Israeli forces shoot unarmed protesters from across Gaza security fence, killing at least 15

[Shusha]

all civilians on the field of battle are the responsibility of the sovereign in control of those civilians

That is the biggest bullshit statement I have seen amoungst the rest of the bullshit statements being banded around here by Team Israel!!!

It's another point of international law.

I am intrigued though to hear what international law validates what you are saying.

Care to share a link or do you just expect us to believe every word Team Israel spouts?

No. I expect you to do your own research if you want to discuss international law. It might also be useful to read mine and Rocco's posts. They are usually pretty informative.

 

[Shusha]

I am not whining. I am just pointing out that Israel never gave gave them a chance and you are ignoring that while justifying the blockade. The blockade was not just. It went up ahead of any offensive actions towards Israel, because Israel refused to accept the results of the election. It promptly ended any possibility for peace as effectively as any violence.

The blockade IS perfectly justifiable. Whether it was a decade ago is immaterial to this discussion, though I'd argue that was then as well. Hamas was designated a terrorist organization in 2002 by Canada and 2003 by the US. Hamas stated that it would not recognize Israel, would not make peace with Israel and would not honor existing agreements and treaties with Israel. All valid reasons to institute a blockade. Not to mention the fact that Fatah and Hamas were throwing each other off buildings.

And not only that, it reeks of victim-blaming in the sense, "Its all Israel's fault -- if only they had made peace with a terrorist organization there wouldn't have been any violence". Again, its reversing cause and effect. The blockade was a REACTION to a threat to Israel.

And it doesn't explain or excuse what Hamas should be doing NOW to police its own people and prevent them from making unwarranted and belligerent attacks on Israel.

I never said it was all Israel's fault. I said that Israel instituted the blockade upon the election of Hamas. Not upon any escalation of violence but upon the results of an election they did not like . That IS collective punishment.

The situation now, of course has changed but you cannot just view it in a vacuum.Ignore the beginning when it has likely affected what is happening now.

I know you didn't say that it was Israel's fault. But it has the underlying implication of victim-blaming.

The blockade was not instituted because a new government was elected. It was instituted because that government refused to recognize Israel. Refused peace with Israel. And declared they would not comply with existing treaties.

That is part of the vacuum.

Why shouldn't Hamas be required to police its side of the border fence in order to prevent civilian deaths? Particularly when they are the instigators of the events.

 

[Coyote]

I am not whining. I am just pointing out that Israel never gave gave them a chance and you are ignoring that while justifying the blockade. The blockade was not just. It went up ahead of any offensive actions towards Israel, because Israel refused to accept the results of the election. It promptly ended any possibility for peace as effectively as any violence.

The blockade IS perfectly justifiable. Whether it was a decade ago is immaterial to this discussion, though I'd argue that was then as well. Hamas was designated a terrorist organization in 2002 by Canada and 2003 by the US. Hamas stated that it would not recognize Israel, would not make peace with Israel and would not honor existing agreements and treaties with Israel. All valid reasons to institute a blockade. Not to mention the fact that Fatah and Hamas were throwing each other off buildings.

And not only that, it reeks of victim-blaming in the sense, "Its all Israel's fault -- if only they had made peace with a terrorist organization there wouldn't have been any violence". Again, its reversing cause and effect. The blockade was a REACTION to a threat to Israel.

And it doesn't explain or excuse what Hamas should be doing NOW to police its own people and prevent them from making unwarranted and belligerent attacks on Israel.

I never said it was all Israel's fault. I said that Israel instituted the blockade upon the election of Hamas. Not upon any escalation of violence but upon the results of an election they did not like . That IS collective punishment.

The situation now, of course has changed but you cannot just view it in a vacuum.Ignore the beginning when it has likely affected what is happening now.

I know you didn't say that it was Israel's fault. But it has the underlying implication of victim-blaming.

The blockade was not instituted because a new government was elected. It was instituted because that government refused to recognize Israel. Refused peace with Israel. And declared they would not comply with existing treaties.

That is part of the vacuum.

Why shouldn't Hamas be required to police its side of the border fence in order to prevent civilian deaths? Particularly when they are the instigators of the events.

I think it would be odd to demand Hamad comply with policing what they would consider part of a hostile action against them. But we also know Hamas places little value on life and also apparently infiltrated what was a peaceful protest and ratchetted it up in violence.

 

[P F Tinmore]

I am not whining. I am just pointing out that Israel never gave gave them a chance and you are ignoring that while justifying the blockade. The blockade was not just. It went up ahead of any offensive actions towards Israel, because Israel refused to accept the results of the election. It promptly ended any possibility for peace as effectively as any violence.

