A little post mortem

[Norman]

I've been seeing some pretty interesting analysis on this (of course, the analysis is always easier AFTER the fact).

1. If you had asked the average person, say, 5 or 10 years ago, which party would be closer to being populist and which was closer to being for The Big Guy, I think it's pretty clear that most would have said the Dems were closer to being populist. But somehow the GOP beat the Dems to the punch, and the Dems made it easier by running Hillary. Stunning. And reading Dems sites, they're sure as hell stunned, too.

2. And here's another thing: Chris Matthews (yes, I know) made an interesting point yesterday: You know those concerts with the music superstars for Hillary, like Beyonce and the rest? He wondered if those things drove home the point above, by having them all onstage together in "The Winner's Club" -- all these rich, successful people hugging each other. Maybe stuff like that was a net negative.

3. Finally, now that the dust has settled a bit, I think overall half of us just didn't understand the rage that it took to vote for Trump. Enough rage to ignore his myriad faults and weaknesses and behaviors and words and everything else. THAT is a LOT of rage right there. Obama was not able to deliver on the promises he made overall, and a lot of faith was placed in him. Let's see how Trump responds.

My two cents, worth every penny.
.

No rage required to vote for the better candidate... none.

Although, yes it feels amazing to have the bubble of the SJWs pricked. Their echo chamber has been compromised and that is an AMAZING thing. Soon they will have to actually learn how to make real arguments instead of just crying racism towards anyone who doesn't agree with them.

They should have built more safe spaces, perhaps then people would not need to riot.

 

[imawhosure]

I've been seeing some pretty interesting analysis on this (of course, the analysis is always easier AFTER the fact).

1. If you had asked the average person, say, 5 or 10 years ago, which party would be closer to being populist and which was closer to being for The Big Guy, I think it's pretty clear that most would have said the Dems were closer to being populist. But somehow the GOP beat the Dems to the punch, and the Dems made it easier by running Hillary. Stunning. And reading Dems sites, they're sure as hell stunned, too.

2. And here's another thing: Chris Matthews (yes, I know) made an interesting point yesterday: You know those concerts with the music superstars for Hillary, like Beyonce and the rest? He wondered if those things drove home the point above, by having them all onstage together in "The Winner's Club" -- all these rich, successful people hugging each other. Maybe stuff like that was a net negative.

3. Finally, now that the dust has settled a bit, I think overall half of us just didn't understand the rage that it took to vote for Trump. Enough rage to ignore his myriad faults and weaknesses and behaviors and words and everything else. THAT is a LOT of rage right there. Obama was not able to deliver on the promises he made overall, and a lot of faith was placed in him. Let's see how Trump responds.

My two cents, worth every penny.
.

Maybe one day you will be able to reject the propaganda....

Just as I don't know or understand you, you don't know or understand me.

The constant insults aren't necessary.
.

I have him on ignore but I gotta ask, where was the insult in that post?

That I buy into propaganda, which is generally the theme of many of his posts to me. Among others.

Ironic, coming from a person who has clearly bought into everything sold to him by right wing radio and conservative internet.

He doesn't have normal adult conversations, he simply spouts talking points and vague insults.
.

And now to respond to Mac.

You read these boards Mac, how many astro turfing lefties on here kept telling everyone how wonderful the economy was, highlighted the unemployment rate, and poo-pooed anyone talking about the participation rate, putting forth talking point excuses.

What did union and blue collar America say in far greater numbers than before what THEY was true at the pols? You see, when you and I talked while I was in Florida taking its pulse in March, what was going to happen there, and what a counterpart of mine in Penn said, if everything stayed the same. Blue collar people were pissed! They, (along with most thinking individuals) knew that they were being lied to for the express purpose of covering up liberal economic policy failure.

