8th Amendment, Cruel and Unusual Punishment; Mass Murderers

[JBvM]

Torture is unconstitutional

It may be cruel, but if it happened more often it wouldn't be unusual.

Not true, depending on what definition of 'unusual' you are using.

 

[easyt65]

Waterboarding is 'disturbing' and 'cruel' but does not result in death ... as opposed to setting someone on fire, hacking them up into pieces, the terror a woman goes through in the seemingly ENDLESS torturous seconds as she slides backwards on the floor trying to escape the rapist / murderer who is about to end her life with a knife/hammer....or the fear in a child's mind/heart as they scream out for their mommy / daddy as the bad man hurts them and finally kills them....

Yeah, I would have no problem waterboarding the $H!T out of one of them, especially if it had been one of my family members these criminals had done these things to.

 

[g5000]

Torture is unconstitutional

It may be cruel

There is a lot of information about your character in that "may be".

 

[easyt65]

ACTUALLY...God works in mysterious ways...and He is good.

My daughter was drugged and raped a few years ago. The police were worthless and told me that my wife and I should just 'chock her rape up as a loss' (at which point I almost came across the desk after the dumbass who said it).

Serving in the military all these years I have taken lives in the service of my country, but I had never wanted to take one out of hate / for personal reasons...until then. I went to my pastor and asked him to pray not with me but FOR me, pray that I would WANT to pray for the ability to forgive instead of desire to kill the SOB who raped my daughter. He prayed for about an hour....

After I left I didn't go home. I went looking for the guy who raped my daughter. Where I lived was NOT that big of a place, and the guy was fairly well known. It SHOULD have been easy for me to find him.....but I truly believe God intervened and kept me from finding him while He and others in my life worked on my heart.

Weird things like my GPS just shutting off for no reason, my truck dying out in the middle of nowhere only to have a buddy show up - jump in - turn the key and have it start right up before trying to give me a jump....then staying and talking with me....like I said, you don't have to believe, but I believe it was God protecting the guy...and me.

Not much later, visiting the pastor again, I was able to simply let go, learn to forgive. I have no problem serving my country and doing what must be done, but 'revenge' is not my thing. God calls on us to be stronger men and women, and I discovered it take far more strength to forgive someone than it does to allow your emotion to control you and to exact revenge.

Sorry, just thought I would share....

 

[bgrouse]

No. Clearly that is cruel and unusual punish.

Put them in solitary confinement and keep them alive as long as you can.

So apply it to all murderers. Then it won't be unusual. Just cruel.

The thread topic is about MASS MURDERS. Not all murderers. However, I do agree that solitary confinement could be considered cruel.

Right, but MASS MURDERS are not particularly common, so to make torture not unusual, you'd probably have to do something like applying torture as punishment to all murders.

 

[Timmy]

Waterboarding is 'disturbing' and 'cruel' but does not result in death ... as opposed to setting someone on fire, hacking them up into pieces, the terror a woman goes through in the seemingly ENDLESS torturous seconds as she slides backwards on the floor trying to escape the rapist / murderer who is about to end her life with a knife/hammer....or the fear in a child's mind/heart as they scream out for their mommy / daddy as the bad man hurts them and finally kills them....

Yeah, I would have no problem waterboarding the $H!T out of one of them, especially if it had been one of my family members these criminals had done these things to.

Let’s flip this . If the victim forgives the perp , do we let him go? His family pays off the victim, do we let the perp go?

 

[WinterBorn]

No. Yes, the mass murderers may deserve it. But we, the public & citizenry, must be better than the mass murderers.

 

[g5000]

Should an exception to the 8th Amendment be added for Mass Murderers who murder innocent civilians while in public, subjecting them to excruciating torture outdoors, so that the public (victim) can watch?

This test was made for people just like you: F-Scale Study - Individual Differences Research Labs

Sex crimes, such as rape and attacks on children, deserve more than mere imprisonment; such criminals ought to be publicly whipped, or worse.

.

 

[Aldo Raine]

ACTUALLY...God works in mysterious ways...and He is good.

My daughter was drugged and raped a few years ago. The police were worthless and told me that my wife and I should just 'chock her rape up as a loss' (at which point I almost came across the desk after the dumbass who said it).

Serving in the military all these years I have taken lives in the service of my country, but I had never wanted to take one out of hate / for personal reasons...until then. I went to my pastor and asked him to pray not with me but FOR me, pray that I would WANT to pray for the ability to forgive instead of desire to kill the SOB who raped my daughter. He prayed for about an hour....

After I left I didn't go home. I went looking for the guy who raped my daughter. Where I lived was NOT that big of a place, and the guy was fairly well known. It SHOULD have been easy for me to find him.....but I truly believe God intervened and kept me from finding him while He and others in my life worked on my heart.

