For Those Who Don't Understand What Occupy is REALLY About (Obviously LOTS of you)

[Oldstyle]

Its time for another Ronnie in the White House.

Hallaluja

America can't afford another Ronnie until we repair the previous damage caused by Reagan and Bush.

What's amusing to me, Lakhota...is that after almost 3 years, you STILL think Barack Obama is "repairing" anything.

 

[Chris]

Hallaluja

America can't afford another Ronnie until we repair the previous damage caused by Reagan and Bush.

What's amusing to me, Lakhota...is that after almost 3 years, you STILL think Barack Obama is "repairing" anything.

George W. Bush inherited a strong economy, a budget surplus, and a nation at peace.

Eight years later, he left Obama with a shattered economy, a trillion dollar deficit, and two useless wars.

Obama saved the country from another Great Depression, rebuilt GM, reformed healthcare, reformed Wall Street, doubled the stock market, created 19 straight months of private sector job growth, got Bin Laden, got Gaddafi, and got us out of Iraq.

 

[IndependntLogic]

Ok so let me get this Straight.

With the Tea Party, we are suppose to believe what Liberals tell us about them. That they are Racists, and Haters. Despite what we see with our eyes. Which is just a Bunch of Normal People upset about How Government spends money, and ignores what the People want.

With OWS, Liberals wants us to Ignore the Actions of OWS. The Violence, The Anti-Capitalism Signs, the Communist Party signs, the Nazis, and anarchists, and believe what Liberals tell us the Movement stands for?

Sorry, Actions speak louder than words. I am sure there are more level Headed people involved, But the Forces Behind it, and the Core group of the Protesters are indeed Capitalist hating, Communists, and Anarchists, and Nazis.

Obama made this Happen. With the Help of the Lefts Money Bags Soros. Obama as been Crying on the road for Weeks now that people should get mad, get involved. He want's this Distraction. This Move of the Blame from Government to Wall Street, Because he can not win if Americans are Honest and hold him to the Fire along with everyone else.

You can bitch about Wall street all you want, but wall street is not part of our Government. Their Job is to make money, not look out for us. It's the Governments job to over see them. It was government that Encouraged the Practices that Lead to the Housing Crisis. It's always Been Government. Cooperation's have always been Greedy fucks, It's Government that has allowed the Income Gap to Grow. With poor Policies, Corruption, and Ineptitude.

See here's where you, Oddball and those like you are well, basically full of sh1t. What have I, a full fledged Occupier, posted about the Tea Party in this very thread? Instead of being a coward like you or Oddball - instead of projecting what you claim I project and doing the "No, No! Although I'm not a member, I speak for the members of the group I'm obviously clueless about! And that's not what they want!"
Nah. I'm not weak or afraid of the issues, or even afriad to acknowledge valid points like you and Oddball are. I have said this about the Tea Party: They have a lot of valid points. Although there are whackjobs who give the organization a bad name, that doesn't mean all of them are like that. I agree with many of their views.
Whereas weak little pusses avoid the issues brought up by me, an Occupier in the flesh. Instead they simply parrot the bullsh1t their Mind Masters have told them to believe. It's okay. Weakness of character is everywhere. Obviously this weakness is more evident in posters like oddball and yourself, who are simply scared to death to even address issues brought up. So be it.
Another poster said "So what about the three points that were actually made in the OP?" Cowards will never address those.
So Avoid the issues. Run away. It's all you have. Because if you ever had the balls to even try to address the actual issues discussed, you might find you agree with many of them. See signature for your easily predible next steps...

Give me an example of the TEA Party being whack jobs???

I do affiliate myself with the TEA Party and have been to many rallys..

I have never seen anything but good hard working American Men and Woman who are concerned for the direction of their country and the welfare of their children and the disgust of our government and how they're manipulating er dictating our economy..

Now I have seen the anti-TEA Party fucks that would throw stuff at us and talk vial shit and would claim to kill us.. It seems when the TEA party was blaming government for our problems (and rightly so) they were opposed and now its worse its the banks fault and not the governments???

Of course the OWS crowd proves absolutely everything I have asserted they'er violent progressives that want government to save them...

Oh and remember when the progressive activist opposition bit the old man TEA Party protesters finger off???

So please tell me why you deserve any respect at all given the notion you support such a violent party and the fact you're trying to label mine "just as bad"

This is the difference between us:

I have seen absolute whackjobs who claim to represent everyone in the Tea Party but am able to acknowledge they don't speak for the WHOLE movement.
You see the whackjobs in OWS and claim they ARE the whole movement and there is no possibility that anyone with milder views could possibly exist.
So you forward ignorance with a closed mind and I offer ideas from OWS that you haven't seen on the MSM, about OWS.
I am not afraid to admit there are components of your party that are perfectly reasonable - and don't carry assault rifles to political rallies. You are scared to death and refuse to acknowledge that, other than the people you've been shown on the MSM (whom apparently, you now trust implicitly), there are people with valid ideals and logical agendas.

When you have the courage to see beyond the MSM and RW media, I'd be happy to share the ideas of the Home Occupiers with you. For as long as you stay fearful and angry, it is pointless.

