What would America be like if the anti-Abortion types win?

[JoeB131]

November 12, 1933 93.5% of German electorate (43,000,000) voted in favor of Nazi policies.

It is important to remind all of the difference between right and wrong.

Again, so how are you going to impose what is right when so many people are going to oppose you? This is what I am still waiting for an answer on.

Again... the Philippines tried what you want, and they are failing miserably.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Wrong.

There is no 'good medical policy.'

Sure there is. It's just not one you religious crazies like.

"Mississippi Legislature passes bills banning abortion after detectable heartbeat
Both the Mississippi House and Senate passed ‘heartbeat bills’ on Wednesday, bills which would ban abortion after a heartbeat is detected in a preborn child, at approximately six weeks.

Exactly why we can't leave these things to the chimps in the state capital.

I wasn't talking about "heartbeats", I was talking about VIABILITY..

One 1% of abortions are performed after the 21st week, the earliest viability there is. It is usually because the fetus is horribly deformed with Down Syndrom, Tay-Sachs, Brittle Bone or some other disease that will make it's life a living hell.

"There is no 'good medical policy.'"

"Sure there is. It's just not one you religious crazies like. "




"...or some other disease that will make it's life a living hell."

How about you ask this guy before you decide for him.

 

[JoeB131]

Rectitude.

I oppose murder.....even yours...........let me thing about that.....

She has every right not to have sex....did you know that it often leads to pregnancy,and the existence of a new individual?

Okay, so what about if she gets raped... Here, I'll help you out with your handy Republican Rape Advisory Chart.

When does it become okay to make her have her rapist's baby because you are so against Murder.

 

[JoeB131]

How about you ask this guy before you decide for him.

Couldn't care less...

How much did it bankrupt his family to get him to that point.

Tell me, are you going to support the massive spending outlays we would need if women brought every deformed, disabled and genetically defective fetus to term? Because that stuff's gonna cost a lot of money.

Rich people might have to give up their yachts and dressage horses.

 

[PoliticalChic]

What a stupid and totally transparent ploy.

If you didn't end their lives....they would continue to live.

So by that logic, we should let ectopic pregnancies (where the fetus attaches itself to the inside of the Fallopian tube) continue on because it's totally a "unique" baby. They are two percent of all pregnancies. We should compel women to have their rapists' babies. I'm just wondering how far you are willing to take this delusion.

Watch how deftly I pulverize that lie.

How can it be 'her body'.....

And it's inside her body, so none of that stuff really matters.

I'm still waiting for you to tell me how you are going to make your religious crazy work as policy unless you are willing to imprison women for having abortions.

"We should compel women to have their rapists' babies."

Let's deal with the so very overused idea of "cases of rape or incest."
The concept that there are "cases of rape or incest" is a chimera.
They really don't exist.....well, the fact is that 98.5% of abortion don't involve either abhorrent event.
The cases in which abortion is for rape, 1%; and .5% incest.http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/psrh/full/3711005.pdf


. The vast majority of abortion performed in the United States are carried out for reasons that can be broadly categorized as “matters of convenience.”

Nearly every abortion is based on convenience.....Convenience, as in having your groceries delivered rather than having to walk across the street to pick them up.....this level of consideration in deciding to execute the child you've created.



In a study of 27 nations, reasons for abortion services were found to be the following:

a. “Worldwide, the most commonly reported reason women cite for having an abortion is to postpone or stop childbearing. The second most common reason—socioeconomic concerns—includes disruption of education or employment; lack of support from the father; desire to provide schooling for existing children; and poverty, unemployment or inability to afford additional children. In addition, relationship problems with a husband or partner and a woman's perception that she is too young constitute other important categories of reasons.” Reasons Why Women Have Induced Abortions: Evidence from 27 Countries


b. A 2004 study of American women yielded similar results: “The reasons most frequently cited were that having a child would interfere with a woman’s education, work or ability to care for dependents (74%); that she could not afford a baby now (73%); and that she did not want to be a single mother or was having relationship problems (48%). Nearly four in 10 women said they had completed their childbearing, and almost one-third were not ready to have a child. Fewer than 1% said their parents’ or partners’ desire for them to have an abortion was the most important reason. Younger women often reported that they were unprepared for the transition to motherhood, while older women regularly cited their responsibility to dependents.”
http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/psrh/full/3711005.pdf




c. We must reject the view that inconvenience of a mother’s informed choice outweighs the unalienable right to life of the child she bears by virtue of that choice.

