Why would a God even need a hell?

[Mickiel]

Hell is a crutch for religions that cannot walk on their own.

Hell is only a crutch for those who arrogantly reject the Bible as Gods word, and believing goes beyond just recognizing the truth. To believe in Christ for salvation requires a transfer of allegiance. We stop worshiping ourselves, we forsake our sin, and we begin to worship God with our heart, soul, mind, and strength.


Its eternal darkness...separation from a loving God.
Cant remember where I found this but it states well the never ending myth ( by some) that God is a tyrant and treats people unjustly, just throwing the innocent away.
"Each sinner has a fully informed, acutely aware, and sensitive conscience which, in hell, becomes his own tormentor. This is the experience of torture in hell—a person fully aware of his or her sin with a relentlessly accusing conscience, without relief for even one moment. The guilt of sin will produce shame and everlasting self-hatred. The rich man knew that eternal punishment for a lifetime of sins is justified and deserved. That is why he never protested or questioned being in hell."

The belief that God would allow eternal suffering without relief is insane. Its also evidence that religion drives human beliefs insane. And Christianity is the master of ceremonies in that crazy world.

You are now speaking for God by stating "its insane for God to allow eternal eternal suffering"...and based on what.

I

Hell is a crutch for religions that cannot walk on their own.

Hell is only a crutch for those who arrogantly reject the Bible as Gods word, and believing goes beyond just recognizing the truth. To believe in Christ for salvation requires a transfer of allegiance. We stop worshiping ourselves, we forsake our sin, and we begin to worship God with our heart, soul, mind, and strength.


Its eternal darkness...separation from a loving God.
Cant remember where I found this but it states well the never ending myth ( by some) that God is a tyrant and treats people unjustly, just throwing the innocent away.
"Each sinner has a fully informed, acutely aware, and sensitive conscience which, in hell, becomes his own tormentor. This is the experience of torture in hell—a person fully aware of his or her sin with a relentlessly accusing conscience, without relief for even one moment. The guilt of sin will produce shame and everlasting self-hatred. The rich man knew that eternal punishment for a lifetime of sins is justified and deserved. That is why he never protested or questioned being in hell."

The belief that God would allow eternal suffering without relief is insane. Its also evidence that religion drives human beliefs insane. And Christianity is the master of ceremonies in that crazy world.

You are now speaking for God by stating "its insane for God to allow eternal eternal suffering"...and based on what.

I speak for me , myself and my cat.

I was just curious...
lol @ your cat. They always have an opinion, I love 'em.

My cat is a trip , she does not believe in the Christian view of hell; she reads it like this:

How many times is hell mentioned in the Bible?

 

[ding]

Hell is only a crutch for those who arrogantly reject the Bible as Gods word, and believing goes beyond just recognizing the truth. To believe in Christ for salvation requires a transfer of allegiance. We stop worshiping ourselves, we forsake our sin, and we begin to worship God with our heart, soul, mind, and strength.


Its eternal darkness...separation from a loving God.
Cant remember where I found this but it states well the never ending myth ( by some) that God is a tyrant and treats people unjustly, just throwing the innocent away.
"Each sinner has a fully informed, acutely aware, and sensitive conscience which, in hell, becomes his own tormentor. This is the experience of torture in hell—a person fully aware of his or her sin with a relentlessly accusing conscience, without relief for even one moment. The guilt of sin will produce shame and everlasting self-hatred. The rich man knew that eternal punishment for a lifetime of sins is justified and deserved. That is why he never protested or questioned being in hell."

The belief that God would allow eternal suffering without relief is insane. Its also evidence that religion drives human beliefs insane. And Christianity is the master of ceremonies in that crazy world.

You are now speaking for God by stating "its insane for God to allow eternal eternal suffering"...and based on what.

I

Hell is only a crutch for those who arrogantly reject the Bible as Gods word, and believing goes beyond just recognizing the truth. To believe in Christ for salvation requires a transfer of allegiance. We stop worshiping ourselves, we forsake our sin, and we begin to worship God with our heart, soul, mind, and strength.


