Be honest. "Gay rights" is code for more affirmative action.

[Luddly Neddite]

NO, affirmative action is merely a correction to the fact that most of the wealth is held by white males who would just hire people like them left to their own devices.

The main beneficiary of AA have been white women.

Now, all that said... if you think there isn't prejudice out there still, you are mistaken.

Case in point. They sent out 1300 resumes with obviously white names and obviously names that would used by African Americans. Other than that, the experience on the resumes were pretty much identical.

The people with black sounding names were 50% less likely to get a call-back.

Point 1, Most of the prejudice remaining is fueled by resentment. It's not bad enough that blacks are so over represented on the welfare rolls, since AA, qualified white males have lost out in employment and college admissions.

Point 2. Maybe they don't get call backs because no white man knows how to pronounce Laquishatanyatoma.

In my experience, most blacks with "black sounding names" were raised by parents that don't want to be identified as Americans, but as African Americans. Any person I hire needs to be able to interact with my clients. If they were raised with a resentment against "white society", I really don't need them representing my firm.

NOTHING racist in any of that and I agree.
And you will not find anyone on this board more pro gay rights as me.
My question for affirmative actions is, as I supported it when it passed, is when DOES IT END? Who determines when things are "equal" and the "catching up" has been accomplished?
Government?
Affirmative Action was accomplished and needs to end yesterday.

White males have always had "affirmative action".

 

[Gadawg73]

We had a conversation at my watering hole last Friday night over gay marriage over a few beers. Well, more than just a few beers.
The group there was one married couple Republican, a Democrat that works in the district attorneys office as a prosecutor, 2 Libertarians myself included, 2 other REpublicans that own their own business.
8 or 9 of us there discussing this.
I use my GaDawg polling handicapping as: 3 rednecks including myself, 2 Yankees, 1 southern women, 1 man from Asian descent and a Canadian.

Canadian surprised me as he is liberal and he opposes gay marriage.
2 of the 3 rednecks myself included support gay marriage.
Woman supports gay marriage with her husband
1 Republican that owned his own business opposed and 1 supported it.
Asian was on the fence.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Were did I ask about lawyers or courts?

You brought up enumerated power and I asked if you supported the repeal of DOMA so that the federal government recognized all legal Civil Marriages entered into under State law. That had nothing to do with the courts, it had to do with a legislative action by Congress.

Do you understand how a law is repealed?

Deflect much?


>>>>

Lack of comprehension much?

When the case comes before the Court, ask for my opinion.

I asked about your position on the repeal of a law which you claim is outside the enumerated powers, and now twice you have deflected to the courts.

And you insinuate I have a reading problem?


Why won't you present a declarative opinion bout DOMA (Section 3) being beyond the enumerated powers and that it (a) shouldn't have passed, and (b) that it should be repealed so that the federal government recognizes all legal Civil Marriages as it did for over 200 years?


>>>>

If it is not in the enumerated powers of the federal government then it is not within the purview of the federal government.

Isn't that clear?

If the Act comes before the Supreme Court, that would be my position. If it doesn't, I have no position.

OK?

 

[bendog]

Next, youse guys are gonna be telling me I played ball and showered with gays. I just wanna know where this stops. (-:

 

[Gadawg73]

Point 1, Most of the prejudice remaining is fueled by resentment. It's not bad enough that blacks are so over represented on the welfare rolls, since AA, qualified white males have lost out in employment and college admissions.

Point 2. Maybe they don't get call backs because no white man knows how to pronounce Laquishatanyatoma.

In my experience, most blacks with "black sounding names" were raised by parents that don't want to be identified as Americans, but as African Americans. Any person I hire needs to be able to interact with my clients. If they were raised with a resentment against "white society", I really don't need them representing my firm.

NOTHING racist in any of that and I agree.
And you will not find anyone on this board more pro gay rights as me.
My question for affirmative actions is, as I supported it when it passed, is when DOES IT END? Who determines when things are "equal" and the "catching up" has been accomplished?
Government?
Affirmative Action was accomplished and needs to end yesterday.

White males have always had "affirmative action".

Bull shit, I earned everything I ever got on the field and in the business world.
How do I get affirmative action when I work in a city that is primarily black?

 

[Gadawg73]

Affirmative action has nothing to do with gay marriage.
Folk here have no clue about the law and legal precedence.

 

[Gadawg73]

Next, youse guys are gonna be telling me I played ball and showered with gays. I just wanna know where this stops. (-:

Springer or Brittany?
Mom raised both for 40 years.
Great quail dogs.

 

[g5000]

DOMA is a federal law which prevents gays from filing federal married tax returns, collecting Social Security survivor benefits, qualifying for spousal insurance benefits for federal employees, and getting immigrant visas for spouses.

It is not a law protecting men from being forced to smoke another guy's pole. So if the Supreme Court strikes it down, the Army isn't coming to make you do that. Just so you know.

