Justifiable use of deadly force or not?

[OODA_Loop]

Yeah, I don't think it was her honor that needed defending. More that she and the children were about to be cold-cocked.

Through the window ?

 

[Lewdog]

The guy was defending his wife and kids from some psycho that was yelling at them over a parking space. The guy that got shot and killed, actually had more justification to use deadly force than the guy that got pushed down.

Defending people who were safely locked in a car while a guy yelled at them?

Really?

The guy yelling committed no crime

Again you just proved you didn't watch the video. When the shooter was pushed to the ground, the wife had gotten out of the car and the shooter stepped into her face.

Seriously, at this point watch the fucking video before you comment anymore. You are just wasting people's time.

HE did not touch the woman

he was yelling at her

and I'm sure she was also yelling at him

He stepped up into her face as he was yelling at her. He's a man. She's a woman... with KIDS in the car. Really odd how you guys are fucking saying how defenseless the shooter was, but you don't give a shit about the woman and the kids. What scumbags.

Hey, a punk ass gun nut with a concealed carry permit considers women and children a fair fight.

Or a threat in this case.

If that was a white woman with kids in the car, this thread wouldn't even exist.

 

[Skull Pilot]

was she charged with a crime?

the book store was private property and the owners of the store had every right to have anyone removed.

No, she wouldn't stop yelling when the bookstore guy asked and said he'd call the police, but when he started to dial 911, she bugged out.

so no crime

 

[Vastator]

Your Demon-crat is showing, best cover up.

Well that's good because the self-defense used on him wasn't lethal. He was just pushed down.

Because the assault on him wasn’t committed in defense of “self”. Are you even trying to be serious?

Self defense of his woman means nothing eh ?? Remember this, before you choose to use self defense in regards to another person being assaulted or attacked you best think twice, because if you intervene you could be the one killed, and unless you are willing to risk life and limb, then just stay home and never go anywhere.

“His” woman? Misogynist much? And assaulting someone for saying something to someone, in a way you don’t like; does not legally give you the right to assault someone...

Quit trying to move the goal post or change the subject with your pettyness. If a man is verbally assaulting your wife, girlfriend, woman, old lady or whatever she desires to be reffered to as, then you have the right to defend her honor.

If the (husband, her man, boyfriend, Boo or whatever he desires to be called by her), felt that his wife, girlfriend, woman, cutie pie, family member or associate was being threatened by a dangerous person in his mind, then his actions to remove that person from his wife, girlfriend etc could have been warranted.

Defending honor is a legal defense for assault now? Who knew? I guess a lot of Muslim fathers with a jar of acid handy are relieved to hear this...

 

[Circe]

She could have driven away at any time

What, and left her boyfriend behind? Just drove off and abandoned him to this furious screamer-killer? Migod, I would never do that, just drive off and leave your mate in danger? Would you do that??

Big strapping guy like that could have walked to the street and gotten in the car

Huh. Not a bad point. Okay, that's an interesting variation tactic for escape, just not too far for boyfriend to come over and get in with them.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Where did I say that?

Quote it.

The 8th amendment applies to bail and sentences set by the courts not to individual citizens

And you don't know how the guy who got blindsided by a much larger man felt do you?

How would you feel if some guy a head taller and 100 lbs heavier than you blindsided you ?

Would you maybe feel your life might be in danger?

The 8th Amendment refers to Cruel and Unusual Punishment.

Do you honestly not know that?

Wow you really don't know that the Bill of rights applies to the government not the citizens?

People cannot set bail or pass sentences for crimes only the government can do that

I do know, that's why I said they share the same principle. Do you not know what that means?

Hell you keep saying the 8th Amendment is just about bail. No the 8th Amendment's MAIN topic is Cruel and Unusual Punishment. Do you know what that means? That means the punishment should fit the crime... and that everyone should be punished equally. So when you say that a guy that pushed a guy to the ground deserves to die, you show how little morals you have. Then if you want to say that, but then the next minute say you support the Constitution, then you just admit your a hypocrite.

So, what is it then? You are either stupid, racist, a hypocrite, a troll, or a liar based on the comments you've made in this thread.

I'll let you chose.

They don't share the same principal at all.

The guy who shot in what he considered to be self defense after being blindsided by a much larger person will not be charged with violating the 8th amendment.

He will be charged with some degree of murder and tried for it.

