Yes, You're A Communist

[Windship]

Surprising how many good Americans have been fooled into accepting, and voting for, communism. And when the truth is revealed, they are startled, incensed, and furious that anyone would say such a thing.

But it's true. There is no essential difference between communism, socialism, Liberalism and/or Progressivism. At the heart of each is a faith and adherence to big, overarching government, the representative of the collective, at the cost of individual liberty and freedom.

How did communism become the public religion of America? The following will explain, ....as we say in science....'its origin and insertion."


In a recent thread, one that illustrated the connections between environmentalists, communists, with the confiscation of private property, a government school graduate demonstrated how offended she was by posting this as part of a scathing disavowal of the above:

"OP tries to connect communism to the moderate left wing democrats." One More Of Those Environmentalist Fairytales

Clearly, an intervention is sorely needed.

It follows:



1. Karl Marx's lethal philosophy is the basis of both communism and of Nazism.

a. A year after Lenin's death, 1924, the NYTimes published a small article about a newly established party in Germany, the National Socialist Labor Party, which "...persists in believing that Lenin and Hitler can be compared or contrasted...Dr. Goebell's....assertion that Lenin was the greatest man second only to Hitler....and that the difference between communism and the Hitler faith was very slight...." NYTimes, November 27, 1925.

b. "Hitler often stated that he learned much from reading Marx, and the whole of National Socialism is doctrinally based on Marxism."
George Watson, Historian, Cambridge.

c. "Socialists in Germany were national socialists, communists were international socialists."
Vladimir Bukovsky.



2. I don't use "lethal" in a cavalier fashion: Over 100 million men, women, and children were slaughtered by Soviet Communism alone. When that fact was stated, one inveterate Liberal poster laughed, and said 'You sure it wasn't 100 billion?'
And the horrors of Nazism are well known. But both began here:

a. "Early socialists publically advocated genocide, in the 19th and 20th centuries. It first appeared in Marx's journal, Rheinishe Zeitung, in January of 1849. When the socialist class war happens, there will be primitive societies in Europe, two stages behind- not even capitalist yet- the Basques, the Bretons, the Scottish Highlanders, the Serbs, and others he calls 'racial trash,' and they will have to be destroyed because, being two stages behind in the class struggle, it will be impossible to bring them up to being revolutionary." George Watson, Historian, Cambridge University.

b. "The classes and races, too weak to master the new conditions of life, must give way...they must perish in the revolutionary holocaust." Karl Marx, People's Paper, April 16, 1856, Journal of the History of Idea, 1981

c. "Before Marx, no other European thinker publically advocated racial extermination. He was the first."
George Watson.




And this is what we find leading the Democrat Party this very day:
"Bernie Sanders Makes His Pitch for Socialism" Bernie Sanders Outlines A Vision for Fixing American Society



Read more- if you dare, Liberals.

Just as bad as unfettered capitalism.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Surprising how many good Americans have been fooled into accepting, and voting for, communism. And when the truth is revealed, they are startled, incensed, and furious that anyone would say such a thing.

But it's true. There is no essential difference between communism, socialism, Liberalism and/or Progressivism. At the heart of each is a faith and adherence to big, overarching government, the representative of the collective, at the cost of individual liberty and freedom.

How did communism become the public religion of America? The following will explain, ....as we say in science....'its origin and insertion."


In a recent thread, one that illustrated the connections between environmentalists, communists, with the confiscation of private property, a government school graduate demonstrated how offended she was by posting this as part of a scathing disavowal of the above:

"OP tries to connect communism to the moderate left wing democrats." One More Of Those Environmentalist Fairytales

Clearly, an intervention is sorely needed.

It follows:



1. Karl Marx's lethal philosophy is the basis of both communism and of Nazism.

a. A year after Lenin's death, 1924, the NYTimes published a small article about a newly established party in Germany, the National Socialist Labor Party, which "...persists in believing that Lenin and Hitler can be compared or contrasted...Dr. Goebell's....assertion that Lenin was the greatest man second only to Hitler....and that the difference between communism and the Hitler faith was very slight...." NYTimes, November 27, 1925.

b. "Hitler often stated that he learned much from reading Marx, and the whole of National Socialism is doctrinally based on Marxism."
George Watson, Historian, Cambridge.

c. "Socialists in Germany were national socialists, communists were international socialists."
Vladimir Bukovsky.



2. I don't use "lethal" in a cavalier fashion: Over 100 million men, women, and children were slaughtered by Soviet Communism alone. When that fact was stated, one inveterate Liberal poster laughed, and said 'You sure it wasn't 100 billion?'
And the horrors of Nazism are well known. But both began here:

a. "Early socialists publically advocated genocide, in the 19th and 20th centuries. It first appeared in Marx's journal, Rheinishe Zeitung, in January of 1849. When the socialist class war happens, there will be primitive societies in Europe, two stages behind- not even capitalist yet- the Basques, the Bretons, the Scottish Highlanders, the Serbs, and others he calls 'racial trash,' and they will have to be destroyed because, being two stages behind in the class struggle, it will be impossible to bring them up to being revolutionary." George Watson, Historian, Cambridge University.

b. "The classes and races, too weak to master the new conditions of life, must give way...they must perish in the revolutionary holocaust." Karl Marx, People's Paper, April 16, 1856, Journal of the History of Idea, 1981

c. "Before Marx, no other European thinker publically advocated racial extermination. He was the first."
George Watson.




And this is what we find leading the Democrat Party this very day:
"Bernie Sanders Makes His Pitch for Socialism" Bernie Sanders Outlines A Vision for Fixing American Society



Read more- if you dare, Liberals.

Just as bad as unfettered capitalism.

If you ever get around to reading, and educating yourself, pick up a copy of
"The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression,"
by Jean-Louis Panné (Author), Andrzej Paczkowski (Author), Karel Bartosek (Author), Jean-Louis Margolin (Author), Nicolas Werth (Author), Stéphane Courtois (Author), & 2 more

"Already famous throughout Europe, this international bestseller plumbs recently opened archives in the former Soviet bloc to reveal the actual, practical accomplishments of Communism around the world: terror, torture, famine, mass deportations, and massacres. Astonishing in the sheer detail it amasses, the book is the first comprehensive attempt to catalogue and analyze the crimes of Communism over seventy years."



You might want to offer a more intelligent post, windy.

 

[SmokeALib]

The Dims on here want us to turn into a past day USSR or modern day Greece. Both failures. You cannot supress freedom and expect to succeed.

 

[JQPublic1]

1. . FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. On November 16, 1933, President Roosevelt rushed to embrace....recognize...the USSR. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational:

"Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his "Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath" by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.

