GOP turning "American helping American" into Socialism - Is that a national scandal?

[rdean]

Wow, talk about stretching the definition of "socialism" into a pretzel. The radical left must be plumb out of ideas.

It's not the left who turned American helping American into "socialism". Do keep up.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Government of the rich, by the rich, for the rich. Does not need to recognize any form of government as long as the money is controlled by a small group of people.

Now every country in the world, no matter the form of government, has this situation to some extent or another. You think plutocrats wanting to rule the world only happened in long ago history?

It's just that in America, we tried to avoid that situation to some extent. We didn't really want a "ruling class" in this country. Worked for a while, but things are swinging the way of the plutocrats at the present.
You see the amount of wealth of the world controlled by just a few people? The amount of wealth in this country controlled by just a few people.

Funny thing about you is that while you recognize that plutocracies exist around the world, you seem to be in favor of them. At your expense. Why is that? You just like ultra rich people?

so what the fuck you going to do about it Zeke?...both parties have nothing but the anointed run.....if a third party person comes along who is just a "normal" person....he gets the "dont vote for him....you are wasting your vote" treatment...he gets edged out because he aint got the money to hang with the big guys....even if that person is a better candidate.......if attitudes dont change....nothing will,its just going to get worse....

Normal person? Like someone who was on food stamps as a kid? Who took out student loans to go to college and paid them all off after writing two best sellers? I wouldn't call that "normal". I would call someone like that a person who worked hard and succeeded. I would even vote for someone like that. Turns out I already did, twice.

the guy had money behind him dipshit.....and he was already a Senator....thus an "anointed" one....try some "normal" guy who doesnt have any of that behind him but just might be a better Candidate,see how far he gets with assholes with your mindset....and you know dam well Dean...if your fucking little party dont endorse the guy....you aint voting for him.....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Government of the rich, by the rich, for the rich. Does not need to recognize any form of government as long as the money is controlled by a small group of people.

Now every country in the world, no matter the form of government, has this situation to some extent or another. You think plutocrats wanting to rule the world only happened in long ago history?

It's just that in America, we tried to avoid that situation to some extent. We didn't really want a "ruling class" in this country. Worked for a while, but things are swinging the way of the plutocrats at the present.
You see the amount of wealth of the world controlled by just a few people? The amount of wealth in this country controlled by just a few people.

Funny thing about you is that while you recognize that plutocracies exist around the world, you seem to be in favor of them. At your expense. Why is that? You just like ultra rich people?

so what the fuck you going to do about it Zeke?...both parties have nothing but the anointed run.....if a third party person comes along who is just a "normal" person....he gets the "dont vote for him....you are wasting your vote" treatment...he gets edged out because he aint got the money to hang with the big guys....even if that person is a better candidate.......if attitudes dont change....nothing will,its just going to get worse....

Ahha, the 24 dollar question. What to do about living in a plutocracy?

First recognize that we do live in a plutocracy. That is a real good start. After that, when people start to realize that it is the plutocrats of any and all political party that are calling the shots and making the decisions with THEIR (plutocrats) best interests in mind that maybe we the people could insist that decisions be made that more favorably treated the middle class of this country.

My bet is that you and I and most of the people on this message board have MUCH more in common than you have with your typical billionaire plutocrat.

Yet people on here defend ultra rich people with an obsession. Why? What is it that you see the ultra rich doing for the benefit of people like you and I? That does not serve their interest FIRST.

You really think the Koch Brothers hate Obama? After their wealth has doubled under Obama. Really hate him? Not likely. But it sounds so good to some regular middle class people that the Koch Brothers are gonna restore "freedom" and "whatever else sells".

But as what to do about this situation. Maybe nothing to be done. Real rich people are used to making long term plans. And they have enough money to be eternally patient. Eventually if nothing is done, the ultra wealthy will control ever more of the countries wealth.

So let me ask you; if we do nothing about our plutocrats, is there a level of wealth that they could control that YOU think would be harmful to the rest of us. In other words, if 50% of the nations income goes to the ultra wealthy or 60 or whatever the number, when would the control of the nations wealth by just a few become a problem for the vast majority of us?

Or would it be a problem?

rich people have been ruling us for quite some time.....it would not be a problem to me, if they would see that our tax dollars are used for the Country as a whole and not just for special interests or their other rich friends..... until people are ready to back someone who isnt rich, but who just might have a better grasp on life in the world most of us live in, nothing is going to change,rich people stick together,they all have something in common....money....someone here posted a link in a thread here where they said the Obamas were worth around a Million when he got elected and are now worth around 10 million....so i guess they are doing great......