Remember when I told you that all Hispanic cultures were NOT created equal? I put forth the notion to you, that the Cubans in Florida where I was at the time, would NOT vote overwhelmingly for Clinton, and that would push Trump over the top there. Rightwinger told me I had no idea what I was talking about along with Jillian, even as I was traveling through Southern Florida taking surveys that sat right in front of me on the table as he/she lambasted me, that said exactly opposite of what they were saying.

March is a long time from November, and as everything dropped on both candidates, I no longer had a clue what effect it would have, or who/whom was going to win. All I can tell you from the research we did in March, we had Trump winning Florida, Penn, and Ohio; but here is the kicker, our other surveyor had him losing Wisconsin if he was the nominee, by 1.2%, and that was taken in late August. And so, with everything being equal, I would have to say that MORE people moved towards Trump in the waning days, since he carried Wisconsin.

And so, from a political standpoint, the post mortem says this as far as going forward-------------->the republicans will do everything they can to keep their word to revitalize coal country and manufacturing jobs in the rust belt. Why? Because the almighty blue wall of the Democrats has been breached in much more than one place, and the last time that happened and the republicans kept their word to blue collar working men and women, in the next election, Ronald Reagan won every state but Minnesota. Call them dumb if you like, but seeing that, I believe it would be called a clue.

Without the blue wall, Democrats can't win anything as they only have California, New York, Illinois, and Mass. The rest of the states have few electoral votes, and some of them would still be considered swing votes that could be won. The repubs got more control in states this election, and the Democratic slide continues across the country as far as what they actually control. Their control loss was most apparent even in the last 6 years, as their agenda had to be passed by EOs instead of by congressional laws. Their regulations had to be passed by EOs, and the EPA that was NEVER signed by congress, which means they can just be rolled back with a stroke of a pen.

While I agree that the huge population centers vote mostly Democratic, we are NOT a Democracy, we are a Republic. With that in mind, the Dems for the forseeable future are SOL as far as exerting their agenda nationwide without using EOs, and we know how easily they can be rescinded. On the other hand, we now see with the executive branch in their hands, the Republicans CAN and WILL pas laws, that are much harder to ignore; unless of course your name is Obama. But the solution to that is the Supreme Court, which they may have a hand in moulding for a generation to come. In this case, the next Obama will get bitch slapped pretty quickly, and with the influx of illegals being stopped, with a little intelligence to keep the whitehouse for 8 years while installing these policies, it may very well be the Democrats on the outside looking in for the next 20 years.

P.S. Not to put something on this thread NOT pertinent, but HEY RIGHTWINGER, how is that signature of yours working out for you? Which one? The one that said----->
The NEXT REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT HASN'T BEEN BORN YET! Lololol. How is it working out for you and silly Jilly anyway-)

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

I've been seeing some pretty interesting analysis on this (of course, the analysis is always easier AFTER the fact).

1. If you had asked the average person, say, 5 or 10 years ago, which party would be closer to being populist and which was closer to being for The Big Guy, I think it's pretty clear that most would have said the Dems were closer to being populist. But somehow the GOP beat the Dems to the punch, and the Dems made it easier by running Hillary. Stunning. And reading Dems sites, they're sure as hell stunned, too.

2. And here's another thing: Chris Matthews (yes, I know) made an interesting point yesterday: You know those concerts with the music superstars for Hillary, like Beyonce and the rest? He wondered if those things drove home the point above, by having them all onstage together in "The Winner's Club" -- all these rich, successful people hugging each other. Maybe stuff like that was a net negative.

3. Finally, now that the dust has settled a bit, I think overall half of us just didn't understand the rage that it took to vote for Trump. Enough rage to ignore his myriad faults and weaknesses and behaviors and words and everything else. THAT is a LOT of rage right there. Obama was not able to deliver on the promises he made overall, and a lot of faith was placed in him. Let's see how Trump responds.

My two cents, worth every penny.
.

Maybe one day you will be able to reject the propaganda....

Just as I don't know or understand you, you don't know or understand me.

The constant insults aren't necessary.
.

I have him on ignore but I gotta ask, where was the insult in that post?