The blockade IS perfectly justifiable. Whether it was a decade ago is immaterial to this discussion, though I'd argue that was then as well. Hamas was designated a terrorist organization in 2002 by Canada and 2003 by the US. Hamas stated that it would not recognize Israel, would not make peace with Israel and would not honor existing agreements and treaties with Israel. All valid reasons to institute a blockade. Not to mention the fact that Fatah and Hamas were throwing each other off buildings.

And not only that, it reeks of victim-blaming in the sense, "Its all Israel's fault -- if only they had made peace with a terrorist organization there wouldn't have been any violence". Again, its reversing cause and effect. The blockade was a REACTION to a threat to Israel.

And it doesn't explain or excuse what Hamas should be doing NOW to police its own people and prevent them from making unwarranted and belligerent attacks on Israel.

I never said it was all Israel's fault. I said that Israel instituted the blockade upon the election of Hamas. Not upon any escalation of violence but upon the results of an election they did not like . That IS collective punishment.

The situation now, of course has changed but you cannot just view it in a vacuum.Ignore the beginning when it has likely affected what is happening now.

I know you didn't say that it was Israel's fault. But it has the underlying implication of victim-blaming.

The blockade was not instituted because a new government was elected. It was instituted because that government refused to recognize Israel. Refused peace with Israel. And declared they would not comply with existing treaties.

That is part of the vacuum.

Why shouldn't Hamas be required to police its side of the border fence in order to prevent civilian deaths? Particularly when they are the instigators of the events.

I think it would be odd to demand Hamad comply with policing what they would consider part of a hostile action against them. But we also know Hamas places little value on life and also apparently infiltrated what was a peaceful protest and ratchetted it up in violence.

Is that true or is it just something Israel said?

 

[Indeependent]

I am not whining. I am just pointing out that Israel never gave gave them a chance and you are ignoring that while justifying the blockade. The blockade was not just. It went up ahead of any offensive actions towards Israel, because Israel refused to accept the results of the election. It promptly ended any possibility for peace as effectively as any violence.

The blockade IS perfectly justifiable. Whether it was a decade ago is immaterial to this discussion, though I'd argue that was then as well. Hamas was designated a terrorist organization in 2002 by Canada and 2003 by the US. Hamas stated that it would not recognize Israel, would not make peace with Israel and would not honor existing agreements and treaties with Israel. All valid reasons to institute a blockade. Not to mention the fact that Fatah and Hamas were throwing each other off buildings.

And not only that, it reeks of victim-blaming in the sense, "Its all Israel's fault -- if only they had made peace with a terrorist organization there wouldn't have been any violence". Again, its reversing cause and effect. The blockade was a REACTION to a threat to Israel.

And it doesn't explain or excuse what Hamas should be doing NOW to police its own people and prevent them from making unwarranted and belligerent attacks on Israel.

I never said it was all Israel's fault. I said that Israel instituted the blockade upon the election of Hamas. Not upon any escalation of violence but upon the results of an election they did not like . That IS collective punishment.

The situation now, of course has changed but you cannot just view it in a vacuum.Ignore the beginning when it has likely affected what is happening now.

I know you didn't say that it was Israel's fault. But it has the underlying implication of victim-blaming.

The blockade was not instituted because a new government was elected. It was instituted because that government refused to recognize Israel. Refused peace with Israel. And declared they would not comply with existing treaties.

That is part of the vacuum.

Why shouldn't Hamas be required to police its side of the border fence in order to prevent civilian deaths? Particularly when they are the instigators of the events.

I think it would be odd to demand Hamad comply with policing what they would consider part of a hostile action against them. But we also know Hamas places little value on life and also apparently infiltrated what was a peaceful protest and ratchetted it up in violence.

Is that true or is it just something Israel said?

There’s a user named Israel?

 

[Humanity]

It is abhorrent that any right minded person could consider the blockade legitimate!

What I said was that blockades are legal in international law. It's a statement of fact.

But I find it interesting you label that abhorrent and yet refuse to label lethal weapons like IEDS as aborrent.

I find it interesting that you DEFEND the murder of unarmed civilians yet you attack me for saying nothing?!?!

I wonder how that works in the real world Shusha, not your rather skewed vision, I mean the real world?

So when are you moving to Eastern Gaza?

When you do

I’m not the one making up bullshit stories that Jews who live in Israel are murderers.

Oh I see...

You are yet another Team Israel member (yes you can take that literally) who makes shit up!

Wanna show me where I have said all Jews are murderers?

I'll wait....

It's ok, I'm used to waiting for Team Israel to come back to me with anything!

 

[Indeependent]

What I said was that blockades are legal in international law. It's a statement of fact.

