Which was the bigger LIE? WMDs or 46 million "uninsured"???

[TNHarley]

If Obama is not lying, he is not speaking
The WMD's were a complete failure
ALL sides wanted us to do it
Mis-information
Big difference

 

[francoHFW]

Have you ever in your lifetime had to endure over 4 years of blatant lies coming from your leaders? You could make a two hour special on it. "The Obama Years" The Laughable Legacy.

yup- 8 years of Bush, and 4 years of Pubcrappe and hate against Obama, idiot dupe of the greedy idiot rich. Shoot yourself and do the country a favor lol. Only racism explains the depth of GOP insanity. Yes, YOU. lol. Hoping for your recovery

 

[healthmyths]

The GOP opposes all legislation beside pure GOP propaganda. It's a GOP bill- even so it will be the most popular aand important social program EVER. Our GOP health system is a catastrophe, for the economy for starters.

I know, you're a clueless PPM drone. lol

Are you a shill for lawyers? Are you being paid NOT to answer why after Obama/Congress received $300 million in campaign donations there was NO tort reform?
Why are you totally ignoring the $850 billion a year that thousands of physicians ALL agree is spent on "defensive medicine" because of fear of lawsuits?
Do you have access to a database of 6,000 hospitals as I do that shows that hospitals markup sometimes by 6,000% claims sent to medicare?
YOU never deal in facts...just name calling, hyperbole, hysteria... NOT one fact!
Now again... why is it fair to force 18 million people to buy a service if they don't want it?
Why is it fair for obamacare to tax tanning salons 10% BUT NOT the lawyers that cause the $850 billion in wasted,duplicate claims?

Where is your fairness in that...Oh right you are a paid mouthpiece by the $200 billion a year lawyers!!!

Why is it so difficult to deal with FACTS?

There are, in O-care, care guidelines in order to cut malpractice costs, shyttehead. STHU and read something fair, dupe.

Where???
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-111hr3590enr/pdf/BILLS-111hr3590enr.pdf

Obamacare doesn't mention one bit the $850 billion in defensive medicine costs!
The ONLY mention of Tort reform is not DOING but ‘‘SEC. 399V–4. STATE DEMONSTRATION PROGRAMS TO EVALUATE ALTERNATIVES TO CURRENT MEDICAL TORT LITIGATION.

Why did they leave it up to EACH STATE to do Tort Reform when this massive pack of bull crap covers EVERYTHING else to a minute degree!
I mean 10 instances of TANNING.. a DIRECT FEDERAL Government tax on TANNING salons in the bill... WHY this enormous attention on something that is miniscule in
the face of $850 billion in defensive medicine!!!

The 10% tanning tax has replaced the 5% tax on cosmetic surgery that was originally included in the bill.

That tax, nicknamed the "Botax," would have included Botox injections and breast implants among other elective surgeries, but was cut out of the bill last year after heavy lobbying from the medical and dermatology industries.

Because the Botax was expected to generate $5.8 billion, more than double the amount the tanning tax is projected to raise, many tanning industry professionals are furious about the switch, arguing that while the tanning tax targets middle-class, women-owned businesses, the Botax would mainly impact wealthier Americans who would be more able to handle higher prices.
http://money.cnn.com/2010/03/24/news/economy/tanning_tax/

 

[hazlnut]

FACTS are there are less the 4 million Americans that truly want and need insurance! 4 Million NOT 46 million!

Since you can't back that "fact" up with anything....

Then we'll consider this thread a fail....


Better luck next time.

 

[TheSeventhTiger]

so why should those (like myself) who don't smoke, don't eat like a sumo wrestler, not on drugs, work out regularly, never had an illness, Be Required To Buy Health-Care, When I choose to pay for my own doctor visits? This is like Liberal Leaders walking into every gym, point a gun to all of the members heads and tell them they have to buy health insurance and they don't give a chit if you are in top condition.

 

[healthmyths]

FACTS are there are less the 4 million Americans that truly want and need insurance! 4 Million NOT 46 million!

Since you can't back that "fact" up with anything....

Then we'll consider this thread a fail....


Better luck next time.

