Why is Building the Wall Wrong?

[dblack]

"Freedom to choose who comes in"

That's not freedom. That's authoritarian state power.

Is it authoritarian when you lock your doors before you leave the house? Is it authoritarian to have an alarm on your home? Is it authoritarian for you to fence off your property? Is it authoritarian to have a car alarm on your vehicle?

"Authoritarian" applies to government. Individuals aren't empowered to employ violence and can't be authoritarian.

Sure they can. When your boss tells you to perform a task you really hate, that's authoritarian.

No, it's not. Authoritarian describes a mode of government. I know liberals want to pretend that employers are oppressors, but the truth is that we can tell them to piss off whenever we like. And we won't be arrest or thrown in jail for doing so.

No, that's only one definition:

authoritarian
[uh-thawr-i-tair-ee-uh n, uh-thor-]
See more synonyms for authoritarian on Thesaurus

adjective

1. favoring complete obedience or subjection to authority as opposed to individual freedom:authoritarian principles; authoritarian attitudes.
2. of or relating to a governmental or political system, principle, or practice in which individual freedom is held as completely subordinate to the power or authority of the state, centered either in one person or a small group that is not constitutionally accountable to the people.
3. exercising complete or almost complete control over the will of another or of others:

the definition of authoritarian

Now let's concentrate for a moment on the definition you highlight. "A group that is not constitutionally accountable to the people."

That would mean that bureaucrats are authoritarians. That would mean appointed judges are authoritarians.

The law makers that create laws are constitutionally accountable to the people. We don't live in a lawless society, and having laws (that are constitutional) are not authoritarian.

Our representatives are constitutionally charged with the safety of the people foreign or domestic. When people are coming here lowering our wages, when people are coming here selling deadly narcotics to our people, when people are coming here killing our citizens and police officers alike, when people break our laws by entering illegally, the Constitution demands that our representatives adhere to the oath they took which is to conduct themselves in a constitutional way.

The equivocation mambo!

 

[OKTexas]

Trump's campaign promise was a big beautiful wall covering the southern border which would stop illegal immigration from the south. Then the big beautiful wall covering the border became a 1000 mile wall. Then the big beautiful wall became a project to replace a 112 miles of reinforced fencing with a 216 mile slatted steel fence, increased electronic motoring, and aerial surveillance. This is beginning to sound a lot like the increased border security under Obama and Bush.

We're down to a maybe on slats. Meanwhile, border agents are not being paid.

GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN: MORE THAN 54,000 BORDER PATROL AGENTS TO WORK WITHOUT PAY, WHILE TRUMP SAYS THEY ‘WANT THE WALL’
More than 54,000 Border Patrol agents will be working without pay as government shutdown continues

MAGA-n-shit.

You mean they might not be paid on time. BTW according to the DHS white house briefing today, border patrol intercepted 3700 know or suspected terrorist last year. How many of those would you like to see get through. Keep in mind they didn't intercept all border crossers last year, I wonder how many terrorist made it?

.

We've been through that bullshit already.

Odd that the jails aren;t bursting with all these "terrorists" caught huh?

Maybe that's why Trump defeated ISIS. They all got caught crossing the Mexican border.
'
What a crock

Poor little Lush, got a problem with the DHS report, prove it wrong. I'll be waiting with my glass of tea, till you do. LMAO

.

Bullshit. Post this report and actually read what it says. It's nonsense

Nah, I trust the person that was in the briefing, it's your problem if you don't. If you're lucky the WH will publish it.

.

 

[Lesh]

Nah, I trust the person that was in the briefing, it's your problem if you don't. If you're lucky the WH will publish it.

Oh noes! Trumpers talking out their asses again?

 

[OKTexas]

It will be a wall in some places and a fence in others. It depends on the application of the area. Trump isn't an engineer.

Furthermore it's the Democrats stopping Trump from what he would like to spend, so put the blame where it really belongs.

Trump's campaign promise was a big beautiful wall covering the southern border which would stop illegal immigration from the south. Then the big beautiful wall covering the border became a 1000 mile wall. Then the big beautiful wall became a project to replace a 112 miles of reinforced fencing with a 216 mile slatted steel fence, increased electronic motoring, and aerial surveillance. This is beginning to sound a lot like the increased border security under Obama and Bush.

And that's Trump's fault or the Democrats?

