John Kelly calls Robert E. Lee an "honorable man"

[Peach]

He believed in "State's Riiites". Treason is rarely 'honorable', there is evidence Lee thought slavery would die out, thus leaving the South no choice but the Industrial life beginning in the North, thus the two governments reconciling.

 

[Peach]

Lefties undermine American history as part of attacking modern Patriotism.

How so? How are "leftists undermining history"?

LEARNING it, not a choice with the rabid right.

 

[NYcarbineer]

racism is not exclusively southern. much the northeast is racist. philly and bawztun are racist as shit.

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

Let me guess, the war was about an industrial economy v. agrarian? Thomas Pynchon made fun of that historical ? very well.

War was about a lot of things. Mostly nationalism imo opinion. On both sides.


Or do you believe that hundreds of thousands of northern whites were willing to die for the black man?

They were willing to fight to preserve the Union, but the only reason that they had to was slavery.

 

[Peach]

racism is not exclusively southern. much the northeast is racist. philly and bawztun are racist as shit.

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

Let me guess, the war was about an industrial economy v. agrarian? Thomas Pynchon made fun of that historical ? very well.

War was about a lot of things. Mostly nationalism imo opinion. On both sides.


Or do you believe that hundreds of thousands of northern whites were willing to die for the black man?

Each side, in fact different sides, were fighting for differing reasons. The South fired on Fort Sumter, so the men in the North were inflamed. Not just by Lincoln, by many Northern politicians. Slavery WAS an issue, Northern employers made sure to harp on the freedom of underpaid, overworked, WAGE SLAVES with no safety protections, read Mill Child one day. .

 

[Correll]

racism is not exclusively southern. much the northeast is racist. philly and bawztun are racist as shit.

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

The war was all about slavery. Look at it this way. If you removed all of the secondary issues, outside of slavery, that people cite as the causes,

and make it ONLY about slavery, all else being equal, the war still would have happened.

On the other hand, if you removed slavery from the factors, and left only those secondary issues, there's about zero chance the war would ever have happened.

If the north and south had not become two at odd regional blocs, it would have been very easy to avoid war.


The Southerns would not have feared that the North was out to grind them into dust.


The slave owners would have NOT been able to convince Southern Patriots to fight and kill their fellow northern Citizens, if there was not already a deep divide between the two.

 

[Correll]

racism is not exclusively southern. much the northeast is racist. philly and bawztun are racist as shit.

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

Let me guess, the war was about an industrial economy v. agrarian? Thomas Pynchon made fun of that historical ? very well.

War was about a lot of things. Mostly nationalism imo opinion. On both sides.


Or do you believe that hundreds of thousands of northern whites were willing to die for the black man?

They were willing to fight to preserve the Union, but the only reason that they had to was slavery.

Like I said, what sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


That was exactly my point, thanks for seeing it, and being honest enough to admit it.

 

[Correll]

racism is not exclusively southern. much the northeast is racist. philly and bawztun are racist as shit.

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

Let me guess, the war was about an industrial economy v. agrarian? Thomas Pynchon made fun of that historical ? very well.

War was about a lot of things. Mostly nationalism imo opinion. On both sides.


Or do you believe that hundreds of thousands of northern whites were willing to die for the black man?

Each side, in fact different sides, were fighting for differing reasons. The South fired on Fort Sumter, so the men in the North were inflamed. Not just by Lincoln, by many Northern politicians. Slavery WAS an issue, Northern employers made sure to harp on the freedom of underpaid, overworked, WAGE SLAVES with no safety protections, read Mill Child one day. .

Nothing I said denied that slavery was an issue.

Not even a little.

 

[GordonGecko]

racism is not exclusively southern. much the northeast is racist. philly and bawztun are racist as shit.

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

Let me guess, the war was about an industrial economy v. agrarian? Thomas Pynchon made fun of that historical ? very well.

War was about a lot of things. Mostly nationalism imo opinion. On both sides.


Or do you believe that hundreds of thousands of northern whites were willing to die for the black man?

400,000 Americans died to defeat the Axis Powers of Berlin/tokyo/Rome.

 

[NYcarbineer]

racism is not exclusively southern. much the northeast is racist. philly and bawztun are racist as shit.

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

Let me guess, the war was about an industrial economy v. agrarian? Thomas Pynchon made fun of that historical ? very well.

War was about a lot of things. Mostly nationalism imo opinion. On both sides.


Or do you believe that hundreds of thousands of northern whites were willing to die for the black man?

Each side, in fact different sides, were fighting for differing reasons. The South fired on Fort Sumter, so the men in the North were inflamed. Not just by Lincoln, by many Northern politicians. Slavery WAS an issue, Northern employers made sure to harp on the freedom of underpaid, overworked, WAGE SLAVES with no safety protections, read Mill Child one day. .

Slavery was the issue.