 

[IndependntLogic]

Ok so let me get this Straight.

With the Tea Party, we are suppose to believe what Liberals tell us about them. That they are Racists, and Haters. Despite what we see with our eyes. Which is just a Bunch of Normal People upset about How Government spends money, and ignores what the People want.

With OWS, Liberals wants us to Ignore the Actions of OWS. The Violence, The Anti-Capitalism Signs, the Communist Party signs, the Nazis, and anarchists, and believe what Liberals tell us the Movement stands for?

Sorry, Actions speak louder than words. I am sure there are more level Headed people involved, But the Forces Behind it, and the Core group of the Protesters are indeed Capitalist hating, Communists, and Anarchists, and Nazis.

Obama made this Happen. With the Help of the Lefts Money Bags Soros. Obama as been Crying on the road for Weeks now that people should get mad, get involved. He want's this Distraction. This Move of the Blame from Government to Wall Street, Because he can not win if Americans are Honest and hold him to the Fire along with everyone else.

You can bitch about Wall street all you want, but wall street is not part of our Government. Their Job is to make money, not look out for us. It's the Governments job to over see them. It was government that Encouraged the Practices that Lead to the Housing Crisis. It's always Been Government. Cooperation's have always been Greedy fucks, It's Government that has allowed the Income Gap to Grow. With poor Policies, Corruption, and Ineptitude.

See here's where you, Oddball and those like you are well, basically full of sh1t. What have I, a full fledged Occupier, posted about the Tea Party in this very thread? Instead of being a coward like you or Oddball - instead of projecting what you claim I project and doing the "No, No! Although I'm not a member, I speak for the members of the group I'm obviously clueless about! And that's not what they want!"
Nah. I'm not weak or afraid of the issues, or even afriad to acknowledge valid points like you and Oddball are. I have said this about the Tea Party: They have a lot of valid points. Although there are whackjobs who give the organization a bad name, that doesn't mean all of them are like that. I agree with many of their views.
Whereas weak little pusses avoid the issues brought up by me, an Occupier in the flesh. Instead they simply parrot the bullsh1t their Mind Masters have told them to believe. It's okay. Weakness of character is everywhere. Obviously this weakness is more evident in posters like oddball and yourself, who are simply scared to death to even address issues brought up. So be it.
Another poster said "So what about the three points that were actually made in the OP?" Cowards will never address those.
So Avoid the issues. Run away. It's all you have. Because if you ever had the balls to even try to address the actual issues discussed, you might find you agree with many of them. See signature for your easily predible next steps...

Not for nothing, Independent...but do you not realize that you yourself have done in this string EXACTLY what you're accusing others of doing? You ignored my replies to the issues you brought up while you posted insults to your opposition...all the while repeating your "mantra" that the opposition ignores arguments and posts insults. I don't know you well enough to know whether you're just goofing on people...but if you're NOT...then you're rather amusing.

I'm not here every hour or even every day. Please list what you brought up and I will address it directly.

 

[IndependntLogic]

I guess a lot of people here just believe what the MSM and Right Wing E-media
tell them. This would be the only explanation for some of the posts I've seen.
So I thought I'd help! Here is a C&P from a great OWS site. It will give you
guys a better idea of why you should support us! Here ya go:

"1. We don't want to End Capitalism, We Want to End Corporatacracy.

First, let's make it clear, This is a political movement, not an economic
revolt. We want to end the control of our government by Multi-National
Corporations. This is Issue Number One for everyone I've spoken to in Occupy
Wall Street.

Not one Occupier I know of, wants to turn us into the former Soviet Union (although just like the TP, every movement has it's fringe and the MSM loves to find them). We
don't want to end the economic system which allows people to buy the goods of
their choice. But we do want to end a corrupt political system which allows
Multi-National Corporations to buy the politicians of their choice. So the
single most important theme is Taking control of our government away from
Corporations and putting it back into the hands of We the People.

2. We won't tolerate a government that rewards corporate incompetence, greed and
fraud. No More Bank Bailouts.

The banks bought our government and then, after they lined their pockets with
the wealth of our nation, they blackmailed the government into giving them even
MORE money "In order to keep the economy from collapsing". Right. Then, instead
of making or refinancing home loans, Bank of America, Chase, Wells Fargo and
others spent our money on business mergers & acquisitions to benefit the 1%. Oh,
and of course, they paid themselves million dollar bonuses with our money.

We want to set a deadline for payback of existing bailouts. Any company that has
not fully repaid all monies by the deadline, should be broken up so that they
are no longer "too big to fail".

3. We want the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act repealed immediately.
For those of you unfamiliar with it: After the Great Depression, congress passed
the Glass-Steagal act to make sure that banks would never take stupid risks or
use corrupt practices to send the country into another Depression. Then 60 years
later, the banks and companies that bought and paid for Republican Senators Bill
Gramm, Jim Leach and Tom Bliley told them that Glass-Steagal was interfering
with their ability to swindle the American Public. Their masters told these
senators to pass a bill that would NOT ONLY allow them to gamble foolishly again
with American Tax-Payer money - they wanted complete control of our Financial
System by being able OWN both stock brokerages and Insurance Companies too.
Then, once their cohorts completed the creation of what's called a "FIRE
Economy" (an economy based on Finance, Insurance & Real Estate) in America, they
would control everything.

