Israel To Make Dramatic Decisions

[Sweet_Caroline]

For Hoffstra and anyone who cares to know more about the legality
of the Jewish people's right to the land known as the 'West Bank.'...

yeah, and the Jewish peoples' right to settle Palestine is contingent upon their respect and honoring of non-Jewish civil and human rights!!!!!!!!!!!

its in the Balfour Declaration, San Remo Conference, and Palestine Mandate.

you can't run away from this fact, Glick!!

Which they do. I am not running away from anything. The Jews have the right to all the land granted to them in 1922. Get yourself acquainted with the subject before you keep spouting off a load of nonsense.

 

[Hoffstra]

Again I refer you to the post above your Hoffstra. Israel is entitled to the land and any laws that violate that are illegal. I would advise you to read Howard Grief's book if you want to know more about the allocation of land.

Wrong again, Glick.

The Jews have the right to settle the land between the Jordan River and the Sea.........conditional upon they respect the civil and human rights of non-Jews in those areas.

Israel daily violates the civil and human rights of non-Jews in thos areas.

 

[Hoffstra]

Which they do. I am not running away from anything. The Jews have the right to all the land granted to them in 1922. Get yourself acquainted with the subject before you keep spouting off a load of nonsense.

why are you ignoring the daily attacks upon the civil and human rights of non-Jews in Palestine, at the hands of the Jews?

these attacks violate the conditions of the Balfour Declaration, San Remo Conference, and the Palestine Mandate.

The right of the Jews to settle Palestine is CONDITIONAL upon their respecting the civil and human rights of non-Jews in Palestine.

The Jews have violated that condition.

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

Again I refer you to the post above your Hoffstra. Israel is entitled to the land and any laws that violate that are illegal. I would advise you to read Howard Grief's book if you want to know more about the allocation of land.

Wrong again, Glick.

The Jews have the right to settle the land between the Jordan River and the Sea.........conditional upon they respect the civil and human rights of non-Jews in those areas.

Israel daily violates the civil and human rights of non-Jews in thos areas.

No, it doesn't. You need again to get yourself knowledgeable on the facts on the ground and not spout off lies about the subject.

 

[Hoffstra]

San Remo Conference:

(a) To accept the terms of the Mandates Article as given below with reference to Palestine, on the understanding that there was inserted in the process-verbal an undertaking by the Mandatory Power that this would not involve the surrender of the rights hitherto enjoyed by the non-Jewish communities in Palestine; this undertaking not to refer to the question of the religious protectorate of France, which had been settled earlier in the previous afternoon by the undertaking given by the French Government that they recognized this protectorate as being at an end.

(b) that the terms of the Mandates Article should be as follows:

The High Contracting Parties agree that Syria and Mesopotamia shall, in accordance with the fourth paragraph of Article 22, Part I (Covenant of the League of Nations), be provisionally recognized as independent States, subject to the rendering of administrative advice and assistance by a mandatory until such time as they are able to stand alone. The boundaries of the said States will be determined, and the selection of the Mandatories made, by the Principal Allied Powers.

The High Contracting Parties agree to entrust, by application of the provisions of Article 22, the administration of Palestine, within such boundaries as may be determined by the Principal Allied Powers, to a Mandatory, to be selected by the said Powers. The Mandatory will be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 8, 1917, by the British Government, and adopted by the other Allied Powers, in favour of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country.


Balfour Declaration:

His Majesty's government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country

Mandate for Palestine:

Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917, by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favour of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country


The Allies made it clear again and again, that the Jews may settle Palestine to make their own country as long as they do NOT discriminate against the rights of non-Jews.

The Allies considered this condition so important that they included this condition in every document they issued dealing with Jewish settlement in Palestine!!!!

 

[Hoffstra]

No, it doesn't. You need again to get yourself knowledgeable on the facts on the ground and not spout off lies about the subject.

Glick, with all do respect, you madam are a liar.

Israel demolishes Palestinian homes and buildings that have no Israeli building permits, while at the same time allows retro-active building permits for Jewish settlements.

Israel builds walls and fences that disproportionately disadvantage Arabs over Jews in the West Bank.