Its eternal darkness...separation from a loving God.
Cant remember where I found this but it states well the never ending myth ( by some) that God is a tyrant and treats people unjustly, just throwing the innocent away.
"Each sinner has a fully informed, acutely aware, and sensitive conscience which, in hell, becomes his own tormentor. This is the experience of torture in hell—a person fully aware of his or her sin with a relentlessly accusing conscience, without relief for even one moment. The guilt of sin will produce shame and everlasting self-hatred. The rich man knew that eternal punishment for a lifetime of sins is justified and deserved. That is why he never protested or questioned being in hell."

The belief that God would allow eternal suffering without relief is insane. Its also evidence that religion drives human beliefs insane. And Christianity is the master of ceremonies in that crazy world.

You are now speaking for God by stating "its insane for God to allow eternal eternal suffering"...and based on what.

I speak for me , myself and my cat.

I was just curious...
lol @ your cat. They always have an opinion, I love 'em.

My cat is a trip , she does not believe in the Christian view of hell; she reads it like this:

How many times is hell mentioned in the Bible?

If you ask a militant atheist they will tell you it is every other word.

 

[Mudda]

God needs a hell because he gets his jollies scaring dimwits like dingbat.

 

[Dr Grump]

Have you ever created anything? Because the act of creating would be intangible not tangible. What you created would be tangible.

Not it is not. It is absolutely tangible. If I create a salad, I can easily prove it and provide tangible evidence

Maybe you should look up the definition of tangible and intangible. Better yet, why don't you tell me the difference between the two.

I know what they both mean. My point stands. The fact you seem to want to dance in circles about 'meanings' suggests you know you're on a losing streak here.

But let's play the game:

Intangible
not tangible; incapable of being perceived by the sense of touch, as incorporeal or immaterial things; impalpable.

I can't touch the lettuce as I make the salad? or the cucumber? or anything else that goes in the salad. I've even bolded the important part.

 

[Dr Grump]

Given your silence, I am guessing you did look up those definitions.

I was silent because I was asleep. you do know I'm not in the US, right?

 

[ding]

Have you ever created anything? Because the act of creating would be intangible not tangible. What you created would be tangible.

Not it is not. It is absolutely tangible. If I create a salad, I can easily prove it and provide tangible evidence

Maybe you should look up the definition of tangible and intangible. Better yet, why don't you tell me the difference between the two.

I know what they both mean. My point stands. The fact you seem to want to dance in circles about 'meanings' suggests you know you're on a losing streak here.

But let's play the game:

Intangible
not tangible; incapable of being perceived by the sense of touch, as incorporeal or immaterial things; impalpable.

I can't touch the lettuce as I make the salad? or the cucumber? or anything else that goes in the salad. I've even bolded the important part.

The lettuce would be tangible. You making the salad is intangible.

tangible: a thing that is perceptible by touch.

intangible: not made of physical substance; unable to be touched or grasped; not having physical presence.

The act of making a salad is not made of physical substance. It is a freaking act.

 

[ding]

Have you ever created anything? Because the act of creating would be intangible not tangible. What you created would be tangible.

Not it is not. It is absolutely tangible. If I create a salad, I can easily prove it and provide tangible evidence

Maybe you should look up the definition of tangible and intangible. Better yet, why don't you tell me the difference between the two.

I know what they both mean. My point stands. The fact you seem to want to dance in circles about 'meanings' suggests you know you're on a losing streak here.

But let's play the game:

Intangible
not tangible; incapable of being perceived by the sense of touch, as incorporeal or immaterial things; impalpable.

I can't touch the lettuce as I make the salad? or the cucumber? or anything else that goes in the salad. I've even bolded the important part.

So when you make a salad, is the salad the realization of your intention?