Of course the Senators bowed to their masters and Gramm-Leach-Bliley was passed
with a super-majority that was veto-proof. If it had not been passed, NOT ONE
BANK would have needed bailout money because they would have been prohibited
from investing in the Commercial Mortgage Backed Securities Market.

Some people say we should let "The Market" regulate itself. Are the Banksters
worthy of the trust that was given to them under this law? Here's an example:
Citibank is on trial right now.
While they were selling over $500 MILLION dollars worth of those
toxic mortgage securities to the 99% as a good investment, they were betting the
securities would fail by "Short-Selling" at the same time. In other words, while
they sold your parents these securities for their retirement, they made a bet
the securities would fail - and earned over $140M dollars by doing so. Citibank
is currently offering to pay back about half the money they defrauded out of
regular people as long as no one from the bank goes to jail or even loses their
job. Guess what? The government is going for it. Why? Because the 1% doesn't
have to pay for their crimes. We do. In this case, WE'RE paying their $285M fee
with the bailout money they were given. And people wonder why we're mad."

That's just a small part of the REAL message of OWS. it's a little bit different
than what the SpinDoctors of the MSM and Right Wing media talk about or allow
you to see, isn't it?

The Whole World is watching and listening to our message. Foreign stations give more accurate coverage than FOX - who still spews BS about wanting Socialism and anarchy.

Here is an example of the more accurate foreign coverage of our message:

Occupy Wall Street Exposes Enormous Corruption Between Government and Corporations - YouTube

In no portion of this post does it mention " gimme gimme gimme", so at the minimum, it's partially incorrect. Please use some "IndependntLogic" and try again, thanks......

Seriously? You're SO weak on every issue discussed in the OP, that's the best you have? Okay.

 

[IndependntLogic]

Not for nothing, Independent...but do you not realize that you yourself have done in this string EXACTLY what you're accusing others of doing? You ignored my replies to the issues you brought up while you posted insults to your opposition...all the while repeating your "mantra" that the opposition ignores arguments and posts insults. I don't know you well enough to know whether you're just goofing on people...but if you're NOT...then you're rather amusing.

I think the real issue is more easily explained. The liberals on the forum, who may have more of an idea about what should be done to produce a stable progressive society, have used a typical psychological pathology called transference. They believe, right or wrong, that the OWS are logically following the progressive lock step philosophy. In fact, most of the OWS know only that they, each and every one of them, somehow feel like our system has left them behind. Most don't even know how. And few, if any, have even the slightest idea how to solve the problems society faces. Conservatives and liberals alike believe their economic philosophies would best elevate the have nots to a higher status in a less painful manner.

Each to his own and in the eyes of the beholder will describe the OWS according to his/her own concepts of revolt against economic elitism. Recognize that conservatives as individual are no more sheep following some great conservative in the sky than liberals are sheep following the great liberal in the sky. They are simply people who have different ideas about what is best for society.

Personally I believe the OWS is biting the hands that feed them. Without the rich, to include the obscenely rich, fewer people would have jobs than we have now. Would it be great if there was more equity? Sure it would, but not if it is accomplished by fiat. 1% of the people, the ones who are being protested, pay a significant portion of the taxes that fincance or government, pays the welfare, funds the military and all the other goodies the OWS claims it wants more of.

I think they are squeezing the turnip about as far as that turnip can withstand the pressure. If reforms occur, and if they negatively effect the rich, guess where the rich will go with their money? We are already experiencing outsourcing about which the liberals and OWS are complaining. If you think the bottom 99% is facing austerity now, just watch how it plays out of the OWS and the leftwingnutters who are clamoring to support it get their way.

I am 76, and I won't be around to watch the catastrophe they will cause. It is our capitalist relative free market which made us the richest country in the world, and chipping away at what free market we have left has already started to depress our relative wealth. We can only take so much of this "great reformation."


BTW independent logic, most of the MSM available to the masses all lean left, so when you talk about sheep following lock step with the propaganda, it is much more likely to be the liberal listening instead of thinking.

You seem to have only been exposed to the MS version of OWS. the one that says we want to end capitalism, for instance. No one I've met does.
Happens. if you ever want to learn about what the majority of us actually stand for, it would require a bit more open-mindness

 

[gallantwarrior]

If you acknowledge that politicians are the worst part of the problem, why not occupy Washington? Why not initiate recall elections for the worst of the politicians, like Reid, Pelosi, Waters, et.al.? Removing those types from their elected positions might send a message to the rest. Then we need to place people in office who do have the peoples' business at heart.

 

[editec]

If you acknowledge that politicians are the worst part of the problem, why not occupy Washington? Why not initiate recall elections for the worst of the politicians, like Reid, Pelosi, Waters, et.al.? Removing those types from their elected positions might send a message to the rest. Then we need to place people in office who do have the peoples' business at heart.

