Is Israel the Same as South Africa?

[P F Tinmore]

"...Just another Israeli lie..."

Or another Palestinian one, which seems just as likely, if not more...

My post is true. It is a matter of history.

Look it up.

 

[toastman]

Anybody who thinks Israel is actually Palestine is delusional..its really that simple

 

[toastman]

"...Just another Israeli lie..."

Or another Palestinian one, which seems just as likely, if not more...

My post is true. It is a matter of history.

Look it up.

Funny, so you're saying a full member of the UN called Israel is actually Palestine.. have you notified the UN about this mistake of theirs? This is a huge breakthrough!

 

[docmauser1]

The boundary issue was a dilemma created by the Palestinian and the Arab League armies. The Arab League attacked the newly declared State of Israel immediately upon its Declaration of Independence. In the ensuing struggle (an elective trial by combat initiated upon the aggression of the five participating Arab States) with some of the territory annotated as being allotted to the future Arab State [Part II, Section A, GA/RES/181(II)] being overrun by Israeli forces in pursuit of retreating Arab forces beaten back by defenders. Thus, the original allocation for the Jewish State [outlined in Part II, Section B, GA/RES/181(II)] was expanded under Israeli control. This was to set by the Armistice Lines.

Just another Israeli lie. Israel was grabbing land beyond the proposed borders before any Arab country entered Palestine.

Let's review the factual timeline:

• May 15, 1947 - The General Assembly established a Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP).
• August 31 - The UNSCOP recommended partition of Palestine with an internationalised Jerusalem, a minority report recommended a federation.
• September 29 - The arab Higher committee rejected the UNSCOP recommendation formally.
• October 2 - The Jewish agency accepted the UNSCOP recommendation formally.
• November 29 - The UN approved the partition.
• November 30 - Arab mobs attacked jews in Jerusalem, arab armed thugs began operations against jews everywhere.
• March 19, 1948 - The US proposed a partition suspension and called for a special session of the General Assembly to discuss trusteeship.
• April 1 - The Security Council called for a truce and a special session of the General Assembly to reconsider future of Palestine.
• May 13 - Rapacious Jaffa arabs got kicked by the Hagana.
• May 14 - Declaration of Independence. The US recognized Israel de facto.
• May 14 - The British mandate ended. Arab armies invaded Israel.
• May 17 - The USSR recognized Israel.
• May 19 - Jerusalem cut off by arabs.
• May 1948 - July 1949 - War.

We may now happily dispense with arab habitual lies and agitprop, of course. And still there's been no "arab state of palestine".

 

[P F Tinmore]

Anybody who thinks Israel is actually Palestine is delusional..its really that simple

Source: The Avalon Project : Jordanian-Israeli General Armistice Agreement, April 3, 1949

Responding to the Security Council resolution of 16 November 1948,(2) calling upon them, as a further provisional measure under Article 40 of the Charter of the United Nations and in order to facilitate the transition from the present truce to permanent peace in Palestine, to negotiate an armistice;

The term "in Palestine" is used regularly in all of the armistice agreements. The term "in Israel" is completely absent.

(d) In the sector from a point on the Dead Sea (MR 1925-0958) to the southernmost tip of Palestine, the Armistice Demarcation Line shall be determined by...

That agreement, that Israel signed, calls that territory Palestine. Before the ink was dry, Israel started calling that land Israel.

This proves an old adage to be true: Tell a lie often enough and people will believe it.

 

[docmauser1]

The term "in Palestine" is used regularly in all of the armistice agreements.

Geographic area, who cares.

 

[Kondor3]

The term "in Palestine" is used regularly in all of the armistice agreements.

Geographic area, who cares.

True, but, when your back is against the wall and you've been losing for 65 years and when you come to the conclusion that the party is almost over, well, you get even more desperate and grasp at straws and play word-games; mostly because that's all that is left that you CAN do, and habits of resistance die hard, even amongst such a disjointed and loosely-knitted pack of diverse elements as that bunch which has temporarily banded-together under the label 'Palestinians'...

 

[toastman]

Anybody who thinks Israel is actually Palestine is delusional..its really that simple

Source: The Avalon Project : Jordanian-Israeli General Armistice Agreement, April 3, 1949

Responding to the Security Council resolution of 16 November 1948,(2) calling upon them, as a further provisional measure under Article 40 of the Charter of the United Nations and in order to facilitate the transition from the present truce to permanent peace in Palestine, to negotiate an armistice;

The term "in Palestine" is used regularly in all of the armistice agreements. The term "in Israel" is completely absent.

(d) In the sector from a point on the Dead Sea (MR 1925-0958) to the southernmost tip of Palestine, the Armistice Demarcation Line shall be determined by...

That agreement, that Israel signed, calls that territory Palestine. Before the ink was dry, Israel started calling that land Israel.

This proves an old adage to be true: Tell a lie often enough and people will believe it.

