The Truth about Mormons

[Avatar4321]

Naw, I just wondered why anyone was still harping on it after the "Mormon Moment" had passed...

If you think that was the end of the Mormon Moment, you haven't seen anything yet.

 

[Avatar4321]

the book of Mormon is complete fiction, it's far too much like the king James version of the bible to be anything else.
no matter what Mormons claims no one ever saw the plates with their own eyes (spiritual eye does not count)

15 eyewitnesses would disagree with you. As would I.

there were no eyewitnesses the 15 you're talking about saw it with their spiritual eye.

SUMMARY

· It is believed that Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon Statement for the witnesses and induced them to sign.

· Smith knew that none of the witnesses had ever seen the plates with their natural eyes, yet worded the statement as if they had.

· Historical accounts reveal that the three witnesses never saw the gold plates with their natural eyes. They were always covered with a cloth.

· The witnesses were pressured to conjure up their own personal vision after Smith intimidated and hounded them over their lack of faith. They finally envisioned the plates in an “empty” box.

· All of the witnesses were manipulated and pressured by Smith into seeing something that didn’t physically exist, because they believed he was a Prophet of God.

· The gold plates the eight witnesses later claimed to heft in such a casual manner, would have been impossible because of the weight. This suggests that some other kind of plates were provided by Smith.

· That Smith forged false plates with inscriptions, was stated by John C. Bennett and Sarah Pratt, wife of Apostle Orson Pratt.

· All three witnesses, plus many of the eight, left the church and embraced another faith.

· The testimony of the witnesses in their old age, proved to be embellished and exaggerated.

*Copyright 2003 - 2009. This article cannot be copied and used in a professional publication without express permission of the author.



The Three Witnesses to the Gold Plates: www.janishutchinson.com

Wow. going to extremes to discredit the witnesses.

Considering 2 of the 3 witnesses died members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the Third one contacted the press to reaffirm his testimony of seeing the plates before he died, your claims that the left the Church and "Embraced" other faiths is a bit exagerated, don't you think?

Personally, I think the fact that all three of the 3 witnesses spent some time away from the Church and yet still continued to affirm their testimony despite hardship makes them more credible and not elss. Heck, Oliver lost multiple political elections because he wouldn't deny His testimony of the Book of Mormon, despite not being in the Church at the time. And the personal letters between David and Oliver made it clear they still affirmed their testimony. After Joseph's death Oliver even suggest to David that he still had his priesthood and keys (not knowing that Hyrum had replaced him as Second Elder0.

They all seem like very odd things to do if "Joseph tricked them" and they didn't actually see anything.

But hey, if that's what you are going to support, it's your right. I've just studied the witnesses and your claims don't match up with first hand info I've seen.

 

[Avatar4321]

If mormonism was the real truth, we'd all be mormons. So how come we're not?

Because you havent studied the Book of Mormon and gotten on your knees to ask the Lord if i was true.

 

[Avatar4321]

Uncensored cannot even tell anyone what the message of King Benjamin is about.

Stop your lying, peanut.

While i certainly commend you in your defense, I am not convinced that you know what the message of King Benjamin is about, per several of our discussions. Though I think you have actually read it

 

[JoeB131]

Naw, I just wondered why anyone was still harping on it after the "Mormon Moment" had passed...

If you think that was the end of the Mormon Moment, you haven't seen anything yet.

Oh, I think that your cult is already starting to fade, thanks to the fact that the internet is informing more of your dumb sheep about what Joseph Smith really did...

 

[JoeB131]

If mormonism was the real truth, we'd all be mormons. So how come we're not?

Because you havent studied the Book of Mormon and gotten on your knees to ask the Lord if i was true.

Well, the thing is so horribly written that most people find it unreadable....

"exceedingly" badly written, in fact.

The last time I asked the Sky Pixie for anything was to cure my mom's cancer.

Then she died and I realized no one is listening to those prayers, so I don't waste my time with them.

 

[JoeB131]

I was just wandering around in the Religion and Ethics section and spotted this incredible thread !

Of course I haven't read all 422 pages of posts.....but kudos to "Truthspeaker" for hanging in there all that time and answering and explaining thngs about Mormonism (even though disappearing here and there...you came back).

I'm kind of basically Protestant, but have no issues with the Mormon version of Christianity.
I think it's deplorable that the Southern Baptist Convention teaches that it is a cult.
They are Soo mistaken.