It takes TWO to pervert the government

1. corrupt POLS; and
2 People to pay for their corruption.

The TEA PARTY focused mostly on faulting the DEM POLS and nearly completely failed to note the corription in the GOP

The OWS movement FAILED TO FOCUS on those SPECIFIC corporations that are perverting the process.

Both populist movements failed to adaqautely describve the nature of thye beast in my opinion, hence BOTH FAIL.

 

[chanel]

Occupy D.C. just posted a petition on their website. The whole thing can be read here:

The 99%

Perhaps independentlogic needs to look at other "good sites" about the OWS.

Here's my Cliff notes:'

1. raise income taxes on the rich
2. reverse Bush tax cuts - raising taxes on the middle class
3. institute a "speculation tax"
4. raise taxes on capital gains
5. institute a "world wide tax" on multi-national corporations
6. outlaw tax havens
7. raise corporate taxes
8. raise social security taxes

Anyone see a pattern?

It also includes a radical restructuring of the government and the economic system, which in some circles is called "Socialism" or even "Marxism".

These fuckers don't represent me. And I am in the 99%.

 

[Oldstyle]

America can't afford another Ronnie until we repair the previous damage caused by Reagan and Bush.

What's amusing to me, Lakhota...is that after almost 3 years, you STILL think Barack Obama is "repairing" anything.

George W. Bush inherited a strong economy, a budget surplus, and a nation at peace.

Eight years later, he left Obama with a shattered economy, a trillion dollar deficit, and two useless wars.

Obama saved the country from another Great Depression, rebuilt GM, reformed healthcare, reformed Wall Street, doubled the stock market, created 19 straight months of private sector job growth, got Bin Laden, got Gaddafi, and got us out of Iraq.

TARP possibly saved us from another Great Depression...Obama's stimulus was a progressive pork fest that didn't do much of anything except keep unemployment running for another year, kept public sector union folks employed while the private sector got laid off by the tens of thousands and added a trillion dollars to our debt. He "rebuilt" GM with a massive bailout that we will probably never get back as opposed to the bank bailouts that have already been repaid. He added ObamaCare to the list of entitlements that the US already can't afford to pay for, a badly written piece of legislation that he passed against the wishes of a majority of Americans. The "reforming" of Wall Street didn't address the real root of the cause of our fiscal meltdown and was written by some of the very people who were behind the meltdown in the first place. The stock market would have come back from it's lows if Elmer Fudd were in the Oval Office. As for private sector job "growth"? Yes, it's there...but it's been so anemic that to call that a "success" is laughable. Bin Laden and Gaddafi? He got Bin Laden from intel from the Bush enhanced interrogation techniques and he dithered for so long on enforcing a no fly zone against Gaddafi that the conflict was extended another eight months and cost tens of thousands of lives that didn't need to be lost.

There is an old saying Chris...you can polish a turd all you want...but at the end of the day it's still just shit. Barack Obama has been an uninspiring President. He blames others for his own failings and doesn't learn from his mistakes. To make matters worse he surrounds himself with incompetents like Joe Biden, Eric Holder, Larry Summers, Christina Romer, Timothy Geithner, Ken Salazar and Steven Chu. He promised transparency and instead has given us stonewalling on Solyndra and Fast & Furious that is reminiscent of Richard Nixon back in the days of Watergate.

 

[dnsmith35]

Okay again, I don't live here. I miss posts from time to time. So now that I see your post, I'm happy to reply.
First a minor correction - Clinton signed Gramm-Leach-Blilely, not the 1933 Glass-Steagal but it's understandable that you wrote the latter when you meant the former as they are so related. Yup Clinton signed it. Three Republicans had a super-majority, veto-proof senate so what was he going to do, veto it? Besides, several Dems were behind it as well. And it was a huge mistake. By the DEMS and Repubs who let it go through (see how that works? Not afraid of saying the Dems f*cked up at all! Hell, I think Obama SUCKS!).
So I agree with you and Newt and OWS on this issue.

Not to bust your chops but I had to tell you that I'd replied to your position three times before you acknowledged it and then only when you demanded that I show where I had responded to it. Miss posts from time to time? More like ignore them. And when you couple that with insulting posts like the following... "Ahh the sheeple move in herds. Yet all of you are too stupid or too afraid to respond to any of the points. Here, let me dumb it down for ya"...do you understand what a tool you come off as?

Speaking of ignoring? You STILL haven't responded to my question about the other demands that the OWS protesters have made. Once again, you seem to be "selective" on what you want to discuss here.

OWS protesters have also demanded that minimum wage be raised to $20 an hour...that a "living wage" be given to all, regardless of whether they are working or not...that all debt be forgiven...that credit rating agencies should be done away with...and my favorite...that our borders should be open to any that want to come here. Why is it that you don't want to discuss "those" OWS demands?

There are as many OWS demands as their are persons protesting.

In other words, the OWS doesn't know what it wants and likely no two protesters agree as to its demands. They are a rag tag bunch of people who would rather scream, do drugs, have free sex than work. They are a bunch of neer do wells who don't understand the economic or political problems we have - mostly mis/uninformed boobs.

