Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2

[Hollie]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

I noticed right away that Lebanon, Egypt, Golan, etc. are spelled differently than Palestine. Where I come from, that's called "a clue".

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

 

[USAF 2023]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Palestine doesn’t have the authority to claim Israel’s borders

Abbas “ All of Israel is Arab Palestine”
He apparently considers May 14, 1948 and “ International Law” invalid

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Palestine doesn’t have the authority to claim Israel’s borders

Abbas “ All of Israel is Arab Palestine”
He apparently considers May 14, 1948 and “ International Law” invalid

What international law are you talking about?

Link?

 

[Shusha]

"Citizens of a territory"? Are you writing a new dictionary?

Not at all. I am a citizen of the US. A territory defined by international borders.

What part of that confuses you?

“ International Borders” that you claim Israel never had because the U.N. did not have the “ authority to do so” were defined by the U. N. And we’re not accepted by the Arabs
What part of that confuses you?

None of it. The Palestinians have the right not to divide their territory. Nobody else has the right to divide it for them.

Not true. Division of territory based on self-determination of peoples is not only legal, it’s normal.

Link?

Yugoslavia. Czechoslovakia. USSR. India. Ottoman Empire. Sudan. You can't HAVE self-determination for peoples without dividing territory. It would make it impossible to achieve. How can the Palestinians have self-determination without dividing them from the self-determination of the Syrians and the Jordanians?

Its utterly ridiculous for you to keep claiming this not existent "legal premise" that territory can not be divided. Of course it can.

 

[Shusha]

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

No we haven't ducked the question. Again...Israel has the authority to claim borders because she is a STATE. She (long ago) met the requirements for being a state and has been recognized as a state in the international community. One of the most important qualifications for being a state is the ability to create treaties with other states. Such as the treaties Israel has with Jordan and Egypt.

The reason "Palestine" (whatever you mean by that) does not have borders is that it currently does not meet the criteria for being a state. Until such time as it does, it can not, by definition, have borders.

 

[P F Tinmore]

Not at all. I am a citizen of the US. A territory defined by international borders.

What part of that confuses you?

“ International Borders” that you claim Israel never had because the U.N. did not have the “ authority to do so” were defined by the U. N. And we’re not accepted by the Arabs
What part of that confuses you?

None of it. The Palestinians have the right not to divide their territory. Nobody else has the right to divide it for them.

Not true. Division of territory based on self-determination of peoples is not only legal, it’s normal.

Link?

Yugoslavia. Czechoslovakia. USSR. India. Ottoman Empire. Sudan. You can't HAVE self-determination for peoples without dividing territory. It would make it impossible to achieve. How can the Palestinians have self-determination without dividing them from the self-determination of the Syrians and the Jordanians?

Its utterly ridiculous for you to keep claiming this not existent "legal premise" that territory can not be divided. Of course it can.

No link?

 

[Shusha]

“ International Borders” that you claim Israel never had because the U.N. did not have the “ authority to do so” were defined by the U. N. And we’re not accepted by the Arabs
What part of that confuses you?

None of it. The Palestinians have the right not to divide their territory. Nobody else has the right to divide it for them.

Not true. Division of territory based on self-determination of peoples is not only legal, it’s normal.

Link?

Yugoslavia. Czechoslovakia. USSR. India. Ottoman Empire. Sudan. You can't HAVE self-determination for peoples without dividing territory. It would make it impossible to achieve. How can the Palestinians have self-determination without dividing them from the self-determination of the Syrians and the Jordanians?

Its utterly ridiculous for you to keep claiming this not existent "legal premise" that territory can not be divided. Of course it can.

No link?

You need a link to learn that the former territories of Yugoslavia, etc were, in point of fact, divided?

 

[P F Tinmore]

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

No we haven't ducked the question. Again...Israel has the authority to claim borders because she is a STATE. She (long ago) met the requirements for being a state and has been recognized as a state in the international community. One of the most important qualifications for being a state is the ability to create treaties with other states. Such as the treaties Israel has with Jordan and Egypt.

The reason "Palestine" (whatever you mean by that) does not have borders is that it currently does not meet the criteria for being a state. Until such time as it does, it can not, by definition, have borders.

She (long ago) met the requirements for being a state and has been recognized as a state in the international community.

Indeed, what are those requirements?

 

[Hollie]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Israel cannot get borders without treaty.

Where is it?

 

[Hollie]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Israel cannot get borders without treaty.

Where is it?

Indeed, Israel has treaties with neighboring countries. Can you identify them?

Link?

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Look in the legend for the symbol for international boundaries then find them on the map.

 

[Hollie]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Look in the legend for the symbol for international boundaries then find them on the map.

That's the same cut and paste map you have dumped multiple times in multiple threads.

