The War On Everyday Americans: Why Jobs Are Disappearing, & why universal basic income is our future

[deanrd]

There are currently more jobs than workers.

And they are disappearing?

You mean unskilled labor is being automated.

If you could get Republicans off the opioids and the booze, put them in school, they could get good jobs. They just have to learn to work.

 

[basquebromance]

studies have shown that poor people dont waste money on booze & tobacco, rich people do

 

[basquebromance]

in the darkest days of the Great Depression, FDR gave hope to the forgotten man.

without any irony, the Chamber of Commerce actually said this at the time: "one does not exaggerate to say that, in terms of political influence with respect to legislation and government action, the American business executive is truly the forgotten man"

rich guys just can't catch a break!

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

studies have shown that poor people dont waste money on booze & tobacco, rich people do

My grocery store would tell you different.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

universal basic income is the most ambitious social policy in history.

it eliminates welfare and eliminates poverty at the same time

If used to replace welfare programs, I believe you are correct. Currently our social programs rewards people for irresponsibility and failure while we penalize success. Even if you became more mature and had a change of heart, they already trapped you because you had five kids and nobody to take care of them but government.

 

[Wyatt earp]

There are currently more jobs than workers.

And they are disappearing?

You mean unskilled labor is being automated.

If you could get Republicans off the opioids and the booze, put them in school, they could get good jobs. They just have to learn to work.

So you admit high tax , union statez ran off the jobs to the red States...


✓



.

 

[basquebromance]

UBI is a good idea because Art Laffer thinks its a "Silly idea"

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

a UBI would be cheaper and more effective than what we do now, economically. If you take the total amount we spend on anti-poverty programs and divide by the number of poor people, there should be no poor people!

Poor people aren’t lazy, they’re trapped in the current system. A UBI is not contingent on staying poor, so it would both lift people out of poverty and flatten out the benefits cliff. Of course, this means that the new UBI would be instead of existing programs, rather than a supplement, and not everyone agrees with that.

Finally, there is crude "realpolitik." Plenty of very wealthy people already live in the US, and the new economy is likely to create inequality on steroids. In a democracy, the poor and middle class have many tools to “negotiate” redistribution at gunpoint.

So who is going to pay for this ?

Switzerland did a study on this before they voted on it. It was defeated.

Their calculations were that if they eliminated all social programs, they would actually save money with Universal Income. I don't know much about them, but I'm assuming we have more social programs than they do.

We would still pay the same amount of tax, but it wouldn't be so categorized. In other words, no welfare, no SCHIP's, no Medicare or Medicaid, no Social Security, no HUD, nothing. All the money would be converted for Universal Income instead.

I believe the figure they used was similar to 18K US dollars for each adult citizen.

 

[beagle9]

universal basic income is the most ambitious social policy in history.

it eliminates welfare and eliminates poverty at the same time

If used to replace welfare programs, I believe you are correct. Currently our social programs rewards people for irresponsibility and failure while we penalize success. Even if you became more mature and had a change of heart, they already trapped you because you had five kids and nobody to take care of them but government.

Ray, don't you realize that this is just another way of subsidizing the owners of these companies in so that they can save on labor rates or pay on their employees ??

So let's say x begins getting this basic universal income (BUI), and then x goes to work. Does the BUI continue when person x gets a job or does it stop ??

If it continues, don't you think that companies will work the wages around the BUI ???

Is this something that's wanted by the businesses now also, otherwise for whom are having to lose their cheap labor forces now ??

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Jobs are disappearing? Dang, who knew?

Just good jobs going unfilled because we must save the rich... So we can't afford cheap education and Training....

Good jobs going unfilled to save the rich?? WTF kinda nonsense is that...oh, sorry, you're a fricken lib...never mind.

3 to 6 million good technical jobs are going begging because the GOP blocks cheap training and education for them, all to save the rich from paying taxes, dumbass.