 

[buckeye45_73]

Anyone got a rational discussion to the OP?

It a stupid question. To cherish innocent life is not a bad thing. We have sex ed and, condoms and birth control, all of which you guys said would remove the need for abortion.

 

[PoliticalChic]

What a stupid and totally transparent ploy.

If you didn't end their lives....they would continue to live.

So by that logic, we should let ectopic pregnancies (where the fetus attaches itself to the inside of the Fallopian tube) continue on because it's totally a "unique" baby. They are two percent of all pregnancies. We should compel women to have their rapists' babies. I'm just wondering how far you are willing to take this delusion.

Watch how deftly I pulverize that lie.

How can it be 'her body'.....

And it's inside her body, so none of that stuff really matters.

I'm still waiting for you to tell me how you are going to make your religious crazy work as policy unless you are willing to imprison women for having abortions.

"And it's inside her body, so none of that stuff really matters. "

Good to see I've forced you to stop claiming that it is her body.

Now you need to explain this:

Is there any argument for the "right" of a woman to authorize the killing of her unborn baby that would not apply to her authorizing the similar slaughter of a year old that she was breastfeeding?


'cause....if there isn't, and one is murder, so, then, is the other.

That's called logic.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

And the two salient points in this discussion are


1. Abortion is the act of one human ending the existence of another


2. As the developing human is never a part of the 'mother,' where is her right to end his or her life?




The attempt to change the subject reveals that you recognize, and acknowledge the weakness of your position.

You may try to change the subject...but I won't allow you to.




"I'm still waiting for you to tell me how you are going to make your religious crazy work as policy "

Simple....I'm re-educating readers of these posts by proving how blood-thirsty killers of the innocent, you, have no valid argument.

Readers will see that I have eviscerated your every attempt.

 

[MAGAman]

What a load of bullshit. If the pro life people win, each state will make its own abortion laws, just as they did before the Roe v. Wade mutilation of our Constitution. Some states will allow abortions and some states won't, so if a woman who lived in a state that didn't allow abortions wanted one, she would have to take a bus to a state that did allow them, and if she didn't have the bus fare, pro abortion fanatics like yourself would be happy to buy her a bus ticket.

But here's the problem with that...

Poor women in red states wouldn't be able to get abortions, but wealthy women in red states could take a trip.

Does this seem fair to you? It would seem that if anyone should be compelled to have a baby, it should be the affluent person, who has the resources to take care of it.

That's not the case. Poor women in states that do not allow abortion can take a bus to a state that allows them. Even poor people can take sick days.

Poor women don't have the money to take off work, leave the state, leave their children in the care of others, and jump through all of the legal hoops, unnecessary tests, and degradation that the state will put her through because she can't afford to have a baby.

I love it how men think that doing all of this is just so easy for people of limited resources.

Being a parent isn't easy. Nobody said otherwise.

It's a lot easier to abandon your children than to love them, provide for them, and protect them.

It's easier to sell drugs than to get an honest job.

It's easier to lie than to tell the truth.

It's easier to have no morals than to have to worry about doing the right thing.

It's a lot easier to be a leftist than to take personal responsibility for your own actions

 

[JoeB131]

Let's deal with the so very overused idea of "cases of rape or incest."
The concept that there are "cases of rape or incest" is a chimera.
They really don't exist.....well, the fact is that 98.5% of abortion don't involve either abhorrent event.
The cases in which abortion is for rape, 1%; and .5%

Okay, but 1.5% of them do, are you going to make THOSE women have their rapists' babies?

it was a simple enough question..

Of course, we really don't know how many abortions are for rape or incest, because those figures by and large aren't reported. Only half of women who are raped even report being raped. (And understandable, since only 3% of rapists end up in prison cells, why go through the exercise?)

. The vast majority of abortion performed in the United States are carried out for reasons that can be broadly categorized as “matters of convenience.”

Nearly every abortion is based on convenience.....Convenience, as in having your groceries delivered rather than having to walk across the street to pick them up.....this level of consideration in deciding to execute the child you've created.

Yup. But once you've said, "Well rape victims, you can abort your fetuses," you really don't have a leg to stand on when it's the woman who just slept with the wrong guy.

Now, how about answering the question.