 

[Dr Grump]

The lettuce would be tangible. You making the salad is intangible.

tangible: a thing that is perceptible by touch.

intangible: not made of physical substance; unable to be touched or grasped; not having physical presence.

The act of making a salad is not made of physical substance. It is a freaking act.

Well now you're talking about thoughts. And they are intangible for sure. How this means there is a god of some sort I fail to the see the connection. God is based on belief. Nothing else. I don't know if you are a Christian or not, but ponder this: 99 percent of the reason most people are Christians is because of where they are born. Ditto Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs. So it's not even a belief based on the religion itself, but where you are born. Think about that....

 

[ding]

The lettuce would be tangible. You making the salad is intangible.

tangible: a thing that is perceptible by touch.

intangible: not made of physical substance; unable to be touched or grasped; not having physical presence.

The act of making a salad is not made of physical substance. It is a freaking act.

Well now you're talking about thoughts. And they are intangible for sure. How this means there is a god of some sort I fail to the see the connection. God is based on belief. Nothing else. I don't know if you are a Christian or not, but ponder this: 99 percent of the reason most people are Christians is because of where they are born. Ditto Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs. So it's not even a belief based on the religion itself, but where you are born. Think about that....

So when you make a salad, is the salad the realization of your intention?

 

[Dr Grump]

So when you make a salad, is the salad the realization of your intention?

Yep, and you and I can talk about it. I can't talk to a god when that god itself is also intangible. The intangible aspect of something isn't proof that something exists. I'm sure people believe in the flying spaghetti monster or tooth fairy. I know of nobody who has seen those things. I know of plenty of people who have seen salads.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

Vile ISIL burns their victims alive.
As horrible as that is, its over pretty quickly.

The christian god demands that you get on your knees to him or he will burn you forever.

Why would any sane, feeling human being worship a monster like that?

 

[ding]

So when you make a salad, is the salad the realization of your intention?

Yep, and you and I can talk about it. I can't talk to a god when that god itself is also intangible. The intangible aspect of something isn't proof that something exists. I'm sure people believe in the flying spaghetti monster or tooth fairy. I know of nobody who has seen those things. I know of plenty of people who have seen salads.

Right but if I found something you created and didn't know you created it, I could learn things from what you created. And since I have created things myself, I have insight into the process of creating things. So I can use reason and experience to guide my investigation.

Ok, so you agree that when you create something, your creation is the realization of your intention. That's good. A lot of people won't be honest about that. Thanks. See, that was me using reason and experience to know that when you create something, what you create is the realization of your intention. I know this because it is the same for me (i.e. experience).

When you create something, do you do it in steps? Or does it magically appear all at once? For me, I create things in steps. Think about building a house, I have to lay all the utilities first, then pour the foundation, then I can put up walls, then I can put up the roof, etc. It is the same for you, right?

 

[Dr Grump]

[
Right but if I found something you created and didn't know you created it, I could learn things from what you created. And since I have created things myself, I have insight into the process of creating things. So I can use reason and experience to guide my investigation.

Ok, so you agree that when you create something, your creation is the realization of your intention. That's good. A lot of people won't be honest about that. Thanks. See, that was me using reason and experience to know that when you create something, what you create is the realization of your intention. I know this because it is the same for me (i.e. experience).

When you create something, do you do it in steps? Or does it magically appear all at once? For me, I create things in steps. Think about building a house, I have to lay all the utilities first, then pour the foundation, then I can put up walls, then I can put up the roof, etc. It is the same for you, right?

All interesting stuff, but at the end of the day it doesn't get us any closer to our own POV. I don't believe in a god because there is no evidence at all that one exists. There is belief - which is fine - but that is all there is.

 

[ding]

[
Right but if I found something you created and didn't know you created it, I could learn things from what you created. And since I have created things myself, I have insight into the process of creating things. So I can use reason and experience to guide my investigation.

Ok, so you agree that when you create something, your creation is the realization of your intention. That's good. A lot of people won't be honest about that. Thanks. See, that was me using reason and experience to know that when you create something, what you create is the realization of your intention. I know this because it is the same for me (i.e. experience).