As a bitter loser, I would expect Hoover to excoriate the man who soundly beat his ass in a landslide victory. Nash, also a butt hurt RW loser was obliged to use his journalistic skills to join his fellows in nitpicking the new president who was focusing on fixing the economic mess the GOP had left him. Indeed, the Great Depression was a global disaster and the USA, under GOP leadership, was a major contributor to it. That being said, FDR's overtures towards the Kremlin were rational considering the weakened state of affairs in Europe, the rising Nazis in Deutschland and the Japanese ascension in Asia. FDR was an advocate of world peace and was instrumental in jumpstarting the UN. He was aware of the rising power of the Soviets and how crucial that power would be against the Wehrmacht and the Luftwaffe.



The above paragraph encapsulates the second global antebellum period and thankfully, FDR had the insight to reach out to the USSR when he did. But, as you said, previous US administrations refused to recognize the Soviets and Europe followed suit. However, Communism was not the catalysts for the political estrangement of the USSR. No, after the Bolsheviks seized power on 1917 they nationalized foreign assets and confiscated property including that of the USA. Adding insult to injury the new revolutionary government refused to pay back loans the USA had made to the now overthrown TSAR regime. That "betrayed freedom" starts to look like "BS betrayed." It had nothing to do with freedom.



Milestones: 1921–1936 - Office of the Historian

2. Here is the question:was Roosevelt aware of the homicidal pathology of communism, and if so, shouldn't he have considered same as a reason to put off recognition until he persuaded a change in those policies?

Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology, including Christianity, Islam or capitalistic based entities. All of those mentioned have spilled blood. Besides, FDR was in no position to proselytize to the Bolsheviks about human rights when sheet wearing domestic terrorists were still running rampant and killing innocent people, figuratively speaking, in his own backyard. But any insinuation that FDR was secretly an agent of Communism is patently ridiculous. He recognized Russia because of future strategy considerations and for the sake of his fledgling UN and it payed off big time when the Nazis invaded the USSR.

a.He knew.

Eight months earlier, journalist Gareth Jones had exposed Stalin's Terror Famine:

"In the train a Communist denied to me that there was a famine. I flung a crust of bread which I had been eating from my own supply into a spittoon. A peasant fellow-passenger fished it out and ravenously ate it."

Gareth Jones journalist - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

That is a big leap. Jones' anecdote sounds more like something akin to the tall tales of William B. Laughead. If the tale is true there is something very disturbing about Jones' behavior. Who throws a crust of bread into a Spittoon in the first place, and especially in the presence of starving, emaciated people? Jones is either a sick sadist or a liar or both...take your pick.

b. Malcolm Muggeridge "was the first writer to revealthe true nature of Stalin s regime when in 1933he exposed the terror famine in the Ukraine. "

Amazon.com Time and Eternity The Uncollected Writings of Malcolm Muggeridge 9781570759055 Malcolm Muggeridge Nicholas Flynn Books



c. So FDR knew of the Terror Famine...designed and perpetrated by 'Uncle Joe,'...yet heenveloped Joe Stalin in " the cloak of his popularity..."Time Magazine, December 17, 1934.

A leftist who became a voice against communism? Doesn't that throw a wrinkle in that "leftist are all communists paradigm?" But the book review doesn't do much for me. All that does is show me how well you can cut and paste. The terror famine may or may not be true but Stalin probably was a murdering monster like Mao and Hitler were. Soooo, if FDR's Intelligence operatives couldn't confirm Muggeridge's revelations I would hardly expect him to shape his foreign policy around a private author's claims.

OK....so Roosevelt knew the nature of the other side when he offered the partnership....entry into the accepted world community.

There can be no doubt that Roosevelt knew.....and then, as per Stalin's plan, he gave Lend Lease materials that Allies needed, to Stalin.

Here you are mixing pre war events with wartime events. I repeat that FDR couldn't base his pre-war foreign policy on Muggeridge's report. And, apparently, allied spies and operatives in Russia hadn't confirmed the report. (pre war).



The Lend Lease was part of a reciprocal agreement that materialized after the Nazis invaded the USSR. ( war time). FDR's bold pre war initiative and foresight payed off big time with this move. The Europeans had rejected the Soviets bid to join the Grand Alliance earlier so in 1939 the Soviets made a pact with (shudder) the Nazis. Fortunately, for Europe and the world, that pact was broken when Hitler ordered his troops into Soviet territory. FDR seized the opportunity to support the Soviets with that Lend Lease deal and the Soviets promised to supply the US with raw materials and commodities as needed.



Here is the correspondence between Stalin and FDR facilitating crucial collaboration and material support that probably saved the world from Nazi domination!

Correspondence of Roosevelt and Truman with Stalin on Lend Lease and Other Aid to the Soviet Union, 1941-1945

 

[Dr Grump]

Exactly which of those claims refutes the claim that it's a capitalist country? It is a capitalist country and owes it extreme success to only one thing: capitalism.

Guess what other countries were capitalist? All western countries when they were succeeding, apart from the soviet union... The post-soviet countries which are STILL a basket cases, but now are at least well on their way to prosperity through... you guessed it... mostly capitalist economies.

Studies report about 1 % decline in GDP growth for every 10 % of government spending. Regulation can be even worse... Freedom from coercion works!

So it's capitalism no matter what the cost? And successful for who? And what about the social costs?

 

[bripat9643]

Surprising how many good Americans have been fooled into accepting, and voting for, communism. And when the truth is revealed, they are startled, incensed, and furious that anyone would say such a thing.

But it's true. There is no essential difference between communism, socialism, Liberalism and/or Progressivism. At the heart of each is a faith and adherence to big, overarching government, the representative of the collective, at the cost of individual liberty and freedom.

How did communism become the public religion of America? The following will explain, ....as we say in science....'its origin and insertion."


In a recent thread, one that illustrated the connections between environmentalists, communists, with the confiscation of private property, a government school graduate demonstrated how offended she was by posting this as part of a scathing disavowal of the above:

"OP tries to connect communism to the moderate left wing democrats." One More Of Those Environmentalist Fairytales

Clearly, an intervention is sorely needed.

It follows:



1. Karl Marx's lethal philosophy is the basis of both communism and of Nazism.

a. A year after Lenin's death, 1924, the NYTimes published a small article about a newly established party in Germany, the National Socialist Labor Party, which "...persists in believing that Lenin and Hitler can be compared or contrasted...Dr. Goebell's....assertion that Lenin was the greatest man second only to Hitler....and that the difference between communism and the Hitler faith was very slight...." NYTimes, November 27, 1925.

b. "Hitler often stated that he learned much from reading Marx, and the whole of National Socialism is doctrinally based on Marxism."
George Watson, Historian, Cambridge.

c. "Socialists in Germany were national socialists, communists were international socialists."
Vladimir Bukovsky.