That I buy into propaganda, which is generally the theme of many of his posts to me. Among others.

Ironic, coming from a person who has clearly bought into everything sold to him by right wing radio and conservative internet.

He doesn't have normal adult conversations, he simply spouts talking points and vague insults.
.

I'd just call ya a Hillary voter, that's insult enough

 

[Mac1958]

I've been seeing some pretty interesting analysis on this (of course, the analysis is always easier AFTER the fact).

1. If you had asked the average person, say, 5 or 10 years ago, which party would be closer to being populist and which was closer to being for The Big Guy, I think it's pretty clear that most would have said the Dems were closer to being populist. But somehow the GOP beat the Dems to the punch, and the Dems made it easier by running Hillary. Stunning. And reading Dems sites, they're sure as hell stunned, too.

2. And here's another thing: Chris Matthews (yes, I know) made an interesting point yesterday: You know those concerts with the music superstars for Hillary, like Beyonce and the rest? He wondered if those things drove home the point above, by having them all onstage together in "The Winner's Club" -- all these rich, successful people hugging each other. Maybe stuff like that was a net negative.

3. Finally, now that the dust has settled a bit, I think overall half of us just didn't understand the rage that it took to vote for Trump. Enough rage to ignore his myriad faults and weaknesses and behaviors and words and everything else. THAT is a LOT of rage right there. Obama was not able to deliver on the promises he made overall, and a lot of faith was placed in him. Let's see how Trump responds.

My two cents, worth every penny.
.

Maybe one day you will be able to reject the propaganda....

Just as I don't know or understand you, you don't know or understand me.

The constant insults aren't necessary.
.

I have him on ignore but I gotta ask, where was the insult in that post?

That I buy into propaganda, which is generally the theme of many of his posts to me. Among others.

Ironic, coming from a person who has clearly bought into everything sold to him by right wing radio and conservative internet.

He doesn't have normal adult conversations, he simply spouts talking points and vague insults.
.

I'd just call ya a Hillary voter, that's insult enough

Whatever works for ya, Gramps.
.

 

[Tresha91203]

you bought the false narrative about trump that was a creation of the DNC and its complicit media. People who know him, work for and with him do not agree with the false media creation of who and what he is.

We will see the real Trump over the next 4 years, and you will be pleasantly surprised.

My opinions of Trump are based on direct observation of his behaviors and words. Direct. Unless the media created a CGI character I was watching and listening to, there were zero (0) outside influences to my opinion. I've said all along the press was shamelessly anti-Trump and pro-Hillary.

That said, my allegiance is to my country and not any party or ideology. So I'll be able to gleefully celebrate every last good thing that happens during his term, and I'm hoping there's one big shitload of them.
.

OK, cool. But its obvious that your opinions of Trump were shaped by the false impression created by the corrupt media and the DNC. He is not a PC politician, he talks like a normal man, like you and I talk. He is real, not a fake image like Hillary.

Hillary Clinton is the most corrupt human being ever to run for any public office. The country is much better off with the Clinton crime family out of power.

I'll never be able to convince you that my opinions of him are based on direct observation. Okay.

As stunned as I am, I am hoping for the best, as always.
.

I am glad you are hoping for the best, so am I.

What I am trying to get across to you is that the media has controlled what you have "observed" about Trump. The media created an image that is contrary to what his employees, business associates, and others who know him say about him.

But believe whatever you want. The important thing is that the Clinton crime cartel will never again have any political power in this country.

I was in that business for nearly 20 years, I know precisely how they play.

It's his words and behaviors that shaped my opinion, the press was noise to me.

We'll see, here's hoping.
.

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

 

[Mac1958]

My opinions of Trump are based on direct observation of his behaviors and words. Direct. Unless the media created a CGI character I was watching and listening to, there were zero (0) outside influences to my opinion. I've said all along the press was shamelessly anti-Trump and pro-Hillary.