The block is in your head. The GOP never blocked anything. Anybody that wants such training can get it. Take a loan out, work for a few years and save money. But just because taxpayers won't fund it doesn't mean it's blocked except to Commies.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

universal basic income is the most ambitious social policy in history.

it eliminates welfare and eliminates poverty at the same time

If used to replace welfare programs, I believe you are correct. Currently our social programs rewards people for irresponsibility and failure while we penalize success. Even if you became more mature and had a change of heart, they already trapped you because you had five kids and nobody to take care of them but government.

Ray, don't you realize that this is just another way of subsidizing the owners of these companies in so that they can save on labor rates or pay on their employees ??

So let's say x begins getting this basic universal income (BUI), and then x goes to work. Does the BUI continue when person x gets a job or does it stop ??

If it continues, don't you think that companies will work the wages around the BUI ???

Is this something that's wanted by the businesses now also, otherwise for whom are having to lose their cheap labor forces now ??

The great thing about Universal Income is that it isn't altered by anything. If you want to work, great. If you don't want to work and can live off of 18K a year, great. It won't change hiring or wages one bit. If anything, it would take even more people out of the workforce and create a higher need for employees.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It's just a matter of time before we move to the 30 hour work week.

I would be happy with a four day 10 hour work week. Most people getting a three day weekend every week. Several of our customers are using that schedule, and their workers couldn't be happier.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Jobs aren't necessarily 'disappearing.' Statistically speaking, the country is currently at 'Full Employment.' So the jobs are there. The real question is, are they good jobs? And sadly, for the most part they aren't.

Cant say that in my industry. We are currently looking for over 30,000 drivers we can't find. Americans don't want to do that kind of work for any money. Some of them are very good paying; close to six figures in some cases.

Drugs are a huge problem in this country. A shipper at a company that we pickup from often told me they need 14 new employees, so they had a seminar for new applicants that had about 45 people. The HR person conducting the seminar told everybody right up front that they drug screen all employees. Over half of the people walked out at that point. He went on further to say that their drug screening uses hair samples, and another 15 walked out.

They hired about six people, and none of them made it past the first few weeks. They were unproductive workers, always texting instead of working, incapable of understanding basic concepts of system operations.

The job starts out at $15.50 per hour, but he told me you quickly move up to $19.50 per hour as you learn new processes in the company. It's a union job as well, so if you're willing to work, they are willing to pay you.

 

[francoHFW]

Jobs are disappearing? Dang, who knew?

Just good jobs going unfilled because we must save the rich... So we can't afford cheap education and Training....

Good jobs going unfilled to save the rich?? WTF kinda nonsense is that...oh, sorry, you're a fricken lib...never mind.

3 to 6 million good technical jobs are going begging because the GOP blocks cheap training and education for them, all to save the rich from paying taxes, dumbass.

The block is in your head. The GOP never blocked anything. Anybody that wants such training can get it. Take a loan out, work for a few years and save money. But just because taxpayers won't fund it doesn't mean it's blocked except to Commies.

So according to your ridiculous brainwashed give away to the rich ideology, just watch the middle class and the non-rich go to hell along with the rest of the country, as amazingly we lose out to countries with very few natural resources, through Sheer idiocy... Great job!

 

[francoHFW]

Jobs are disappearing? Dang, who knew?

Just good jobs going unfilled because we must save the rich... So we can't afford cheap education and Training....

Good jobs going unfilled to save the rich?? WTF kinda nonsense is that...oh, sorry, you're a fricken lib...never mind.

3 to 6 million good technical jobs are going begging because the GOP blocks cheap training and education for them, all to save the rich from paying taxes, dumbass.

The block is in your head. The GOP never blocked anything. Anybody that wants such training can get it. Take a loan out, work for a few years and save money. But just because taxpayers won't fund it doesn't mean it's blocked except to Commies.

Yep make everything as expensive and hard to do as possible... won't have any effect LOL! At least the rich are doing fine, brainwashed functional moron.

 

[Wyatt earp]

a UBI would be cheaper and more effective than what we do now, economically. If you take the total amount we spend on anti-poverty programs and divide by the number of poor people, there should be no poor people!

Poor people aren’t lazy, they’re trapped in the current system. A UBI is not contingent on staying poor, so it would both lift people out of poverty and flatten out the benefits cliff. Of course, this means that the new UBI would be instead of existing programs, rather than a supplement, and not everyone agrees with that.