Trump asked for 25 billion originally. HIs asking price now is 1/5 of that, and the Democrats are going to fight him tooth and nail for it. So now you blame less quality on Trump instead of them?

What is it with you on the left that never......ever want to assume responsibility for your actions? Now if the Democrats approved 25 billion and Trump didn't deliver, then you'd have a solid argument. But to say Trump failed us when it was actually the Democrats is an out and out lie.

And 25 billion was offered and turned down. Trump doesn't actually KNOW what he wants

I don't think you know what you are talking about. Show me where the Democrats offered the 25 billion and he turned it down for no reason.

Keep up. Schumer offered that on January 19 last year in return for reauthorizing DCA. Trump spit in his face

Actually it was the House that spit in his face, but no need for facts in your propaganda, right?

.

 

[OKTexas]

Nah, I trust the person that was in the briefing, it's your problem if you don't. If you're lucky the WH will publish it.

Oh noes! Trumpers talking out their asses again?

Damn, you're not even a good troll.


.

 

[Dale Smith]

Nah, I trust the person that was in the briefing, it's your problem if you don't. If you're lucky the WH will publish it.

Oh noes! Trumpers talking out their asses again?

Damn, you're not even a good troll.


.

Lesh tries to be a good non-troll-like but her postings give her away......

 

[Flopper]

So it's not actually a wall and it's not actually going across the southern border?

What exactly are we shutting down the government over??

5.8 billion dollars.

slush fund

 

[Lesh]

Trump's campaign promise was a big beautiful wall covering the southern border which would stop illegal immigration from the south. Then the big beautiful wall covering the border became a 1000 mile wall. Then the big beautiful wall became a project to replace a 112 miles of reinforced fencing with a 216 mile slatted steel fence, increased electronic motoring, and aerial surveillance. This is beginning to sound a lot like the increased border security under Obama and Bush.

And that's Trump's fault or the Democrats?

Trump asked for 25 billion originally. HIs asking price now is 1/5 of that, and the Democrats are going to fight him tooth and nail for it. So now you blame less quality on Trump instead of them?

What is it with you on the left that never......ever want to assume responsibility for your actions? Now if the Democrats approved 25 billion and Trump didn't deliver, then you'd have a solid argument. But to say Trump failed us when it was actually the Democrats is an out and out lie.

And 25 billion was offered and turned down. Trump doesn't actually KNOW what he wants

I don't think you know what you are talking about. Show me where the Democrats offered the 25 billion and he turned it down for no reason.

Keep up. Schumer offered that on January 19 last year in return for reauthorizing DCA. Trump spit in his face

Actually it was the House that spit in his face, but no need for facts in your propaganda, right?

.

Offering 25 billion is not spitting in anyone's face retard.

 

[Dale Smith]

And that's Trump's fault or the Democrats?

Trump asked for 25 billion originally. HIs asking price now is 1/5 of that, and the Democrats are going to fight him tooth and nail for it. So now you blame less quality on Trump instead of them?

What is it with you on the left that never......ever want to assume responsibility for your actions? Now if the Democrats approved 25 billion and Trump didn't deliver, then you'd have a solid argument. But to say Trump failed us when it was actually the Democrats is an out and out lie.

And 25 billion was offered and turned down. Trump doesn't actually KNOW what he wants

I don't think you know what you are talking about. Show me where the Democrats offered the 25 billion and he turned it down for no reason.

Keep up. Schumer offered that on January 19 last year in return for reauthorizing DCA. Trump spit in his face

Actually it was the House that spit in his face, but no need for facts in your propaganda, right?

.

Offering 25 billion is not spitting in anyone's face retard.

LMAO!!! Try using a "comma", ya dumb fuck.

 

[Lesh]

When you're reduced to playing grammar Nazi you might as well just quit, retard.

 

[OKTexas]

And that's Trump's fault or the Democrats?

Trump asked for 25 billion originally. HIs asking price now is 1/5 of that, and the Democrats are going to fight him tooth and nail for it. So now you blame less quality on Trump instead of them?

What is it with you on the left that never......ever want to assume responsibility for your actions? Now if the Democrats approved 25 billion and Trump didn't deliver, then you'd have a solid argument. But to say Trump failed us when it was actually the Democrats is an out and out lie.

And 25 billion was offered and turned down. Trump doesn't actually KNOW what he wants

I don't think you know what you are talking about. Show me where the Democrats offered the 25 billion and he turned it down for no reason.