2. I don't use "lethal" in a cavalier fashion: Over 100 million men, women, and children were slaughtered by Soviet Communism alone. When that fact was stated, one inveterate Liberal poster laughed, and said 'You sure it wasn't 100 billion?'
And the horrors of Nazism are well known. But both began here:

a. "Early socialists publically advocated genocide, in the 19th and 20th centuries. It first appeared in Marx's journal, Rheinishe Zeitung, in January of 1849. When the socialist class war happens, there will be primitive societies in Europe, two stages behind- not even capitalist yet- the Basques, the Bretons, the Scottish Highlanders, the Serbs, and others he calls 'racial trash,' and they will have to be destroyed because, being two stages behind in the class struggle, it will be impossible to bring them up to being revolutionary." George Watson, Historian, Cambridge University.

b. "The classes and races, too weak to master the new conditions of life, must give way...they must perish in the revolutionary holocaust." Karl Marx, People's Paper, April 16, 1856, Journal of the History of Idea, 1981

c. "Before Marx, no other European thinker publically advocated racial extermination. He was the first."
George Watson.




And this is what we find leading the Democrat Party this very day:
"Bernie Sanders Makes His Pitch for Socialism" Bernie Sanders Outlines A Vision for Fixing American Society



Read more- if you dare, Liberals.

Just as bad as unfettered capitalism.

What's bad about unfettered capitalism? How many people starved to death?

 

[there4eyeM]

America is a nation of liberty, brotherhood and intellectual clarity. There is no 'ism' that made or makes it great; it is the people who make it so. If it is not great, it is nevertheless the people who make it so.
The 'founders' were eclectic, not simple ideologues. They accepted and incorporated divergent concepts of theology, politics and economics.
Worshiping 'capitalism' is such a gross error that it seems unthinkable such a thing could happen. 'Capitalism' is merely a tool, something we can use, not something that must be used. It may be appropriate in some cases and not others. Blind faith in something that is not even a faith is inhuman. Capital itself is a mere creation of the mind of man, thus it and all value issue from the same source; human thought, followed by human effort.
"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." Abraham Lincoln

 

[bripat9643]

America is a nation of liberty, brotherhood and intellectual clarity. There is no 'ism' that made or makes it great; it is the people who make it so. If it is not great, it is nevertheless the people who make it so.
The 'founders' were eclectic, not simple ideologues. They accepted and incorporated divergent concepts of theology, politics and economics.
Worshiping 'capitalism' is such a gross error that it seems unthinkable such a thing could happen. 'Capitalism' is merely a tool, something we can use, not something that must be used. It may be appropriate in some cases and not others. Blind faith in something that is not even a faith is inhuman. Capital itself is a mere creation of the mind of man, thus it and all value issue from the same source; human thought, followed by human effort.
"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." Abraham Lincoln

Lincoln wasn't an economist. His theory is false.

Capitalism is the system that results when you respect the laws of economics. They are not whims. They are laws.

 

[there4eyeM]

Gravity is a law of the universe.
Economics is a totally relativistic human creation and exercise.

 

[Norman]

Exactly which of those claims refutes the claim that it's a capitalist country? It is a capitalist country and owes it extreme success to only one thing: capitalism.

Guess what other countries were capitalist? All western countries when they were succeeding, apart from the soviet union... The post-soviet countries which are STILL a basket cases, but now are at least well on their way to prosperity through... you guessed it... mostly capitalist economies.

Studies report about 1 % decline in GDP growth for every 10 % of government spending. Regulation can be even worse... Freedom from coercion works!

So it's capitalism no matter what the cost? And successful for who? And what about the social costs?

Social costs are bullshit measure invented by leftist to justify their enslavement of other people. Not coercing others is FREE, and in this case free really means free.

Only an idiot would be a commie apologist in this day and age. We know what the ideology represents, there are no questions whether it works or not. We know it does not.

 

[Norman]

Gravity is a law of the universe.
Economics is a totally relativistic human creation and exercise.

So you are one of those, like some other posters in the forum, who doesn't believe law of demand generally works?

And this is why, the one business a regressives built - his lemonade stand - still failed.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. . FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. On November 16, 1933, President Roosevelt rushed to embrace....recognize...the USSR. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational:

"Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his "Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath" by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.

As a bitter loser, I would expect Hoover to excoriate the man who soundly beat his ass in a landslide victory. Nash, also a butt hurt RW loser was obliged to use his journalistic skills to join his fellows in nitpicking the new president who was focusing on fixing the economic mess the GOP had left him. Indeed, the Great Depression was a global disaster and the USA, under GOP leadership, was a major contributor to it. That being said, FDR's overtures towards the Kremlin were rational considering the weakened state of affairs in Europe, the rising Nazis in Deutschland and the Japanese ascension in Asia. FDR was an advocate of world peace and was instrumental in jumpstarting the UN. He was aware of the rising power of the Soviets and how crucial that power would be against the Wehrmacht and the Luftwaffe.



The above paragraph encapsulates the second global antebellum period and thankfully, FDR had the insight to reach out to the USSR when he did. But, as you said, previous US administrations refused to recognize the Soviets and Europe followed suit. However, Communism was not the catalysts for the political estrangement of the USSR. No, after the Bolsheviks seized power on 1917 they nationalized foreign assets and confiscated property including that of the USA. Adding insult to injury the new revolutionary government refused to pay back loans the USA had made to the now overthrown TSAR regime. That "betrayed freedom" starts to look like "BS betrayed." It had nothing to do with freedom.



Milestones: 1921–1936 - Office of the Historian

2. Here is the question:was Roosevelt aware of the homicidal pathology of communism, and if so, shouldn't he have considered same as a reason to put off recognition until he persuaded a change in those policies?

Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology, including Christianity, Islam or capitalistic based entities. All of those mentioned have spilled blood. Besides, FDR was in no position to proselytize to the Bolsheviks about human rights when sheet wearing domestic terrorists were still running rampant and killing innocent people, figuratively speaking, in his own backyard. But any insinuation that FDR was secretly an agent of Communism is patently ridiculous. He recognized Russia because of future strategy considerations and for the sake of his fledgling UN and it payed off big time when the Nazis invaded the USSR.

a.He knew.

Eight months earlier, journalist Gareth Jones had exposed Stalin's Terror Famine:

"In the train a Communist denied to me that there was a famine. I flung a crust of bread which I had been eating from my own supply into a spittoon. A peasant fellow-passenger fished it out and ravenously ate it."

Gareth Jones journalist - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

That is a big leap. Jones' anecdote sounds more like something akin to the tall tales of William B. Laughead. If the tale is true there is something very disturbing about Jones' behavior. Who throws a crust of bread into a Spittoon in the first place, and especially in the presence of starving, emaciated people? Jones is either a sick sadist or a liar or both...take your pick.

b. Malcolm Muggeridge "was the first writer to revealthe true nature of Stalin s regime when in 1933he exposed the terror famine in the Ukraine. "

Amazon.com Time and Eternity The Uncollected Writings of Malcolm Muggeridge 9781570759055 Malcolm Muggeridge Nicholas Flynn Books



c. So FDR knew of the Terror Famine...designed and perpetrated by 'Uncle Joe,'...yet heenveloped Joe Stalin in " the cloak of his popularity..."Time Magazine, December 17, 1934.

