The Trinity

[AllieBaba]

Then GOD's given us an operating manual that must have lost a LOT in the translation.

No, it hasn't. The bible remains under God's control, and as such is as true today as when it was written. This is another miracle of God, and is backed up, actually, by archaeologists and historians who study the ancient texts and the history of them.

Nor does the Bible contradict itself, if one understands fully the history and different aspects from which different writers were approaching the same history.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You are aware that the Book Of Mormon is NOT a replacement for the Bible? That it is simply a work from the America's when Jesus visited America after Israel? You are aware that Mormons believe in and support the King James Bible?

You may want to check some of your "facts".

You are also aware that the Bible speaks of other religious works from God? Other books?

Joseph Smith was visited by an Angel and given the scriptures that are in the Book of Mormon. No one in the Church has ever claimed the Bible is corrupted. You may want to read the Bible a bit. God needed to restore the Church, that would include providing a prophet so that he could return to providing Divine Guidance.

Now there ARE corrupted forms of the Bible out there. But the Mormon Church does not believe the real Bible, the King James Version, is corrupted.

 

[Eightball]

You are aware that the Book Of Mormon is NOT a replacement for the Bible? That it is simply a work from the America's when Jesus visited America after Israel? You are aware that Mormons believe in and support the King James Bible?

Totally, refuted, by archeologists and historians, and you know it. There is no basis for this claim accept through false prophets of the LDS church. DNA refutes A. Indians lost tribe connection too. You are astute enough to know that too.
You may want to check some of your "facts".

You are also aware that the Bible speaks of other religious works from God? Other books?

Joseph Smith was visited by an Angel and given the scriptures that are in the Book of Mormon. No one in the Church has ever claimed the Bible is corrupted. You may want to read the Bible a bit. God needed to restore the Church, that would include providing a prophet so that he could return to providing Divine Guidance.

Now there ARE corrupted forms of the Bible out there. But the Mormon Church does not believe the real Bible, the King James Version, is corrupted.

All based on the teachings of a questionable character named Joseph Smith Jr.

 

[Care4all]

Why again would he tell them to "ALSO" trust in him, if he is in fact God? He already told them to trust in God.

He's trying to explain to them that he is one and the same, ret sgt....sheesh, you are being dense...and Jesus was crucified because he clained TO BE GOD....

Jesus continually was trying to tell the diciples that He and God were one....in a manner that they as humans, would understand....

you say NOTHING on the passages where Jesus STATES he and God are one and the same....why not? What's your rewriting, as I see it, of that ret sgt?

If the Word is God, what does the "Word made flesh" mean to you?

What does, jesus saying that he is I AM, mean to you?

What does, I am THE way, THE truth, and THE light mean to you? He's not just "telling" the truth...He IS the truth, he's not just "showing" the way...He IS the way, He's not just "illuminating" light...He IS the light....THOSE are attributes of God.*

you are restricting God's capabilities....why? you are excluding ALL Bible passages that shows and states Jesus is God, manifested in the flesh...as a human....as a messiah, so that we may understand...

care

 

[sethdingas]

There are some things the human mind will never be able to conceive, the Trinity being one of them. For the Trinity is One, the Father Almighty, but is also three separate identities. Jesus is God in human form. This is how God reveals Himself. The Holy Spirit is the revelation of God and His Son to humanity. The deliverer of His Grace, if you will. (i.e. The birth of our Savior through the Virgin Mary.) The Trinity is said to be the "central mystery of Christian Faith and life", therefore, to believe in the Trinity is to call yourself a Christian, for it takes Faith to believe. The human mind will never fully understand this mystery. "The Trinity is a mystery of faith in the strict sense, one of the mysteries that are hidden in God, which can never be known unless they are revealed by God."

 

[Care4all]

There are some things the human mind will never be able to conceive, the Trinity being one of them. For the Trinity is One, the Father Almighty, but is also three separate identities. Jesus is God in human form. This is how God reveals Himself. The Holy Spirit is the revelation of God and His Son to humanity. The deliverer of His Grace, if you will. (i.e. The birth of our Savior through the Virgin Mary.) The Trinity is said to be the "central mystery of Christian Faith and life", therefore, to believe in the Trinity is to call yourself a Christian, for it takes Faith to believe. The human mind will never fully understand this mystery. "The Trinity is a mystery of faith in the strict sense, one of the mysteries that are hidden in God, which can never be known unless they are revealed by God."

hi! welcome to the site! don't just post on this and run, please... , stick around!

care

 

[sethdingas]

hi! welcome to the site! don't just post on this and run, please... , stick around!

care

I wasn't planning on leaving!

 

[Care4all]

I wasn't planning on leaving!

Good! Ret sgt is arguing this argument with the rest of the board, one against us all...he is also not online all the time, he will come back with a rebuttle, just give it a few...fyi.

Care

 

[stivex]

If Jesus was a form of God, then why would he ask why his Father had forsaken him on the cross?

Not to change the subject, but to hear the ignorance of the anti-religious on this thread is dumbfounding. I am amazed at how little many understand about religion.

 

[sethdingas]

If Jesus was a form of God, then why would he ask why his Father had forsaken him on the cross?

Not to change the subject, but to hear the ignorance of the anti-religious on this thread is dumbfounding. I am amazed at how little many understand about religion.

I'm not anti-religious and I know much about Christianity, but to answer your question like I stated earlier in the thread, Jesus and God are the same, but also different identities. Just as you have your father's blood, but you are two different people.

 

[stivex]

Then GOD's given us an operating manual that must have lost a LOT in the translation.

