Banned for Reading Bible BEFORE Class

[Tilly]

 

[PoliticalChic]

It’s apparently OK to read history books at Northern Arizona University, but not the Good Book.

Mark Holden, a 22-year-old history major, tells me he was ordered to leave a lecture hall after his professor objected to him reading the Bible before the start of the class.

“All the students agreed with her that assimilation is oppressive and evil.”

Holden alleges that professor Heather Martel ordered him to put away the Good Book around six minutes before a scheduled history class. It’s unclear why she objected to the reading of God’s word.

According to her biography, Professor Martel is a noted scholar who is working on an essay titled, “The Gender Amazon: Indigenous Female Masculinity in Early Modern European Representations of Contact.” She also teaches classes on Global Queer History and Feminist Theory.

When Holden declined to stop reading his Bible, the professor summoned Derek Heng, the chairman of the department. Heng then proceeded to explain the situation.

Holden recorded the conversation and turned it over to congressional candidate Kevin Cavanaugh. In turn, Cavanaugh provided me with a copy of the audio.

"So Professor Martel says that she doesn't want you sitting in front of her because you put, you know, a Bible out, right?" Heng said.

"So she doesn't want me in the front because I have my Bible out," Holden replied.

"No, I think she — I mean, well, why do you have your Bible out anyway," Heng asked.

After a bit more back and forth regarding the dynamics in the classroom, the chairman of the department got to the heart of the issue. "So, will you, will you, will you, put your Bible away?" Heng asked.

The incident occurred back in February, but just recently became public after Campus Reform reported on the controversy.

Holden had previously drawn the ire of his professor during a classroom discussion on assimilation.

"All the students agreed with her that assimilation is oppressive and evil," Holden said. "I suggested there are both positive and negative aspects to assimilation."

As an example, he referenced a report about two Muslim men in California who reportedly said the Koran justified doing terrible things to women.

"She told me I was a racist and she would not tolerate that kind of racism in the class," Holden said. "I told her Islam was not a race and I was only talking about what the two Muslim men as individuals said — I was not making broad claims about Islam or my interpretation of the Koran."

After a bit of back and forth, Holden said the professor told the class, "Welcome to Trump's new America — where straight white males can say prejudicial things without being reprimanded for it."

Nothing like feeling persecuted.

Is this a claim that the bullying and 'persecution' doesn't go on?

Or your version of 'snitches get stitches and wind up in ditches'?

Speak up, dolt.

Did I trigger you? Sorry.

There is much you should be sorry for.

Well, not as much as I would be if I wasted my time reading your posting novels.

Well....if you ever decide to pick up a book that doesn't involve Crayolas, here is one by a Liberal, as opposed to a Fascist as you have proven to be:

 

[Moonglow]

The left isn't killing my free speech, the cops usually do..

 

[Skull Pilot]

This story stinks of....lets hear the rest of the story before we go batshit crazy

I seriously doubt a professor would object to a student reading the bible before class
The only side we have heard is the student claiming she did

Lets hear what the professor and other students have to say

really you doubt that in today's political climate of perpetual butthurt?

where the hell have you been?

 

[rightwinger]

Mr Holden's side of the story just doesn't seem to pass the "Does that make sense" test

The rightwing is outraged that a liberal professor would punish a student for reading the bible six minutes before class. Why would a professor do that? Makes no sense. I could see starting class and asking someone to put their bible away....but six minutes before with him silently reading ?

What does make sense is the student had been disruptive in class and disrespectful towards other students. He had been instructed to use a desk at the rear of the classroom near the door and was now intentionally sitting front and center with his bible. He was told to move because of his previous classroom behavior and not because he was reading a bible

"Why would a professor do that?"

Because he is of the Liberal persuasion, of course.

You know that....Shirley.

Maybe she caught him cutting and pasting

 

[rightwinger]

The whole "Bible Reading" thing looks like a setup to create a media backlash

Lets hear what other students have to say about Mr Holden.

Is he a quiet, sincere bible reading student or is he a fucking asshole?

Excellent conspiracy theory. You win an aluminum foil beanie!

Regardless whether it was a "setup" or not, Professor Martel is responsible for her own actions.

We shall see

 

[Tommy Tainant]

He needs to get himself a girlfriend.He will soon grow out of his aggressive and disruptive behaviour.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Mr Holden's side of the story just doesn't seem to pass the "Does that make sense" test

The rightwing is outraged that a liberal professor would punish a student for reading the bible six minutes before class. Why would a professor do that? Makes no sense. I could see starting class and asking someone to put their bible away....but six minutes before with him silently reading ?

What does make sense is the student had been disruptive in class and disrespectful towards other students. He had been instructed to use a desk at the rear of the classroom near the door and was now intentionally sitting front and center with his bible. He was told to move because of his previous classroom behavior and not because he was reading a bible

"Why would a professor do that?"

Because he is of the Liberal persuasion, of course.

You know that....Shirley.

Maybe she caught him cutting and pasting

And....what is your problem with that scholarly method of presentation of material....

...aside from the fact that you aren't capable of same?

 

[rightwinger]

He needs to get himself a girlfriend.He will soon grow out of his aggressive and disruptive behaviour.

Yes, they can conduct bible studies together

 

[Tommy Tainant]

He needs to get himself a girlfriend.He will soon grow out of his aggressive and disruptive behaviour.