Completely irrelevant.
What I'm trying to say is that when you look at a map, and you find Israel, then the land marked as Israel, is actually Israel. And nobody can dispute that.
No matter how hateful a person is towards Israel, Israel is here. Deal with it

 

[georgephillip]

Anybody who thinks Israel is actually Palestine is delusional..its really that simple

Source: The Avalon Project : Jordanian-Israeli General Armistice Agreement, April 3, 1949



The term "in Palestine" is used regularly in all of the armistice agreements. The term "in Israel" is completely absent.

(d) In the sector from a point on the Dead Sea (MR 1925-0958) to the southernmost tip of Palestine, the Armistice Demarcation Line shall be determined by...

That agreement, that Israel signed, calls that territory Palestine. Before the ink was dry, Israel started calling that land Israel.

This proves an old adage to be true: Tell a lie often enough and people will believe it.

Completely irrelevant.
What I'm trying to say is that when you look at a map, and you find Israel, then the land marked as Israel, is actually Israel. And nobody can dispute that.
No matter how hateful a person is towards Israel, Israel is here. Deal with it

Which Israel and which maps are you talking about?
The maps of "Israel" devoid of any Green Lines?
If so, you are talking about an Israel that's sovereign from the River to the sea.
Is that the "Israel" you believe exists?

 

[Kondor3]

"...you are talking about an Israel that's sovereign from the River to the sea. Is that the "Israel" you believe exists?"

My guess is that nobody believes that Israel exists in such a monolithic state, yet, however...

That is the Israel which we will probably see in or lifetimes, as the net continues to tighten, and the remaining Palestinians are squeezed off their last few scraps of land, and scattered into Jordan and Lebanon and the rest...

Palestinians with the means to do so are better off packing-up and moving to another country now, before the worst of the squeezing and evictions and deportations begin...

Israel cannot exist with the Palestinians in their midst as a large bloc of population, so the remaining Palestinians will be forced to move someplace else...

The world will put up a squawk for all of about 10 seconds, then breathe a sign of relief after six or seven decades of this shit, begin to forget about it at the speed of light, and move on with more important things...

Consolidations and mop-up operations continue...

 

[Hoffstra]

Does South Africa still steal black peoples' land and just give it away to whites?

Nope.

But Israel does steal Arab land and simply give it to Jews.

 

[Kondor3]

Does South Africa still steal black peoples' land and just give it away to whites? Nope. But Israel does steal Arab land and simply give it to Jews.

You don't know much about the history of Apartheid in South Africa, do you?

In the case of the Jews, you may consider it the spoils of victory in war, and forcing an antagonistic native contingent away rather than just slaughtering them.

Perhaps the Muslim-Arabs of the so-called Occupied Territories should not have opposed Israel back in 1948 and afterwards...

They chose sides poorly...

And now they (and their descendants) are dealing with the consequences of their bad decision...

Nations and Peoples steal land all the time.

Victory on the battlefield tends to settle disputes over land-title.

Besides, the Arabs stole it from somebody else a few hundred years ago, anyway.

It's simply their turn in the barrel.

Heck, the Arabs have that entire big sandbox to play in...

The least they can do is let the little poor kid down the block who goes to a different church, to have a little scoop of sand of their own that really won't be missed anyway, and to move-over just a skosh, to make room...

 

[Trajan]

"The question is not 'Is Israel the same as South Africa?'
It is 'do Israel's actions meet the international definition of what apartheid is?'

The crime of apartheid is defined by the 2002 Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court as inhumane acts of a character similar to other crimes against humanity 'committed in the context of an institutionalized regime of systematic oppression and domination by one racial group over any other racial group or groups and committed with the intention of maintaining that regime.'"

A couple of other relevant questions include did Israel sign the 2002 Rome Statute, if not;why not, and does it even matter?

Is Israel an Apartheid State?

Is Israel the Same as South Africa?

No.

Next?

 

[Hoffstra]

You don't know much about the history of Apartheid in South Africa, do you?

In the case of the Jews, you may consider it the spoils of victory in war, and forcing an antagonistic native contingent away rather than just slaughtering them.

Perhaps the Muslim-Arabs of the so-called Occupied Territories should not have opposed Israel back in 1948 and afterwards...

They chose sides poorly...

And now they (and their descendants) are dealing with the consequences of their bad decision...

Nations and Peoples steal land all the time.

Victory on the battlefield tends to settle disputes over land-title.

Besides, the Arabs stole it from somebody else a few hundred years ago, anyway.

It's simply their turn in the barrel.

translation: Yes, Israel is just like Apartheid South Africa, and its all good!!!!!

and btw, if its ok for Israel to do what its doing to the Arabs, then Israel must also accept the consequences of such actions.

 

[Kondor3]

"...translation: Yes, Israel is just like Apartheid South Africa, and its all good!!!!!..."