 

[dnsmith35]

If you acknowledge that politicians are the worst part of the problem, why not occupy Washington? Why not initiate recall elections for the worst of the politicians, like Reid, Pelosi, Waters, et.al.? Removing those types from their elected positions might send a message to the rest. Then we need to place people in office who do have the peoples' business at heart.

It takes TWO to pervert the government

1. corrupt POLS; and
2 People to pay for their corruption.

The TEA PARTY focused mostly on faulting the DEM POLS and nearly completely failed to note the corription in the GOP

The OWS movement FAILED TO FOCUS on those SPECIFIC corporations that are perverting the process.

Both populist movements failed to adaqautely describve the nature of thye beast in my opinion, hence BOTH FAIL.

The teaparty focused on excessive taxes, excessive deficits, and the huge debt. "If some Democrats believed they were the targets it is obvious they are too stupid to breath," spoken by a moderate Democrat. It is time we moderates take back our party.

 

[Full-Auto]

I guess a lot of people here just believe what the MSM and Right Wing E-media
tell them. This would be the only explanation for some of the posts I've seen.
So I thought I'd help! Here is a C&P from a great OWS site. It will give you
guys a better idea of why you should support us! Here ya go:

"1. We don't want to End Capitalism, We Want to End Corporatacracy.

First, let's make it clear, This is a political movement, not an economic
revolt. We want to end the control of our government by Multi-National
Corporations. This is Issue Number One for everyone I've spoken to in Occupy
Wall Street.

Not one Occupier I know of, wants to turn us into the former Soviet Union (although just like the TP, every movement has it's fringe and the MSM loves to find them). We
don't want to end the economic system which allows people to buy the goods of
their choice. But we do want to end a corrupt political system which allows
Multi-National Corporations to buy the politicians of their choice. So the
single most important theme is Taking control of our government away from
Corporations and putting it back into the hands of We the People.

2. We won't tolerate a government that rewards corporate incompetence, greed and
fraud. No More Bank Bailouts.

The banks bought our government and then, after they lined their pockets with
the wealth of our nation, they blackmailed the government into giving them even
MORE money "In order to keep the economy from collapsing". Right. Then, instead
of making or refinancing home loans, Bank of America, Chase, Wells Fargo and
others spent our money on business mergers & acquisitions to benefit the 1%. Oh,
and of course, they paid themselves million dollar bonuses with our money.

We want to set a deadline for payback of existing bailouts. Any company that has
not fully repaid all monies by the deadline, should be broken up so that they
are no longer "too big to fail".

3. We want the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act repealed immediately.
For those of you unfamiliar with it: After the Great Depression, congress passed
the Glass-Steagal act to make sure that banks would never take stupid risks or
use corrupt practices to send the country into another Depression. Then 60 years
later, the banks and companies that bought and paid for Republican Senators Bill
Gramm, Jim Leach and Tom Bliley told them that Glass-Steagal was interfering
with their ability to swindle the American Public. Their masters told these
senators to pass a bill that would NOT ONLY allow them to gamble foolishly again
with American Tax-Payer money - they wanted complete control of our Financial
System by being able OWN both stock brokerages and Insurance Companies too.
Then, once their cohorts completed the creation of what's called a "FIRE
Economy" (an economy based on Finance, Insurance & Real Estate) in America, they
would control everything.

Of course the Senators bowed to their masters and Gramm-Leach-Bliley was passed
with a super-majority that was veto-proof. If it had not been passed, NOT ONE
BANK would have needed bailout money because they would have been prohibited
from investing in the Commercial Mortgage Backed Securities Market.

Some people say we should let "The Market" regulate itself. Are the Banksters
worthy of the trust that was given to them under this law? Here's an example:
Citibank is on trial right now.
While they were selling over $500 MILLION dollars worth of those
toxic mortgage securities to the 99% as a good investment, they were betting the
securities would fail by "Short-Selling" at the same time. In other words, while
they sold your parents these securities for their retirement, they made a bet
the securities would fail - and earned over $140M dollars by doing so. Citibank
is currently offering to pay back about half the money they defrauded out of
regular people as long as no one from the bank goes to jail or even loses their
job. Guess what? The government is going for it. Why? Because the 1% doesn't
have to pay for their crimes. We do. In this case, WE'RE paying their $285M fee
with the bailout money they were given. And people wonder why we're mad."

That's just a small part of the REAL message of OWS. it's a little bit different
than what the SpinDoctors of the MSM and Right Wing media talk about or allow
you to see, isn't it?

The Whole World is watching and listening to our message. Foreign stations give more accurate coverage than FOX - who still spews BS about wanting Socialism and anarchy.

Here is an example of the more accurate foreign coverage of our message:

Occupy Wall Street Exposes Enormous Corruption Between Government and Corporations - YouTube

Thats all the socialists say "we're not anti-capitalism."

Guess what? no one believes your stupidity and lies anymore.

The majority of OWS would defend Francis Fox Piven in a nanosecond...