That said, my allegiance is to my country and not any party or ideology. So I'll be able to gleefully celebrate every last good thing that happens during his term, and I'm hoping there's one big shitload of them.
.

OK, cool. But its obvious that your opinions of Trump were shaped by the false impression created by the corrupt media and the DNC. He is not a PC politician, he talks like a normal man, like you and I talk. He is real, not a fake image like Hillary.

Hillary Clinton is the most corrupt human being ever to run for any public office. The country is much better off with the Clinton crime family out of power.

I'll never be able to convince you that my opinions of him are based on direct observation. Okay.

As stunned as I am, I am hoping for the best, as always.
.

I am glad you are hoping for the best, so am I.

What I am trying to get across to you is that the media has controlled what you have "observed" about Trump. The media created an image that is contrary to what his employees, business associates, and others who know him say about him.

But believe whatever you want. The important thing is that the Clinton crime cartel will never again have any political power in this country.

I was in that business for nearly 20 years, I know precisely how they play.

It's his words and behaviors that shaped my opinion, the press was noise to me.

We'll see, here's hoping.
.

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

 

[Norman]

OK, cool. But its obvious that your opinions of Trump were shaped by the false impression created by the corrupt media and the DNC. He is not a PC politician, he talks like a normal man, like you and I talk. He is real, not a fake image like Hillary.

Hillary Clinton is the most corrupt human being ever to run for any public office. The country is much better off with the Clinton crime family out of power.

I'll never be able to convince you that my opinions of him are based on direct observation. Okay.

As stunned as I am, I am hoping for the best, as always.
.

I am glad you are hoping for the best, so am I.

What I am trying to get across to you is that the media has controlled what you have "observed" about Trump. The media created an image that is contrary to what his employees, business associates, and others who know him say about him.

But believe whatever you want. The important thing is that the Clinton crime cartel will never again have any political power in this country.

I was in that business for nearly 20 years, I know precisely how they play.

It's his words and behaviors that shaped my opinion, the press was noise to me.

We'll see, here's hoping.
.

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

No, it is not merely an opinion. There is such a thing as better and worse. For example US is better than the 3rd world... by almost all indicators. Similarly kids of two parent families do better... measured by almost all indicators.

And Trump is better than Hillary... by almost all measures.

 

[Tresha91203]

OK, cool. But its obvious that your opinions of Trump were shaped by the false impression created by the corrupt media and the DNC. He is not a PC politician, he talks like a normal man, like you and I talk. He is real, not a fake image like Hillary.

Hillary Clinton is the most corrupt human being ever to run for any public office. The country is much better off with the Clinton crime family out of power.

I'll never be able to convince you that my opinions of him are based on direct observation. Okay.

As stunned as I am, I am hoping for the best, as always.
.

I am glad you are hoping for the best, so am I.

What I am trying to get across to you is that the media has controlled what you have "observed" about Trump. The media created an image that is contrary to what his employees, business associates, and others who know him say about him.

But believe whatever you want. The important thing is that the Clinton crime cartel will never again have any political power in this country.

I was in that business for nearly 20 years, I know precisely how they play.

It's his words and behaviors that shaped my opinion, the press was noise to me.

We'll see, here's hoping.
.

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

I was addressing your third point:

"3. Finally, now that the dust has settled a bit, I think overall half of us just didn't understand the rage that it took to vote for Trump. Enough rage to ignore his myriad faults and weaknesses and behaviors and words and everything else. THAT is a LOT of rage right there. Obama was not able to deliver on the promises he made overall, and a lot of faith was placed in him. Let's see how Trump responds."

How could you not understand the rage. Every single piece of poo she flung was her own.

How he treats women: She and her husband are the very last people who should comment on that. Her statement that all women should be believed made everyone over 40 angry, unless they were an ostrich or had dementia.

It's Russia!: She is the one with the russian ties, deals with Putin and big financial gain from same.

Too untrustworthy to trust with classified info: Hahaha. How many pages of classified info did she have printed off by people with no clearance? Where are those hard copies now?