Obviously you can't subtract 42 million from 46 million but once again Prove these numbers are incorrect!
1) The census says there are 10 million counted as uninsured AS NOT citizens!
2) Studies have shown 14 million that think they are uninsured ARE COVERED BY MEDICAID.. all that have to do is register.. and since 2007 10 million have!
3) Why do you insist on ignoring the simple fact 18 million people don't want health insurance because they spend less then $1,000 a year for health services?
That adds up to 42 million with 4 million that want and need insurance.

FACT 90% of physicians state they order duplicate tests,etc. over $850 billion a year simply out of fear of being sued!
TELL me that taxing lawyers 10% like Obamacare taxes tanning salons is unfair?
Tell me the $20 billion in lawyers taxes couldn't buy $5,000 a year premium for health insurance for the 4 million that want and need?
Tell me that hospitals would no longer be able to overbill insurance/medicare by 6,000% justifying their "unreimbursed" when they could file claims for the "uninsured"??

AND YOU are stupid enough not to recognize if those steps were done.. $200 billion a year in costs reductions alone would lower premiums making insurance more
affordable for those 4 million!

These are facts YOU haven't refuted! All you did is show you have NO substance to your defense of Obamacare! NOTHING!

 

[TheSeventhTiger]

could the number one reason that health-care costs were already a bit expensive (but not like in 2012) were due to illegals? can you imagine what health-care costs would be if the USA had always protected its borders since the beginning of time in 1863? (well give or take 20 years).

 

[Greenbeard]

The ONLY mention of Tort reform is not DOING but ‘‘SEC. 399V–4. STATE DEMONSTRATION PROGRAMS TO EVALUATE ALTERNATIVES TO CURRENT MEDICAL TORT LITIGATION.

Why did they leave it up to EACH STATE to do Tort Reform when this massive pack of bull crap covers EVERYTHING else to a minute degree!

Perhaps you haven't noticed but most of the law is based at the state level.

Regardless, the ACA's tort reform language was borrowed from Paul Ryan and Mike Enzi. It was copied and pasted from Republican health reform proposals.

 

[TheSeventhTiger]

And who can't wait for the 2014 campaign season, all of those GOP ads telling the truth behind Obama-Care, and new commercials showing Obama/Reid and the rest throwing old people off the cliff, cause that is one of the purposes of Obama-Care, do away with older-white republicans, they have no reason to live, so lets just put them in a wheel-chair, and off they go!

 

[healthmyths]

The ONLY mention of Tort reform is not DOING but ‘‘SEC. 399V–4. STATE DEMONSTRATION PROGRAMS TO EVALUATE ALTERNATIVES TO CURRENT MEDICAL TORT LITIGATION.

Why did they leave it up to EACH STATE to do Tort Reform when this massive pack of bull crap covers EVERYTHING else to a minute degree!

Perhaps you haven't noticed but most of the law is based at the state level.

Regardless, the ACA's tort reform language was borrowed from Paul Ryan and Mike Enzi. It was copied and pasted from Republican health reform proposals.

So if state law per you supersedes federal then why does Obamcare exist?
You can't have a Federal law i.e. Obamacare also single out one industry, tanning salons and then exclude lawyers that cause 10 times the amount of
health care cost! That's what many of my points are.
A) Obamacare uses all states' Uninsured numbers i.e. 46 million when there never have been 46 million uninsured.

B) Yes there are 4 million uninsured when you subtract 10 million illegals, 14 million already covered by Medicaid and 18 million that don't want to be forced to buy something they don't need as they pay out of pocket their health expenses. They are not "free loaders" by the way because that means they are falsifying their financial responsibilities which affect their credit status so why would they be called "free loaders'??

C) And yes you are right about states taking tort reform responsibility.. look at Illinois, Texas and other successful states that have lured physicians from more
litigious states because of tort reform.
But my point is simple.
Federal taxing of lawyers $200 billion would pay for the 4 million uninsured that want and need it.
Tax declines as the $850 billion declines and those states that do tort reform those lawyers benefit!
So explain why Obamacare taxes tanning salons but not lawyers???

 

[lynn63]

30M was also a lie.​

....per The Axis Of Ignorance.​

ON August 21, 2009 Obama said: "We are not a nation that accepts nearly 46 million uninsured men, women and children,"
46 Million Uninsured: A Look Behind The Number : NPR
Now I gave you Obama's exact QUOTE! HE said 46 million!