 

[bendog]

Springers, but I may be too old train a new puppy after this one ages out.

I just don't see the rationale, from an equal protection standpoint, of treating a gay or lesbian, or male or female, differently. And, I think it just comes down to disagreeing, or agreeing, with that view.

Sure there are job requirements that would tend to exclude more of one group than another, but those are invidualized decisions.

 

[g5000]

If DOMA is struck down, here is the effect it will have on every non-homosexual in America:

NOTHING! NADA! ZIP! ZERO!

Well, you will have to suffer the incredibly painful knowledge that married fags are filing married tax returns every year, and that it is...legal.

OH, THE HUMANITY!!!!

 

[WorldWatcher]

Lack of comprehension much?

When the case comes before the Court, ask for my opinion.

I asked about your position on the repeal of a law which you claim is outside the enumerated powers, and now twice you have deflected to the courts.

And you insinuate I have a reading problem?


Why won't you present a declarative opinion bout DOMA (Section 3) being beyond the enumerated powers and that it (a) shouldn't have passed, and (b) that it should be repealed so that the federal government recognizes all legal Civil Marriages as it did for over 200 years?


>>>>

If it is not in the enumerated powers of the federal government then it is not within the purview of the federal government.

Isn't that clear?

If the Act comes before the Supreme Court, that would be my position. If it doesn't, I have no position.

OK?

So let me get this straight. Marriage is beyond the enumerated powers of the federal government. The federal government therefore exceeded it's enumerated powers in section 3 of DOMA by refusing to recognize for federal purposes all legal Civil Marriages entered into under State law which it had done for over 200 years.

This law exceeds the enumerated powers (which you appear to have made a big deal about) - but will not call for Congress to repeal this law? You are fine letting it sit on the books with no call for Congress to repeal it's own law.


********************

BTW - Section 3 has come before the courts and been found unconstitutional, the SCOTUS will hear oral arguments in the case on Wednesday.



>>>>

 

[g5000]

Social conservatives continue to mistake their loss of power over the personal lives of people unlike them as persecution of social conservatives.

Affirmative action is persecution. Nothing could be more obvious. THINK`

NO, affirmative action is merely a correction to the fact that most of the wealth is held by white males who would just hire people like them left to their own devices.

The main beneficiary of AA have been white women.

Now, all that said... if you think there isn't prejudice out there still, you are mistaken.

Case in point. They sent out 1300 resumes with obviously white names and obviously names that would used by African Americans. Other than that, the experience on the resumes were pretty much identical.

The people with black sounding names were 50% less likely to get a call-back.

What would a resume with a gay sounding name be?

Bruce?

 

[Meathead]

We saw it with blacks and hispanics and women and disabled. They say they want equal rights but it's just the opposite. They want special treatment in things like jobs and college scholarships. The perverts are playing the same game - take from the normals and give to me.

Actually, there is no such thing as ‘gay rights,’ homosexuals have the same rights as everyone else – no more, no less.

The problem is the ignorant and hateful social right and reactionary conservatives who seek to deny homosexuals their civil rights.

Odd then that California, a decidedly liberal state voted down the homosexual initiative for what you term "civil rights".

After all, only conservatives can ignorant and hateful. Go figure.

 

[High_Gravity]

If DOMA is struck down, here is the effect it will have on every non-homosexual in America:

NOTHING! NADA! ZIP! ZERO!

Well, you will have to suffer the incredibly painful knowledge that married fags are filing married tax returns every year, and that it is...legal.

OH, THE HUMANITY!!!!

But its so icky.

 

[poet]

We saw it with blacks and hispanics and women and disabled. They say they want equal rights but it's just the opposite. They want special treatment in things like jobs and college scholarships. The perverts are playing the same game - take from the normals and give to me.

Actually, there is no such thing as ‘gay rights,’ homosexuals have the same rights as everyone else – no more, no less.

The problem is the ignorant and hateful social right and reactionary conservatives who seek to deny homosexuals their civil rights.

Odd then that California, a decidedly liberal state voted down the homosexual initiative for what you term "civil rights".

After all, only conservatives can ignorant and hateful. Go figure.

"Spearheaded" by the homophobic black church, in California. The "black church", is as hypocritical as any evangelicals or the moral majority/Christian Right.

 

[Ernie S.]

NO, affirmative action is merely a correction to the fact that most of the wealth is held by white males who would just hire people like them left to their own devices.

The main beneficiary of AA have been white women.

Now, all that said... if you think there isn't prejudice out there still, you are mistaken.

Case in point. They sent out 1300 resumes with obviously white names and obviously names that would used by African Americans. Other than that, the experience on the resumes were pretty much identical.

The people with black sounding names were 50% less likely to get a call-back.

Point 1, Most of the prejudice remaining is fueled by resentment. It's not bad enough that blacks are so over represented on the welfare rolls, since AA, qualified white males have lost out in employment and college admissions.

Point 2. Maybe they don't get call backs because no white man knows how to pronounce Laquishatanyatoma.