And the Southerners were not nearly unanimous in their support for secession. The pro and anti secession factions almost entirely separated over the issue of slavery. The slave owning regions most in support of secession, the conservative aristocrat class most in support of secession,

the areas and people least dependent in one way or another on slavery were most likely to be unionist.

 

[Correll]

Being racist and fighting a civil war in defense of it are really not the same. The South was fierce about their supremacy.

What sparks a war is rarely what the war is actually about.


The vast majority of the South were not fighting for slaves or racism.

Let me guess, the war was about an industrial economy v. agrarian? Thomas Pynchon made fun of that historical ? very well.

War was about a lot of things. Mostly nationalism imo opinion. On both sides.


Or do you believe that hundreds of thousands of northern whites were willing to die for the black man?

Each side, in fact different sides, were fighting for differing reasons. The South fired on Fort Sumter, so the men in the North were inflamed. Not just by Lincoln, by many Northern politicians. Slavery WAS an issue, Northern employers made sure to harp on the freedom of underpaid, overworked, WAGE SLAVES with no safety protections, read Mill Child one day. .

Slavery was the issue.

And the Southerners were not nearly unanimous in their support for secession. The pro and anti secession factions almost entirely separated over the issue of slavery. The slave owning regions most in support of secession, the conservative aristocrat class most in support of secession,

the areas and people least dependent in one way or another on slavery were most likely to be unionist.

Slavery was not Lee's motivation, that was clear.

 

[Timmy]

Who cares about his motives . He took up arms against the us and killed 100,000s troops.

Who’s worse ? Bowe berghdal or Lee??

 

[GordonGecko]

Lots of people die for causes they believe in. It’s amazing we caught this New York terrorist alive. Maybe we can find out how he was radicalized. We should have some nice CIA type interrogation like we did to Saddam to get the answers. Maybe the cia can drive a truck over him,

 

[Correll]

Who cares about his motives . He took up arms against the us and killed 100,000s troops.

Who’s worse ? Bowe berghdal or Lee??

You lefties care. THat's why you keep insisting that the Civil War was about nothing BUT slavery.


So that you can vilify them, and thus any of their descendants that are not wallowing in guilt.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Not that I'm under the illusion that anyone here might actually take my advice, but if you want to understand the causes of the war, laid out factually, unbiased, and in gruesome detail,

read this book:

History of the Southern Confederacy

 

[bripat9643]

It's unbelievably stupid to ask someone a question like that. The past is the past. What people think about it today is irrelevant to what people thought then.

Have you tried Preparation-H? It might solve your problem.

How will that make you any smarter?

 

[bripat9643]

Not that I'm under the illusion that anyone here might actually take my advice, but if you want to understand the causes of the war, laid out factually, unbiased, and in gruesome detail,

read this book:

History of the Southern Confederacy

You are correct, no one here will take your moronic advice. I don't waste my time reading Lincoln cult propaganda.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Who cares about his motives . He took up arms against the us and killed 100,000s troops.

Who’s worse ? Bowe berghdal or Lee??

You lefties care. THat's why you keep insisting that the Civil War was about nothing BUT slavery.


So that you can vilify them, and thus any of their descendants that are not wallowing in guilt.

If slavery was the deal breaker, or the deal maker, depending on how you look at it, and it was,

then it is not inaccurate to say that THE cause of the war was slavery.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Not that I'm under the illusion that anyone here might actually take my advice, but if you want to understand the causes of the war, laid out factually, unbiased, and in gruesome detail,

read this book:

History of the Southern Confederacy

You are correct, no one here will take your moronic advice. I don't waste my time reading Lincoln cult propaganda.

Since you haven't read it, your charge is baseless and retarded.

 

[Timmy]

Who cares about his motives . He took up arms against the us and killed 100,000s troops.

Who’s worse ? Bowe berghdal or Lee??

You lefties care. THat's why you keep insisting that the Civil War was about nothing BUT slavery.


So that you can vilify them, and thus any of their descendants that are not wallowing in guilt.

When it comes to Lee I don’t care?

Answer my question. Who’s worse ? LEE or Berghdal? As a bonus , throw in the Dallas cop shooter!

 

[Correll]

Who cares about his motives . He took up arms against the us and killed 100,000s troops.

Who’s worse ? Bowe berghdal or Lee??

You lefties care. THat's why you keep insisting that the Civil War was about nothing BUT slavery.


So that you can vilify them, and thus any of their descendants that are not wallowing in guilt.

If slavery was the deal breaker, or the deal maker, depending on how you look at it, and it was,

then it is not inaccurate to say that THE cause of the war was slavery.

The question was about why Lee and/or others were fighting.


Lee certainly was not fighting for slavery.

Neither were the vast majority of either side.


It probably is NOT an accident that the flag that has become the symbol of the Confederacy and/or the South, is the Battle Flag of the Army of Virginia, and NOT one of the National Flags of the Confederacy.