Keep up. Schumer offered that on January 19 last year in return for reauthorizing DCA. Trump spit in his face

Actually it was the House that spit in his face, but no need for facts in your propaganda, right?

.

Offering 25 billion is not spitting in anyone's face retard.

The senate is the one that made the offer, the house said no, too many other things involved they objected to.

.

 

[Lesh]

And 25 billion was offered and turned down. Trump doesn't actually KNOW what he wants

I don't think you know what you are talking about. Show me where the Democrats offered the 25 billion and he turned it down for no reason.

Keep up. Schumer offered that on January 19 last year in return for reauthorizing DCA. Trump spit in his face

Actually it was the House that spit in his face, but no need for facts in your propaganda, right?

.

Offering 25 billion is not spitting in anyone's face retard.

The senate is the one that made the offer, the house said no, too many other things involved they objected to.

.

The GOP HOUSE?

What did they object to?

THEY didn't want 25 billion in wall funding?

 

[OKTexas]

I don't think you know what you are talking about. Show me where the Democrats offered the 25 billion and he turned it down for no reason.

Keep up. Schumer offered that on January 19 last year in return for reauthorizing DCA. Trump spit in his face

Actually it was the House that spit in his face, but no need for facts in your propaganda, right?

.

Offering 25 billion is not spitting in anyone's face retard.

The senate is the one that made the offer, the house said no, too many other things involved they objected to.

.

The GOP HOUSE?

What did they object to?

THEY didn't want 25 billion in wall funding?

That was months ago, look it up. I know there was some shamnesty involved.

.

 

[Flopper]

We still have a government shut down...and Trump is claiming it's because of a wall

But I guess the Trumpers don't want to talk about it any more since well...it's not actually a wall but a fence...and it's not actually going to run across the whole southern border...because ya know....like the sane ones of us have been saying...that would be a stupid waste of money that pretty much could never happen anyway

It will be a wall in some places and a fence in others. It depends on the application of the area. Trump isn't an engineer.

Furthermore it's the Democrats stopping Trump from what he would like to spend, so put the blame where it really belongs.

Trump's campaign promise was a big beautiful wall covering the southern border which would stop illegal immigration from the south. Then the big beautiful wall covering the border became a 1000 mile wall. Then the big beautiful wall became a project to replace a 112 miles of reinforced fencing with a 216 mile slatted steel fence, increased electronic motoring, and aerial surveillance. This is beginning to sound a lot like the increased border security under Obama and Bush.

And that's Trump's fault or the Democrats?

Trump asked for 25 billion originally. HIs asking price now is 1/5 of that, and the Democrats are going to fight him tooth and nail for it. So now you blame less quality on Trump instead of them?

What is it with you on the left that never......ever want to assume responsibility for your actions? Now if the Democrats approved 25 billion and Trump didn't deliver, then you'd have a solid argument. But to say Trump failed us when it was actually the Democrats is an out and out lie.

Yes, it is Trump's fault. Don't you remember the Trump campaign rhetoric.

"I am the greatest deal maker this county has every seen."

“MY STYLE of deal-making is quite simple and straightforward. I aim very high, and then I just keep pushing and pushing and pushing to get what I’m after. And I always get what I want."

"When it comes to negotiations, democrats are a push over"

Well it seems the greatest deal maker that ever lived has met his match simply because he does not know how to deal with congress. In order to get any money for his wall he has to offer House democrats concessions on immigration and that's not going to be easy because almost anything he offers will cost far right votes.

House democrats shouldn't cave in. They have the votes and they have the public. Neither the wall nor Trump's government shutdown is popular. Cowing down to the school yard bully would cost them dearly.

 

[bripat9643]

Really, no one told me I can't go anywhere? Me thinks you need to elaborate a bit.

Better make sure you have all your papers handy. And don't have too much of a tan.

I always carry my drivers license, moron.

 

[bripat9643]

No, I dislike illegals. Regular immigrants are cool.

Then we can surely count on you to increase (or remove) immigration quotas and bureaucratic barriers to legal immigration, right?

Why increase them? How big IS your family?

So, I guess you don't think immigrants aren't THAT cool.

The government sets quotas based on several factors. If they decide we need more, then ok. But not just because of nothing.

