Georgia Senate blocks mega tax cuts for Delta in response to Delta punishing law abiding NRA

[TemplarKormac]

I understand that you're upset by the criticism against the NRA. But that doesn't change the bottom line here.

And what is the "bottom line" exactly?

 

[WillowTree]

Again, if the constituents feel that the "private squabble" is an attack on them and demand it, do you really expect their elected representatives to refuse?

Please offer some evidence that this is the case.

And yes, I would like to think that doing the right thing mattered to elected officials. I do not believe that elected officials are there to jump at the daily whims of the voters.


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Yes, well, politics can sometimes require balancing between what an officeholder thinks is right, and what their constituents think is right. This is probably not one of those cases, though. Do you really think it's likely that politicians from Georgia are big into gun-grabbing?

Furthermore, the NRA has a national membership of 5 million people. How many of them do you suppose are in a state like Georgia? And how pissed off do you think they are about Delta's decision, particularly considering that NRA members tend to be very passionate and energized on the subject of gun rights?

Again, the NRA's influence comes from its politically active membership. If you really think they're just sitting quietly and taking this boycott bullshit without a fight, you're delusional.

If the NRA members are pissed at Delta, then THEY should boycott Delta. The gov't should not use the tax system to punish Delta. If you cannot see how wrong that is, I have no way to make you see.

Well, you're correct that you have no way to make me see the world the way you do. I have no interest in putting my head that far up my ass.

I'm sure there are NRA members already boycotting Delta, and I expect it will grow. That in no way revokes their right to ALSO decide that they don't want a tax break deal to be made with them. Like it or not, leftie, you don't have a God-given right to government goodies.

Leftie? WTF? Because I despise politicians using the tax system to punish a private company for not catering to a big political donor? No.

NRA members boycotting Delta is not part of the issue. That is fine.

Cagle said "I will kill any tax legislation that benefits @Delta unless the company changes its position and fully reinstates its relationship with @NRA,” In otherwords, he is punishing Delta unless Delta steps back in line. That is the worst kind of gov't interference in private business.

Oh, and rightwing loon, I have been an outspoken proponent of removing ALL tax breaks and fundamentally changing the tax system to remove this ability to make the tax system a weapon. But that would be actual conservatism, not this sick version being practiced now.

Are you for a fair flat tax, no exceptions, no excuses, no exemptions?

 

[Winston]

Over 30% of citizens in Georgia are gun owners. And they pay taxes. Why would any of them want their tax dollars going to Delta after they pulled this stunt of punishing THEM when neither they or the NRA had anything to do with the school shooting?

Look, I am not going through some thirty pages of posts to see if anyone has not pointed out the obvious to you.

It's an exemption for the sales tax on jet fuel. It was part of a broader tax bill proposed by Republicans and is now being stripped out. It is worth 50 million dollars. Now any Republican will tell you, Delta is not going to be paying that tax, they are going to pass it on to their customers. Now the NRA has around 5 million members by their own claim. How many live in Georgia? And better yet, how many NRA members living in Georgia are going to use the NRA discount when flying Delta? The number has got to be laughably small.

But Hartsfield-Jackson is not the nation's busiest airport, it is the WORLD'S busiest airport, by both number of passengers and take-off's and landings. And I am pretty sure this exemption of sales tax was for ALL airlines, not just Delta.

Now I doubt you understand the concept of marginal utility, but the profound sense of STEWPYD this whole fiasco exhibits approaches the absolute absurd. I hope every single airline, airline trade group, airline employer or employee representation immediately ceases any and all political contributions. Because one airline company had the audacity to eliminate their relationship with the NRA, which only amounted to a ten percent discount on ticket purchases, the Republican contingent within the Georgia legislature has chose to punish each and every passenger that flies on a plane the refuels in the WORLD'S BUSIEST FREAKIN DAMN AIRPORT. Punish them to the tune of fifty million dollars. Fifty million dollars that those passengers could have saved and instead spent in, now wait for it, GEORGIA.

Not to mention what this PROVES about Republican tax cuts. They are not about stimulating the economy. They are not about returning the people their money back. They are not about creating jobs, or increasing the standard of living, or even encouraging investment. Nope, they are PAYOFFS. Gratuities provided to the legislator's "patrons".