Trump incites violence: Turns out they were Dem plants paid to incite violence. It is still the left right now, probably the same exact people, rioting.

I don't understand how one could not feel the rage, much less not understand it. I'm fairly certain if Trump had done those things, you'd feel the rage. If Trump had done those things, would he be slightly less repulsive? No.

 

[Mac1958]

I'll never be able to convince you that my opinions of him are based on direct observation. Okay.

As stunned as I am, I am hoping for the best, as always.
.

I am glad you are hoping for the best, so am I.

What I am trying to get across to you is that the media has controlled what you have "observed" about Trump. The media created an image that is contrary to what his employees, business associates, and others who know him say about him.

But believe whatever you want. The important thing is that the Clinton crime cartel will never again have any political power in this country.

I was in that business for nearly 20 years, I know precisely how they play.

It's his words and behaviors that shaped my opinion, the press was noise to me.

We'll see, here's hoping.
.

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

No, it is not merely an opinion. There is such a thing as better and worse. For example US is better than the 3rd world... by almost all indicators. Similarly kids of two parent families do better... measured by almost all indicators.

And Trump is better than Hillary... by almost all measures.

Of course it's opinion, and it's a little troubling that you don't realize that.

There's a lot of that going around right now.
.

 

[cutter]

Trump won because he was the first anti-PC canidate. He refused to apologize for being blunt and telling people what he thought. Just look at the riots, a bunch of idiots lost and it hurt their feelings and they need a safe spact where they can go and tell themselves they are right and they deserve a trophy too.

 

[Tresha91203]

Interstate competition is not as easy as writing a law

Most of the impediments right now are being imposed by states which establish strict rules and regulations to sell insurance in their state
Secondly, selling health insurance is not as easy as setting up a website that says "Cheap Insurance"
You must set up networks with doctors and pharmacies in EVERY state. Not an easy thing to do

Well, nobody will spend TWO BILLION DOLLARS on a website like your First Lady's pal charged us. Nobody said this will be easy or the lazy democrats would have done it long ago. The industry knows how to adapt...this is the beginning of the end of government trying to pick one-size-fits-all. And it's about time destructive behavior is addressed in insurance rates. A yearly physical to set premium and deductible rate is coming...if you're obese or drink like a fish, you're going to pay more.

Of course the Republicans will do better. They have had seven years to develop a plan that is better than Obamacare

If Obamacare is such a disaster why can't they deliver a plan that:

1. Covers pre-existing conditions
2. Is affordable
3. Covers those who have low incomes
4. Eliminates the fallback of emergency rooms as healthcare providers for those without insurance

Ball is in Republicans court once they repeal Obamacare. It would be nice to know their plans before they pull the plug wouldn't it?

Why? We had to pass the last bill so we could see what's in it. You were on board with that then, right?

 

[Norman]

I am glad you are hoping for the best, so am I.

What I am trying to get across to you is that the media has controlled what you have "observed" about Trump. The media created an image that is contrary to what his employees, business associates, and others who know him say about him.

But believe whatever you want. The important thing is that the Clinton crime cartel will never again have any political power in this country.

I was in that business for nearly 20 years, I know precisely how they play.

It's his words and behaviors that shaped my opinion, the press was noise to me.

We'll see, here's hoping.
.

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

No, it is not merely an opinion. There is such a thing as better and worse. For example US is better than the 3rd world... by almost all indicators. Similarly kids of two parent families do better... measured by almost all indicators.

And Trump is better than Hillary... by almost all measures.

Of course it's opinion, and it's a little troubling that you don't realize that.

There's a lot of that going around right now.
.

So you think Hitler being better than Obama is merely an opinion too?

Nope, he was worse than Obama by all standards. I am sorry if you fail to see that.

 

[Mac1958]

I was in that business for nearly 20 years, I know precisely how they play.

It's his words and behaviors that shaped my opinion, the press was noise to me.