OK let's concede he said 30 million!
18 million DON"T WANT HEALTH INSURANCE. THEY PAY THEIR OWN WAY!
So are you counting people that don't want health insurance???
That leaves 12 million!
WHY then are 10 million per the census counted when they are NOT AMERICANS?
That leaves 2 million you idiot!

In 2009, according to the U.S. Census there were 50,674 million with no insurance.
These people fell into the following income levels:

Less than $25,000 a yr - 15,483
$25,000 - $49,000 a yr - 15,278
$50,000 -$74,000 a yr - 9,352
$75,000 and more a yr - 10,561

Out of the 15,483 that made under $25,000 a yr, 13,903 were considered below poverty level.

 

[The Rabbi]

....per The Axis Of Ignorance.​

ON August 21, 2009 Obama said: "We are not a nation that accepts nearly 46 million uninsured men, women and children,"
46 Million Uninsured: A Look Behind The Number : NPR
Now I gave you Obama's exact QUOTE! HE said 46 million!

OK let's concede he said 30 million!
18 million DON"T WANT HEALTH INSURANCE. THEY PAY THEIR OWN WAY!
So are you counting people that don't want health insurance???
That leaves 12 million!
WHY then are 10 million per the census counted when they are NOT AMERICANS?
That leaves 2 million you idiot!

In 2009, according to the U.S. Census there were 50,674 million with no insurance.
These people fell into the following income levels:

Less than $25,000 a yr - 15,483
$25,000 - $49,000 a yr - 15,278
$50,000 -$74,000 a yr - 9,352
$75,000 and more a yr - 10,561

Out of the 15,483 that made under $25,000 a yr, 13,903 were considered below poverty level.

So it is 30M, 45M, or 50+M?
It is amazing people bandy around numbers with little understanding.

 

[Borillar]

All of you Obamatrons so constantly blathering "Bush LIED people died" because they haven't found the WMDs yet that are in Syria by the way... YET YOU've bought hook line and sinker the BIGGEST most disastrous lie that Obama has told: "there are 46 million uninsured Americans"!

FACTS are there are less the 4 million Americans that truly want and need insurance! 4 Million NOT 46 million!

YET this bald grotesque LIE passed Obamacare by only 6 votes..
AND NOW we have even Harry Reid calling Obamacare a "train wreck"!
All because everyone including conservatives still think there were 46 million that wanted and needed insurance!

1) Census says 10 million of uninsured are not citizens!
2) A studyBlue Cross and Blue Shield Association contracted with the Actuarial Research Corporation (ARC) to provide a detailed analysis of the uninsured identified by the Census Bureau, which found:
- Of the 44.7 million non-elderly uninsured individuals identified in the 2004 Census Current Population Survey (CPS) data,
nearly one-third — almost 14 million — were reachable through existing government
health programs such as Medicaid and the State Children’s Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) under current rules.
by Source: http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf

24 million from 46 million leaves 22 million!
NOW the biggest stupidest LIE!!
Counted among those remaining 22 million are 18 million people that DON'T WANT health insurance!
DO YOU UNDERSTAND the implications of this???
These 18 million make over $50,000 a year. Don't want their employers insurance because they spend less then $1,000 a year out of their own pocket for health care!
THAT leaves 4 million! NOT 46 million! The biggest LIE ever told by a President... FAR BIGGER and more costly then WMDs!!!

Bush's lies about WMDs precipitated a war costing thousands of US servicemen their lives, tens of thousands of US servicemen to be wounded or maimed, hundreds of thousands of Iraqis dead, millions of Iraqis displaced, billions of dollars lost, and trillions of dollars wasted. And for what? So Bush could get revenge on Saddam for an attempted assassination attempt on his dad?

Inflated claims of people needing health care haven't cost any lives that I'm aware of. We haven't invaded any other countries because of healthcare. Seems pretty clear to me which lie is bigger.

 

[healthmyths]

....per The Axis Of Ignorance.​

ON August 21, 2009 Obama said: "We are not a nation that accepts nearly 46 million uninsured men, women and children,"
46 Million Uninsured: A Look Behind The Number : NPR
Now I gave you Obama's exact QUOTE! HE said 46 million!

OK let's concede he said 30 million!
18 million DON"T WANT HEALTH INSURANCE. THEY PAY THEIR OWN WAY!
So are you counting people that don't want health insurance???
That leaves 12 million!
WHY then are 10 million per the census counted when they are NOT AMERICANS?
That leaves 2 million you idiot!