 

[rdean]

so what the fuck you going to do about it Zeke?...both parties have nothing but the anointed run.....if a third party person comes along who is just a "normal" person....he gets the "dont vote for him....you are wasting your vote" treatment...he gets edged out because he aint got the money to hang with the big guys....even if that person is a better candidate.......if attitudes dont change....nothing will,its just going to get worse....

Normal person? Like someone who was on food stamps as a kid? Who took out student loans to go to college and paid them all off after writing two best sellers? I wouldn't call that "normal". I would call someone like that a person who worked hard and succeeded. I would even vote for someone like that. Turns out I already did, twice.

the guy had money behind him dipshit.....and he was already a Senator....thus an "anointed" one....try some "normal" guy who doesnt have any of that behind him but just might be a better Candidate,see how far he gets with assholes with your mindset....and you know dam well Dean...if your fucking little party dont endorse the guy....you aint voting for him.....

Newsflash, he wasn't always a "senator". Duh. Just being a senator makes you "anointed"? Laughable.
Besides, I want a "smart guy", not a "normal guy" as president. Bush was "normal". Someone you would want to have a beer with, or do coke and pass out under a bar stool with. See how well that worked out?

 

[Harry Dresden]

Normal person? Like someone who was on food stamps as a kid? Who took out student loans to go to college and paid them all off after writing two best sellers? I wouldn't call that "normal". I would call someone like that a person who worked hard and succeeded. I would even vote for someone like that. Turns out I already did, twice.

the guy had money behind him dipshit.....and he was already a Senator....thus an "anointed" one....try some "normal" guy who doesnt have any of that behind him but just might be a better Candidate,see how far he gets with assholes with your mindset....and you know dam well Dean...if your fucking little party dont endorse the guy....you aint voting for him.....

Newsflash, he wasn't always a "senator". Duh. Just being a senator makes you "anointed"? Laughable.
Besides, I want a "smart guy", not a "normal guy" as president. Bush was "normal". Someone you would want to have a beer with, or do coke and pass out under a bar stool with. See how well that worked out?

what was he when he was picked dumbass?.....was he some guy working in Chicago doing community organizing or was he a Congressmen?......how much money was behind him during the election?....a billion dollars?....thats pretty good for a "normal" guy....and im sure your buddy Obama had a few nights where he passed out from drinking and doing drugs too......see how that worked out?.....your problem Dean?.....you wont question anything that the Democrats do.....why?.....because you are a dumbass....Duh.....

 

[Avatar4321]

Wow, look at that. Turns out there are many forms of "education" including "job training". This is why Republicans can't compete against immigrants with degrees. They don't even know what education is and without that knowledge, "job training" won't "take". These days, not all jobs are "work hard and dig ditches". These days, for a good job, you need "skills". Skills you get from, well, some would call it "education", others would call it "job training". Turns out that job training is one of the many forms of education.

Consider this a "teaching moment".

You'd have to teach me something first. Because if you actually bothered reading what I said, you'd have realized I said that you can learn job training, but that isn't the sole purpose of education. Education is to learn about the world around us. You can get it to some degree in schools, but more often you have to learn it through life.

I know you're trying to prove yourself intelligent, but if you can't even bother reading pretty clear text, you aren't going to prove it to anyone. Next time you try to "teach" me something, try not to make it what I've already written to you.

 

[Avatar4321]

I also would point out that Education isn't "job training". Education is learning about the world around us solely for the sake of learning about the world around us. Some of it is very useful in a career. Some of it just makes us a better person.

I didn't study European history for job training. I studied it because it's interesting (all history is really). Most people don't study music theory for job training, but because they want to learn about music. Most people don't study philosophy to get job training, they do so to understand ideas, thoughts, etc.

I don't think rdean has a clue what education really is. He thinks getting a degree shows that you are educated and smart. It doesn't. It doesn't hurt. But it doesn't guarantee anything.

ed·u·ca·tion [ej-oo-key-shuhn]
noun
1.
the act or process of imparting or acquiring general knowledge, developing the powers of reasoning and judgment, and generally of preparing oneself or others intellectually for mature life.
2.
the act or process of imparting or acquiring particular knowledge or skills, as for a profession.
3.
a degree, level, or kind of schooling: a university education.
4.
the result produced by instruction, training, or study

Education | Define Education at Dictionary.com

Definition of "Job Training":

A method of preparing an employee to perform a task by providing them with information about the task, a demonstration of its performance, an opportunity for the employee to imitate the demonstration and subsequent feedback. Many business operators feel that effective job training makes an important contribution to their company's success.

