Is this a fair representative of Christianity?

[irosie91]

I will share this again since it likely got buried in Rosie's tantrum where she picked out dancing on a balcony which WAS NOT the major point of this post. As I said before people pick their own agenda so they can call attention to themselves off the thread topic.

Please allow me to share:

If Christian people want to attract others to their faith be an attraction for it. How many people want to be a part of a church that does nothing but tell people God is going to beat their brains out? A good number of people have been disillusioned with Christianity not because of Christ but because of people who claim they are acting on His behalf. Many Christians have lost or never had a passion for God nor sought God in how to use the grace (gift) He has given them to minister to people. I am just now realizing that my unique gift is my wit and humor and it brings me joy as well as ministering to others. I have excuses to be downtrodden but I walk through the valley of the shadow of death I don't set up and build a house there. Let me illustrate an example of someone who set many on fire with his passion...

This man had a passion and fire so strong it was infectious. Even if one didn't care about his cause some wished they could just be around him for a vapor of time so that it would rub off on them. He drew people to his cause and changed many people's mind about the way in which certain species in nature were perceived. Am I talking about Paul? Jesus? David? No...I am describing Steve Irwin. This type of passion he had was so hot that if you were in the distance of his shadow it got all over you. Some didn't like him but no one can deny that he didn't believe in his cause.

That is the type of passion that Jesus has called Christians to have. Did people make fun of Steve? Sure but he never let that criticism touch him. Like David danced before the Lord on his balcony unashamed and full of passion for God, Steve acted in that same manner toward the world. Do I love crocs and want to kiss them on the nose? No but I respect their majesty in a new way because he shared his passion for them and when I see a croc on a nature show I always think of him and remember his teaching. People may not always remember what you look like or your name but they will remember your passion and your message if your spirit is on fire for the Lord.

I really can't tell if your version of on fire for Jesus is sexual or not.

I'm just grateful that so many agree that kgrill is not a Christian role model.

why would Christians want to "attract people to their faith"----empire building?
IMPERIALISM. There are religions that DON't DO THAT

 

[TrinityPower]

 

[ChrisL]

TrinityPower and BluePhantom ~ I think that you two are very nice Christians and people. I understand what you mean, Trinity. That a lot of the hatred displayed by some of the Christians turns people off to the religion and that you feel if you make religion more enticing and welcoming and concentrate on the good things instead of the "evil" and "demons" and things (like referring to people like that, I mean), more people would be interested in joining you. While I don't necessarily agree with your religious beliefs, I do respect you as a person and I know what you mean and agree with that. So your words aren't wasted.

 

[TrinityPower]

Sometimes the only Jesus people see is the Jesus in you and the Jesus in me
Everyone that you come into contact with should see the light of Christ in your life, but you don’t have to preach down their necks to do it. You can get more people saved with a smile than you ever could with a frown, because actions speak louder than words. Jesus said, “Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in Heaven” (Matthew 5:16). It’s not always what you say, but how you act and the good works that you do that shine a bright light for God.
Jesse Duplantis

 

[Derideo_Te]

Can one expect a non-Christian to understand without enlightenment? No.

Really?

All non-Christians lack enlightenment?

No wonder Ghandi was so unimpressed by all of the "enlightened" Christians who were screwing life up for tens of millions of devout Hindus.

Considering he based his entire non violent movement on the teachings of Jesus Christ that these "enlightened" christians taught I think he would be rather vocal in pointing out that your attempts to make it look like he didn't like christians. In fact he would probably encourage you to listen to the Christians you attack so often and take the good they have and use it in your own life.

No, Ghandi told Christians to take their own advice and actually put it into practice if they expect others to embrace their religion.

The problem with "Christians" is two-fold:

(1) Many aren't
(2) Many don't act like it

We recently had to leave our church because my husband went to our (former) Pastor and he (the Pastor) copped attitude with him, said and acted in a VERY un-Christian like manner (unprovoked) -- this, in addition to not being there for us in time of need. That doesn't change my love for God. God is perfect.

Our former Pastor is not.

Therein lies the reason why I draw a distinction between those who belong to a religion versus those who are genuine believers in a God.

While it is indisputable that good does come from all religions the harm outweighs the good IMO. Yes, that is my personal opinion and no, I am not going to debate it.

Religion was a major reason why I became an atheist. Way too many people doing things in the name of God that no sane God would ever condone and if he was condoning it then I wanted nothing whatsoever to do with that God.

So Gandhi was right, Christians are not likeable and as a result Christianity suffers because it's adherents fail to call out and discipline those that give it a bad name.

Yes, Christians are responsible for disavowing what is done in their name. The pathetic excuse of "we are all sinners but we are forgiven" is so puerile as to be barf inducing. You are adults, act like them, take responsibility and hold the miscreants in your midst accountable.