Nope. Very few similarities, actually. Palestinians are not Israeli citizens and are living in largely autonomous areas that are slowing being reduced in size to force them elsewhere.

"...if its ok for Israel to do what its doing to the Arabs, then Israel must also accept the consequences of such actions."

Bahhhhhh... suicide bombings and rocket attacks that are more pussy than balls... and, of course, when things get out of hand, the IDF just sends in the tanks and planes and troops, to burn-out the nest-of-vipers du jour.

They've been at this for decades but they're nearly done now and none of us will have to worry about this within the next 20 years or so.

 

[georgephillip]

"...you are talking about an Israel that's sovereign from the River to the sea. Is that the "Israel" you believe exists?"

My guess is that nobody believes that Israel exists in such a monolithic state, yet, however...

That is the Israel which we will probably see in or lifetimes, as the net continues to tighten, and the remaining Palestinians are squeezed off their last few scraps of land, and scattered into Jordan and Lebanon and the rest...

Palestinians with the means to do so are better off packing-up and moving to another country now, before the worst of the squeezing and evictions and deportations begin...

Israel cannot exist with the Palestinians in their midst as a large bloc of population, so the remaining Palestinians will be forced to move someplace else...

The world will put up a squawk for all of about 10 seconds, then breathe a sign of relief after six or seven decades of this shit, begin to forget about it at the speed of light, and move on with more important things...

Consolidations and mop-up operations continue...

Really?

"According to Israel's Central Bureau of Statistics, as of May 2006, of Israel's 7 million people, 77% were Jews, 18.5% Arabs, and 4.3% 'others'..."

"According to Palestinian evaluations, The West Bank is inhabited by approximately 2.4 million Palestinians and the Gaza Strip by another 1.4 million. According to a study presented at The Sixth Herzliya Conference on The Balance of Israel's National Security[65] there are 1.4 million Palestinians in the West Bank.

"This study was criticised by demographer Sergio DellaPergola, who estimated 3.33 million Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip combined at the end of 2005.[66]

"According to these Israeli and Palestinian estimates, the population in Israel and the Palestinian Territories stands at 9.8–10.8 million."

Roughly equal numbers of Jews and Arabs currently live under Jewish civil and military laws between the River and the sea. Arab birthrates outpace Jewish rates of reproduction.
Maybe Jews should call up Samson and his Shit?

Demographics of Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Hoffstra]

Nope. Very few similarities, actually. Palestinians are not Israeli citizens and are living in largely autonomous areas that are slowing being reduced in size to force them elsewhere....

yes, its called ethnic cleansing.

Milosevic would be proud of Israel.

 

[Kondor3]

"...birthrates..."

Birthrates?

Really?

What-in-the-world leads you to believe that the Palestinians will be allowed to REMAIN in the West Bank and Gaza long enough to overwhelm the Jews by sheer numbers?

Never gonna happen.

They'll be kicked-out by force long before that happens.

And the world won't lift a finger, as the Palestinians are scattered and neutralized.

As a matter of fact, most of the rest of the world will breathe a sigh of relief that it's finally over.

They won't be killed... they'll just be quickly and decisively overwhelmed by the IDF...

Then evicted and deported; put on the road to Amman and Beirut and Damascus and the like...

Luggage on top, kids in the back seat, with some Israeli compensation money in their pockets for their trouble, destination: new and happier lives...

Those who aren't smart enough to 'get out of Dodge' before that happens, anyway...

And the world will forget all about it with blinding speed.

 

[Hoffstra]

Birthrates?

Really?

What-in-the-world leads you to believe that the Palestinians will be allowed to REMAIN in the West Bank and Gaza long enough to overwhelm the Jews by sheer numbers?

Never gonna happen...

when you and other Uber-Zionists make statements like this, I suddenly lose enough tears to cry over terrorist attacks against Israel.

 

[Kondor3]

Nope. Very few similarities, actually. Palestinians are not Israeli citizens and are living in largely autonomous areas that are slowing being reduced in size to force them elsewhere....

yes, its called ethnic cleansing.

Consider it both retaliatory and preemptive in nature.

The Arabs (including the Palestinians) have repeatedly threatened to clear the land of Jews and to drown them in the Mediterranean...

If that's not ethnic cleansing, I don't know what is...

But the Palestinians lost their bid for a viable State, so they never got the chance to put into practice what their mouths salivate about and what their minds fantasize about doing...

For the Jews of Israel, it's an "Us or Them" choice.

They chose "us" - from their perspective - big surprise.

Under identical circumstances, most of us would make the same choice.

I would rather that my enemy and his family be driven from the land into exile and forced to begin new lives someplace else, then lie down and wait for me-and-mine to be slaughtered and drowned and enslaved and scattered.

Good on the Jews... after centuries of oppression, they finally found their backbone as a People again... and man-oh-man, have they been kicking some major ass; most excellently.