If he can justify the shooting he will walk

They don't? If you break the law, the punishment you receive is dictated by the Bill of Rights in the 8th Amendment that you can not receive a punishment that the courts rule are cruel and unusual compared to the severity of the crime. That's EXACTLY the same principle. But see the issue here is you are a hypocrite that lacks morals. You'd rather defend and try to scapegoat a murderer, instead of admitting a legal gun carrying citizen abused his right.

No it's not it's dictated by the laws and statutes of the state the crime was committed in

 

[beagle9]

This needs to have a hearing and a fact finding investigation.

The initial fact finding investigation resulted in the Sheriff passing on charges.

Not just the sheriff, because we know how close nit the good ole boys clubs are right ?? Might need a federal investigation if rises to that level.

It's not going to happen in Florida. That place is a special kind of stupid. And special stupid requires a special kind of circumstances.

People better come to understand. If you're going to live by laws like that.

You had god damned better be ready to die by laws like that.

Apparently the special kind of stupid that exists in Florida doesn't understand the concept of the two way street.

I am heartened though by those kids in the Parkland school shooting, who are obviously more intelligent than the dumb ass adults, and use the term adults very loosely here, that they don't believe in gun nut America, and their dumb ass gun nut, small dick, way of thinking, and that generation is going to make some changes in the years to come.

Well specific cases shouldn't apply to all of America, and in that one specific case down there where we as citizens got to see this video, there needs to be further investigation of such a case as this. I'm not for using individual cases to punish the good citizens of America as a whole. I am for common sense gun laws to regulate the activities in which might allow idiots to become armed and dangerous.

 

[Lewdog]

Again you just proved you didn't watch the video. When the shooter was pushed to the ground, the wife had gotten out of the car and the shooter stepped into her face.

Seriously, at this point watch the fucking video before you comment anymore. You are just wasting people's time.

HE did not touch the woman

he was yelling at her

and I'm sure she was also yelling at him

He stepped up into her face as he was yelling at her. He's a man. She's a woman... with KIDS in the car. Really odd how you guys are fucking saying how defenseless the shooter was, but you don't give a shit about the woman and the kids. What scumbags.

I never said the shooter was defenseless.

He shot AFTER he was violently assaulted by a much larger man.

She could have driven away at any time

Being pushed to the ground because he was intimidating a woman, is NOT defenseless. If he had been minding his own business and not trying to intimidate a woman, then he wouldn't have gotten knocked on his ass.

Looks to me like the guy only had the balls to yell at her because he thought it was just her and the kids. If the guy that got shot had been out there with them, the shooter wouldn't have said shit.

I never said the shooter was defenseless.

Please stop making up quotes and attributing them to me.

Tell you what the next time you want to tell me what I said use the quote function

Yes, you did say that. You just keep on lying and doing what you do. I can live with my self.

 

[Skull Pilot]

HE did not touch the woman

he was yelling at her

and I'm sure she was also yelling at him

He stepped up into her face as he was yelling at her. He's a man. She's a woman... with KIDS in the car. Really odd how you guys are fucking saying how defenseless the shooter was, but you don't give a shit about the woman and the kids. What scumbags.

I never said the shooter was defenseless.

He shot AFTER he was violently assaulted by a much larger man.

She could have driven away at any time

Being pushed to the ground because he was intimidating a woman, is NOT defenseless. If he had been minding his own business and not trying to intimidate a woman, then he wouldn't have gotten knocked on his ass.

Looks to me like the guy only had the balls to yell at her because he thought it was just her and the kids. If the guy that got shot had been out there with them, the shooter wouldn't have said shit.

I never said the shooter was defenseless.

Please stop making up quotes and attributing them to me.

Tell you what the next time you want to tell me what I said use the quote function

Yes, you did say that. You just keep on lying and doing what you do. I can live with my self.

If I did then quote the post

 

[OODA_Loop]

If that was a white woman with kids in the car, this thread wouldn't even exist.

Ah the death rattle.

This almost as satisfying as the proclamation of leaving the thread or putting someone on ignore.

 

[Circe]

She could have driven away at any time

What, and left her boyfriend behind? Just drove off and abandoned him to this furious screamer-killer? Migod, I would never do that, just drive off and leave your mate in danger? Would you do that??

Create time and space. Not go home and leave him.

You are saying the same thing as Skull Pilot. Okay, I see your point. I like it. I'll think about that if such a thing comes up.

Though come to think of it I could make more distance on foot faster than Himself ------------- and he'd never drive away and leave me. Darn, this is really a sad situation, isn't it? I think I'll go play some video game.