What is job training? definition and meaning

-----------------------------------------------------

Wow, look at that. Turns out there are many forms of "education" including "job training". This is why Republicans can't compete against immigrants with degrees. They don't even know what education is and without that knowledge, "job training" won't "take". These days, not all jobs are "work hard and dig ditches". These days, for a good job, you need "skills". Skills you get from, well, some would call it "education", others would call it "job training". Turns out that job training is one of the many forms of education.

Consider this a "teaching moment".

OMG, look at that. TRAINING PROGRAMS:

Training Programs Definition | Small Business Encyclopedia

Sounds an awful lot like "education". Especially the part about "classroom sessions". Oops.

You really aren't that bright, are you?

 

[Avatar4321]

Who the fuck was that?

Certainly not Barack Obama, who went to the finest prep schools, had a silver spoon up his ass, and was ushered through life by a hoard of sycophants who declared him the great black (or should that be "red") hope?

wow, I wouldn't admit I was duped by someone I voted for

but there it is for all to see...he voted for a man who won, liar of the year, made up most of his life as being some black child who was actually raised by rich white grandparents.....and wrote two books even though he had never accomplished anything outstanding...gawd help us all these people vote

Never accomplished anything outstanding, except being a US Senator and US President twice, bringing us back from Iraq, taking out Bin Laden, bringing back the economy, putting healthcare for all Americans into motion, signing the Lily Ledbetter act, turned around the auto industry, repealed Don't ask Don't tell, abolished Bush torture policies, kicked banks out of the student loan program, increased support for veterans, tightened sanctions on Iran, passed credit card reform, expanded health care coverage for people who have kids in college.........I could think of another ten before I had to go look stuff up on the Internet. How many can you think of for Ronald Reagan and either Bush?

And he was on food stamps as a kid. The right likes to say his grandmother was a bank VP. Yea, she was so rich, she made at least $50,000 a year at a small local bank. Wow, that's a lot.

In the 60s? yeah it sure was alot. Heck, it's still quite a bit now. At least it was when the Obama administration began.

 

[RDD_1210]

LOL, the mental backflips you must have to do to justify contradicting yourself with every breath you take must be exhausting.

So you aren't taxing people into poverty?

And stating the truth is never exhausting. It's lying that gets exhausted. See. When you tell the truth, you don't have to remember your story. You just say things as they are. When you are lying you have to remember every detail you've said to keep your story straight. Which is why most liars get caught.

If you didn't take as much money from people, there would be far less poor, regardless of age. We would be in a far better position to take care of one another and support ourselves.

So this is where the major disconnect happens. I'd love for you to explain how you and your heros claim that "47% of the country are moochers" and how the "poor don't pay any taxes" and yet at the same time claim that "they are being taxed in to poverty".

Like I said, you're an Olympic quality back peddler and circus grade contortionist to be able to hold absolutely contradictory viewpoints that you so easily spew.

...and of course you never returned to answer this.

 

[Stephanie]

so now the requirement for president is writing two self serving book's about oneself before they accomplished anything in their pathetic lives...

ole rdean has a huge man crush on the Dear Leader...creepy and cultish

 

[zeke]

So you aren't taxing people into poverty?

And stating the truth is never exhausting. It's lying that gets exhausted. See. When you tell the truth, you don't have to remember your story. You just say things as they are. When you are lying you have to remember every detail you've said to keep your story straight. Which is why most liars get caught.

If you didn't take as much money from people, there would be far less poor, regardless of age. We would be in a far better position to take care of one another and support ourselves.

So this is where the major disconnect happens. I'd love for you to explain how you and your heros claim that "47% of the country are moochers" and how the "poor don't pay any taxes" and yet at the same time claim that "they are being taxed in to poverty".

Like I said, you're an Olympic quality back peddler and circus grade contortionist to be able to hold absolutely contradictory viewpoints that you so easily spew.

...and of course you never returned to answer this.

Which really pisses me off. I got up this morning wanting to find out how that moocher class that pays no tax to the Federal government is now being taxed to the point of poverty.

Come on avatar. Curious minds would like to know how this works. Pay no taxes and be taxed to poverty levels.

How can it be both?

 

[rdean]

So this is where the major disconnect happens. I'd love for you to explain how you and your heros claim that "47% of the country are moochers" and how the "poor don't pay any taxes" and yet at the same time claim that "they are being taxed in to poverty".