Israel installs roadblocks, checkpoints, curfews, work quotas, etc etc..that affect Arabs and not Jews.

This is all in clear violation of the conditions set forth in the Balfour Declaration, San Remo Conference, and Palestine Mandate.

You cannot deny this. You have lost the debate, Glick!!

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

The non-Jews have total rights within Israel. There is no discrimination. If Israel has roadblocks, you know precisely why that is. Same with all the safety and security aspects in Israel to protect its Muslim, Druze, and Jewish citizens. Israeli Jews are under attack daily. What do you want Israel to do? Not protect its citizens?

 

[Hoffstra]

The non-Jews have total rights within Israel. There is no discrimination. If Israel has roadblocks, you know precisely why that is. Same with all the safety and security aspects in Israel to protect its Muslim, Druze, and Jewish citizens. Israeli Jews are under attack daily. What do you want Israel to do? Not protect its citizens?

bullshit, Glick.

You are lying again.

#1. Palestinians do not have the right to vote in Israeli elections even though the Israeli govt. is the ultimate decision maker in their lives.

#2. Israel gives retro-active building permits to illegally built Israeli settlements, while demolishing "illegally" built Palestinian buildings.

#3. The Israeli Supreme Court has agreed again and again, that the Israeli govt. builds fences and walls in the West Bank that discriminate against the rights of Arabs and favors Israelis. Rather than building walls and fences right along the borders of Israeli settlements, they build them into Palestinian lands and farms.

#4. Israel establishes roadblocks, curfews, checkpoints, all aimed at Palestinians and not Israelis.

None of this can be denied. This all violates the conditions of Jewish settlements set forth in the Balfour Declaration, San Remo Conference, and Mandate for Palestine.

and YOU defend it all!!!

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

The non-Jews have total rights within Israel. There is no discrimination. If Israel has roadblocks, you know precisely why that is. Same with all the safety and security aspects in Israel to protect its Muslim, Druze, and Jewish citizens. Israeli Jews are under attack daily. What do you want Israel to do? Not protect its citizens?

bullshit, Glick.

You are lying again.

#1. Palestinians do not have the right to vote in Israeli elections even though the Israeli govt. is the ultimate decision maker in their lives.

#2. Israel gives retro-active building permits to illegally built Israeli settlements, while demolishing "illegally" built Palestinian buildings.

#3. The Israeli Supreme Court has agreed again and again, that the Israeli govt. builds fences and walls in the West Bank that discriminate against the rights of Arabs and favors Israelis. Rather than building walls and fences right along the borders of Israeli settlements, they build them into Palestinian lands and farms.

#4. Israel establishes roadblocks, curfews, checkpoints, all aimed at Palestinians and not Israelis.

None of this can be denied. This all violates the conditions of Jewish settlements set forth in the Balfour Declaration, San Remo Conference, and Mandate for Palestine.

and YOU defend it all!!!

You need to provide substantial links.

 

[Hoffstra]

You need to provide substantial links.

first you defend ALL of these actions and now you demand evidence that they actually exist???

come on Glick, you have more integrity than this.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

Article 80 protects the rights of Jews to the land from the Jordan River to the Sea. Please read the link I showed you above. The word Mandate certainly seems to confuse you and others on here all too quick to run down Israel.

hey dumbass Glick, San Remo Conference also compels Israel to protect & respect the rights and freedoms of non-Jews between the River and the Sea.

Israel violates these rights and freedoms daily, by setting up roadblocks, creating embargos, discriminatory application of the need for building permits, building demolitions, building fences and walls that favor Jews over Arabs, etc etc.

You can't win this debate, Glick. You've lost.

dumbass? Um, what have you said about personal insults?

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

You need to provide substantial links.

first you defend ALL of these actions and now you demand evidence that they actually exist???

come on Glick, you have more integrity than this.

After your insults, twisting and turning you accuse me of not having integrity?

 

[Hoffstra]

After your insults, twisting and turning you accuse me of not having integrity?

yes Glick, demanding evidence for facts that you yourself defend and excuse, shows no integrity.