Are you going to compel women under penalty of law to have their rapists' babies. If you think that fetuses should have all the same rights real actual people do, you kind of have to insist on that. After all, we don't execute children for the crimes of their parents.

(At least not yet. With Trump in charge, you never know.)

 

[PoliticalChic]

Let's deal with the so very overused idea of "cases of rape or incest."
The concept that there are "cases of rape or incest" is a chimera.
They really don't exist.....well, the fact is that 98.5% of abortion don't involve either abhorrent event.
The cases in which abortion is for rape, 1%; and .5%

Okay, but 1.5% of them do, are you going to make THOSE women have their rapists' babies?

it was a simple enough question..

Of course, we really don't know how many abortions are for rape or incest, because those figures by and large aren't reported. Only half of women who are raped even report being raped. (And understandable, since only 3% of rapists end up in prison cells, why go through the exercise?)

. The vast majority of abortion performed in the United States are carried out for reasons that can be broadly categorized as “matters of convenience.”

Nearly every abortion is based on convenience.....Convenience, as in having your groceries delivered rather than having to walk across the street to pick them up.....this level of consideration in deciding to execute the child you've created.

Yup. But once you've said, "Well rape victims, you can abort your fetuses," you really don't have a leg to stand on when it's the woman who just slept with the wrong guy.

Now, how about answering the question.

Are you going to compel women under penalty of law to have their rapists' babies. If you think that fetuses should have all the same rights real actual people do, you kind of have to insist on that. After all, we don't execute children for the crimes of their parents.

(At least not yet. With Trump in charge, you never know.)

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.” Thomas Jefferson.


And based on the above, every conservative is pro-life.



Your side:

"We must rid ourselves once and for all of the Quaker-Papist babble about the sanctity of human life." Leon Trotsky






Our nation was founded on the premise that each individual has the unalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. But they don’t become rights by virtue of birth…we are endowed with these rights by our Creator, at the moment of creation.
This is a political argument: the form of the Creator invoked by the Founders is irrelevant to the debate. Morality is not a consideration here, so there is no mention of contraception as being right or wrong; one’s use of contraceptives does not infringe on anyone else’s rights.


The fact is that our nation, at its very founding, acknowledged that, by virtue of being created, of being conceived, the unborn child, has a right to live. It is not a right that is alienable….even by the child’s mother.

 

[MAGAman]

I knew a guy that constantly beast the shit out of his alcoholic wife who kept going back to him. Is that ok with you since we don't live in a perfect world?

People shouldn't take their bad choices out on drunk wives or innocent children

beast the shit? Never mind, don't want to know.

Here's the thing. Domestic battery laws are enforceable... to a degree.

Abortion laws aren't.

Next lame argument.

1. Abortion laws are not hard to enforce.

2. Rape laws are much harder to enforce than abortion laws. We should still do our best.

3. Human Rights should be protected even if it's difficult

4. My spelling, typing, and spellcheck aren't perfect, but an adult would have no problem. Let me know what you can't figure out and I'll help you.

 

[JoeB131]

Now you need to explain this:

Is there any argument for the "right" of a woman to authorize the killing of her unborn baby that would not apply to her authorizing the similar slaughter of a year old that she was breastfeeding?

yes, it isn't viable... and you need to see someone about that OCD.

We've been over this several times... I am wondering if you have some kind of learning disability.

And the two salient points in this discussion are

1. Abortion is the act of one human ending the existence of another
2. As the developing human is never a part of the 'mother,' where is her right to end his or her life?

No, there's only one really salient point. 70% of the country disagrees with you. How are you going to make your crazy laws work.

because your opinion matters to any fetuses growing in your uterus...but not so much anyone else's.

Simple....I'm re-educating readers of these posts by proving how blood-thirsty killers of the innocent, you, have no valid argument.

Readers will see that I have eviscerated your every attempt.

Okay, so how is that going to convince a woman facing that situation?

"Well, if I have an abortion, I can still have college and a career, but I saw the CrazyChick on USMB wear down JoeB131 until he finally gave up and went home.... that's a compelling argument for signing up for a lifetime of poverty and government assistance!!!"

Ain't gonna happen.

 

[JoeB131]

1. Abortion laws are not hard to enforce.

Actually, they are next to impossible to enforce. Probably harder than the prostitution laws, now that we have drugs like the morning after pill.