We'll see, here's hoping.
.

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

No, it is not merely an opinion. There is such a thing as better and worse. For example US is better than the 3rd world... by almost all indicators. Similarly kids of two parent families do better... measured by almost all indicators.

And Trump is better than Hillary... by almost all measures.

Of course it's opinion, and it's a little troubling that you don't realize that.

There's a lot of that going around right now.
.

So you think Hitler being better than Obama is merely an opinion too?

Nope, he was worse than Obama by all standards. I am sorry if you fail to see that.

Uh oh, Hitler comparisons.

Okay, never mind.
.

 

[Norman]

Did you not observe his opponent? She is the most corrupt hypocrite I've observed, and I've been observing her for a long time. She does not care about women, as she proved while on bimbo eruption control. She ruined those women, women her husband assaulted or was inappropriate with. She does not care about her country or she would not jeapordize the US by being extremely careless with national secrets because she was lazy or didnt want the inconvenience. Why the hell did she have people printing so much classified information????? She purposely skirted FoI with her bleached server. She did not want her stuff archived. Why???

She was the worst possible candidate, worse than Trump, even. Blame the DNC for cheating her onto the ballot even after "discouraging" any viable D opponent. She had to cheat to beat Crazy Uncle Bernie, who wasn't even a democrat. Her own party did not want her. The rest of us sure as hell didn't. How can anyone be surprised she lost?!?! It is absurd.

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

No, it is not merely an opinion. There is such a thing as better and worse. For example US is better than the 3rd world... by almost all indicators. Similarly kids of two parent families do better... measured by almost all indicators.

And Trump is better than Hillary... by almost all measures.

Of course it's opinion, and it's a little troubling that you don't realize that.

There's a lot of that going around right now.
.

So you think Hitler being better than Obama is merely an opinion too?

Nope, he was worse than Obama by all standards. I am sorry if you fail to see that.

Uh oh, Hitler comparisons.

Okay, never mind.
.

What a rebuttal...

 

[Mac1958]

"Worse than Trump". That's not a fact, it's opinion. 50% agree, 50% disagree.

We had two horrible, terrible choices, and one of them won. It is what it is.
.

No, it is not merely an opinion. There is such a thing as better and worse. For example US is better than the 3rd world... by almost all indicators. Similarly kids of two parent families do better... measured by almost all indicators.

And Trump is better than Hillary... by almost all measures.

Of course it's opinion, and it's a little troubling that you don't realize that.

There's a lot of that going around right now.
.

So you think Hitler being better than Obama is merely an opinion too?

Nope, he was worse than Obama by all standards. I am sorry if you fail to see that.

Uh oh, Hitler comparisons.

Okay, never mind.
.

What a rebuttal...

Precisely.
.

 

[Norman]

No, it is not merely an opinion. There is such a thing as better and worse. For example US is better than the 3rd world... by almost all indicators. Similarly kids of two parent families do better... measured by almost all indicators.

And Trump is better than Hillary... by almost all measures.

Of course it's opinion, and it's a little troubling that you don't realize that.

There's a lot of that going around right now.
.

So you think Hitler being better than Obama is merely an opinion too?

Nope, he was worse than Obama by all standards. I am sorry if you fail to see that.

Uh oh, Hitler comparisons.

Okay, never mind.
.

What a rebuttal...

Precisely.
.

No, what I said seems to have flown right past your head. You seem to have drank the post-modernist cool-aid where everything is an opinion and there are no facts.

Clinton was a terrible, terrible candidate, one of the worst ones ever. Trump said some stupid things. Therefore Trump is better, end of story. Not an opinion, but an argument.

 

[Mac1958]

Of course it's opinion, and it's a little troubling that you don't realize that.

There's a lot of that going around right now.
.

So you think Hitler being better than Obama is merely an opinion too?

Nope, he was worse than Obama by all standards. I am sorry if you fail to see that.

Uh oh, Hitler comparisons.