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

After your insults, twisting and turning you accuse me of not having integrity?

yes Glick, demanding evidence for facts that you yourself defend and excuse, shows no integrity.

Well, does that mean you are not going to show the forum the facts to support your outrageous claims then?

 

[Hoffstra]

Well, does that mean you are not going to show the forum the facts to support your outrageous claims then?

you want to see evidence that Israel sets up roadbocks and checkpoints in the West Bank, for Palestinians?

you want to see evidence that Israel demolishes Palestinian housing while giving retro-active building permits to Jewish housing??

you want to see evidence that Israel builds the Hafrada Barrier in ways that hurts Arabs more than Jews?

jeez Glick, next you'll demand evidence that there are millions of non-Jews in the West Bank.

 

[Sweet_Caroline]

Well, does that mean you are not going to show the forum the facts to support your outrageous claims then?

you want to see evidence that Israel sets up roadbocks and checkpoints in the West Bank, for Palestinians?

you want to see evidence that Israel demolishes Palestinian housing while giving retro-active building permits to Jewish housing??

you want to see evidence that Israel builds the Hafrada Barrier in ways that hurts Arabs more than Jews?

jeez Glick, next you'll demand evidence that there are millions of non-Jews in the West Bank.

Links?

 

[Hossfly]

Article 80 protects the rights of Jews to the land from the Jordan River to the Sea. Please read the link I showed you above. The word Mandate certainly seems to confuse you and others on here all too quick to run down Israel.

hey dumbass Glick, San Remo Conference also compels Israel to protect & respect the rights and freedoms of non-Jews between the River and the Sea.

Israel violates these rights and freedoms daily, by setting up roadblocks, creating embargos, discriminatory application of the need for building permits, building demolitions, building fences and walls that favor Jews over Arabs, etc etc.

You can't win this debate, Glick. You've lost.

dumbass? Um, what have you said about personal insults?

It is just Hoffstra trying out her comedy act. It appears that she is jealous of the columnist Caroline Glick because Caroline Glick has a huge audience and Hoffstra just has the forums. Perhaps if she were more clever and intelligent, she too would have a following in the world. I am sure the viewers are intelligent enough, though, to see through her and realize that it is the same old, same old stuff we have seen from the pro Palistinians posters for years on end. They all seem to use the same handbook. It's a shame that they aren't capable at least of throwing in a few good jokes along with the old stuff.

 

[toastman]

Anyone else find it ironic that Hoffy accuses others of trolling, but in fact he himself is a massive troll? Then he uses insults while complaining about other insulting him?
What is it with pro - Palestinians and accusing others of what they are CLEARLY guilty of ??? I just don't get it

 

[Hossfly]

Anyone else find it ironic that Hoffy accuses others of trolling, but in fact he himself is a massive troll? Then he uses insults while complaining about other insulting him?
What is it with pro - Palestinians and accusing others of what they are CLEARLY guilty of ??? I just don't get it

T-U-R-N-S-P-E-A-K. It's become a genetic trait, poor devils.

 

[RoccoR]

Hoffstra, et al,

This is sort of a Catch 22 discussion.

For Hoffstra and anyone who cares to know more about the legality
of the Jewish people's right to the land known as the 'West Bank.'...

yeah, and the Jewish peoples' right to settle Palestine is contingent upon their respect and honoring of non-Jewish civil and human rights!!!!!!!!!!!

its in the Balfour Declaration, San Remo Conference, and Palestine Mandate.

you can't run away from this fact, XXXXX

(COMMENT)

Yes, there are several written and moral commands that make it imperative that the civil and religious rights of the non-Jewish communities in Palestine (primarily the Arab Palestinian), as well as, the the consummation of their national aspirations, be protected. There is no question on this matter. It was understood by the UN Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) that presented the recommendations for the Partition Plan (1947) and each of the preceding responsible action agents and authorities going back to the agreement between HRH the Emir Faisal bin Hussein bin Ali al-Hashimi, representing and acting on behalf of the Arab Kingdom of HEJAZ, and Dr Chaim Weizmann, who represented and acted on behalf of the Zionist Organization. I don't think anyone disputes this. From the very beginning, both the Arab leadership and the Zionist leadership understood that there were to be "protections in place," and "nation aspirations" to be balanced.