When you create something, do you do it in steps? Or does it magically appear all at once? For me, I create things in steps. Think about building a house, I have to lay all the utilities first, then pour the foundation, then I can put up walls, then I can put up the roof, etc. It is the same for you, right?

All interesting stuff, but at the end of the day it doesn't get us any closer to our own POV. I don't believe in a god because there is no evidence at all that one exists. There is belief - which is fine - but that is all there is.

I'm getting there. These things take time. So, I think we can assume that you agree that when you create something that you do it in steps. Do your more complex creations require more steps and intelligence than your less complex creations? For instance. let's say you are making a turkey dinner and a cell phone, ok? Would it be fair to say that the cell phone would require greater intelligence to make than a turkey dinner would?

 

[Dr Grump]

I'm getting there. These things take time. So, I think we can assume that you agree that when you create something that you do it in steps. Do your more complex creations require more steps and intelligence than your less complex creations? For instance. let's say you are making a turkey dinner and a cell phone, ok? Would it be fair to say that the cell phone would require greater intelligence to make than a turkey dinner would?

I can see where you are going. And it doesn't prove anything other than you have a belief in something that is intangible and unproveable. That's fine. That is your right.

 

[ding]

I'm getting there. These things take time. So, I think we can assume that you agree that when you create something that you do it in steps. Do your more complex creations require more steps and intelligence than your less complex creations? For instance. let's say you are making a turkey dinner and a cell phone, ok? Would it be fair to say that the cell phone would require greater intelligence to make than a turkey dinner would?

I can see where you are going. And it doesn't prove anything other than you have a belief in something that is intangible and unproveable. That's fine. That is your right.

Humor me. I'm almost to the point of discussion. So assuming that you agree that I could learn something about your intelligence and number of steps you took to make your creation, do you think I could tell why you made it or what it's purpose was?

 

[Dr Grump]

Humor me. I'm almost to the point of discussion. So assuming that you agree that I could learn something about your intelligence and number of steps you took to make your creation, do you think I could tell why you made it or what it's purpose was?

Yes, you should.

But in the case of a god you would have to see him making it in the first place. Nobody has ever witnessed a god making anything. Ever. However, some believe that he or she did. But that is all it is. Belief.

 

[ding]

Humor me. I'm almost to the point of discussion. So assuming that you agree that I could learn something about your intelligence and number of steps you took to make your creation, do you think I could tell why you made it or what it's purpose was?

Yes, you should.

But in the case of a god you would have to see him making it in the first place. Nobody has ever witnessed a god making anything. Ever. However, some believe that he or she did. But that is all it is. Belief.

Why? That's not how evidence is used. No one saw Bob shoot Tom, but from the evidence it can be deduced that he did. How is this any different? I haven't made my case yet. All I have done so far is to introduce the evidence. The evidence is what He created. Do you want to hear the case?

 

[Dr Grump]

Why? That's not how evidence is used. No one saw Bob shoot Tom, but from the evidence it can be deduced that he did. How is this any different? I haven't made my case yet. All I have done so far is to introduce the evidence. The evidence is what He created. Do you want to hear the case?

Not really. I've heard the evidence many times. Simply put, it is not believable. With Tom being shot at least there is evidence of him being shot. He has a bullet in him.

But carry on if you wish...

 

[ding]

Why? That's not how evidence is used. No one saw Bob shoot Tom, but from the evidence it can be deduced that he did. How is this any different? I haven't made my case yet. All I have done so far is to introduce the evidence. The evidence is what He created. Do you want to hear the case?

Not really. I've heard the evidence many times. Simply put, it is not believable. With Tom being shot at least there is evidence of him being shot. He has a bullet in him.

But carry on if you wish...

Well the universe exists so that is Tom being shot with a bullet in him. But since your mind is already made up, it wouldn't be logical to continue. The evidence is there, what you choose to do with it is up to you.