A leftist who became a voice against communism? Doesn't that throw a wrinkle in that "leftist are all communists paradigm?" But the book review doesn't do much for me. All that does is show me how well you can cut and paste. The terror famine may or may not be true but Stalin probably was a murdering monster like Mao and Hitler were. Soooo, if FDR's Intelligence operatives couldn't confirm Muggeridge's revelations I would hardly expect him to shape his foreign policy around a private author's claims.

OK....so Roosevelt knew the nature of the other side when he offered the partnership....entry into the accepted world community.

There can be no doubt that Roosevelt knew.....and then, as per Stalin's plan, he gave Lend Lease materials that Allies needed, to Stalin.

Here you are mixing pre war events with wartime events. I repeat that FDR couldn't base his pre-war foreign policy on Muggeridge's report. And, apparently, allied spies and operatives in Russia hadn't confirmed the report. (pre war).



The Lend Lease was part of a reciprocal agreement that materialized after the Nazis invaded the USSR. ( war time). FDR's bold pre war initiative and foresight payed off big time with this move. The Europeans had rejected the Soviets bid to join the Grand Alliance earlier so in 1939 the Soviets made a pact with (shudder) the Nazis. Fortunately, for Europe and the world, that pact was broken when Hitler ordered his troops into Soviet territory. FDR seized the opportunity to support the Soviets with that Lend Lease deal and the Soviets promised to supply the US with raw materials and commodities as needed.



Here is the correspondence between Stalin and FDR facilitating crucial collaboration and material support that probably saved the world from Nazi domination!

Correspondence of Roosevelt and Truman with Stalin on Lend Lease and Other Aid to the Soviet Union, 1941-1945

"Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Gads. you're a fool.


"The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression,"
by Jean-Louis Panné (Author), Andrzej Paczkowski (Author), Karel Bartosek (Author), Jean-Louis Margolin (Author), Nicolas Werth (Author), Stéphane Courtois (Author), & 2 more

"Already famous throughout Europe, this international bestseller plumbs recently opened archives in the former Soviet bloc to reveal the actual, practical accomplishments of Communism around the world: terror, torture, famine, mass deportations, and massacres. Astonishing in the sheer detail it amasses, the book is the first comprehensive attempt to catalogue and analyze the crimes of Communism over seventy years."


100 million slaughtered.


Roosevelt facilitated this.

 

[JQPublic1]

America is a nation of liberty, brotherhood and intellectual clarity. There is no 'ism' that made or makes it great; it is the people who make it so. If it is not great, it is nevertheless the people who make it so.
The 'founders' were eclectic, not simple ideologues. They accepted and incorporated divergent concepts of theology, politics and economics.
Worshiping 'capitalism' is such a gross error that it seems unthinkable such a thing could happen. 'Capitalism' is merely a tool, something we can use, not something that must be used. It may be appropriate in some cases and not others. Blind faith in something that is not even a faith is inhuman. Capital itself is a mere creation of the mind of man, thus it and all value issue from the same source; human thought, followed by human effort.
"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." Abraham Lincoln

Lincoln wasn't an economist. His theory is false.

Capitalism is the system that results when you respect the laws of economics. They are not whims. They are laws.

Lincoln didn't have to be an economist to realize that Capitalism depends on cheap labor, cheap raw materials and cheap energy so that there is enough profit to pay the owners of the means of production far more than they deserve and to pay the workers far, far less than they deserve.

 

[JQPublic1]

1. . FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. On November 16, 1933, President Roosevelt rushed to embrace....recognize...the USSR. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational:

"Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his "Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath" by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.

As a bitter loser, I would expect Hoover to excoriate the man who soundly beat his ass in a landslide victory. Nash, also a butt hurt RW loser was obliged to use his journalistic skills to join his fellows in nitpicking the new president who was focusing on fixing the economic mess the GOP had left him. Indeed, the Great Depression was a global disaster and the USA, under GOP leadership, was a major contributor to it. That being said, FDR's overtures towards the Kremlin were rational considering the weakened state of affairs in Europe, the rising Nazis in Deutschland and the Japanese ascension in Asia. FDR was an advocate of world peace and was instrumental in jumpstarting the UN. He was aware of the rising power of the Soviets and how crucial that power would be against the Wehrmacht and the Luftwaffe.



The above paragraph encapsulates the second global antebellum period and thankfully, FDR had the insight to reach out to the USSR when he did. But, as you said, previous US administrations refused to recognize the Soviets and Europe followed suit. However, Communism was not the catalysts for the political estrangement of the USSR. No, after the Bolsheviks seized power on 1917 they nationalized foreign assets and confiscated property including that of the USA. Adding insult to injury the new revolutionary government refused to pay back loans the USA had made to the now overthrown TSAR regime. That "betrayed freedom" starts to look like "BS betrayed." It had nothing to do with freedom.



Milestones: 1921–1936 - Office of the Historian

2. Here is the question:was Roosevelt aware of the homicidal pathology of communism, and if so, shouldn't he have considered same as a reason to put off recognition until he persuaded a change in those policies?

Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology, including Christianity, Islam or capitalistic based entities. All of those mentioned have spilled blood. Besides, FDR was in no position to proselytize to the Bolsheviks about human rights when sheet wearing domestic terrorists were still running rampant and killing innocent people, figuratively speaking, in his own backyard. But any insinuation that FDR was secretly an agent of Communism is patently ridiculous. He recognized Russia because of future strategy considerations and for the sake of his fledgling UN and it payed off big time when the Nazis invaded the USSR.

a.He knew.

Eight months earlier, journalist Gareth Jones had exposed Stalin's Terror Famine:

"In the train a Communist denied to me that there was a famine. I flung a crust of bread which I had been eating from my own supply into a spittoon. A peasant fellow-passenger fished it out and ravenously ate it."

Gareth Jones journalist - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

That is a big leap. Jones' anecdote sounds more like something akin to the tall tales of William B. Laughead. If the tale is true there is something very disturbing about Jones' behavior. Who throws a crust of bread into a Spittoon in the first place, and especially in the presence of starving, emaciated people? Jones is either a sick sadist or a liar or both...take your pick.

b. Malcolm Muggeridge "was the first writer to revealthe true nature of Stalin s regime when in 1933he exposed the terror famine in the Ukraine. "

Amazon.com Time and Eternity The Uncollected Writings of Malcolm Muggeridge 9781570759055 Malcolm Muggeridge Nicholas Flynn Books



c. So FDR knew of the Terror Famine...designed and perpetrated by 'Uncle Joe,'...yet heenveloped Joe Stalin in " the cloak of his popularity..."Time Magazine, December 17, 1934.