 

[Bonzi]

Can one expect a non-Christian to understand without enlightenment? No.

Really?

All non-Christians lack enlightenment?

No wonder Ghandi was so unimpressed by all of the "enlightened" Christians who were screwing life up for tens of millions of devout Hindus.

Considering he based his entire non violent movement on the teachings of Jesus Christ that these "enlightened" christians taught I think he would be rather vocal in pointing out that your attempts to make it look like he didn't like christians. In fact he would probably encourage you to listen to the Christians you attack so often and take the good they have and use it in your own life.

No, Ghandi told Christians to take their own advice and actually put it into practice if they expect others to embrace their religion.

The problem with "Christians" is two-fold:

(1) Many aren't
(2) Many don't act like it

We recently had to leave our church because my husband went to our (former) Pastor and he (the Pastor) copped attitude with him, said and acted in a VERY un-Christian like manner (unprovoked) -- this, in addition to not being there for us in time of need. That doesn't change my love for God. God is perfect.

Our former Pastor is not.

Therein lies the reason why I draw a distinction between those who belong to a religion versus those who are genuine believers in a God.

While it is indisputable that good does come from all religions the harm outweighs the good IMO. Yes, that is my personal opinion and no, I am not going to debate it.

Religion was a major reason why I became an atheist. Way too many people doing things in the name of God that no sane God would ever condone and if he was condoning it then I wanted nothing whatsoever to do with that God.

So Gandhi was right, Christians are not likeable and as a result Christianity suffers because it's adherents fail to call out and discipline those that give it a bad name.

Yes, Christians are responsible for disavowing what is done in their name. The pathetic excuse of "we are all sinners but we are forgiven" is so puerile as to be barf inducing. You are adults, act like them, take responsibility and hold the miscreants in your midst accountable.

God is perfect, we are not.
Christians or not.
There are non-Christians who live more "Christian like lives" but, ultimately, it is not WORKS that get you to heaven but BELIEF, FAITH and SUBMISSION.

People have a hard time accepting that you can get something without EARNING it.

 

[aris2chat]

Really?

All non-Christians lack enlightenment?

No wonder Ghandi was so unimpressed by all of the "enlightened" Christians who were screwing life up for tens of millions of devout Hindus.

Considering he based his entire non violent movement on the teachings of Jesus Christ that these "enlightened" christians taught I think he would be rather vocal in pointing out that your attempts to make it look like he didn't like christians. In fact he would probably encourage you to listen to the Christians you attack so often and take the good they have and use it in your own life.

No, Ghandi told Christians to take their own advice and actually put it into practice if they expect others to embrace their religion.

The problem with "Christians" is two-fold:

(1) Many aren't
(2) Many don't act like it

We recently had to leave our church because my husband went to our (former) Pastor and he (the Pastor) copped attitude with him, said and acted in a VERY un-Christian like manner (unprovoked) -- this, in addition to not being there for us in time of need. That doesn't change my love for God. God is perfect.

Our former Pastor is not.

Therein lies the reason why I draw a distinction between those who belong to a religion versus those who are genuine believers in a God.

While it is indisputable that good does come from all religions the harm outweighs the good IMO. Yes, that is my personal opinion and no, I am not going to debate it.

Religion was a major reason why I became an atheist. Way too many people doing things in the name of God that no sane God would ever condone and if he was condoning it then I wanted nothing whatsoever to do with that God.

So Gandhi was right, Christians are not likeable and as a result Christianity suffers because it's adherents fail to call out and discipline those that give it a bad name.

Yes, Christians are responsible for disavowing what is done in their name. The pathetic excuse of "we are all sinners but we are forgiven" is so puerile as to be barf inducing. You are adults, act like them, take responsibility and hold the miscreants in your midst accountable.

God is perfect, we are not.
Christians or not.
There are non-Christians who live more "Christian like lives" but, ultimately, it is not WORKS that get you to heaven but BELIEF, FAITH and SUBMISSION.

People have a hard time accepting that you can get something without EARNING it.

God of the bible is not perfect.

humans are not supposed to be perfect, no life form is.

 

[BluePhantom]

So Gandhi was right, Christians are not likeable and as a result Christianity suffers because it's adherents fail to call out and discipline those that give it a bad name..

What do you think we have been doing on this entire thread? Yeah we can call out Koshergrl and those like her for being bad ambassadors of faith and generally acting like a douchebag, but there's nothing I can do to stop Koshergrl and those like her from being a dick.

 

[presonorek]

God of the bible is not perfect.

humans are not supposed to be perfect, no life form is.

I'd love to have a discussion about this topic in the philosophy forum.

