We need Mueller to say what he actually THINKS

[Mac1958]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

the question: if trump were not president would you have charged him.

I don't have enough information to say. The question now is obstruction, and I would have some questions on that.
.

 

[Mac1958]

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Twist things?
They were the only ones saying correctly that there was no evidence in collusion.

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

That's because he could find no evidence of collusion, despite a two-year multimillion-dollar investigation. When you don't have any evidence and you're not willing to be honest, you do exactly what Mueller is doing.

I'm pretty sure this whole thing has moved beyond collusion. For the most part, the Dems have given up on that and are concentrating on obstruction. That's where my questions for Mueller would be.
.

 

[Mac1958]

My guess is Mueller did this purposely. He and rest of the ruling class want Americans divided.

That's possible, but look at this thread. I don't think the wingers want the whole story either, because loose ends allow them to toss around their accusations and extrapolations and theories with impunity.

Intellectual curiosity has exited the building, and that doesn't bode well for the country.
.

 

[candycorn]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

Very good post. Correct on all points.

 

[jknowgood]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

He can't tell the truth, because he knows there was never any collusion. It was a plot to get Trumps approval rating low enough to impeach him. Well it failed,and now a real investigation needs to get started and people need to go to jail.

 

[Mac1958]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

He can't tell the truth, because he knows there was never any collusion. It was a plot to get Trumps approval rating low enough to impeach him. Well it failed,and now a real investigation needs to get started and people need to go to jail.

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.
.

 

[candycorn]

I’d view it as the DVD commentary to a movie. When you watch a movie in a theater, you see the “report” on the screen. Act I, the planning; Act II, the action; Act III, the Resolution. In the DVD commentary, the director (Mueller) will tell us why he made the choices he made, the bewildering decisions that he made relative to the decision not to subpoena Trump for a sit-down interview where follow up questions could be asked, etc…

As a private citizen now (he no longer works for the Executive)…he is fully able to be subpoenaed by the House. One would think that if the Republicans were really interested in learning more or roasting the IC….he would be subpoenaed by the Senate JC as well.

 

[BluesLegend]

Its front page news today the so called Mueller report selectively left out parts of testimony to SPIN it as obstruction. Goddamn these DC fuckers are corrupt. The full testimony has now been released, shocker its not obstruction at all.

If it's front page news, I can't find it.
Put up a link.

I posted a link calm yourself.

 

[peach174]

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Twist things?
They were the only ones saying correctly that there was no evidence in collusion.

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

That's because he could find no evidence of collusion, despite a two-year multimillion-dollar investigation. When you don't have any evidence and you're not willing to be honest, you do exactly what Mueller is doing.

I'm pretty sure this whole thing has moved beyond collusion. For the most part, the Dems have given up on that and are concentrating on obstruction. That's where my questions for Mueller would be.
.

Muller's report says he tried to obstruct, but did not happen, because his orders were not carried out.
Trying and actual doing are two different things.
If there is no collusion, then there can not be an obstruction.

 

[BluesLegend]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

WTF is wrong with you? Mueller is not JUDGE and JURY you hack.

Of course, I didn't come within 500 miles of saying that. Obviously.

But that appears to be what your fevered mind perceived.

Always fascinating. Thank you.
.

Clearly you did.

 

[Polishprince]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

He can't tell the truth, because he knows there was never any collusion. It was a plot to get Trumps approval rating low enough to impeach him. Well it failed,and now a real investigation needs to get started and people need to go to jail.

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.
.

"Obstruction" is bullshit. President Trump allowed scores of his staff to interview with Mueller's team of grand inquisitors. He turned over a million and a half pages of documents.

How is that "obstruction"?

The fact that he denounced the Witch Hunt repeatedly isn't "obstruction". If someone is innocent, it isn't "obstruction" for them to object to unfounded persecution. Particularly when the persecution was not well predicated to start with.

 

[candycorn]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

He can't tell the truth, because he knows there was never any collusion. It was a plot to get Trumps approval rating low enough to impeach him. Well it failed,and now a real investigation needs to get started and people need to go to jail.

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.
.

Not so sure about that. The conclusion was that there was no finding of evidence. That the evidence was not uncovered…doesn’t mean it is not out there. Like somewhere…OJ’s bloody knife is in a landfill. Do I think it will be found? No. But it’s out there. Evidence that Trump colluded with the Russians…is it on a cell phone of some Russian Intelligence officer? Who knows. I do know that if it is, it’s a great bargaining chip for Putin to have in his pocket. It would explain his light touch when it comes to the thrice-confirmed Russian meddling in our elections, the zero-record of his conversations with Putin while President, etc…

 

[Mac1958]

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Maybe you're right Mac
he was hired to do a job , his 'opinion' would only muddy the judicial waters ~S~

Yeah, agreed, can't argue. There certainly isn't a magic bullet here, especially when we already know the wings will paint anything to their liking.

Loose ends just make things easier for Hannity and Levin and Limbaugh to twist things as they tell their people what to think, that's all.
.

Twist things?
They were the only ones saying correctly that there was no evidence in collusion.

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

That's because he could find no evidence of collusion, despite a two-year multimillion-dollar investigation. When you don't have any evidence and you're not willing to be honest, you do exactly what Mueller is doing.

I'm pretty sure this whole thing has moved beyond collusion. For the most part, the Dems have given up on that and are concentrating on obstruction. That's where my questions for Mueller would be.
.

Muller's report says he tried to obstruct, but did not happen, because his orders were not carried out.
Trying and actual doing are two different things.
If there is no collusion, then there can not be an obstruction.