What do you think the map represents?

Link?

 

[P F Tinmore]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

Nice deflection.

Now how about those borders?

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Look in the legend for the symbol for international boundaries then find them on the map.

That's the same cut and paste map you have dumped multiple times in multiple threads.

What do you think the map represents?

Link?

Just what it says. Palestine's international borders.

 

[Hollie]

RE: Who Are The Palestinians? Part 2
⁜→ P F Tinmore, et al,

OK, here we go (again).

(COMMENT)

◈ Jordan: • Jordan-Israeli Peace Treaty (1994) • Article 3 - International Boundary

1. The international boundary between Jordan and Israel is delimited with reference to the boundary definition under the Mandate as is shown in Annex I (a), on the mapping materials attached thereto and coordinates specified therein.​

◈ Egypt: • Egypt-Israel Peace Treaty (26 March 1979) • Article II

The permanent boundary between Egypt and Israel is the recognized international boundary between Egypt and the former mandated territory of Palestine.​

◈ Lebanon: • Letter dated 9 June 2000 from the President of Lebanon addressed to the Secretary-General • II. Report of the Secretary-General of 22 May 2000 (S/2000/460)
Paragraph 13 of the report states that “the international boundary between Israel and Lebanon was established pursuant to the 1923 Agreement between France and Great Britain ...”

◈ Syria: • 14 December 1981 | Israel Annexes Former Syrian Territory of Golan Heights • Golan Heights Law​

Does,, w,hatever you call "Palestine," even remotely like this???



........View attachment 278499
Most Respectfully,
R

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Look in the legend for the symbol for international boundaries then find them on the map.

That's the same cut and paste map you have dumped multiple times in multiple threads.

What do you think the map represents?

Link?

Just what it says. Palestine's international borders.

The map is dated 1956. I'd have to check my calendar but I think 1948 came before 1956 and a map entitled "Plan......."

Link?

 

[Shusha]

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

No we haven't ducked the question. Again...Israel has the authority to claim borders because she is a STATE. She (long ago) met the requirements for being a state and has been recognized as a state in the international community. One of the most important qualifications for being a state is the ability to create treaties with other states. Such as the treaties Israel has with Jordan and Egypt.

The reason "Palestine" (whatever you mean by that) does not have borders is that it currently does not meet the criteria for being a state. Until such time as it does, it can not, by definition, have borders.

She (long ago) met the requirements for being a state and has been recognized as a state in the international community.

Indeed, what are those requirements?

Oh, come on now, you know these as well as I do: a government, a defined territory, a population and the ability to enter into formal agreements with other states.

Yeah, yeah, you are going to argue that Israel does not have the necessary "defined territory". But you apply some ridiculous notions about what "defined territory" means so you can claim Israel doesn't have it.

• International boundaries follow the previous boundaries in cases where there is a transfer of nationality or a division of territory occurs. The new nation therefore has the same boundaries as the old.
• International treaties, such as the Mandate for Palestine, can delineate or form boundaries.
• International treaties between states determine boundaries between states.
• States can abandon territory in a number of ways, such as removing actual sovereign control of a specific territory, creating a new boundary unilaterally, or through treaties with other states, including nascent states, creating a new boundary by mutual agreement.

Israel meets absolutely every one of these criteria. Without question.

Your imaginary "State of Palestine" meets none. It doesn't even come close until somewhere between 1988 and 1994, and arguably even now.

 

[P F Tinmore]

You have posted this many times but you have always ducked the question about where Israel got the authority to claim Palestine's borders.

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Look in the legend for the symbol for international boundaries then find them on the map.

That's the same cut and paste map you have dumped multiple times in multiple threads.

What do you think the map represents?

Link?

Just what it says. Palestine's international borders.

The map is dated 1956. I'd have to check my calendar but I think 1948 came before 1956 and a map entitled "Plan......."

Link?

Now you are obfuscating.

 

[Hollie]

Israel never claimed palestine's borders. What does that mean. What borders did any soverign "country of Pal'istan" have?

Link?

Look in the legend for the symbol for international boundaries then find them on the map.

That's the same cut and paste map you have dumped multiple times in multiple threads.

What do you think the map represents?

Link?

Just what it says. Palestine's international borders.

The map is dated 1956. I'd have to check my calendar but I think 1948 came before 1956 and a map entitled "Plan......."

Link?

Now you are obfuscating.

Why?

It's a map you cut and pasted and you don't understand what the map represents?

Link?

 

[Shusha]

Just what it says. Palestine's international borders.

Oh, you are SO close! Yes, it shows the international borders which were passed down, in accordance with customary law, during a transfer of nationality or statehood. And what new state was formed there in 1948? Israel. Only Israel. Thank you for confirming Israel's borders.