But I find it interesting you label that abhorrent and yet refuse to label lethal weapons like IEDS as aborrent.

I find it interesting that you DEFEND the murder of unarmed civilians yet you attack me for saying nothing?!?!

I wonder how that works in the real world Shusha, not your rather skewed vision, I mean the real world?

So when are you moving to Eastern Gaza?

When you do

I’m not the one making up bullshit stories that Jews who live in Israel are murderers.

Oh I see...

You are yet another Team Israel member (yes you can take that literally) who makes shit up!

Wanna show me where I have said all Jews are murderers?

I'll wait....

It's ok, I'm used to waiting for Team Israel to come back to me with anything!

You mean you’re only joking when you criticize Israel defending itself against people who are infamous for wearing homicide belts?
Whew!

 

[Billo_Really]

Lllll

errrr not really Billo....

If I'm wrong, then Josef Goebbels was just a janitor.

 

[Billo_Really]

What has Hamas invested into the Gaza economy? Besides tunnels and rockets?

Hamas is not the "terrorist only" organization many people claim it to be.

Hamas Social institutions include charitable societies, schools, community outreach programs, libraries, research centers, orphanage programs, day care centers, women’s centers, youth centers, homes for the elderly, specialized care centers, health clinics, summer camps, Islamic committees in the refugee camps of the Gaza Strip, and zakat committees.

Hamas Economic institutions include investment companies, banks, retail businesses, factories, and private entrepreneurs.
​

Hamas has been steadily moving away from its terrorist roots for some time now.

 

[Billo_Really]

Israel's response to acts of war from islamic terrorists are hardly war crimes.

Protesting the illegal and immoral occupation, is not an act of war.

 

[Billo_Really]

The minimum needed to keep receiving more aid and keep the struggle, all the luxury in Gaza is coming from Emirates money because they're more strict about the spending.

So I suggest that a better question is how much peanuts have been diverted from Hamas pockets to the people on the order of Qatar, and who else is in power to influence Hamas.. or make them irrelevant?

Gaza is the new Warsaw Ghetto.

 

[Hollie]

The minimum needed to keep receiving more aid and keep the struggle, all the luxury in Gaza is coming from Emirates money because they're more strict about the spending.

So I suggest that a better question is how much peanuts have been diverted from Hamas pockets to the people on the order of Qatar, and who else is in power to influence Hamas.. or make them irrelevant?

Gaza is the new Warsaw Ghetto.

Such silly melodrama.

 

[rylah]

The minimum needed to keep receiving more aid and keep the struggle, all the luxury in Gaza is coming from Emirates money because they're more strict about the spending.

So I suggest that a better question is how much peanuts have been diverted from Hamas pockets to the people on the order of Qatar, and who else is in power to influence Hamas.. or make them irrelevant?

Gaza is the new Warsaw Ghetto.

Is it, it thought the Warsaw Ghetto was supposed to be full of Jews...


Talking about ghetto:

 

[USAF 2023]

Sweetheart if you were putting bombs on you all's OWN fences I'd have no problem. Israel is not invading Gaza. Other way around.

Israeli snipers are deliberately shooting unarmed Palestinian's on Palestinian soil. That's an invasion.

Sweetheart if you were putting bombs on you all's OWN fences I'd have no problem. Israel is not invading Gaza. Other way around.

Israeli snipers are deliberately shooting unarmed Palestinian's on
Palestinian soil. That's an invasion.

Israeli Snipers are deliberately targeting innocent unarmed Palestinians? Link please.Even if it were true, I wouldn’t give s it l
Shit

What I said was that blockades are legal in international law. It's a statement of fact.

But I find it interesting you label that abhorrent and yet refuse to label lethal weapons like IEDS as aborrent.

I find it interesting that you DEFEND the murder of unarmed civilians yet you attack me for saying nothing?!?!

I wonder how that works in the real world Shusha, not your rather skewed vision, I mean the real world?

So when are you moving to Eastern Gaza?

When you do

I’m not the one making up bullshit stories that Jews who live in Israel are murderers.

Oh I see...

You are yet another Team Israel member (yes you can take that literally) who makes shit up!

Wanna show me where I have said all Jews are murderers?

I'll wait....

It's ok, I'm used to waiting for Team Israel to come back to me with anything!

Just more proof that Team Palestine are liars . In another post he was concerned about the rights of Palestinians at the Gaza border despite the Violence they ensued. He even had the CHUTPAH to mention “ International Law” and the Geneva Convention.
When I referred to those Israeli Soldiers literally being torn to death with those Animals proudly displaying their blood soaked Hands ,yet there was no mention of “ International
Law “ or the Geneva Convention throughout the world or on the board there is no response.
I’m used to Team Palestine “s silent Voice of approval which is why they don’t come back to me with anything

 

[ForeverYoung436]

What I said was that blockades are legal in international law. It's a statement of fact.