Finally, there is crude "realpolitik." Plenty of very wealthy people already live in the US, and the new economy is likely to create inequality on steroids. In a democracy, the poor and middle class have many tools to “negotiate” redistribution at gunpoint.

So who is going to pay for this ?

Switzerland did a study on this before they voted on it. It was defeated.

Their calculations were that if they eliminated all social programs, they would actually save money with Universal Income. I don't know much about them, but I'm assuming we have more social programs than they do.

We would still pay the same amount of tax, but it wouldn't be so categorized. In other words, no welfare, no SCHIP's, no Medicare or Medicaid, no Social Security, no HUD, nothing. All the money would be converted for Universal Income instead.

I believe the figure they used was similar to 18K US dollars for each adult citizen.

I wonder how many government workers it would put on the unemployment line??? 2 million, 3 million???



.

 

[francoHFW]

a UBI would be cheaper and more effective than what we do now, economically. If you take the total amount we spend on anti-poverty programs and divide by the number of poor people, there should be no poor people!

Poor people aren’t lazy, they’re trapped in the current system. A UBI is not contingent on staying poor, so it would both lift people out of poverty and flatten out the benefits cliff. Of course, this means that the new UBI would be instead of existing programs, rather than a supplement, and not everyone agrees with that.

Finally, there is crude "realpolitik." Plenty of very wealthy people already live in the US, and the new economy is likely to create inequality on steroids. In a democracy, the poor and middle class have many tools to “negotiate” redistribution at gunpoint.

So who is going to pay for this ?

Switzerland did a study on this before they voted on it. It was defeated.

Their calculations were that if they eliminated all social programs, they would actually save money with Universal Income. I don't know much about them, but I'm assuming we have more social programs than they do.

We would still pay the same amount of tax, but it wouldn't be so categorized. In other words, no welfare, no SCHIP's, no Medicare or Medicaid, no Social Security, no HUD, nothing. All the money would be converted for Universal Income instead.

I believe the figure they used was similar to 18K US dollars for each adult citizen.

You think we have more social programs than Switzerland? Back to School with you! We have fewer social programs and benefits than any other modern country, easily. All thanks to the GOP.

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

How about we get rid of all different social programs but this.

Give each child 10K a year, but we invest it in "Mutual funds" they can't touch.

By the time the kids 18, they're probably worth nearly a million.

So, everyone becomes a close to millionaire by 18, and if they lose it's their fault.

 

[sartre play]

IF the tax cut money & some of the military money went to repair of roads bridges & such that would create jobs + make living better for all.

 

[beagle9]

universal basic income is the most ambitious social policy in history.

it eliminates welfare and eliminates poverty at the same time

If used to replace welfare programs, I believe you are correct. Currently our social programs rewards people for irresponsibility and failure while we penalize success. Even if you became more mature and had a change of heart, they already trapped you because you had five kids and nobody to take care of them but government.

Ray, don't you realize that this is just another way of subsidizing the owners of these companies in so that they can save on labor rates or pay on their employees ??

So let's say x begins getting this basic universal income (BUI), and then x goes to work. Does the BUI continue when person x gets a job or does it stop ??

If it continues, don't you think that companies will work the wages around the BUI ???

Is this something that's wanted by the businesses now also, otherwise for whom are having to lose their cheap labor forces now ??

The great thing about Universal Income is that it isn't altered by anything. If you want to work, great. If you don't want to work and can live off of 18K a year, great. It won't change hiring or wages one bit. If anything, it would take even more people out of the workforce and create a higher need for employees.

Ok, so does this allow companies to pay even cheaper wages than they would otherwise pay in a situation where such a thing doesn't exist ?? Is this a subsidy for employers paid for by the American taxpayers to subsidize their workforces just like the welfare programs were being accessed by military soldiers and McDonald's employees etc ??

How much of the $18,000 dollars do you think a company will use to subsidize the employee's pay, otherwise by what it will pay that employee knowing this bullcrap exist ??