Actually, no there are no quotas. Congress sets the maximum number immigrants at about 675,000 per year plus about half dozen categories of immigration that pushes the total to about a million a year or higher.

Then the law establishes the maximum number of immigrants from any country as 7% of the total, about 70,000 excluding certain categories. However, this figure is reduced by the number of legal residents from that country living in the US who change immigration status to permanent resident. Immigrants being sponsored by family members further reduces the number as well as employment sponsoring and other categories of immigration.

So for most countries if you do not have family living in the US or have special skills that will attract an employer to sponsor you or you don't fit in one of the other special categories, you simple can not immigrate to the US, no matter how long you wait.

Yeah? So what? Since when does anyone have a right to emigrate to the United States?

 

[Rigby5]

Moron leftists say a wall wont stop them all. There is truth in that BUT just ask them this...

If you had to play Russian Roulette would you rather have 1 bullet in the revolver or 5?

That makes no sense because the way to stop there from being refugees wanting asylum in the US is to stop arming military dictatorship in places like Honduras, Guatamala, etc. A wall is a waste of time and money because desperate people fleeing death, will get around or over it. The US is mostly coastline. There is no way to build a wall for that. Tons of drug fly in over the border all the time. All a wall would do is make it costly enough so that these planes would be smuggling people as well.

 

[Rigby5]

Then we can surely count on you to increase (or remove) immigration quotas and bureaucratic barriers to legal immigration, right?

Why increase them? How big IS your family?

So, I guess you don't think immigrants aren't THAT cool.

The government sets quotas based on several factors. If they decide we need more, then ok. But not just because of nothing.

Actually, no there are no quotas. Congress sets the maximum number immigrants at about 675,000 per year plus about half dozen categories of immigration that pushes the total to about a million a year or higher.

Then the law establishes the maximum number of immigrants from any country as 7% of the total, about 70,000 excluding certain categories. However, this figure is reduced by the number of legal residents from that country living in the US who change immigration status to permanent resident. Immigrants being sponsored by family members further reduces the number as well as employment sponsoring and other categories of immigration.

So for most countries if you do not have family living in the US or have special skills that will attract an employer to sponsor you or you don't fit in one of the other special categories, you simple can not immigrate to the US, no matter how long you wait.

Yeah? So what? Since when does anyone have a right to emigrate to the United States?

When the colonists came here from Europe 500 years ago, it was they who claimed anyone had the right to immigrate here, and now we are stuck with that legal precedent. But it is even more complex because when we negotiated treaties to buy CA, AZ, NM, NV, CO, UT, TX, FL and others, there were already over a million Mexicans living here, so we agreed to treaties that prohibited any infringement on travel by Mexicans. Those million Mexicans were not required to become US citizens or leave. So we can't now close the border or else be in violation of the treaties and be in default.

 

[bripat9643]

Why increase them? How big IS your family?

So, I guess you don't think immigrants aren't THAT cool.

The government sets quotas based on several factors. If they decide we need more, then ok. But not just because of nothing.

Actually, no there are no quotas. Congress sets the maximum number immigrants at about 675,000 per year plus about half dozen categories of immigration that pushes the total to about a million a year or higher.

Then the law establishes the maximum number of immigrants from any country as 7% of the total, about 70,000 excluding certain categories. However, this figure is reduced by the number of legal residents from that country living in the US who change immigration status to permanent resident. Immigrants being sponsored by family members further reduces the number as well as employment sponsoring and other categories of immigration.

So for most countries if you do not have family living in the US or have special skills that will attract an employer to sponsor you or you don't fit in one of the other special categories, you simple can not immigrate to the US, no matter how long you wait.

Yeah? So what? Since when does anyone have a right to emigrate to the United States?

When the colonists came here from Europe 500 years ago, it was they who claimed anyone had the right to immigrate here, and now we are stuck with that legal precedent. But it is even more complex because when we negotiated treaties to buy CA, AZ, NM, NV, CO, UT, TX, FL and others, there were already over a million Mexicans living here, so we agreed to treaties that prohibited any infringement on travel by Mexicans. Those million Mexicans were not required to become US citizens or leave. So we can't now close the border or else be in violation of the treaties and be in default.

Those treaties were all defunct long ago. Our government isn't bound by any of them.

 

[basquebromance]

Trump is strong. Trump is kind. Trump is generous of spirit. he's gonna get a deal done that makes everyone happy