A leftist who became a voice against communism? Doesn't that throw a wrinkle in that "leftist are all communists paradigm?" But the book review doesn't do much for me. All that does is show me how well you can cut and paste. The terror famine may or may not be true but Stalin probably was a murdering monster like Mao and Hitler were. Soooo, if FDR's Intelligence operatives couldn't confirm Muggeridge's revelations I would hardly expect him to shape his foreign policy around a private author's claims.

OK....so Roosevelt knew the nature of the other side when he offered the partnership....entry into the accepted world community.

There can be no doubt that Roosevelt knew.....and then, as per Stalin's plan, he gave Lend Lease materials that Allies needed, to Stalin.

Here you are mixing pre war events with wartime events. I repeat that FDR couldn't base his pre-war foreign policy on Muggeridge's report. And, apparently, allied spies and operatives in Russia hadn't confirmed the report. (pre war).



The Lend Lease was part of a reciprocal agreement that materialized after the Nazis invaded the USSR. ( war time). FDR's bold pre war initiative and foresight payed off big time with this move. The Europeans had rejected the Soviets bid to join the Grand Alliance earlier so in 1939 the Soviets made a pact with (shudder) the Nazis. Fortunately, for Europe and the world, that pact was broken when Hitler ordered his troops into Soviet territory. FDR seized the opportunity to support the Soviets with that Lend Lease deal and the Soviets promised to supply the US with raw materials and commodities as needed.



Here is the correspondence between Stalin and FDR facilitating crucial collaboration and material support that probably saved the world from Nazi domination!

Correspondence of Roosevelt and Truman with Stalin on Lend Lease and Other Aid to the Soviet Union, 1941-1945

"Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Gads. you're a fool.


"The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression,"
by Jean-Louis Panné (Author), Andrzej Paczkowski (Author), Karel Bartosek (Author), Jean-Louis Margolin (Author), Nicolas Werth (Author), Stéphane Courtois (Author), & 2 more

"Already famous throughout Europe, this international bestseller plumbs recently opened archives in the former Soviet bloc to reveal the actual, practical accomplishments of Communism around the world: terror, torture, famine, mass deportations, and massacres. Astonishing in the sheer detail it amasses, the book is the first comprehensive attempt to catalogue and analyze the crimes of Communism over seventy years."


100 million slaughtered.


Roosevelt facilitated this.

Gads you're a stupid bitch but I won't allow you to DOG me around, heh heh heh! I don't deny the atrocities committed by totalitarian dictators purporting to be communists occurred. Do you deny that the USA, Britain and many of the allied european countries including Australia also committed murderous acts on indigenous populations. We are reluctant to pin a face to US atrocities but that didn't make them any less deadly or less bloody for the men , women and children that perished. Sure, 100 million is a huge number that defies the imagination. I wonder where all those bullets came from. But who was counting? How did the pundits arrive at that estimate? US historians are famous for undercounting casualties of non combatant autochthonous peoples murdered US military campaigns. They are simply written off as collateral damage. But our historians and journalist are quick to point to that combined 100 million killed by Stalin and Mao. I don't care what ideology a charismatic psychopath has be it Capitalist or Communist. I blame the man not the ideology

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. . FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. On November 16, 1933, President Roosevelt rushed to embrace....recognize...the USSR. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational:

"Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his "Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath" by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.

As a bitter loser, I would expect Hoover to excoriate the man who soundly beat his ass in a landslide victory. Nash, also a butt hurt RW loser was obliged to use his journalistic skills to join his fellows in nitpicking the new president who was focusing on fixing the economic mess the GOP had left him. Indeed, the Great Depression was a global disaster and the USA, under GOP leadership, was a major contributor to it. That being said, FDR's overtures towards the Kremlin were rational considering the weakened state of affairs in Europe, the rising Nazis in Deutschland and the Japanese ascension in Asia. FDR was an advocate of world peace and was instrumental in jumpstarting the UN. He was aware of the rising power of the Soviets and how crucial that power would be against the Wehrmacht and the Luftwaffe.



The above paragraph encapsulates the second global antebellum period and thankfully, FDR had the insight to reach out to the USSR when he did. But, as you said, previous US administrations refused to recognize the Soviets and Europe followed suit. However, Communism was not the catalysts for the political estrangement of the USSR. No, after the Bolsheviks seized power on 1917 they nationalized foreign assets and confiscated property including that of the USA. Adding insult to injury the new revolutionary government refused to pay back loans the USA had made to the now overthrown TSAR regime. That "betrayed freedom" starts to look like "BS betrayed." It had nothing to do with freedom.



Milestones: 1921–1936 - Office of the Historian

2. Here is the question:was Roosevelt aware of the homicidal pathology of communism, and if so, shouldn't he have considered same as a reason to put off recognition until he persuaded a change in those policies?

Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology, including Christianity, Islam or capitalistic based entities. All of those mentioned have spilled blood. Besides, FDR was in no position to proselytize to the Bolsheviks about human rights when sheet wearing domestic terrorists were still running rampant and killing innocent people, figuratively speaking, in his own backyard. But any insinuation that FDR was secretly an agent of Communism is patently ridiculous. He recognized Russia because of future strategy considerations and for the sake of his fledgling UN and it payed off big time when the Nazis invaded the USSR.

a.He knew.

Eight months earlier, journalist Gareth Jones had exposed Stalin's Terror Famine:

"In the train a Communist denied to me that there was a famine. I flung a crust of bread which I had been eating from my own supply into a spittoon. A peasant fellow-passenger fished it out and ravenously ate it."

Gareth Jones journalist - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

That is a big leap. Jones' anecdote sounds more like something akin to the tall tales of William B. Laughead. If the tale is true there is something very disturbing about Jones' behavior. Who throws a crust of bread into a Spittoon in the first place, and especially in the presence of starving, emaciated people? Jones is either a sick sadist or a liar or both...take your pick.

b. Malcolm Muggeridge "was the first writer to revealthe true nature of Stalin s regime when in 1933he exposed the terror famine in the Ukraine. "

Amazon.com Time and Eternity The Uncollected Writings of Malcolm Muggeridge 9781570759055 Malcolm Muggeridge Nicholas Flynn Books



c. So FDR knew of the Terror Famine...designed and perpetrated by 'Uncle Joe,'...yet heenveloped Joe Stalin in " the cloak of his popularity..."Time Magazine, December 17, 1934.

A leftist who became a voice against communism? Doesn't that throw a wrinkle in that "leftist are all communists paradigm?" But the book review doesn't do much for me. All that does is show me how well you can cut and paste. The terror famine may or may not be true but Stalin probably was a murdering monster like Mao and Hitler were. Soooo, if FDR's Intelligence operatives couldn't confirm Muggeridge's revelations I would hardly expect him to shape his foreign policy around a private author's claims.