In my experience, most blacks with "black sounding names" were raised by parents that don't want to be identified as Americans, but as African Americans. Any person I hire needs to be able to interact with my clients. If they were raised with a resentment against "white society", I really don't need them representing my firm.

Whats a "black sounding" name though?

something like "High_Gravity"..... Oh come on guy! L'quisha, Kwhame,....

We all succumb to stereotypes to a certain extent. If I'm hiring someone to represent me to my customers, I want a qualified person I feel will respect and interact well with a wide array of personalities.
My impression, right or wrong is that parents that give their child a pseudo-ethnic name do so for reasons of racial identity and there is a very good chance that their child will self identify as African American rather than just plain American.
I really don't want to concern myself with the race of the person I hire and I don't want him or her concerned with it either.

I might have a stack of resumes on my desk and have a limited amount of time to see candidates. I'll read resumes, looking for qualifications, experience and outside interests. My perceptions are the only ones that matter. The choice is mine, and if I have 2 identically qualified applicants, Alan West will be getting the interview over Kwame Kilpatrick.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Equal protection. No state can enforce separate but equal. A marriage in one state must be recognized in all other states (full faith and credit). State's cannot hide behind the skirts of "state's rights" to enforce discriminatory laws. Gone are the days of little bigoted fiefdoms. No more George Wallaces or Lester Maddoxes.

How about a right to carry issued in one state?

Concealed carry is not a contract.

A constitutional right....full faith and credit?

 

[PoliticalChic]

I asked about your position on the repeal of a law which you claim is outside the enumerated powers, and now twice you have deflected to the courts.

And you insinuate I have a reading problem?


Why won't you present a declarative opinion bout DOMA (Section 3) being beyond the enumerated powers and that it (a) shouldn't have passed, and (b) that it should be repealed so that the federal government recognizes all legal Civil Marriages as it did for over 200 years?


>>>>

If it is not in the enumerated powers of the federal government then it is not within the purview of the federal government.

Isn't that clear?

If the Act comes before the Supreme Court, that would be my position. If it doesn't, I have no position.

OK?

So let me get this straight. Marriage is beyond the enumerated powers of the federal government. The federal government therefore exceeded it's enumerated powers in section 3 of DOMA by refusing to recognize for federal purposes all legal Civil Marriages entered into under State law which it had done for over 200 years.

This law exceeds the enumerated powers (which you appear to have made a big deal about) - but will not call for Congress to repeal this law? You are fine letting it sit on the books with no call for Congress to repeal it's own law.


********************

BTW - Section 3 has come before the courts and been found unconstitutional, the SCOTUS will hear oral arguments in the case on Wednesday.



>>>>

Didn't I make my position clear?

 

[High_Gravity]

Point 1, Most of the prejudice remaining is fueled by resentment. It's not bad enough that blacks are so over represented on the welfare rolls, since AA, qualified white males have lost out in employment and college admissions.

Point 2. Maybe they don't get call backs because no white man knows how to pronounce Laquishatanyatoma.

In my experience, most blacks with "black sounding names" were raised by parents that don't want to be identified as Americans, but as African Americans. Any person I hire needs to be able to interact with my clients. If they were raised with a resentment against "white society", I really don't need them representing my firm.

Whats a "black sounding" name though?

something like "High_Gravity"..... Oh come on guy! L'quisha, Kwhame,....

We all succumb to stereotypes to a certain extent. If I'm hiring someone to represent me to my customers, I want a qualified person I feel will respect and interact well with a wide array of personalities.
My impression, right or wrong is that parents that give their child a pseudo-ethnic name do so for reasons of racial identity and there is a very good chance that their child will self identify as African American rather than just plain American.
I really don't want to concern myself with the race of the person I hire and I don't want him or her concerned with it either.

I might have a stack of resumes on my desk and have a limited amount of time to see candidates. I'll read resumes, looking for qualifications, experience and outside interests. My perceptions are the only ones that matter. The choice is mine, and if I have 2 identically qualified applicants, Alan West will be getting the interview over Kwame Kilpatrick.

Sometimes a name can be decieving though, if my mom and dad name me something crazy its not my choice you know.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

NOTHING racist in any of that and I agree.
And you will not find anyone on this board more pro gay rights as me.
My question for affirmative actions is, as I supported it when it passed, is when DOES IT END? Who determines when things are "equal" and the "catching up" has been accomplished?
Government?
Affirmative Action was accomplished and needs to end yesterday.

White males have always had "affirmative action".

Bull shit, I earned everything I ever got on the field and in the business world.
How do I get affirmative action when I work in a city that is primarily black?

So did I. Worked since I was 13y/o and while I'm certainly not wealthy, I'm fairly well off now. Blacks, Hispanics, Asias, gays - none of them had any bearing on whether I succeeded or failed. That was all on me.

White males are no more "disenfranchised" than Christians and I'm sick of their whining and excuses.