Like I said, you're an Olympic quality back peddler and circus grade contortionist to be able to hold absolutely contradictory viewpoints that you so easily spew.

...and of course you never returned to answer this.

Which really pisses me off. I got up this morning wanting to find out how that moocher class that pays no tax to the Federal government is now being taxed to the point of poverty.

Come on avatar. Curious minds would like to know how this works. Pay no taxes and be taxed to poverty levels.

How can it be both?

The same way Obama could be weak and a strongman in the same sentence.

For USMB right wingers, they can hold every position at the same time and quite often do.

 

[rdean]

ed·u·ca·tion [ej-oo-key-shuhn]
noun
1.
the act or process of imparting or acquiring general knowledge, developing the powers of reasoning and judgment, and generally of preparing oneself or others intellectually for mature life.
2.
the act or process of imparting or acquiring particular knowledge or skills, as for a profession.
3.
a degree, level, or kind of schooling: a university education.
4.
the result produced by instruction, training, or study

Education | Define Education at Dictionary.com

Definition of "Job Training":

A method of preparing an employee to perform a task by providing them with information about the task, a demonstration of its performance, an opportunity for the employee to imitate the demonstration and subsequent feedback. Many business operators feel that effective job training makes an important contribution to their company's success.

What is job training? definition and meaning

-----------------------------------------------------

Wow, look at that. Turns out there are many forms of "education" including "job training". This is why Republicans can't compete against immigrants with degrees. They don't even know what education is and without that knowledge, "job training" won't "take". These days, not all jobs are "work hard and dig ditches". These days, for a good job, you need "skills". Skills you get from, well, some would call it "education", others would call it "job training". Turns out that job training is one of the many forms of education.

Consider this a "teaching moment".

OMG, look at that. TRAINING PROGRAMS:

Training Programs Definition | Small Business Encyclopedia

Sounds an awful lot like "education". Especially the part about "classroom sessions". Oops.

You really aren't that bright, are you?

Bright enough to know job training is another form of education. I didn't say, "Education isn't "job training". You did.

 

[rdean]

the guy had money behind him dipshit.....and he was already a Senator....thus an "anointed" one....try some "normal" guy who doesnt have any of that behind him but just might be a better Candidate,see how far he gets with assholes with your mindset....and you know dam well Dean...if your fucking little party dont endorse the guy....you aint voting for him.....

Newsflash, he wasn't always a "senator". Duh. Just being a senator makes you "anointed"? Laughable.
Besides, I want a "smart guy", not a "normal guy" as president. Bush was "normal". Someone you would want to have a beer with, or do coke and pass out under a bar stool with. See how well that worked out?

what was he when he was picked dumbass?.....was he some guy working in Chicago doing community organizing or was he a Congressmen?......how much money was behind him during the election?....a billion dollars?....thats pretty good for a "normal" guy....and im sure your buddy Obama had a few nights where he passed out from drinking and doing drugs too......see how that worked out?.....your problem Dean?.....you wont question anything that the Democrats do.....why?.....because you are a dumbass....Duh.....

Only "pretty sure"? For such a charge you must have evidence. When I say Mitt Romney abused his dog so bad it shit all over his car, we know that to be true because he told us. When I say John McCain graduated 5th from the bottom out of a class of 899, we know that because he told us. When I say George Bush denied having a criminal past when running for president, he, OK, he didn't tell it. He was confronted with evidence and he got really mad. The operatives here are "testimony" and "evidence".

 

[Stephanie]

How do you stand being preached to by someone who has a crush on a man (a human just like the rest of us, not some g-d, messiah, saint sent from the heavens above)...If he was some saint, he would DONATE all his millions he has made off the people he is now serving back to them..
yeah I know I made a funny


How do you take someone like that serious...when they push care for OTHERS and it means with other peoples monies and not their own

the Democrat party has a lot of people duped...unfortunately they vote

 

[Harry Dresden]

so now the requirement for president is writing two self serving book's about oneself before they accomplished anything in their pathetic lives...

ole rdean has a huge man crush on the Dear Leader...creepy and cultish

if Dean overheard Obama and a group of Democratic Congress people talking about how they fucked over a bunch of citizens.....he still would back them and would not even think of questioning what he heard.....thats what kind of Character he has....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Newsflash, he wasn't always a "senator". Duh. Just being a senator makes you "anointed"? Laughable.
Besides, I want a "smart guy", not a "normal guy" as president. Bush was "normal". Someone you would want to have a beer with, or do coke and pass out under a bar stool with. See how well that worked out?

what was he when he was picked dumbass?.....was he some guy working in Chicago doing community organizing or was he a Congressmen?......how much money was behind him during the election?....a billion dollars?....thats pretty good for a "normal" guy....and im sure your buddy Obama had a few nights where he passed out from drinking and doing drugs too......see how that worked out?.....your problem Dean?.....you wont question anything that the Democrats do.....why?.....because you are a dumbass....Duh.....