That's ok... more and more people don't believe that you guys are patriots anymore either. More and more people are coming to realize that you are borderline anarchists with a Fascist agenda.

Or... to really act like one of you mouth breathers......

Fuck you Corporatist!!!!

That's the only kinds of posts that people like you, ladycumslinger, the Cajun Creep, and slobber on my Willow Pillows can understand, or even try to.

Being Incorporated I only have one thing to say


FUCK YOU TOO!!

 

[dnsmith35]

Occupy D.C. just posted a petition on their website. The whole thing can be read here:

The 99%

Perhaps independentlogic needs to look at other "good sites" about the OWS.

Here's my Cliff notes:'

1. raise income taxes on the rich
2. reverse Bush tax cuts - raising taxes on the middle class
3. institute a "speculation tax"
4. raise taxes on capital gains
5. institute a "world wide tax" on multi-national corporations
6. outlaw tax havens
7. raise corporate taxes
8. raise social security taxes

Anyone see a pattern?

It also includes a radical restructuring of the government and the economic system, which in some circles is called "Socialism" or even "Marxism".

These fuckers don't represent me. And I am in the 99%.

If the government followed the 8 points as listed, the economy would go tits up in a hurry. Some of the issues need attention but 3,4,5 and 8 should be thrown out arbitrarily. If we need to raise more FICA revenue, remove the cap on the incomes from which it is collected, don't raise them. Long term capital gains aren't gains at all as they tend to get larger because of inflation. Short term capital gains are treated like normal income already. Corporate taxes hurt the economy more than they help. Studies have proved that based on mobility of capital corporate taxes are passed on to labor - like companies moving overseas leaving our labor force sucking hind teat. If there is flexibility of supply the consumer pays the corporate tax. Capital will only pay the part of the tax if demand elasticity exists.

 

[gallantwarrior]

I guess a lot of people here just believe what the MSM and Right Wing E-media
tell them. This would be the only explanation for some of the posts I've seen.
So I thought I'd help! Here is a C&P from a great OWS site. It will give you
guys a better idea of why you should support us! Here ya go:

"1. We don't want to End Capitalism, We Want to End Corporatacracy.

First, let's make it clear, This is a political movement, not an economic
revolt. We want to end the control of our government by Multi-National
Corporations. This is Issue Number One for everyone I've spoken to in Occupy
Wall Street.

Not one Occupier I know of, wants to turn us into the former Soviet Union (although just like the TP, every movement has it's fringe and the MSM loves to find them). We
don't want to end the economic system which allows people to buy the goods of
their choice. But we do want to end a corrupt political system which allows
Multi-National Corporations to buy the politicians of their choice. So the
single most important theme is Taking control of our government away from
Corporations and putting it back into the hands of We the People.

2. We won't tolerate a government that rewards corporate incompetence, greed and
fraud. No More Bank Bailouts.

The banks bought our government and then, after they lined their pockets with
the wealth of our nation, they blackmailed the government into giving them even
MORE money "In order to keep the economy from collapsing". Right. Then, instead
of making or refinancing home loans, Bank of America, Chase, Wells Fargo and
others spent our money on business mergers & acquisitions to benefit the 1%. Oh,
and of course, they paid themselves million dollar bonuses with our money.

We want to set a deadline for payback of existing bailouts. Any company that has
not fully repaid all monies by the deadline, should be broken up so that they
are no longer "too big to fail".

3. We want the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act repealed immediately.
For those of you unfamiliar with it: After the Great Depression, congress passed
the Glass-Steagal act to make sure that banks would never take stupid risks or
use corrupt practices to send the country into another Depression. Then 60 years
later, the banks and companies that bought and paid for Republican Senators Bill
Gramm, Jim Leach and Tom Bliley told them that Glass-Steagal was interfering
with their ability to swindle the American Public. Their masters told these
senators to pass a bill that would NOT ONLY allow them to gamble foolishly again
with American Tax-Payer money - they wanted complete control of our Financial
System by being able OWN both stock brokerages and Insurance Companies too.
Then, once their cohorts completed the creation of what's called a "FIRE
Economy" (an economy based on Finance, Insurance & Real Estate) in America, they
would control everything.

Of course the Senators bowed to their masters and Gramm-Leach-Bliley was passed
with a super-majority that was veto-proof. If it had not been passed, NOT ONE
BANK would have needed bailout money because they would have been prohibited
from investing in the Commercial Mortgage Backed Securities Market.

Some people say we should let "The Market" regulate itself. Are the Banksters
worthy of the trust that was given to them under this law? Here's an example:
Citibank is on trial right now.
While they were selling over $500 MILLION dollars worth of those
toxic mortgage securities to the 99% as a good investment, they were betting the
securities would fail by "Short-Selling" at the same time. In other words, while
they sold your parents these securities for their retirement, they made a bet
the securities would fail - and earned over $140M dollars by doing so. Citibank
is currently offering to pay back about half the money they defrauded out of
regular people as long as no one from the bank goes to jail or even loses their
job. Guess what? The government is going for it. Why? Because the 1% doesn't
have to pay for their crimes. We do. In this case, WE'RE paying their $285M fee
with the bailout money they were given. And people wonder why we're mad."