OK....so Roosevelt knew the nature of the other side when he offered the partnership....entry into the accepted world community.

There can be no doubt that Roosevelt knew.....and then, as per Stalin's plan, he gave Lend Lease materials that Allies needed, to Stalin.

Here you are mixing pre war events with wartime events. I repeat that FDR couldn't base his pre-war foreign policy on Muggeridge's report. And, apparently, allied spies and operatives in Russia hadn't confirmed the report. (pre war).



The Lend Lease was part of a reciprocal agreement that materialized after the Nazis invaded the USSR. ( war time). FDR's bold pre war initiative and foresight payed off big time with this move. The Europeans had rejected the Soviets bid to join the Grand Alliance earlier so in 1939 the Soviets made a pact with (shudder) the Nazis. Fortunately, for Europe and the world, that pact was broken when Hitler ordered his troops into Soviet territory. FDR seized the opportunity to support the Soviets with that Lend Lease deal and the Soviets promised to supply the US with raw materials and commodities as needed.



Here is the correspondence between Stalin and FDR facilitating crucial collaboration and material support that probably saved the world from Nazi domination!

Correspondence of Roosevelt and Truman with Stalin on Lend Lease and Other Aid to the Soviet Union, 1941-1945

"Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Gads. you're a fool.


"The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression,"
by Jean-Louis Panné (Author), Andrzej Paczkowski (Author), Karel Bartosek (Author), Jean-Louis Margolin (Author), Nicolas Werth (Author), Stéphane Courtois (Author), & 2 more

"Already famous throughout Europe, this international bestseller plumbs recently opened archives in the former Soviet bloc to reveal the actual, practical accomplishments of Communism around the world: terror, torture, famine, mass deportations, and massacres. Astonishing in the sheer detail it amasses, the book is the first comprehensive attempt to catalogue and analyze the crimes of Communism over seventy years."


100 million slaughtered.


Roosevelt facilitated this.

Gads you're a stupid bitch but I won't allow you to DOG me around, heh heh heh! I don't deny the atrocities committed by totalitarian dictators purporting to be communists occurred. Do you deny that the USA, Britain and many of the allied european countries including Australia also committed murderous acts on indigenous populations. We are reluctant to pin a face to US atrocities but that didn't make them any less deadly or less bloody for the men , women and children that perished. Sure, 100 million is a huge number that defies the imagination. I wonder where all those bullets came from. But who was counting? How did the pundits arrive at that estimate? US historians are famous for undercounting casualties of non combatant autochthonous peoples murdered US military campaigns. They are simply written off as collateral damage. But our historians and journalist are quick to point to that combined 100 million killed by Stalin and Mao. I don't care what ideology a charismatic psychopath has be it Capitalist or Communist. I blame the man not the ideology

Watch your language....it gives away how irked you are at being correctly identified as a dunce.

You wrote: ""Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Then you wrote: "I don't deny the atrocities committed by totalitarian dictators purporting to be communists occurred."



Does that neon light flashing IDIOT over your head keep you awake at night?

 

[JQPublic1]

1. . FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. On November 16, 1933, President Roosevelt rushed to embrace....recognize...the USSR. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational:

"Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his "Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath" by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.

As a bitter loser, I would expect Hoover to excoriate the man who soundly beat his ass in a landslide victory. Nash, also a butt hurt RW loser was obliged to use his journalistic skills to join his fellows in nitpicking the new president who was focusing on fixing the economic mess the GOP had left him. Indeed, the Great Depression was a global disaster and the USA, under GOP leadership, was a major contributor to it. That being said, FDR's overtures towards the Kremlin were rational considering the weakened state of affairs in Europe, the rising Nazis in Deutschland and the Japanese ascension in Asia. FDR was an advocate of world peace and was instrumental in jumpstarting the UN. He was aware of the rising power of the Soviets and how crucial that power would be against the Wehrmacht and the Luftwaffe.



The above paragraph encapsulates the second global antebellum period and thankfully, FDR had the insight to reach out to the USSR when he did. But, as you said, previous US administrations refused to recognize the Soviets and Europe followed suit. However, Communism was not the catalysts for the political estrangement of the USSR. No, after the Bolsheviks seized power on 1917 they nationalized foreign assets and confiscated property including that of the USA. Adding insult to injury the new revolutionary government refused to pay back loans the USA had made to the now overthrown TSAR regime. That "betrayed freedom" starts to look like "BS betrayed." It had nothing to do with freedom.



Milestones: 1921–1936 - Office of the Historian

2. Here is the question:was Roosevelt aware of the homicidal pathology of communism, and if so, shouldn't he have considered same as a reason to put off recognition until he persuaded a change in those policies?

Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology, including Christianity, Islam or capitalistic based entities. All of those mentioned have spilled blood. Besides, FDR was in no position to proselytize to the Bolsheviks about human rights when sheet wearing domestic terrorists were still running rampant and killing innocent people, figuratively speaking, in his own backyard. But any insinuation that FDR was secretly an agent of Communism is patently ridiculous. He recognized Russia because of future strategy considerations and for the sake of his fledgling UN and it payed off big time when the Nazis invaded the USSR.

a.He knew.

Eight months earlier, journalist Gareth Jones had exposed Stalin's Terror Famine:

"In the train a Communist denied to me that there was a famine. I flung a crust of bread which I had been eating from my own supply into a spittoon. A peasant fellow-passenger fished it out and ravenously ate it."

Gareth Jones journalist - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

That is a big leap. Jones' anecdote sounds more like something akin to the tall tales of William B. Laughead. If the tale is true there is something very disturbing about Jones' behavior. Who throws a crust of bread into a Spittoon in the first place, and especially in the presence of starving, emaciated people? Jones is either a sick sadist or a liar or both...take your pick.

b. Malcolm Muggeridge "was the first writer to revealthe true nature of Stalin s regime when in 1933he exposed the terror famine in the Ukraine. "

Amazon.com Time and Eternity The Uncollected Writings of Malcolm Muggeridge 9781570759055 Malcolm Muggeridge Nicholas Flynn Books



c. So FDR knew of the Terror Famine...designed and perpetrated by 'Uncle Joe,'...yet heenveloped Joe Stalin in " the cloak of his popularity..."Time Magazine, December 17, 1934.

A leftist who became a voice against communism? Doesn't that throw a wrinkle in that "leftist are all communists paradigm?" But the book review doesn't do much for me. All that does is show me how well you can cut and paste. The terror famine may or may not be true but Stalin probably was a murdering monster like Mao and Hitler were. Soooo, if FDR's Intelligence operatives couldn't confirm Muggeridge's revelations I would hardly expect him to shape his foreign policy around a private author's claims.

OK....so Roosevelt knew the nature of the other side when he offered the partnership....entry into the accepted world community.