I can spell my name perfectly every time. If the standard is low enough then perfection can be obtained by any creature. If a person is disciplined enough he can heighten these standards and eventually reach perfection.

Have you ever heard the concept of mastering a trade? Anyways, this is something for the philosophy forum.

 

[Derideo_Te]

There are non-Christians who live more "Christian like lives" but, ultimately, it is not WORKS that get you to heaven but BELIEF, FAITH and SUBMISSION.

People have a hard time accepting that you can get something without EARNING it.

And yet that is exactly what you are proposing.

An atheist like me who doesn't buy into the snake oil goes to hell because he never kissed the ring of your God in spite of living a more "Christian like life" than KG who does get to spend eternity in heaven even though she has done nothing at all to "earn it"?

Then again from my perspective I won't have to put up with scumbags like her in hell while you will have to put up with her in heaven for all eternity.

Why does that sound like I am getting the better deal?

 

[Bonzi]

And yet that is exactly what you are proposing.

An atheist like me who doesn't buy into the snake oil goes to hell because he never kissed the ring of your God in spite of living a more "Christian like life" than KG who does get to spend eternity in heaven even though she has done nothing at all to "earn it"?

Then again from my perspective I won't have to put up with scumbags like her in hell while you will have to put up with her in heaven for all eternity.

Why does that sound like I am getting the better deal?

What exactly do you think it is that I am proposing?

You don't have to believe the truth. Your option.

So, you believe in a heaven and a hell? (as an atheist, that is unusual.....)

 

[Derideo_Te]

So Gandhi was right, Christians are not likeable and as a result Christianity suffers because it's adherents fail to call out and discipline those that give it a bad name..

What do you think we have been doing on this entire thread? Yeah we can call out Koshergrl and those like her for being bad ambassadors of faith and generally acting like a douchebag, but there's nothing I can do to stop Koshergrl and those like her from being a dick.

I agree you can't stop her and that I not what I am asking you to do.

What you are doing in this thread is a bandaid IMO. Salving your conscience in an obscure thread on a message board with a couple of thousand readers at most is hardly the same thing as publicly denouncing people like her to the entire world.

Where are the genuine Christians denouncing those who are advocating hatred for gays? Who is the voice of Christianity speaking for Jesus and recognizing that we are all equal under the law and under the eyes of your God?

Or are you saying that under your God's eyes there is no equality and that KG and her vile ilk are right about gays?

 

[Bonzi]

Where are the genuine Christians denouncing those who are advocating hatred for gays? Who is the voice of Christianity speaking for Jesus and recognizing that we are all equal under the law and under the eyes of your God?

I don't advocate hatred for any person.
I do advocate hatred for sin, however.
One is a person; another is an action. An action does not equal a person.

 

[Derideo_Te]

And yet that is exactly what you are proposing.

An atheist like me who doesn't buy into the snake oil goes to hell because he never kissed the ring of your God in spite of living a more "Christian like life" than KG who does get to spend eternity in heaven even though she has done nothing at all to "earn it"?

Then again from my perspective I won't have to put up with scumbags like her in hell while you will have to put up with her in heaven for all eternity.

Why does that sound like I am getting the better deal?

What exactly do you think it is that I am proposing?

You don't have to believe the truth. Your option.

So, you believe in a heaven and a hell? (as an atheist, that is unusual.....)

No, I don't. I am using your own beliefs to expose their fallacy.

You are proposing, from what I have gathered so far, that someone can be a KG their entire life and still end up in heaven because they signed on the dotted line for your religion.

Is that not what you are saying?

 

[Derideo_Te]

Where are the genuine Christians denouncing those who are advocating hatred for gays? Who is the voice of Christianity speaking for Jesus and recognizing that we are all equal under the law and under the eyes of your God?

I don't advocate hatred for any person.
I do advocate hatred for sin, however.
One is a person; another is an action. An action does not equal a person.

Gotta LOL at the "love the sinner while hating the sin" paradox.

Essentially you are advocating hating love!

Just because a gay person loves someone of the same sex you hate their love for that person while pretending that you love the gay person at the same time.

Is it any wonder that atheists like myself don't want anything at all to do with that kind of cognitive dissonance?

What is more defining of a person than the love they give to others?

If your "love" is conditional then it isn't love.

 

[Bonzi]

No, I don't. I am using your own beliefs to expose their fallacy.

You are proposing, from what I have gathered so far, that someone can be a KG their entire life and still end up in heaven because they signed on the dotted line for your religion.

Is that not what you are saying?

What I am saying is that if you truly give your live over to God, acknowledging his sacrifice for your sins, and begin to live for him, you will have everlasting life with Him.

It's about your heart. Not your actions.