Read up on free will. God cares, but won't make us follow Him. We are given the choice. How we live our lives determines how we exist in the afterlife. No, we don't need to be saints. We can get forgiven and absolved of our sins. We only need to sincerely ask for it. That is about as simple as I can explain it.

 

[Eightball]

If Jesus was a form of God, then why would he ask why his Father had forsaken him on the cross?

Not to change the subject, but to hear the ignorance of the anti-religious on this thread is dumbfounding. I am amazed at how little many understand about religion.

The "foresaken" element of Jesus' humanity was His/Jesus experiencing in full God's judgement upon mankind for their sins/rebellion.

Jesus never stopped being God incarnate, but voluntarily gave up His Godly powers to experience fully humanity in the flesh, body/soul/spirit.

To be the "perfect" sacrifice or propitiation for mankinds sin, Jesus had to endure, "fully" God's wrath, eternal separation, judgement that was intended for the human race, and every human being individually.

Being foresaken was experiencing total separation from God the Father. Only God Himself could go through this and be victorious in the end..........The ressurrection/ and ascension of Christ being the result.

Again as another poster mentioned a few posts back, we humans with our finite minds can't possibly figure out through any kind of imagery or thought processes what this all entailed. Suffice it to say, it just plain happened according to scripture.

Jesus experienced total, eternal separation from the Father. Yet, now He/Jesus sits at the right hand of God in Heaven. The Holy Spirit was sent by Jesus as the guaranter/confirmation of those that are sealed or saved through faith in Christ's work on the cross in their "stead". This process of salvation through faith continues to this day; nearly 2,000 years since Jesus' ascension.

 

[Care4all]

it's like a flock of birds that are freezing to death out side in sub zero weather/storm....a man sees this and opens his heated barn's doors to let them in, so that they would be safe and warm....but none in the flock understood what the man was trying to show them, and they stayed outside of the barn instead of in the safety of it....the man is so distraught to see the birds dying off, one by one.

he dispairingly watches the birds and WISHES he could turn himself in to a bird in that flock....SO THAT he could show them the WAY to life, to safety.....

take this anology, and substitute the man with God, and the flock with humans, and turning himself in to a bird, Jesus, to show the confused birds the way or us, in to the barn....in to life or safety.

care

 

[sethdingas]

it's like a flock of birds that are freezing to death out side in sub zero weather/storm....a man sees this and opens his heated barn's doors to let them in, so that they would be safe and warm....but none in the flock understood what the man was trying to show them, and they stayed outside of the barn instead of in the safety of it....the man is so distraught to see the birds dying off, one by one.

he dispairingly watches the birds and WISHES he could turn himself in to a bird in that flock....SO THAT he could show them the WAY to life, to safety.....

take this anology, and substitute the man with God, and the flock with humans, and turning himself in to a bird, Jesus, to show the confused birds the way or us, in to the barn....in to life or safety.

care

Nicely put. I never thought of it that way.

 

[Eightball]

it's like a flock of birds that are freezing to death out side in sub zero weather/storm....a man sees this and opens his heated barn's doors to let them in, so that they would be safe and warm....but none in the flock understood what the man was trying to show them, and they stayed outside of the barn instead of in the safety of it....the man is so distraught to see the birds dying off, one by one.

he dispairingly watches the birds and WISHES he could turn himself in to a bird in that flock....SO THAT he could show them the WAY to life, to safety.....

take this anology, and substitute the man with God, and the flock with humans, and turning himself in to a bird, Jesus, to show the confused birds the way or us, in to the barn....in to life or safety.

care

Very good way of putting it!

I'll remember that if someone raises a question to me where I could apply that example.

 

[AllieBaba]

If Jesus was a form of God, then why would he ask why his Father had forsaken him on the cross?

Not to change the subject, but to hear the ignorance of the anti-religious on this thread is dumbfounding. I am amazed at how little many understand about religion.

Because he was in pain and anguished. He also said for his father's will to be done.

 

[Eightball]

Because he was in pain and anguished. He also said for his father's will to be done.

Also, being, "Foresaken" was just that. He/Jesus did indeed experience being "foresaken".

Many even have mentioned that "Hell" is being totally separated from God.............Something to ponder?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

He's trying to explain to them that he is one and the same, ret sgt....sheesh, you are being dense...and Jesus was crucified because he clained TO BE GOD....

Jesus continually was trying to tell the diciples that He and God were one....in a manner that they as humans, would understand....

you say NOTHING on the passages where Jesus STATES he and God are one and the same....why not? What's your rewriting, as I see it, of that ret sgt?

If the Word is God, what does the "Word made flesh" mean to you?

What does, jesus saying that he is I AM, mean to you?

What does, I am THE way, THE truth, and THE light mean to you? He's not just "telling" the truth...He IS the truth, he's not just "showing" the way...He IS the way, He's not just "illuminating" light...He IS the light....THOSE are attributes of God.*

you are restricting God's capabilities....why? you are excluding ALL Bible passages that shows and states Jesus is God, manifested in the flesh...as a human....as a messiah, so that we may understand...

care

Jesus never claimed to be his Father. John does not make that claim either.

 

[AllieBaba]

No, Jesus was crucified because he pissed off the pharisees by saying that God was his father, and because he told them the temple would fall. He was crucified because he claimed it was through God that he was able to perform miracles, and that his powers came directly from God his father. He was crucified because people believed him and the pharisees were afraid that the growing numbers of Christians would alarm Romans and bring their wrath down upon them, disturbing the status quo.

 

[Care4all]

Jesus never claimed to be his Father. John does not make that claim either.

he is a part of the Father or God, made in the flesh....made to feel and function and interact as we do....so that we could understand his love for us, on human terms....in terms of the flesh and spiritually.