confederacy did ya?

I think its problematic to go tell recent Russian immigrants that Uncle Sam just decided to intentionally lose a judgement over a 200 yr old debt. So they have to pony up for what CONSTITUTIONAL reason???

What I find most interesting about your comment is your belief that all reparations would accomplish is to show a desire to repent. And that say $10Bill would be nothing but an opening to a real apology. THAT is gonna be an impossible sell. Your expectation should be to ask for whatever amount would end the grief and hurt. Or like the bereaved family, taking the movie royalty money from the crappile that killed their kin, maybe there's no amount of money that will fix the grief in the first place and they rather not see the murder story win an OSCAR.

 

[Asclepias]

Hows about ..... ??

Reparations would be like allowing a convicted murderer to collect $2Mill for an autobiography as long as the proceeds go to the victims. Are the victims gonna forgive and forget? Are they GLAD his story got a brand new movie to open their wounds?

All the purposes it serves are token and does not serve to provide relief to the original victims. And no relief from the grief is realized by anyone.

Not quite getting your analogy. Who is the convicted murder in this and why is he receiving 2 million dollars? The purpose of reparations would be token as well as provide real assets denied by the withholding of reparations. The victims will never forget but reparations would go a long way towards seeing that real progress is desired.

The analogy is ackward, but it works. Usually a convicted murderer is as naturally destitute as Uncle Sam. Both are only allowed to raise money for noble causes and have no means of support except as prescribed by the law. So if a convict raises money by selling his story, the proceeds must go to the victims. That means that Uncle Sam would have to legally justify the appropriation in terms of its ability to raise money from its Constitutional allowance to tax. You didnt think the money would come from the Confederacy did ya?

I think its problematic to go tell recent Russian immigrants that Uncle Sam just decided to intentionally lose a judgement over a 200 yr old debt. So they have to pony up for what CONSTITUTIONAL reason???

What I find most interesting about your comment is your belief that all reparations would accomplish is to show a desire to repent. And that say $10Bill would be nothing but an opening to a real apology. THAT is gonna be an impossible sell. Your expectation should be to ask for whatever amount would end the grief and hurt. Or like the bereaved family, taking the movie royalty money from the crappile that killed their kin, maybe there's no amount of money that will fix the grief in the first place and they rather not see the murder story win an OSCAR.

OK. The convict part was throwing me off as you are correct they are usually destitute. In this case Uncle Sam is hardly destitute, has never been sentenced, and never even convicted. I would describe Uncle Sam more like Bernie Madoff before he was caught.

It may be problematic to tell your new Russian immigrant that his taxes are going to pay for a 200 year old debt that was never paid but I think most rational people would understand a debt is a debt until its paid. I think they would be ok with part of the initiation fee they were going to be paying anyway is going to pay that debt. They dont seem to have a problem with paying for wars.

I didnt say thats all reparations would do. There would be some real economic benefit to not only the descendants of the ex-slaves but also the US itself would naturally recoup that money in the form of a better economy due to increased spending in the Black sector. The part that would be most valuable is the trust it would build in the Black community. Most Black people do not trust whites to do what is right to put it simply. That is a big source of contention. Looking at the excuses against reparations bears that out. To most Blacks its pretty simple. Our ancestors worked and made this nation a economic power. The money those ancestors should have been paid for just that aspect is glaringly obvious. The attempts to trivialize the subsequent effects of slavery on the Black condition also builds large barriers. You are correct in saying there really is no amount large enough but a good faith gesture of a reasonable amount would show an attempt to rectify the wrong.

 

[Imperious]

There is no doubt that slavery was a horrific act committed by sick individuals, but, I dont think that this necessarily means we should have to financially repararend something that happened 100 years ago! Anyone who is still alive in our currently, had no direct hand in slavery, therefore, why should we have to be the ones paying? Also, only a small portion of people owned slaves, its not like the whole Eastern Seaboard had hundreds upon hundreds of slaves, I think that this topic is commonly over exaggerated, especially in regard to the amount of slaves there were.

 

[Meathead]

I think reparations for slavery are a wonderful idea. I hope a groundswell of support builds and it gets included in the 2015 Democrat platform. That would be fun to watch!