 

[Cecilie1200]

Depends on the airline, one assumes. You know it's possible to make decisions on a case-by-case basis, rather than just trying to make simplistic blanket decisions across the board, right?

but that is not what the Ga senate is doing, so go tell them

No, that is not how you want to see what the Georgia Senate is doing. And I'm not going to tell them squat. Not my state, not my Senators, not my business.

No, that is what they are doing. They are holding up a bill that gives tax breaks on jet fuel to EVERY airline. If you would take 5 seconds to educate yourself, you would not look do dumb on here when you post.

If YOU had taken 5 seconds to educate yourself, instead of spending it reading left-wing opinions on the subject, you would know that the tax breaks were not very popular in many segments of the population to begin with, which is why they were allowed to expire, and the actual discussion is whether or not to reinstate them. There has been both support and opposition to the reinstatement in the Georgia state government, which is now swinging more toward opposition, and includes calls to do away with the idea no matter what Delta does in re: NRA discounts. This whole question is also coming up at a time when they are apparently preparing to have a gubernatorial election later this year, which always tends to make any questions or issues that arise more intense.

There's your 5 seconds of education (assuming you can read without moving your lips). You're welcome.

Why yes, I did know that. And I know that they made it through the House in Ga in less than 2 days, there was not much opposition.

I would personally love to see these sorts of tax breaks go away totally, but to use them as a tool to force one private company to give discounts to another private company is way worse than the fact that the tax breaks even exist.

Can I ask you why you think it is a good idea for the state to use tax policies to force one private company to give discounts to another private company? Would you be ok with this on a national level?

Actually, using them as a tool to encourage certain behavior is EXACTLY why such tax breaks exist on a state level. Admittedly, the behavior in question is usually more economic in nature, but it still remains within the state legislature's purview.

Methinks you don't really get the difference between federal, state, and local government, and why there are multiple levels.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If it were that simple, I wouldn't bat an eye.

But the same people who are threatening to remove the tax break are the ones who pushed for it. And they are not just removing the tax break. They are using the tax system to punish Delta for removing discounts. That is the worst sort of gov't interference in private affairs. This is what conservative vehemently opposed in the past.

Wow, it's like politicians are human beings who can change their minds according to the situation, or some shit like that.

Oh please, this is not about them changing their minds. All the reasons for the tax exemption still exist. What changed is that Delta no longer offers a discount for NRA members. This is using the tax system to punish a business for not toeing the line.

Yes, what changed was that Delta did something that made tax breaks less appealing to the Senate's constituents. Which would be exactly the sort of change they're SUPPOSED to pay attention to.

What did the other airlines do to make the tax breaks less appealing for them as well?

i doubt there were 12 people outside of the senate that knew about this.

I bet there are a lot more now.

Again, the relationships between the current and future officeholders of the government of a state I don't live in are really none of my business. State government has the right to decide what deals it negotiates, with whom, and why, and I have faith both in the ability of successful politicians to gauge the will of their constituents, and in the people to make their will clear, one way or another.

They're in the middle of a gubernatorial election campaign right now. I would imagine we'll see what the people of Georgia want very quickly.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Yep - heard about this. More NRA whores puff out their chests and make idle threats.

But Delta holds the ace - they can simply threaten to move their hub from Atlanta to Dallas or Denver.

Watch the slimy little worms consider the thousands of jobs that'd go buh-bye, go silent and crawl back under their rocks

Have ewe ever been through Atlanta Hartsfield? Ain’t never gonna happen dummie.

you do know they can move their hq and still fly out of atlanta, right?

You do know that would be an enormous expenditure of money and effort, right?

 

[Cecilie1200]

delta, like every other corp that has stopped doing business with the nra, is doing it for one reason

the bottom line

you have to be a complete fuckwit to believe otherwise

And Georgia is making it clear that there's another side of the story affecting that bottom line. You have to be a complete fuckwit to believe otherwise.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If it is discriminatory, then sue or prosecute. The State gov't does not wield tax laws as punishment. That is pure bullshit.

Those that giveth a tax break may take the it away!

And I have no problem with cutting tax breaks.

But this is blatant interference from the gov't. This is punishing Delta for taking away the NRA's discounts. That is NOT the job of the gov't. And that is certainly not part of the conservative's ideal for gov't.

it is now

face it, cons stand for nothing

Face it, no one is interested in what you do or don't think conservatives stand for. We have never been, nor will ever be, vying for your approval.

bought any new whips lately?