There can be no doubt that Roosevelt knew.....and then, as per Stalin's plan, he gave Lend Lease materials that Allies needed, to Stalin.

Here you are mixing pre war events with wartime events. I repeat that FDR couldn't base his pre-war foreign policy on Muggeridge's report. And, apparently, allied spies and operatives in Russia hadn't confirmed the report. (pre war).



The Lend Lease was part of a reciprocal agreement that materialized after the Nazis invaded the USSR. ( war time). FDR's bold pre war initiative and foresight payed off big time with this move. The Europeans had rejected the Soviets bid to join the Grand Alliance earlier so in 1939 the Soviets made a pact with (shudder) the Nazis. Fortunately, for Europe and the world, that pact was broken when Hitler ordered his troops into Soviet territory. FDR seized the opportunity to support the Soviets with that Lend Lease deal and the Soviets promised to supply the US with raw materials and commodities as needed.



Here is the correspondence between Stalin and FDR facilitating crucial collaboration and material support that probably saved the world from Nazi domination!

Correspondence of Roosevelt and Truman with Stalin on Lend Lease and Other Aid to the Soviet Union, 1941-1945

"Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Gads. you're a fool.


"The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression,"
by Jean-Louis Panné (Author), Andrzej Paczkowski (Author), Karel Bartosek (Author), Jean-Louis Margolin (Author), Nicolas Werth (Author), Stéphane Courtois (Author), & 2 more

"Already famous throughout Europe, this international bestseller plumbs recently opened archives in the former Soviet bloc to reveal the actual, practical accomplishments of Communism around the world: terror, torture, famine, mass deportations, and massacres. Astonishing in the sheer detail it amasses, the book is the first comprehensive attempt to catalogue and analyze the crimes of Communism over seventy years."


100 million slaughtered.


Roosevelt facilitated this.

Gads you're a stupid bitch but I won't allow you to DOG me around, heh heh heh! I don't deny the atrocities committed by totalitarian dictators purporting to be communists occurred. Do you deny that the USA, Britain and many of the allied european countries including Australia also committed murderous acts on indigenous populations. We are reluctant to pin a face to US atrocities but that didn't make them any less deadly or less bloody for the men , women and children that perished. Sure, 100 million is a huge number that defies the imagination. I wonder where all those bullets came from. But who was counting? How did the pundits arrive at that estimate? US historians are famous for undercounting casualties of non combatant autochthonous peoples murdered US military campaigns. They are simply written off as collateral damage. But our historians and journalist are quick to point to that combined 100 million killed by Stalin and Mao. I don't care what ideology a charismatic psychopath has be it Capitalist or Communist. I blame the man not the ideology

Watch your language....it gives away how irked you are at being correctly identified as a dunce.

You wrote: ""Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Then you wrote: "I don't deny the atrocities committed by totalitarian dictators purporting to be communists occurred."



Does that neon light flashing IDIOT over your head keep you awake at night?

What is wrong with my language? Looking at your vicious insults, one would think you wanted a nasty knock down drag out fight. Ok, I see you are sensitive so I will refrain from calling you names and focus on the subject matter.

You have identified every person who says something you dislike as a dunce. I guess that puts me in good company...thanks.

Yes I wrote both of the statements you quoted above but one doesn't conflict with the other. communism was NOT the cause of atrocities committed by Mao and Stalin. Those were decisions made by them and was independent of anything Marx stood for or said. Or... at least I haven't heard or read that Marx made homicide and mass murder a tenet of Communism. I could be wrong... am I? If so show me. If not STFU!

 

[Mac1958]

Okay, so we've learned here that everyone who dares to be to the left of hardcore right wing partisan ideologues is a commie.

Well, that was just fascinating.

Anything else?
.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1. . FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. On November 16, 1933, President Roosevelt rushed to embrace....recognize...the USSR. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational:

"Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his "Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath" by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.

As a bitter loser, I would expect Hoover to excoriate the man who soundly beat his ass in a landslide victory. Nash, also a butt hurt RW loser was obliged to use his journalistic skills to join his fellows in nitpicking the new president who was focusing on fixing the economic mess the GOP had left him. Indeed, the Great Depression was a global disaster and the USA, under GOP leadership, was a major contributor to it. That being said, FDR's overtures towards the Kremlin were rational considering the weakened state of affairs in Europe, the rising Nazis in Deutschland and the Japanese ascension in Asia. FDR was an advocate of world peace and was instrumental in jumpstarting the UN. He was aware of the rising power of the Soviets and how crucial that power would be against the Wehrmacht and the Luftwaffe.



The above paragraph encapsulates the second global antebellum period and thankfully, FDR had the insight to reach out to the USSR when he did. But, as you said, previous US administrations refused to recognize the Soviets and Europe followed suit. However, Communism was not the catalysts for the political estrangement of the USSR. No, after the Bolsheviks seized power on 1917 they nationalized foreign assets and confiscated property including that of the USA. Adding insult to injury the new revolutionary government refused to pay back loans the USA had made to the now overthrown TSAR regime. That "betrayed freedom" starts to look like "BS betrayed." It had nothing to do with freedom.



Milestones: 1921–1936 - Office of the Historian

2. Here is the question:was Roosevelt aware of the homicidal pathology of communism, and if so, shouldn't he have considered same as a reason to put off recognition until he persuaded a change in those policies?

Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology, including Christianity, Islam or capitalistic based entities. All of those mentioned have spilled blood. Besides, FDR was in no position to proselytize to the Bolsheviks about human rights when sheet wearing domestic terrorists were still running rampant and killing innocent people, figuratively speaking, in his own backyard. But any insinuation that FDR was secretly an agent of Communism is patently ridiculous. He recognized Russia because of future strategy considerations and for the sake of his fledgling UN and it payed off big time when the Nazis invaded the USSR.

a.He knew.

Eight months earlier, journalist Gareth Jones had exposed Stalin's Terror Famine:

"In the train a Communist denied to me that there was a famine. I flung a crust of bread which I had been eating from my own supply into a spittoon. A peasant fellow-passenger fished it out and ravenously ate it."

Gareth Jones journalist - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

That is a big leap. Jones' anecdote sounds more like something akin to the tall tales of William B. Laughead. If the tale is true there is something very disturbing about Jones' behavior. Who throws a crust of bread into a Spittoon in the first place, and especially in the presence of starving, emaciated people? Jones is either a sick sadist or a liar or both...take your pick.

b. Malcolm Muggeridge "was the first writer to revealthe true nature of Stalin s regime when in 1933he exposed the terror famine in the Ukraine. "

Amazon.com Time and Eternity The Uncollected Writings of Malcolm Muggeridge 9781570759055 Malcolm Muggeridge Nicholas Flynn Books



c. So FDR knew of the Terror Famine...designed and perpetrated by 'Uncle Joe,'...yet heenveloped Joe Stalin in " the cloak of his popularity..."Time Magazine, December 17, 1934.