But I find it interesting you label that abhorrent and yet refuse to label lethal weapons like IEDS as aborrent.

I find it interesting that you DEFEND the murder of unarmed civilians yet you attack me for saying nothing?!?!

I wonder how that works in the real world Shusha, not your rather skewed vision, I mean the real world?

So when are you moving to Eastern Gaza?

When you do

I’m not the one making up bullshit stories that Jews who live in Israel are murderers.

Oh I see...

You are yet another Team Israel member (yes you can take that literally) who makes shit up!

Wanna show me where I have said all Jews are murderers?

I'll wait....

It's ok, I'm used to waiting for Team Israel to come back to me with anything!

ILOVEISRAEL said that You said that Jews living in Israel are murderers. Not all Jews live in Israel. Therefore, Humanity, your accusation against ILOVEISRAEL is false.

 

[Coyote]

What has Hamas invested into the Gaza economy? Besides tunnels and rockets?

Hamas is not the "terrorist only" organization many people claim it to be.

Hamas Social institutions include charitable societies, schools, community outreach programs, libraries, research centers, orphanage programs, day care centers, women’s centers, youth centers, homes for the elderly, specialized care centers, health clinics, summer camps, Islamic committees in the refugee camps of the Gaza Strip, and zakat committees.

Hamas Economic institutions include investment companies, banks, retail businesses, factories, and private entrepreneurs.
​

Hamas has been steadily moving away from its terrorist roots for some time now.

Hamas would be more credible if it acknowledged Israel’s right to exist.

 

[rylah]

What has Hamas invested into the Gaza economy? Besides tunnels and rockets?

Hamas is not the "terrorist only" organization many people claim it to be.

Hamas Social institutions include charitable societies, schools, community outreach programs, libraries, research centers, orphanage programs, day care centers, women’s centers, youth centers, homes for the elderly, specialized care centers, health clinics, summer camps, Islamic committees in the refugee camps of the Gaza Strip, and zakat committees.

Hamas Economic institutions include investment companies, banks, retail businesses, factories, and private entrepreneurs.
​

Hamas has been steadily moving away from its terrorist roots for some time now.

Hamas would be more credible if it acknowledged Israel’s right to exist.

You know what, let's leave the acknowledgement aside for a sec,
Let them first divert at least half of what he listed out of suicidal Jihad:

Let the charitable societies be charity not for martyred militants but for those who want life,
Let the summer camps be summer camps and not Jihad training and indoctrination centers for kids.
Let the schools be a place where they are learn to question rather than recite martyr songs.
Let the health clinics and hospitals work without hiding ammunition in them
Let the research centers become hubs of innovation rather than laboratories of rockets.


We can surely live without their recognition, they need it more that us.
What they need is to come to senses first...

 

[P F Tinmore]

What has Hamas invested into the Gaza economy? Besides tunnels and rockets?

Hamas is not the "terrorist only" organization many people claim it to be.

Hamas Social institutions include charitable societies, schools, community outreach programs, libraries, research centers, orphanage programs, day care centers, women’s centers, youth centers, homes for the elderly, specialized care centers, health clinics, summer camps, Islamic committees in the refugee camps of the Gaza Strip, and zakat committees.

Hamas Economic institutions include investment companies, banks, retail businesses, factories, and private entrepreneurs.
​

Hamas has been steadily moving away from its terrorist roots for some time now.

Hamas would be more credible if it acknowledged Israel’s right to exist.

Is that another Israeli talking point?

 

[Coyote]

What has Hamas invested into the Gaza economy? Besides tunnels and rockets?

Hamas is not the "terrorist only" organization many people claim it to be.

Hamas Social institutions include charitable societies, schools, community outreach programs, libraries, research centers, orphanage programs, day care centers, women’s centers, youth centers, homes for the elderly, specialized care centers, health clinics, summer camps, Islamic committees in the refugee camps of the Gaza Strip, and zakat committees.

Hamas Economic institutions include investment companies, banks, retail businesses, factories, and private entrepreneurs.
​

Hamas has been steadily moving away from its terrorist roots for some time now.

Hamas would be more credible if it acknowledged Israel’s right to exist.

Is that another Israeli talking point?

Nope.

 

[Shusha]

Gaza is the new Warsaw Ghetto.

You are either appallingly ignorant or exceedingly vile.

The Warsaw Ghetto saw 70% of the people exterminated. Another 25% were starved to death.

They were compelled to hand over thousands of people at a time including all the children under ten, the sick and elderly.

The comparison is sickening.