It's nothing to you if I have, since you certainly aren't anywhere near my standards.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

I understand that you're upset by the criticism against the NRA. But that doesn't change the bottom line here.

And what is the "bottom line" exactly?

The bottom line is that the State of Georgia is explicitly using their tax code as a weapon to demand ideological conformity.

Whether or not Delta "surprised" the NRA, or whether you side with NRA on this particular issue - that doesn't change the bottom line.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Well that said all Ga. is doing is stopping discounts to Delta. See how that works?

If it were that simple, I wouldn't bat an eye.

But the same people who are threatening to remove the tax break are the ones who pushed for it. And they are not just removing the tax break. They are using the tax system to punish Delta for removing discounts. That is the worst sort of gov't interference in private affairs. This is what conservative vehemently opposed in the past.

Wow, it's like politicians are human beings who can change their minds according to the situation, or some shit like that.

Oh please, this is not about them changing their minds. All the reasons for the tax exemption still exist. What changed is that Delta no longer offers a discount for NRA members. This is using the tax system to punish a business for not toeing the line.

Yes, what changed was that Delta did something that made tax breaks less appealing to the Senate's constituents. Which would be exactly the sort of change they're SUPPOSED to pay attention to.

Constituents? Do you think their constituents really care about the discount the NRA got for one event?

Delta is the largest employer in the state. I would think they would care about that.

I think their constituents care about the bigger picture, and the slap-in-the-face insult to them.

It is not for you OR me to decide what their priorities are, or should be, in this case.

 

[Cecilie1200]

If it were that simple, I wouldn't bat an eye.

But the same people who are threatening to remove the tax break are the ones who pushed for it. And they are not just removing the tax break. They are using the tax system to punish Delta for removing discounts. That is the worst sort of gov't interference in private affairs. This is what conservative vehemently opposed in the past.

Wow, it's like politicians are human beings who can change their minds according to the situation, or some shit like that.

Oh please, this is not about them changing their minds. All the reasons for the tax exemption still exist. What changed is that Delta no longer offers a discount for NRA members. This is using the tax system to punish a business for not toeing the line.

Guess politicians in Georgia don't care much for a company that won't kiss NRA's ass

Since a goodly number of their constituents are NRA members or supporters, why is that surprising? You certainly expect politicians in leftist states like California to cooperate with every left-wing advocacy group that comes down the pike, don't you?

I actually expect politicians to act in a manner that is best for their state or nation.

Seems to me that you expect politicians to act in a manner YOU deem best for their state or nation.

 

[theDoctorisIn]

You appear to contradict yourself here.

Do you support the government enforcing political views on corporations by weaponized tax law, or not?

No. But what I am saying is that actions have consequences. I don't necessarily have to agree with the consequences. Cause and effect.

That's a cop-out.

If you disagree with the government attempting to coerce political conformity via the tax code, then say so. If you think it's ok, then say that.

Saying "cause and effect" is desperately trying to find a middle ground that doesn't exist. You can claim a causal chain between any two events.

If I stabbed a man to death for looking at me funny, would you accept the statement "Actions have consequences. I don't have to agree with the consequences, but cause and effect"?

 

[Cecilie1200]

Just heard about this. Will find a link. Kudos to the Senators for hitting back at the NRA. Why should gun owners in Georgia who pay taxes have to support Delta financially?

If Delta doesn't want or need the business of 5 million NRA members why do they even need a tax break?

Delta’s tax break may not take flight after Georgia Senate blocks it

So its a good thing the state govt attacks businesses like this?

So you want to protect your 2nd amendment but get angry when someone uses their 1st amendment rights..humm could that be called a cherry picker..[emoji39] [emoji11] [emoji89]

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Using the power of government to pressure a business into performing or not performing certain actions for another organization is not someone using their 1st amendment rights. According to a quote in the article, the tax break in question was explicitly described as being contingent upon Delta resuming its previous business affairs with the NRA.

I don't know what version of the First Amendment YOU'RE reading, but the version I'm familiar with says, "Petition the government for redress of grievances". Doesn't specify what the grievances have to be to count. You get to pester your local politician for whatever you wanna pester him for.

I'm not talking about anyone petitioning government, I'm talking about the actions of the government. When a government representative says that a piece of legislation will not be passed unless company A does business in a particular way with organization X, that is not free speech. The representative is not acting as a private citizen in that context.

How do you know that representative hasn't heard from his constituents?