2. Rape laws are much harder to enforce than abortion laws. We should still do our best.

We should, because rape is a bad thing, everyone agrees. Everyone does not agree that abortion is, no matter how many times you scream "Jesus" at them.

3. Human Rights should be protected even if it's difficult

Which would be great if everyone agreed fetuses were people. Not everyone does.

4. My spelling, typing, and spellcheck aren't perfect, but an adult would have no problem. Let me know what you can't figure out and I'll help you.

If you are going to waste my valuable time with stupid arguments, don't give me an opening to mock you.

 

[JoeB131]

And based on the above, every conservative is pro-life.

That had nothing to do with the questions I asked, and there are a lot of native Americans and blacks who were the victims of gencoide and slavery who would disagree with Tommy's devotion to human rights for white males.

So one more time how are you going to enforce your crazy laws, if most of don't agree that's what the law should be?

The fact is that our nation, at its very founding, acknowledged that, by virtue of being created, of being conceived, the unborn child, has a right to live. It is not a right that is alienable….even by the child’s mother.

Again, how are you going to enforce that?
How many years in prison should a woman get for terminating her rapist's fetus?

 

[JoeB131]

I don't expect PoliticalSpice to actually answer the question, so I will move on to another thread.. maybe watch some Law and Order reruns.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Now you need to explain this:

Is there any argument for the "right" of a woman to authorize the killing of her unborn baby that would not apply to her authorizing the similar slaughter of a year old that she was breastfeeding?

yes, it isn't viable... and you need to see someone about that OCD.

We've been over this several times... I am wondering if you have some kind of learning disability.

And the two salient points in this discussion are

1. Abortion is the act of one human ending the existence of another
2. As the developing human is never a part of the 'mother,' where is her right to end his or her life?

No, there's only one really salient point. 70% of the country disagrees with you. How are you going to make your crazy laws work.

because your opinion matters to any fetuses growing in your uterus...but not so much anyone else's.

Simple....I'm re-educating readers of these posts by proving how blood-thirsty killers of the innocent, you, have no valid argument.

Readers will see that I have eviscerated your every attempt.

Okay, so how is that going to convince a woman facing that situation?

"Well, if I have an abortion, I can still have college and a career, but I saw the CrazyChick on USMB wear down JoeB131 until he finally gave up and went home.... that's a compelling argument for signing up for a lifetime of poverty and government assistance!!!"

Ain't gonna happen.

Fucking hilarious...I love it when you proponents of baby killing can act like those who oppose are crazy....that’s backwards LibTardian belief at its finest right there.
Opposing baby killing = crazy
Supporting baby killing = not crazy

 

[JoeB131]

Fucking hilarious...I love it when you proponents of baby killing can act like those who oppose are crazy....that’s backwards LibTardian belief at its finest right there.
Opposing baby killing = crazy
Supporting baby killing = not crazy

1) Fetuses aren't babies.
2) If you got a Fetus protection law, it would be completely unenforceable without turning America into a draconian police state.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Fucking hilarious...I love it when you proponents of baby killing can act like those who oppose are crazy....that’s backwards LibTardian belief at its finest right there.
Opposing baby killing = crazy
Supporting baby killing = not crazy

1) Fetuses aren't babies.
2) If you got a Fetus protection law, it would be completely unenforceable without turning America into a draconian police state.

Don’t we have laws which protect the eggs of Bald Eagles...how draconian huh?

 

[22lcidw]

Rectitude.

I oppose murder.....even yours...........let me thing about that.....

She has every right not to have sex....did you know that it often leads to pregnancy,and the existence of a new individual?

Okay, so what about if she gets raped... Here, I'll help you out with your handy Republican Rape Advisory Chart.

View attachment 246405

When does it become okay to make her have her rapist's baby because you are so against Murder.

Perhaps you should see the endless sex derived product and intimacy commercials every night. You are spouting clean as the driven snowflake while promoting a Caligula existence and thinking even with rap that there is not more of an affect on rape because of it. On top of this you accuse people of rape because of protected group status. The college rape allegations are a clean green gas.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Fucking hilarious...I love it when you proponents of baby killing can act like those who oppose are crazy....that’s backwards LibTardian belief at its finest right there.
Opposing baby killing = crazy
Supporting baby killing = not crazy

1) Fetuses aren't babies.
2) If you got a Fetus protection law, it would be completely unenforceable without turning America into a draconian police state.