Anyway, thanks, Truthspeaker......well done.

Sorry, I'm an atheist, and I think Mormonism is a cult.

The difference between a cult and a religion is that a cult seeks to control every aspect of their members lives.

So let's see. Mandetory Missionary work, Magic Underwear, Tithing, requiring people to recite their testimony on demand, shunning family members if they leave the faith.

Cult.

 

[ima]

If mormonism was the real truth, we'd all be mormons. So how come we're not?

Because you havent studied the Book of Mormon and gotten on your knees to ask the Lord if i was true.

Sure I did, I got no response. Could it be because I was laughing most of the way through?

 

[Avatar4321]

Naw, I just wondered why anyone was still harping on it after the "Mormon Moment" had passed...

If you think that was the end of the Mormon Moment, you haven't seen anything yet.

Oh, I think that your cult is already starting to fade, thanks to the fact that the internet is informing more of your dumb sheep about what Joseph Smith really did...

yeah, but we've already established that your depiction of reality is questionable.

 

[Avatar4321]

If mormonism was the real truth, we'd all be mormons. So how come we're not?

Because you havent studied the Book of Mormon and gotten on your knees to ask the Lord if i was true.

Well, the thing is so horribly written that most people find it unreadable....

"exceedingly" badly written, in fact.

The last time I asked the Sky Pixie for anything was to cure my mom's cancer.

Then she died and I realized no one is listening to those prayers, so I don't waste my time with them.

Considering how clear it is, it sounds like you're just making excuses for your lack of effort.

 

[Avatar4321]

I was just wandering around in the Religion and Ethics section and spotted this incredible thread !

Of course I haven't read all 422 pages of posts.....but kudos to "Truthspeaker" for hanging in there all that time and answering and explaining thngs about Mormonism (even though disappearing here and there...you came back).

I'm kind of basically Protestant, but have no issues with the Mormon version of Christianity.
I think it's deplorable that the Southern Baptist Convention teaches that it is a cult.
They are Soo mistaken.

Anyway, thanks, Truthspeaker......well done.

Sorry, I'm an atheist, and I think Mormonism is a cult.

The difference between a cult and a religion is that a cult seeks to control every aspect of their members lives.

So let's see. Mandetory Missionary work, Magic Underwear, Tithing, requiring people to recite their testimony on demand, shunning family members if they leave the faith.

Cult.

There, again, demonstrates your ignorance. No one is shunned. Quite the opposite, critics like yourself likewise claim we don't leave people alone. No one is forced to recite their testimony, in fact, no one is forced to do anything. People share their testimony because its meaningful to them. There is nothing magical about anyone's underwear and the obsession some of you critics have with underwear is a bit creepy. The so called mandatory missionary work is still the choice of anyone who does it.

 

[Avatar4321]

If mormonism was the real truth, we'd all be mormons. So how come we're not?

Because you havent studied the Book of Mormon and gotten on your knees to ask the Lord if i was true.

Sure I did, I got no response. Could it be because I was laughing most of the way through?

And your mocking just demonstrates that you didnt bother doing it. You think it's a joke, which is why you won't ever get an answer. You dont bother trying and if you ever are, you aren't sincere. You think God is going to answer someone actively mocking Him?

 

[LittleNipper]

One needs to compare the the writing within the Bible to those of the book of Mormon. If there is confusion, and since God is not the author of confusion, and Jesus fully supported the Bible, then one must conclude that the book of Mormon is counterfeit.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Uncensored cannot even tell anyone what the message of King Benjamin is about.

Stop your lying, peanut.

While i certainly commend you in your defense, I am not convinced that you know what the message of King Benjamin is about, per several of our discussions. Though I think you have actually read it

I fully understand it. Sat down with a Stake Presidency counselor a couple of years ago, and he agrees that the fusion of theocracy and religion are complete. The people were commanded to attend and to follow their prophet king's direction.

My LDS friends here in Utah, many of whom work in the JBS and CHL, agree that your libertarian interpretation is in error. As long as you don't defy LDS teaching publicly, you are not in heresy. If you do, are corrected, and refuse to recant, then you are in a state of apostasy.

I hope it does not go that far.