That's just a small part of the REAL message of OWS. it's a little bit different
than what the SpinDoctors of the MSM and Right Wing media talk about or allow
you to see, isn't it?

The Whole World is watching and listening to our message. Foreign stations give more accurate coverage than FOX - who still spews BS about wanting Socialism and anarchy.

Here is an example of the more accurate foreign coverage of our message:

why didn't you mention unions and their ability to buy demoncrat politicians? inquiring minds wanna know.

My guess is that these points, as well as those in your next post, were not including in the talking points memo used to craft the OP.

 

[dnsmith35]

Independent logic, you are the typical left wing nutter, a fanatic who believes your way is the only way. Clue, your way is not only not the only way, it is the extremist, elitist wrong way.

When posters choose to insult and call names they automatically have forfeited the debate. When posters insult and call names it is obvious to even the casual observer that you have no argument. That personifies you, no argument, no facts, no truth, just BS.

As long as you follow the left wing propaganda sites and follow them like a sheep you will never find facts to discuss. You remind me of all the other trolls who live only to flame because they have nothing substantive to say, and, you say it in long winded diatribes. I was amazed at how many words it took you to say absolutely nothing.

PS, OWS is the very definition of anarchy.

 

[IndependntLogic]

Occupy D.C. just posted a petition on their website. The whole thing can be read here:

The 99%

Perhaps independentlogic needs to look at other "good sites" about the OWS.

Here's my Cliff notes:'

1. raise income taxes on the rich
2. reverse Bush tax cuts - raising taxes on the middle class
3. institute a "speculation tax"
4. raise taxes on capital gains
5. institute a "world wide tax" on multi-national corporations
6. outlaw tax havens
7. raise corporate taxes
8. raise social security taxes

Anyone see a pattern?

It also includes a radical restructuring of the government and the economic system, which in some circles is called "Socialism" or even "Marxism".

These fuckers don't represent me. And I am in the 99%.

Let me compliment you for at least taking the time to look at one OWS site. The one you linked seems to be legitimate (there are a lot of fakes out there).

Actually, I'm in complete agreement with much of the above.
1. Yes
2. You mean just let those "Temporary" cuts expire? Sure.
3. 0.5% tax on stock trades?
So if someone buys $10,000 of stock, there is a tax of fifty bucks?
And that could create $800,000,000,000 in revenues? Might be worth a look.
4. Um yeah. The middle classes are really worried about captial gains taxes nowadays! Not. I would be okay with returning it to the 1997 level.
5. So wait. You're FOR the loopholes which allowed GE (Obama's buddies) to make $5B in profits and pay zero in taxes? Hmmm. Well, Obama might appreciate that sentiment but I don't. How do you feel about the fact that Lexapro is sold ONLY in the USA and all revenues from that American company (Forrest Labs) is attributed to a 10 person office in Ireland? Well heel, what's a little thing like the deficit anyway?
6. Again, I guess you're just a big fan of the deficit or something because the tax havens the site refers to, have NOTHING to do with expanding operations.
7. Where do they say that want to raise them? They just reiterate the point that loopholes like the one that let GE pay zero, cost the USA over $100,000,000,000 a year, and should be closed. Big GE fan are you? I would bet not. Me either.
8. Where did you see something about raising SS taxes? I didn't. I did however, see ending the cap on it at $107K.

So I've addressed everything you brought up directly. That IS a pattern you will see in this thread.

I could go on but you seem trongly disinclined to consider anything that might contradict what you've been told to believe by the MSM.

Want to see a pattern? Look at the OP and the issues brought up in it. Then look at the responses by Conservs and see whether any of them address THOSE issues, the way I addressed yours. Or whether they all just avoid them, change the subject etc...

You will see a VERY clear pattern.

Like I said, if nothing else, you've done 10x more than most Conservs, in that you actually took a minute to look at a site - if only to criticize it. it's a start, anyway.

 

[IndependntLogic]

If you acknowledge that politicians are the worst part of the problem, why not occupy Washington? Why not initiate recall elections for the worst of the politicians, like Reid, Pelosi, Waters, et.al.? Removing those types from their elected positions might send a message to the rest. Then we need to place people in office who do have the peoples' business at heart.

It takes TWO to pervert the government

1. corrupt POLS; and
2 People to pay for their corruption.

The TEA PARTY focused mostly on faulting the DEM POLS and nearly completely failed to note the corription in the GOP

The OWS movement FAILED TO FOCUS on those SPECIFIC corporations that are perverting the process.

Both populist movements failed to adaqautely describve the nature of thye beast in my opinion, hence BOTH FAIL.

The teaparty focused on excessive taxes, excessive deficits, and the huge debt. "If some Democrats believed they were the targets it is obvious they are too stupid to breath," spoken by a moderate Democrat. It is time we moderates take back our party.

The other thing I learned from going to Tea Party Rallies and meetings, was that they want to dramatically reduce all the wasteful duplication of state government / federal government agencies.
After speaking with a few of them, I researched it and am fully behind this conceptually.