The struggle, which has culminated into the situation today, didn't just happen all at once. Clearly there was a gradual breakdown in the communication between the Arab community and the Jewish community. As HAMAS points out, this started in the anti-Zionist Movement with "the emergence of the Islamic Martyr Izz al-Din al Kissam" (sic) (1882 – 20 November 1935 of Jableh, Vilayet of Syria), and escalated out of control.

The issue of Israeli Roadblock and checkpoints, did not happen overnight with the 1967 Occupation. These barriers started in the 1990's. And the Security Barrier (The Wall) construction did not begin until the year 2000. There were 25 major terrorist attacks alone between the Oslo Accords and the stretch of Wall being approved (1994-1999)(mostly HAMAS, but a few from the Islamic Jihad). Well before the first roadblocks went up, the Palestinians had been routinely launching terrorist attacks:

• December 1971: Attempted assassination of Jordan's Ambassador to London, Zeid Al Rifai.
• February 1972: Sabotage of a West German electrical installation and a Dutch gas plant.
• May 1972: Hijacking of a Belgian Sabena airplane flying from Vienna to Tel Aviv
• March 1 1973: Attack on the Saudi Embassy in Khartoum, killing the American charge d'affaires J. Curtis Moore, the American ambassador, Cleo Noel, and the Belgian charge d'affaires, Guy Eid.

Of course the most well known of that time were: the kidnapping and killing of Israeli athletes during the 1972 Summer Olympics in Munich; the Rome and Vienna airports in December 1985, the Neve Shalom synagogue in Istanbul and the Pan Am flight 73 hijacking in Karachi in September 1986, and the City of Poros day-excursion ship attack in Greece in July 1988. And, of course, the attack of October 7, 1985, when the Palestine Liberation Front (PLF) hijacked the Italian MS Achille Lauro Liner off the coast of Egypt. All this before the first Israeli Roadblock started to appear or even before the Security Barrier was even thought out.

There must be a balance between protecting the rights of state sponsors of terrorism, and allowing the terrorist free roam --- and the security integrity of both the State of Israel and the security of the region. And the Palestinians did not care which hand they bit.

Remember, before the incremental increase in security containment:

Various clashes between the fedayeen and the army occurred between the years 1968–1970. The situation climaxed in September 1970, when several attempts to assassinate king Hussein failed. On September 7, 1970, in the series of Dawson's Field hijackings, three planes were hijacked by PFLP: a SwissAir and a TWA that were landed in Azraq area and a Pan Am that was landed in Cairo. Then on September 9, a BOAC flight from Bahrain was also hijacked to Zarqa. The PFLP announced that the hijackings were intended "to pay special attention to the Palestinian problem". After all hostages were removed, the planes were dramatically blown up in front of TV cameras.

Battles between Palestinian guerrilla forces and the Jordanian army continued during the closing months of 1970 and the first six months of 1971. In November 1971, members of the Palestinian Black September group, who took their name from the civil war, assassinated Jordanian Prime Minister Wasfi al-Tal in Cairo. In December the group made an unsuccessful attempt to assassinate the Jordanian ambassador in Britain.

SOURCE: Jordanian-Palestinian civil war

The containment of the Hostile Arab Palestinian (HoAP) not only added security to the integrity of Israeli sovereignty, but also to regional security of adjacent states.

Whether we talk about a general population that supports and defends the actions of Article 13 Jihadists (HAMAS) or Article 9 Armed Aggressors (PNC), the need to quarantine the threat was not only imperative, but now has demonstrated that is can significantly contribute to the local and regional security.

A balance between the competing issues of security containment of the HoAP, and the protection of the rights of non-HoAP that voted for one of two Palestinian political entities [Article 13 Jihadists (HAMAS) or Article 9 Armed Aggressors (PNC)] is a difficult problem. Until that time when a solution is found, like any diseased population, containment is the closest approximation.

Most Respectfully,
R