Weird things like my GPS just shutting off for no reason, my truck dying out in the middle of nowhere only to have a buddy show up - jump in - turn the key and have it start right up before trying to give me a jump....then staying and talking with me....like I said, you don't have to believe, but I believe it was God protecting the guy...and me.

Not much later, visiting the pastor again, I was able to simply let go, learn to forgive. I have no problem serving my country and doing what must be done, but 'revenge' is not my thing. God calls on us to be stronger men and women, and I discovered it take far more strength to forgive someone than it does to allow your emotion to control you and to exact revenge.

Sorry, just thought I would share....

Very sorry to hear that about your daughter sir. I am sure that 90% of us on this board would feel the same as you did. Not sure I could ever forgive something like that and hope I never have to find out. My condolences.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

I believe in eye for an eye; tooth for a tooth.

The same pain and misery of a perpetrator should be inflicted upon them...at the very least.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

No. Clearly that is cruel and unusual punish.

Put them in solitary confinement and keep them alive as long as you can.

So apply it to all murderers. Then it won't be unusual. Just cruel.

The thread topic is about MASS MURDERS. Not all murderers. However, I do agree that solitary confinement could be considered cruel.

Right, but MASS MURDERS are not particularly common, so to make torture not unusual, you'd probably have to do something like applying torture as punishment to all murders.

That there is the justification, mass murder is cruel and unusual, and thus is well deserving of cruel and unusual punishment.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

and the "pick pocket, deterrence hypothesis" is a flawed study, quoting the main author:

The tenet that harsher penalties could substantially reduce crime rates rests on the assumption that currently active criminals weigh the costs and benefits of their contemplated acts. Existing and proposed crime strategies exhibit this belief, as does a large and growing segment of the crime literature. This study examines the premise that criminals make informed and calculated decisions. The findings suggest that 76% of active criminals and 89% of the most violent criminals either perceive no risk of apprehension or are incognizant of the likely punishments for their crimes.

That's the wrong premise, he was supposed to study ordinary citizens who were law abiding, and ask them what deterred them from committing crimes when thoughts of stealing/injuring/killing came to mind. Such a study could be extended to one-time felons (like myself) and ask them what keeps that at bay.

In place without law (total anarchy), murder and theft skyrocket. This is why "anarchists" crack me up. They are either very naive, or very thirsty to enact heinous crimes without repercussions.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Should an exception to the 8th Amendment be added for Mass Murderers who murder innocent civilians while in public, subjecting them to excruciating torture outdoors, so that the public (victim) can watch?

No.

As much as I would love to pull them apart with four horses does not mean it should be done...

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I voted no.
Just an old fashioned hanging forcing the guilty to watch and listen to their own gallows being built.
Why should we feed and house trash for decades?

Why build them? We can reuse them many times, not like in the Old West days.

Put them in a queue and have a long line!

 

[Marion Morrison]

ACTUALLY...God works in mysterious ways...and He is good.

My daughter was drugged and raped a few years ago. The police were worthless and told me that my wife and I should just 'chock her rape up as a loss' (at which point I almost came across the desk after the dumbass who said it).

Serving in the military all these years I have taken lives in the service of my country, but I had never wanted to take one out of hate / for personal reasons...until then. I went to my pastor and asked him to pray not with me but FOR me, pray that I would WANT to pray for the ability to forgive instead of desire to kill the SOB who raped my daughter. He prayed for about an hour....

After I left I didn't go home. I went looking for the guy who raped my daughter. Where I lived was NOT that big of a place, and the guy was fairly well known. It SHOULD have been easy for me to find him.....but I truly believe God intervened and kept me from finding him while He and others in my life worked on my heart.

Weird things like my GPS just shutting off for no reason, my truck dying out in the middle of nowhere only to have a buddy show up - jump in - turn the key and have it start right up before trying to give me a jump....then staying and talking with me....like I said, you don't have to believe, but I believe it was God protecting the guy...and me.

Not much later, visiting the pastor again, I was able to simply let go, learn to forgive. I have no problem serving my country and doing what must be done, but 'revenge' is not my thing. God calls on us to be stronger men and women, and I discovered it take far more strength to forgive someone than it does to allow your emotion to control you and to exact revenge.

Sorry, just thought I would share....

Oh boy, Good thing you didn't find him. I truly believe God prevented that to preserve you.

You can only interact in this this life, to what God allows you to interact with.

Have you ever had ahold of something and you just drop it? That's God.

Have you ever been looking for something and just couldn't find it? That's God, too.


It wasn't the right time for you to find that.

I had a friend..that was was ready to kill some boys..I had to talk him down..

Dammit! All this and I don't get no Budweiser?

I'll be ok.