Yes, they can conduct bible studies together

In the UK he would be regarded as an oddball and the other students would give him a really wide swerve.

 

[Divine Wind]

The whole "Bible Reading" thing looks like a setup to create a media backlash

Lets hear what other students have to say about Mr Holden.

Is he a quiet, sincere bible reading student or is he a fucking asshole?

Excellent conspiracy theory. You win an aluminum foil beanie!

Regardless whether it was a "setup" or not, Professor Martel is responsible for her own actions.

We shall see

An excellent and highly recommended position to take. Much better than making half-assed judgments of others before all the facts are revealed.

 

[Tilly]

He needs to get himself a girlfriend.He will soon grow out of his aggressive and disruptive behaviour.

What aggressive behaviour?

 

[Tilly]

He needs to get himself a girlfriend.He will soon grow out of his aggressive and disruptive behaviour.

Yes, they can conduct bible studies together

In the UK he would be regarded as an oddball and the other students would give him a really wide swerve.

Why?

 

[Divine Wind]

He needs to get himself a girlfriend.He will soon grow out of his aggressive and disruptive behaviour.

Yes, they can conduct bible studies together

In the UK he would be regarded as an oddball and the other students would give him a really wide swerve.

Do you know this from experience?

 

[Spare_change]

Is there a link to the article?

Why? Do you think I lied?

 

[Spare_change]

I believe in Jesus but a child shouldn't be forced to accept religion....

It should be a personal choice outside of the school....

Clearly, you didn't bother to read the OP ---- the young man (child, my ass!) chose to believe, and was being threatened and harassed because he chose to exercise that belief by reading the Bible.

 

[jillian]

It’s apparently OK to read history books at Northern Arizona University, but not the Good Book.

Mark Holden, a 22-year-old history major, tells me he was ordered to leave a lecture hall after his professor objected to him reading the Bible before the start of the class.

“All the students agreed with her that assimilation is oppressive and evil.”

Holden alleges that professor Heather Martel ordered him to put away the Good Book around six minutes before a scheduled history class. It’s unclear why she objected to the reading of God’s word.

According to her biography, Professor Martel is a noted scholar who is working on an essay titled, “The Gender Amazon: Indigenous Female Masculinity in Early Modern European Representations of Contact.” She also teaches classes on Global Queer History and Feminist Theory.

When Holden declined to stop reading his Bible, the professor summoned Derek Heng, the chairman of the department. Heng then proceeded to explain the situation.

Holden recorded the conversation and turned it over to congressional candidate Kevin Cavanaugh. In turn, Cavanaugh provided me with a copy of the audio.

"So Professor Martel says that she doesn't want you sitting in front of her because you put, you know, a Bible out, right?" Heng said.

"So she doesn't want me in the front because I have my Bible out," Holden replied.

"No, I think she — I mean, well, why do you have your Bible out anyway," Heng asked.

After a bit more back and forth regarding the dynamics in the classroom, the chairman of the department got to the heart of the issue. "So, will you, will you, will you, put your Bible away?" Heng asked.

The incident occurred back in February, but just recently became public after Campus Reform reported on the controversy.

Holden had previously drawn the ire of his professor during a classroom discussion on assimilation.

"All the students agreed with her that assimilation is oppressive and evil," Holden said. "I suggested there are both positive and negative aspects to assimilation."

As an example, he referenced a report about two Muslim men in California who reportedly said the Koran justified doing terrible things to women.

"She told me I was a racist and she would not tolerate that kind of racism in the class," Holden said. "I told her Islam was not a race and I was only talking about what the two Muslim men as individuals said — I was not making broad claims about Islam or my interpretation of the Koran."

After a bit of back and forth, Holden said the professor told the class, "Welcome to Trump's new America — where straight white males can say prejudicial things without being reprimanded for it."

poor snowflake.

if someone can't spend 8 hours without their bible they should be in a parochial school.

and given that there's no link, I'm going to be it's a lie anyway.

btw, mark holden is the chief legal officer of Koch industries.

thanks for the fable.

 

[Spare_change]

They also have no right to tell him he can't keep it on his desk whether class is in session or not, period.

Why does he need his bible in a history class ?

BEFORE class .... geesh.

 

[bodecea]

Nothing like feeling persecuted.

Is this a claim that the bullying and 'persecution' doesn't go on?

Or your version of 'snitches get stitches and wind up in ditches'?

Speak up, dolt.

Did I trigger you? Sorry.

There is much you should be sorry for.

Well, not as much as I would be if I wasted my time reading your posting novels.

Well....if you ever decide to pick up a book that doesn't involve Crayolas, here is one by a Liberal, as opposed to a Fascist as you have proven to be:

Ooooooo! I guess you told me, eh?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Is this a claim that the bullying and 'persecution' doesn't go on?

Or your version of 'snitches get stitches and wind up in ditches'?

Speak up, dolt.

Did I trigger you? Sorry.

There is much you should be sorry for.

Well, not as much as I would be if I wasted my time reading your posting novels.

Well....if you ever decide to pick up a book that doesn't involve Crayolas, here is one by a Liberal, as opposed to a Fascist as you have proven to be:

Ooooooo! I guess you told me, eh?

Why would being recognized as a Fascist upset a Liberal?


I suggested you read a book.

That scared you?


You must be a reliable Democrat voter, huh?