In 2009, according to the U.S. Census there were 50,674 million with no insurance.
These people fell into the following income levels:

Less than $25,000 a yr - 15,483
$25,000 - $49,000 a yr - 15,278
$50,000 -$74,000 a yr - 9,352
$75,000 and more a yr - 10,561

Out of the 15,483 that made under $25,000 a yr, 13,903 were considered below poverty level.

WHERE IS YOUR SOURCE?? Because here are mine!
I am not afraid of showing MY facts why are you???

1) I can tell you 10 million of Obama's 46 million PER THE below link are NOT AMERICANS!
Source: Income, Poverty and Health Insurance Coverage in the United States: 2009 - Income & Wealth - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau

A study of the Census' also shows:
2) GIVEN: 14 million are eligible for Medicaid..but they are counted as "uninsured"….
but Obama totally ignored this FACT and subtracting 14 million from 36 million that leaves 22 million…
Source: http://coverageforall.org/pdf/BC-BS_Uninsured-America.pdf

3) Source:The American Spectator : The Myth of the 46 Million
"in 2007, 17.6 million of the uninsured had annual incomes of more than $50,000 and 9.1 million earned more than $75,000. "

Check out my links and you will see that 18 million are people that can afford but don't want health insurance because it is less for them to pay out of pocket!

 

[TheSeventhTiger]

How do Demorats expect .001 of all Americans (millionaires) to pay for 50 or so Million Americans health-care, among other living expenses. Obama makes it sound as if Millionaires are all over the place with Trillions and Trillions of dollars they don't spend and never will. Yup, lets all go to Detroit and other crappy suberbs and look for these multi-millionaires.

 

[TheSeventhTiger]

lets just wait and see what happens as illegals and "The Dumb-Informed" go to an ER, private practice, clinic and either have a 5/4 hour wait, their doctor on vacation, its closed, need to fill out a 25 page form, will demand some form of payment ahead of time, etc. all of these dufasses who think that as of now, all health-care is free, no long lines, will be in for a big surprise soon!

 

[TheSeventhTiger]

and what makes all of these Mexicans crossing the border believe that once they make it in the USA, Everything Is Free? Really? did they do their homework first? do they know we are 17 Trillion in debt along with 200 or so Trillion in unfunded liabilities for the next 20/25 years?

 

[Redfish]

Anyone who supports going to Iraq and making it so all those Americans died....well, fuck you.

that would be Bill and Hillary Clinton, Biden, Gore, Kerry, Scumer, Reid, and a majority of the democrats in congress. so I guess you can tell all of them to fuck off too.

congress authorized and funded Iraq. It was a stupid waste of american lives and money. but both parties are equally responsible.

Stop the fucking lies and tell the truth, you might gain a small measure of credibility.

 

[Zona]

Anyone who supports going to Iraq and making it so all those Americans died....well, fuck you.

that would be Bill and Hillary Clinton, Biden, Gore, Kerry, Scumer, Reid, and a majority of the democrats in congress. so I guess you can tell all of them to fuck off too.

congress authorized and funded Iraq. It was a stupid waste of american lives and money. but both parties are equally responsible.

Stop the fucking lies and tell the truth, you might gain a small measure of credibility.

Who was president. Simply respond to that please.

 

[buckeye45_73]

Healthmyths has started this same thread about 2 dozen times now,

and it's based on HIS lie.

The truth is as follows:

Link is below:

Last night, President Obama stated: "We are the only democracy—the only advanced democracy on Earth—the only wealthy nation—that allows such hardship for millions of its people. There are now more than 30 million American citizens who cannot get coverage."

So for starters the OP is lying because the President's number, which was based on census numbers,

was 30+ million, not 46 million.

Once the OP concedes that he has been lying about this for YEARS now, then maybe we could move to deciding what the most reasonable accurate number was.

Counting the Uninsured: 46 Million or ?More than 30 Million?? | The White House

Ok so explain this?
46 Million Uninsured: A Look Behind The Number : NPR

We are not a nation that accepts nearly 46 million uninsured men, women and children," President Obama told doctors in a speech before the American Medical Association in Chicago in June

Look man, liberals cant lie and change the subject anymore, it's too easy to look it up.......