 

[Bonzi]

Gotta LOL at the "love the sinner while hating the sin" paradox.

Essentially you are advocating hating love!

Just because a gay person loves someone of the same sex you hate their love for that person while pretending that you love the gay person at the same time.

Is it any wonder that atheists like myself don't want anything at all to do with that kind of cognitive dissonance?

What is more defining of a person than the love they give to others?

If your "love" is conditional then it isn't love.

I hate my sins. But I don't hate myself.
What is your definition of "love"?
As a Christian, you love God most. It's above anyone you would love on this earth, even your children.

Athiests don't want anything to do with God because they want it their own way.
They think their way is better than God's.

God's love is not conditional. We as human's, however, are fallible.
I seriously doubt any human being is capable of 100% unconditional love.
I have gay family members I love deeply. Because I don't agree with or approve of their lifestyle doesn't mean I don't love them.

 

[aris2chat]

God of the bible is not perfect.

humans are not supposed to be perfect, no life form is.

I'd love to have a discussion about this topic in the philosophy forum.

I can spell my name perfectly every time. If the standard is low enough then perfection can be obtained by any creature. If a person is disciplined enough he can heighten these standards and eventually reach perfection.

Have you ever heard the concept of mastering a trade? Anyways, this is something for the philosophy forum.

Every life has some flaw.

Why should the criteria for some magical after life be perfection or hell? Even if humans try to live a 'perfect' life, we are not always thinking imperfect thoughts. Even the youngest children have the instinct to lie rather than admit fault. We are always pushing the limits of our lives and rules. We instinctively fight against controls.
Animals are not content to be caged, humans are caged by rules and authority not just walls and fences. Even single cells and bacteria fight and evolve. They kill and destroy to survive.
The very fact that we are frail and die is an imperfection. The mind and body fail us and we fight and curse and rage against our deaths, and we loose.
Even the planet and sun will eventually die.
There is no perfection or the need to exist would have no meaning. If there was such a thing as a perfect god, the boredom alone would make him want to kill himself.
We marvel at the logic and 'perfection' of the laws of science but yet we try to overcome them and alter them.
No there is no perfection, and if there was we would try to change that too.

 

[aris2chat]

Gotta LOL at the "love the sinner while hating the sin" paradox.

Essentially you are advocating hating love!

Just because a gay person loves someone of the same sex you hate their love for that person while pretending that you love the gay person at the same time.

Is it any wonder that atheists like myself don't want anything at all to do with that kind of cognitive dissonance?

What is more defining of a person than the love they give to others?

If your "love" is conditional then it isn't love.

I hate my sins. But I don't hate myself.
What is your definition of "love"?
As a Christian, you love God most. It's above anyone you would love on this earth, even your children.

Athiests don't want anything to do with God because they want it their own way.
They think their way is better than God's.

God's love is not conditional. We as human's, however, are fallible.
I seriously doubt any human being is capable of 100% unconditional love.
I have gay family members I love deeply. Because I don't agree with or approve of their lifestyle doesn't mean I don't love them.

It is not a life choice, it is the way they were created before birth. Shame on you for not approving of them.
If you believe in god, then you should accept your family as god created them.

 

[Bonzi]

Gotta LOL at the "love the sinner while hating the sin" paradox.

Essentially you are advocating hating love!

Just because a gay person loves someone of the same sex you hate their love for that person while pretending that you love the gay person at the same time.

Is it any wonder that atheists like myself don't want anything at all to do with that kind of cognitive dissonance?

What is more defining of a person than the love they give to others?

If your "love" is conditional then it isn't love.

I hate my sins. But I don't hate myself.
What is your definition of "love"?
As a Christian, you love God most. It's above anyone you would love on this earth, even your children.

Athiests don't want anything to do with God because they want it their own way.
They think their way is better than God's.

God's love is not conditional. We as human's, however, are fallible.
I seriously doubt any human being is capable of 100% unconditional love.
I have gay family members I love deeply. Because I don't agree with or approve of their lifestyle doesn't mean I don't love them.

It is not a life choice, it is the way they were created before birth. Shame on you for not approving of them.
If you believe in god, then you should accept your family as god created them.

God created us to be His companions, and, gave us free will.
We chose to go our own way and that is why there is sin in the world.
We all sin. Acting on your homosexual desires (whether or not they are inborn or not) is sinful.
I don't approve of what a lot of my family members to, I even DISAPPROVE of things I do myself!
Again, love and acceptance of someone doesn't mean you have to agree with everything they do.
If you are a Christian, you should want to deny yourself your earthly desires and be obedient to him.
If you are not a Christian, and choose your own rules and your own way, I think you are not making a wise choice, nor a healthy one, yet, it is your choice indeed!