My questions would center around the nature of the attempted obstruction.

Such as, "did Trump bring it up, and then stop when told it could not be done legally, or did he push it and threaten people if they didn't follow his request regardless of its legality?"

I wouldn't look at the former as an impeachable offense, but I'd possibly look at the latter as one.
.

 

[peach174]

My guess is Mueller did this purposely. He and rest of the ruling class want Americans divided.

That's possible, but look at this thread. I don't think the wingers want the whole story either, because loose ends allow them to toss around their accusations and extrapolations and theories with impunity.

Intellectual curiosity has exited the building, and that doesn't bode well for the country.
.

Yes they do want the whole story.
We all want answers into the background of the dossier, which is what Barr is doing.

 

[Mac1958]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

He can't tell the truth, because he knows there was never any collusion. It was a plot to get Trumps approval rating low enough to impeach him. Well it failed,and now a real investigation needs to get started and people need to go to jail.

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.
.

"Obstruction" is bullshit. President Trump allowed scores of his staff to interview with Mueller's team of grand inquisitors. He turned over a million and a half pages of documents.

How is that "obstruction"?

The fact that he denounced the Witch Hunt repeatedly isn't "obstruction". If someone is innocent, it isn't "obstruction" for them to object to unfounded persecution. Particularly when the persecution was not well predicated to start with.

Please see post 73.
.

 

[Polishprince]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

He can't tell the truth, because he knows there was never any collusion. It was a plot to get Trumps approval rating low enough to impeach him. Well it failed,and now a real investigation needs to get started and people need to go to jail.

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.
.

Not so sure about that. The conclusion was that there was no finding of evidence. That the evidence was not uncovered…doesn’t mean it is not out there. Like somewhere…OJ’s bloody knife is in a landfill. Do I think it will be found? No. But it’s out there. Evidence that Trump colluded with the Russians…is it on a cell phone of some Russian Intelligence officer? Who knows. I do know that if it is, it’s a great bargaining chip for Putin to have in his pocket. It would explain his light touch when it comes to the thrice-confirmed Russian meddling in our elections, the zero-record of his conversations with Putin while President, etc…

Mueller was invited by President Putin to come to Moscow to interview the Russians he indicted. Why didn't Mueller and his teams go to land fills in the Russian Steppe to examine and do DNA testing of ruined mattresses?

Comparing the DNA found on the mattresses with that of known Russian prostitutes- reputedly the finest prostitutes in the world- could have broken the case.

 

[candycorn]

My disappointment with Mueller is that he has chosen to leave so much up to interpretation and conjecture.

Predictably, all the silly wingers are highlighting only what supports their set-in-stone opinions and making assumptions that may or may not be true. Because that's what they do.

This stuff is too important for that. I understand his reticence to inject opinion on this matter, since his task was to find facts only. But we need more. The more detail the better, because detail forces out conjecture.

Maybe this will get so fucking ugly that he'll finally feel some obligation to let it all out and tell us what he really thinks. He seems like a guy who is simply too principled and professional for the times.
.

He can't tell the truth, because he knows there was never any collusion. It was a plot to get Trumps approval rating low enough to impeach him. Well it failed,and now a real investigation needs to get started and people need to go to jail.

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.
.

Not so sure about that. The conclusion was that there was no finding of evidence. That the evidence was not uncovered…doesn’t mean it is not out there. Like somewhere…OJ’s bloody knife is in a landfill. Do I think it will be found? No. But it’s out there. Evidence that Trump colluded with the Russians…is it on a cell phone of some Russian Intelligence officer? Who knows. I do know that if it is, it’s a great bargaining chip for Putin to have in his pocket. It would explain his light touch when it comes to the thrice-confirmed Russian meddling in our elections, the zero-record of his conversations with Putin while President, etc…

Mueller was invited by President Putin to come to Moscow to interview the Russians he indicted. Why didn't Mueller and his teams go to land fills in the Russian Steppe to examine and do DNA testing of ruined mattresses?

Comparing the DNA found on the mattresses with that of known Russian prostitutes- reputedly the finest prostitutes in the world- could have broken the case.

DNA…mattresses? Wow.

As for the invitation to Moscow…that is a good question. I would love to hear his explanation. Which is again, a good reason for the House to subpoena Mr. Mueller.

 

[mikegriffith1]

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.

Obstruction of WHAT? If there's no underlying crime, there can be no obstruction. Suppose I falsely accuse you of stealing my car. You know the charge is baseless. You justifiably feel upset about the charge. You might spout off about wanting to stop me from investigating you and all your friends over the charge, but that would never rise to obstruction, even if I had stolen your car. Did Trump withhold any documents that Mueller requested? No. Did he tell anyone to lie to Mueller about any material issue that directly related to the collusion charge? No. Did he fire Mueller? No.

 

[BluesLegend]

My questions would center around the nature of the attempted obstruction.

Since its being reported today that Mueller deceitfully edited out testimony to intentionally spin the report towards obstruction the entire report is now suspect. We have the full unedited testimony, Mueller is toast.

 

[Mac1958]

The collusion angle is over. History. The question now, and what the Democrats are going after, is obstruction.

Obstruction of WHAT? If there's no underlying crime, there can be no obstruction.

That meme being pushed so hard by talk radio just doesn't work.

Obstruction is a behavior. If an innocent person is accused of murder and still chooses to interfere in the investigation, he's still obstructing. The murder and the obstruction are mutually exclusive behaviors.

I'm not saying he obstructed, because I don't have enough information yet. That's the point of the thread.
.