Okay, never mind.
.

What a rebuttal...

Precisely.
.

No, what I said seems to have flown right past your head. You seem to have drank the post-modernist cool-aid where everything is an opinion and there are no facts.

I honestly don't know how to communicate with someone who no longer recognizes the difference between fact and opinion.

I deal with this pretty regularly with people on both ends of the spectrum, hence my sig.
.

 

[Norman]

So you think Hitler being better than Obama is merely an opinion too?

Nope, he was worse than Obama by all standards. I am sorry if you fail to see that.

Uh oh, Hitler comparisons.

Okay, never mind.
.

What a rebuttal...

Precisely.
.

No, what I said seems to have flown right past your head. You seem to have drank the post-modernist cool-aid where everything is an opinion and there are no facts.

I honestly don't know how to communicate with someone who no longer recognizes the difference between fact and opinion.

I deal with this pretty regularly with people on both ends of the spectrum, hence my sig.
.

"Clinton was a terrible, terrible candidate, one of the worst ones ever. Trump said some stupid things. Therefore Trump is better, end of story. Not an opinion, but an argument."

Yes, there is a value judgement. I think criminality is worse than saying stupid things, the justice system and all reasonable people agree. But yeah, it's an opinion just like the preferred taste of an ice cream.

No dude... the point of democracy is to pick the candidate who wins the arguments, it's not like picking an ice cream where opinion is all that counts. If you missed this you are an idiot.

 

[Mac1958]

Uh oh, Hitler comparisons.

Okay, never mind.
.

What a rebuttal...

Precisely.
.

No, what I said seems to have flown right past your head. You seem to have drank the post-modernist cool-aid where everything is an opinion and there are no facts.

I honestly don't know how to communicate with someone who no longer recognizes the difference between fact and opinion.

I deal with this pretty regularly with people on both ends of the spectrum, hence my sig.
.

"Clinton was a terrible, terrible candidate, one of the worst ones ever. Trump said some stupid things. Therefore Trump is better, end of story. Not an opinion, but an argument."

Yes, there is a value judgement. I think criminality is worse than saying stupid things, the justice system and all reasonable people agree. But yeah, it's an opinion just like the preferred taste of an ice cream.

No dude... the point of democracy is to pick the candidate who wins the arguments, it's not like picking an ice cream where opinion is all that counts. If you missed this you are an idiot.

"No dude... the point of democracy is to pick the candidate who wins the arguments."

Oh, okay, great.

I didn't see the scoreboard. What were the scores? I'm sure they were tabulated in a very objective way.

Link, please.
.

 

[Norman]

What a rebuttal...

Precisely.
.

No, what I said seems to have flown right past your head. You seem to have drank the post-modernist cool-aid where everything is an opinion and there are no facts.

I honestly don't know how to communicate with someone who no longer recognizes the difference between fact and opinion.

I deal with this pretty regularly with people on both ends of the spectrum, hence my sig.
.

"Clinton was a terrible, terrible candidate, one of the worst ones ever. Trump said some stupid things. Therefore Trump is better, end of story. Not an opinion, but an argument."

Yes, there is a value judgement. I think criminality is worse than saying stupid things, the justice system and all reasonable people agree. But yeah, it's an opinion just like the preferred taste of an ice cream.

No dude... the point of democracy is to pick the candidate who wins the arguments, it's not like picking an ice cream where opinion is all that counts. If you missed this you are an idiot.

"No dude... the point of democracy is to pick the candidate who wins the arguments."

Oh, okay, great.

I didn't see the scoreboard. What were the scores? I'm sure they were tabulated in a very objective way.

Link, please.
.

Yes they were. It's not an opinion that Clinton is under 4 different FBI investigations. It's no an opinion she cheated on the debates... it's not an opinion that she lied a lot about the emails. These are all facts.

Given that people prefer people who say mean things rather than criminals... of course, there are some bigots, who would vote for a criminal if it meant they get free stuff or whatever.