 

[Dragonlady]

Just heard about this. Will find a link. Kudos to the Senators for hitting back at the NRA. Why should gun owners in Georgia who pay taxes have to support Delta financially?

If Delta doesn't want or need the business of 5 million NRA members why do they even need a tax break?

Delta’s tax break may not take flight after Georgia Senate blocks it

Trump's motorcade was booed in Atlanta Georgia a while back, so these State Republican senators may have bit off more than they can chew. They have made themselves a target in the upcoming November election--


Lot's of business's have been dumping the NRA since the school shooting in Parkland, Florida.
NRA fallout: See the list of companies that cut discounts for NRA members after Parkland, Florida school shooting
http://www.newsweek.com/nra-boycott...es-corporate-backlash-latest-school-shooting/
First National Bank cuts ties with NRA

I think that many of these companies are dumping the NRA because of their anti-FBI rhetoric, and the current FBI money laundering investigations of Wayne LaPierre and the NRA.

Not to mention their “call to arms” ads which denigrate schools, the FBI and the MSM. This isn’t protecting rights. It’s promoting a dystopian view of those who promote any policy but theirs.

 

[Mac1958]

So we're now learning how eager "conservatives" are to allow government to throw its weight around.

Going after a private-sector business because you don't like one specific thing it did legally. Wow.

 

[blastoff]

Just heard about this. Will find a link. Kudos to the Senators for hitting back at the NRA. Why should gun owners in Georgia who pay taxes have to support Delta financially?

If Delta doesn't want or need the business of 5 million NRA members why do they even need a tax break?

Delta’s tax break may not take flight after Georgia Senate blocks it

Now THAT'S bringing a gun to a gun fight!

 

[jillian]

Just heard about this. Will find a link. Kudos to the Senators for hitting back at the NRA. Why should gun owners in Georgia who pay taxes have to support Delta financially?

If Delta doesn't want or need the business of 5 million NRA members why do they even need a tax break?

Delta’s tax break may not take flight after Georgia Senate blocks it

Now THAT'S bringing a gun to a gun fight!

so gubmint can violate the first amendment because you feel like?

hacks.

 

[Cecilie1200]

you have to understand that cons have very strict principles and they won't budge from them if the price isn't right

You have to understand that leftists try to insist on conservatives holding to principles set up as straw men by the leftists, while they themselves proudly have no principles whatsoever.

What principles? Conservatives talk the talk but don’t walk the walk.

The party of “smaller government” now wants to put armed guards in every school. Hired 5,000 additional people for border security, imposes more restrictions on women’s reproductive rights than they do on who purchased a handgun.

The party of “fiscal responsibility” just passed legislation which will raise the deficit by 1.5 trillion dollars in 10 years. And then went on a spending spree.

The “family values” party ran a pedophile for the Senate and a man who admits to sexually harassing and assaulting women as President.

Talk about people with their heads up their asses.

As opposed to leftists, who don't even bother to talk the talk? That's what's really amusing me here. Lefties like you want to excoriate conservatives for not "living up to their principles" AS YOU PERCEIVE THEM, while you escape the whole question by simply never espousing any principles at all. And for reasons I shall never understand, we are somehow expected to creep away in shame over not having achieved the approval of our enemies. Please, PLEASE, hold your breath waiting for that to happen.

I'm always going to look down on you as amoral scum who is beneath me, and I'm always going to be correct in doing so, and I am NEVER going to be trying to make you like me. Deal with it.

 

[TemplarKormac]

That's a cop-out.

If you disagree with the government attempting to coerce political conformity via the tax code, then say so. If you think it's ok, then say that.

Saying "cause and effect" is desperately trying to find a middle ground that doesn't exist. You can claim a causal chain between any two events.

Middle ground exists whether you want it to or not.

No, I don't support government coercion of any type. But if you're going to provoke a political group by singling them out over a singular issue, you shouldn't be surprised by the response.

 

[del]

I bet there are a lot more now.

Again, the relationships between the current and future officeholders of the government of a state I don't live in are really none of my business. State government has the right to decide what deals it negotiates, with whom, and why, and I have faith both in the ability of successful politicians to gauge the will of their constituents, and in the people to make their will clear, one way or another.

They're in the middle of a gubernatorial election campaign right now. I would imagine we'll see what the people of Georgia want very quickly.

can't fool you for long, huh?

at least you admit this vlown is grandstanding for vote

talk about putting the goober in gubernatorial...