 

[dnsmith35]

Occupy D.C. just posted a petition on their website. The whole thing can be read here:

The 99%

Perhaps independentlogic needs to look at other "good sites" about the OWS.

Here's my Cliff notes:'

1. raise income taxes on the rich
2. reverse Bush tax cuts - raising taxes on the middle class
3. institute a "speculation tax"
4. raise taxes on capital gains
5. institute a "world wide tax" on multi-national corporations
6. outlaw tax havens
7. raise corporate taxes
8. raise social security taxes

Anyone see a pattern?

It also includes a radical restructuring of the government and the economic system, which in some circles is called "Socialism" or even "Marxism".

These fuckers don't represent me. And I am in the 99%.

Let me compliment you for at least taking the time to look at one OWS site. The one you linked seems to be legitimate (there are a lot of fakes out there).

8. Where did you see something about raising SS taxes? I didn't. I did however, see ending the cap on it at $107K.

See #8 above. It clearly wants to raise SS "taxes"

Psssst, SS premiums are not taxes, they are premiums. Don't raise them. Remove the cap on income from which the premiums are collected.

So I've addressed everything you brought up directly. That IS a pattern you will see in this thread.

I could go on but you seem trongly disinclined to consider anything that might contradict what you've been told to believe by the MSM.

Believe nothing the MSM tells you. Those leftist propaganda specialists lie like rugs.

Want to see a pattern? Look at the OP and the issues brought up in it. Then look at the responses by Conservs and see whether any of them address THOSE issues, the way I addressed yours. Or whether they all just avoid them, change the subject etc...

You will see a VERY clear pattern.

Like I said, if nothing else, you've done 10x more than most Conservs, in that you actually took a minute to look at a site - if only to criticize it. it's a start, anyway.

 

[Bern80]

Occupy D.C. just posted a petition on their website. The whole thing can be read here:

The 99%

Perhaps independentlogic needs to look at other "good sites" about the OWS.

Here's my Cliff notes:'

1. raise income taxes on the rich
2. reverse Bush tax cuts - raising taxes on the middle class
3. institute a "speculation tax"
4. raise taxes on capital gains
5. institute a "world wide tax" on multi-national corporations
6. outlaw tax havens
7. raise corporate taxes
8. raise social security taxes

Anyone see a pattern?

It also includes a radical restructuring of the government and the economic system, which in some circles is called "Socialism" or even "Marxism".

These fuckers don't represent me. And I am in the 99%.

Let me compliment you for at least taking the time to look at one OWS site. The one you linked seems to be legitimate (there are a lot of fakes out there).

Actually, I'm in complete agreement with much of the above.
1. Yes
2. You mean just let those "Temporary" cuts expire? Sure.
3. 0.5% tax on stock trades?
So if someone buys $10,000 of stock, there is a tax of fifty bucks?
And that could create $800,000,000,000 in revenues? Might be worth a look.
4. Um yeah. The middle classes are really worried about captial gains taxes nowadays! Not. I would be okay with returning it to the 1997 level.
5. So wait. You're FOR the loopholes which allowed GE (Obama's buddies) to make $5B in profits and pay zero in taxes? Hmmm. Well, Obama might appreciate that sentiment but I don't. How do you feel about the fact that Lexapro is sold ONLY in the USA and all revenues from that American company (Forrest Labs) is attributed to a 10 person office in Ireland? Well heel, what's a little thing like the deficit anyway?
6. Again, I guess you're just a big fan of the deficit or something because the tax havens the site refers to, have NOTHING to do with expanding operations.
7. Where do they say that want to raise them? They just reiterate the point that loopholes like the one that let GE pay zero, cost the USA over $100,000,000,000 a year, and should be closed. Big GE fan are you? I would bet not. Me either.
8. Where did you see something about raising SS taxes? I didn't. I did however, see ending the cap on it at $107K.

So I've addressed everything you brought up directly. That IS a pattern you will see in this thread.

I could go on but you seem trongly disinclined to consider anything that might contradict what you've been told to believe by the MSM.

Want to see a pattern? Look at the OP and the issues brought up in it. Then look at the responses by Conservs and see whether any of them address THOSE issues, the way I addressed yours. Or whether they all just avoid them, change the subject etc...

You will see a VERY clear pattern.

Like I said, if nothing else, you've done 10x more than most Conservs, in that you actually took a minute to look at a site - if only to criticize it. it's a start, anyway.

I really think you're missing the bigger picture here. Almost all of those things are about raising taxes. U can just see the democrats laughing at suggestions like these because they've made people talk about solutions other than addressing the real issue and it's why the left LOVES class warfare. If they can just get people to focus on something else, like from and how much taxes there should be, rather then say, their out of control spending, well then they can just keep spending.

This is where I have to call the OWSers bluff. If they were just for separation of corporate america and government then they would be for things like a simple, flat income tax. But the simple fact is the bulk of OWSers are hard core liberals who ALSO want big government which means more and more spending, which means we're never going to solve our debt issue.