Only "pretty sure"? For such a charge you must have evidence. When I say Mitt Romney abused his dog so bad it shit all over his car, we know that to be true because he told us. When I say John McCain graduated 5th from the bottom out of a class of 899, we know that because he told us. When I say George Bush denied having a criminal past when running for president, he, OK, he didn't tell it. He was confronted with evidence and he got really mad. The operatives here are "testimony" and "evidence".

Dean you are either stupid.....or you were never around any kind of drugs.....or you just wont say anything about Obama.....or its all 3.....the guy admits doing drugs back when....so yea im pretty sure he had a few times where he got pretty fucked up.....just like when Clinton said he never inhaled.....yea right,im pretty sure he inhaled more than once.....take your fucking head out of your ass once in a while..

 

[Harry Dresden]

How do you stand being preached to by someone who has a crush on a man (a human just like the rest of us, not some g-d, messiah, saint sent from the heavens above)...If he was some saint, he would DONATE all his millions he has made off the people he is now serving back to them..
yeah I know I made a funny


How do you take someone like that serious...when they push care for OTHERS and it means with other peoples monies and not their own

the Democrat party has a lot of people duped...unfortunately they vote

it amazes me how naive Dean is.....i thought the guy had a little more savvy then this.....Obama who admits he did drugs back when never got fucked up....i guess Dean thinks he just took a hit and that was it....he just snorted one line....and that was it....im sure he believes Clintons "story" about never inhaling too....

 

[Avatar4321]

OMG, look at that. TRAINING PROGRAMS:

Training Programs Definition | Small Business Encyclopedia

Sounds an awful lot like "education". Especially the part about "classroom sessions". Oops.

You really aren't that bright, are you?

Bright enough to know job training is another form of education. I didn't say, "Education isn't "job training". You did.

And it isn't job training. Education is far more expansive than that. It includes far more than just job training. You are trying to pretend it's solely job training. or that I said job training was not at all involved in education.

If you are going to have a problem with what I am saying, at least be honest about what I'm saying. I understand you can't, because I am correct that education is far more than just job training. Education is learning about the world around us. Something you don't want us to do. Because the more people know about the world around them, the less they will give you political power for your fantasy agenda.

 

[Flopper]

....yawn.

Medicare | ObamaCare Watch

ObamaCare cuts a half-trillion dollars from Medicare over the next decade. These cuts are unsustainable and will lead to a reduction in the quality of care for seniors who rely on the program to secure access to needed medical services. The cuts in Medicare Advantage will impose steep costs on millions of Medicare beneficiaries, and will fall disproportionately on low income and minority seniors.

Even with these so called cuts, Medicare will double in 10 years which means that these cuts will amount to only 5% of the Medicare budget.

However the cuts are actually wrung from health-care providers, not Medicare beneficiaries. Hospitals will be paid less if they have too many re-admissions. The Medicare Advantage program offered by private insurers was suppose to save money but instead has cost Medicare hundreds of millions of dollars. Obamacare is gradually cutting the program back to the point where it equals the amount spend on Medicare beneficiaries.

It’s worth noting that the preferred plan of Republicans in 2012, Wisconsin Rep. Paul Ryan’s budget included the same magnitude of cuts to Medicare.

...without ObamaCare. Hospitals pass costs on or cut services so you didn't figure that in. Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security need fixing since they are doomed to fail, ObamaCare is the wrong answer.

If the cuts to hospitals reimbursements were across the board, you might have a valid point. However, the cuts are to hospitals with too many readmission. Insurance companies across the country are following suit by reducing payments to hospitals with poor outcomes.

This is in keeping with what healthcare professional have been saying for years; payments need to be based more on outcome and not just on delivering a service. Although many hospitals face cuts because of readmission, relatively few will be hit with these cuts because they have the ability to correct the problem. The actually cuts aren't very much but the real incentive is the fact that no hospital want to have on their records that they have a number of violations or penalties. This hurts them badly both in their quality ratings and their ability to negotiate contracts with insurance companies.