 

[ima]

One needs to compare the the writing within the Bible to those of the book of Mormon. If there is confusion, and since God is not the author of confusion, and Jesus fully supported the Bible, then one must conclude that the book of Mormon is counterfeit.

I thought god created everything?

 

[daws101]

15 eyewitnesses would disagree with you. As would I.

there were no eyewitnesses the 15 you're talking about saw it with their spiritual eye.

SUMMARY

· It is believed that Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon Statement for the witnesses and induced them to sign.

· Smith knew that none of the witnesses had ever seen the plates with their natural eyes, yet worded the statement as if they had.

· Historical accounts reveal that the three witnesses never saw the gold plates with their natural eyes. They were always covered with a cloth.

· The witnesses were pressured to conjure up their own personal vision after Smith intimidated and hounded them over their lack of faith. They finally envisioned the plates in an “empty” box.

· All of the witnesses were manipulated and pressured by Smith into seeing something that didn’t physically exist, because they believed he was a Prophet of God.

· The gold plates the eight witnesses later claimed to heft in such a casual manner, would have been impossible because of the weight. This suggests that some other kind of plates were provided by Smith.

· That Smith forged false plates with inscriptions, was stated by John C. Bennett and Sarah Pratt, wife of Apostle Orson Pratt.

· All three witnesses, plus many of the eight, left the church and embraced another faith.

· The testimony of the witnesses in their old age, proved to be embellished and exaggerated.

*Copyright 2003 - 2009. This article cannot be copied and used in a professional publication without express permission of the author.



The Three Witnesses to the Gold Plates: www.janishutchinson.com

Wow. going to extremes to discredit the witnesses.

Considering 2 of the 3 witnesses died members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the Third one contacted the press to reaffirm his testimony of seeing the plates before he died, your claims that the left the Church and "Embraced" other faiths is a bit exagerated, don't you think?

Personally, I think the fact that all three of the 3 witnesses spent some time away from the Church and yet still continued to affirm their testimony despite hardship makes them more credible and not elss. Heck, Oliver lost multiple political elections because he wouldn't deny His testimony of the Book of Mormon, despite not being in the Church at the time. And the personal letters between David and Oliver made it clear they still affirmed their testimony. After Joseph's death Oliver even suggest to David that he still had his priesthood and keys (not knowing that Hyrum had replaced him as Second Elder0.

They all seem like very odd things to do if "Joseph tricked them" and they didn't actually see anything.

But hey, if that's what you are going to support, it's your right. I've just studied the witnesses and your claims don't match up with first hand info I've seen.

don't need to ,there are no plates (never were) whatever the witnesses BELIEVE they saw or imagined they saw (the spiritual eye) is no evidence of the plates existing.
humans tend to find what they want to find even when it's not there.
I have no doubt they did believe what they imagined they saw, books on human behavior are full of accounts of misidentification.

 

[HUGGY]

It is astonishing how so many people are duped into believeing they will get rewarded for their participation in any religion after they are dead.

You some REALLY STUPID MoFos.

 

[Uncensored2008]

While i certainly commend you in your defense, I am not convinced that you know what the message of King Benjamin is about, per several of our discussions. Though I think you have actually read it

There is nothing for Jakematters to defend. I never "attacked" Mormonism in the first place, and have often defended it from other leftist fools like JoeB.

I am agnostic, but find Mormonism no more ridiculous than other faiths. You already know that Jake is a fraud who engages in deceit. In another thread he is purporting to be a Catholic and speak for that church.

I don't share your faith, but I sure haven't attacked it.

 

[daws101]

It is astonishing how so many people are duped into believeing they will get rewarded for their participation in any religion after they are dead.

You some REALLY STUPID MoFos.

no shit!
you'd think after 2000 or so years people would catch on to the scam.

 

[JakeStarkey]

While i certainly commend you in your defense, I am not convinced that you know what the message of King Benjamin is about, per several of our discussions. Though I think you have actually read it

There is nothing for Jakematters to defend. I never "attacked" Mormonism in the first place, and have often defended it from other leftist fools like JoeB.

I am agnostic, but find Mormonism no more ridiculous than other faiths. You already know that Jake is a fraud who engages in deceit. In another thread he is purporting to be a Catholic and speak for that church.

I don't share your faith, but I sure haven't attacked it.

Uncensored now moves from spamming to lying. Post the link, so I can metaphorically kick your face in there and here. Without the link, you are merely spamming.