A leftist who became a voice against communism? Doesn't that throw a wrinkle in that "leftist are all communists paradigm?" But the book review doesn't do much for me. All that does is show me how well you can cut and paste. The terror famine may or may not be true but Stalin probably was a murdering monster like Mao and Hitler were. Soooo, if FDR's Intelligence operatives couldn't confirm Muggeridge's revelations I would hardly expect him to shape his foreign policy around a private author's claims.

OK....so Roosevelt knew the nature of the other side when he offered the partnership....entry into the accepted world community.

There can be no doubt that Roosevelt knew.....and then, as per Stalin's plan, he gave Lend Lease materials that Allies needed, to Stalin.

Here you are mixing pre war events with wartime events. I repeat that FDR couldn't base his pre-war foreign policy on Muggeridge's report. And, apparently, allied spies and operatives in Russia hadn't confirmed the report. (pre war).



The Lend Lease was part of a reciprocal agreement that materialized after the Nazis invaded the USSR. ( war time). FDR's bold pre war initiative and foresight payed off big time with this move. The Europeans had rejected the Soviets bid to join the Grand Alliance earlier so in 1939 the Soviets made a pact with (shudder) the Nazis. Fortunately, for Europe and the world, that pact was broken when Hitler ordered his troops into Soviet territory. FDR seized the opportunity to support the Soviets with that Lend Lease deal and the Soviets promised to supply the US with raw materials and commodities as needed.



Here is the correspondence between Stalin and FDR facilitating crucial collaboration and material support that probably saved the world from Nazi domination!

Correspondence of Roosevelt and Truman with Stalin on Lend Lease and Other Aid to the Soviet Union, 1941-1945

"Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Gads. you're a fool.


"The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression,"
by Jean-Louis Panné (Author), Andrzej Paczkowski (Author), Karel Bartosek (Author), Jean-Louis Margolin (Author), Nicolas Werth (Author), Stéphane Courtois (Author), & 2 more

"Already famous throughout Europe, this international bestseller plumbs recently opened archives in the former Soviet bloc to reveal the actual, practical accomplishments of Communism around the world: terror, torture, famine, mass deportations, and massacres. Astonishing in the sheer detail it amasses, the book is the first comprehensive attempt to catalogue and analyze the crimes of Communism over seventy years."


100 million slaughtered.


Roosevelt facilitated this.

Gads you're a stupid bitch but I won't allow you to DOG me around, heh heh heh! I don't deny the atrocities committed by totalitarian dictators purporting to be communists occurred. Do you deny that the USA, Britain and many of the allied european countries including Australia also committed murderous acts on indigenous populations. We are reluctant to pin a face to US atrocities but that didn't make them any less deadly or less bloody for the men , women and children that perished. Sure, 100 million is a huge number that defies the imagination. I wonder where all those bullets came from. But who was counting? How did the pundits arrive at that estimate? US historians are famous for undercounting casualties of non combatant autochthonous peoples murdered US military campaigns. They are simply written off as collateral damage. But our historians and journalist are quick to point to that combined 100 million killed by Stalin and Mao. I don't care what ideology a charismatic psychopath has be it Capitalist or Communist. I blame the man not the ideology

Watch your language....it gives away how irked you are at being correctly identified as a dunce.

You wrote: ""Communism has no more of a homicidal pathology than any other ideology,"

Then you wrote: "I don't deny the atrocities committed by totalitarian dictators purporting to be communists occurred."



Does that neon light flashing IDIOT over your head keep you awake at night?

Ok, I see you are sensitive so I will refrain from calling you names and focus on the subject matter.

You have identified every person who says something you dislike as a dunce. I guess that puts me in good company...thanks.

Yes I wrote both of the statements you quoted above but one doesn't conflict with the other. communism was NOT the cause of atrocities committed by Mao and Stalin. Those were decisions made by them and was independent of anything Marx stood for or said. Or... at least I haven't heard or read that Marx made homicide and mass murder a tenet of Communism. I could be wrong... am I? If so show me. If not STFU!

"What is wrong with my language? Looking at your vicious insults,....."

I never use language that I wouldn't use in front of children, and still have no problem identifying you correctly.

That's because I have an education, and am not a Liberal....or, is that a redundancy.



'....one would think you wanted a nasty knock down drag out fight."
You catch on quick....I fight ignorance and Leftist oppression at every opportunity.



"communism was NOT the cause of atrocities committed by Mao and Stalin."
I stated that you are an imbecile...and here you are, gilding the lily.

" Among these monstrous crimes, Ukraine stands out as the worst in terms of numbers.Stalin declared war on his own peoplein 1932, sending Commissars V. Molotov and Lazar Kaganovitch and NKVD secret police chief Genrikh Yagoda to crush the resistance of Ukrainian farmers toforced collectivization.

Ukraine was sealed off. All food supplies and livestock were confiscated. NKVD death squads executed "anti-party elements." Furious that insufficient Ukrainians were being shot, Kaganovitch - virtually the Soviet Union's Adolf Eichmann - set a quota of 10,000 executions a week. Eighty percent of Ukrainian intellectuals were shot.



During the bitter winter of 1932-33,25,000 Ukrainians per day were being shot or died of starvation and cold.Cannibalism became common. Ukraine, writes historian Robert Conquest, looked like a giant version of the future Bergen-Belsen death camp.

The mass murder of seven million Ukrainians, three million of them children, and deportation to the gulag of two million more (where most died) was hidden by Soviet propaganda. Pro-communist westerners, like The New York Times' Walter Duranty, British writers Sidney and Beatrice Webb and French Prime Minister Edouard Herriot, toured Ukraine, denied reports of genocide, and applauded what they called Soviet "agrarian reform." Those who spoke out against the genocide were branded "fascist agents."Seven million died in the 'forgotten' holocaust - Eric Margolis




I'm curious....how do imbeciles like you find your way home to that split-level porta-potty each day?
Bread crumbs?
Shiny pebbles?
A string attached to your Depends????

 

[PoliticalChic]

Okay, so we've learned here that everyone who dares to be to the left of hardcore right wing partisan ideologues is a commie.

Well, that was just fascinating.

Anything else?
.

"....so we've learned ...."

Actually, the "we" is your attempt to pretend that everyone is as weak as you are, and subscribes to moral equivalency.

 

[Mac1958]

Okay, so we've learned here that everyone who dares to be to the left of hardcore right wing partisan ideologues is a commie.

Well, that was just fascinating.

Anything else?
.

"....so we've learned ...."

Actually, the "we" is your attempt to pretend that everyone is a weak as you are, and subscribes to moral equivalency.

Hey, I'm just admitting you're right.

You've got me. I'm a commie.

Here's my favorite hat:

Now, is there a point to all of this, outside of being a platform for your standard personal insults and name-calling?
.