 

[Lewdog]

The 8th Amendment refers to Cruel and Unusual Punishment.

Do you honestly not know that?

Wow you really don't know that the Bill of rights applies to the government not the citizens?

People cannot set bail or pass sentences for crimes only the government can do that

I do know, that's why I said they share the same principle. Do you not know what that means?

Hell you keep saying the 8th Amendment is just about bail. No the 8th Amendment's MAIN topic is Cruel and Unusual Punishment. Do you know what that means? That means the punishment should fit the crime... and that everyone should be punished equally. So when you say that a guy that pushed a guy to the ground deserves to die, you show how little morals you have. Then if you want to say that, but then the next minute say you support the Constitution, then you just admit your a hypocrite.

So, what is it then? You are either stupid, racist, a hypocrite, a troll, or a liar based on the comments you've made in this thread.

I'll let you chose.

They don't share the same principal at all.

The guy who shot in what he considered to be self defense after being blindsided by a much larger person will not be charged with violating the 8th amendment.

He will be charged with some degree of murder and tried for it.

If he can justify the shooting he will walk

They don't? If you break the law, the punishment you receive is dictated by the Bill of Rights in the 8th Amendment that you can not receive a punishment that the courts rule are cruel and unusual compared to the severity of the crime. That's EXACTLY the same principle. But see the issue here is you are a hypocrite that lacks morals. You'd rather defend and try to scapegoat a murderer, instead of admitting a legal gun carrying citizen abused his right.

No it's not it's dictated by the laws and statutes of the state the crime was committed in

Wow. The Bill of Rights has power over the states given to it by Due Process through the 14th Amendment.

Our educational system is seriously failing our country. Some of the stuff in this thread EVERY citizen in this country should know in order to be able to vote.

 

[beagle9]

No his current actions did a great job enough of that. No past required...

Victim blaming now? Maybe the rape victim should have dressed less provocatively as well, eh?

Your Demon-crat is showing, best cover up.

You're taking everything into account except for the fact that the guy that got shot was defending his girlfriend, who was being threatened by an armed man. Where is her self defense rights?

Where are the self defense rights of the guy that got shot?

She was verbally attacked no right to lethal self-defense.

Guy that got shot initiated a hands on attack Thats what got him shot, No right to lethal self-defense.

Well that's good because the self-defense used on him wasn't lethal. He was just pushed down.

Because the assault on him wasn’t committed in defense of “self”. Are you even trying to be serious?

Self defense of his woman means nothing eh ?? Remember this, before you choose to use self defense in regards to another person being assaulted or attacked you best think twice, because if you intervene you could be the one killed, and unless you are willing to risk life and limb, then just stay home and never go anywhere.

The victim hadn’t assaulted, or attacked anyone. Quit trying to resort to a “Red Herring”. It doesn’t help you prove your case...

You calling the live guy the victim in disregards to the dead guy is quite interesting. I refer to the dead guy as the victim, because he shouldn't be dead to begin with.

 

[Vastator]

Defending people who were safely locked in a car while a guy yelled at them?

Really?

The guy yelling committed no crime

Again you just proved you didn't watch the video. When the shooter was pushed to the ground, the wife had gotten out of the car and the shooter stepped into her face.

Seriously, at this point watch the fucking video before you comment anymore. You are just wasting people's time.

HE did not touch the woman

he was yelling at her

and I'm sure she was also yelling at him

He stepped up into her face as he was yelling at her. He's a man. She's a woman... with KIDS in the car. Really odd how you guys are fucking saying how defenseless the shooter was, but you don't give a shit about the woman and the kids. What scumbags.

Hey, a punk ass gun nut with a concealed carry permit considers women and children a fair fight.

Or a threat in this case.

If that was a white woman with kids in the car, this thread wouldn't even exist.

Hey. Madame Cleo... There are actual facts relevant to this incident. Let’s use those.... Mmkay?

 

[Lewdog]

Again you just proved you didn't watch the video. When the shooter was pushed to the ground, the wife had gotten out of the car and the shooter stepped into her face.

Seriously, at this point watch the fucking video before you comment anymore. You are just wasting people's time.

HE did not touch the woman

he was yelling at her

and I'm sure she was also yelling at him

He stepped up into her face as he was yelling at her. He's a man. She's a woman... with KIDS in the car. Really odd how you guys are fucking saying how defenseless the shooter was, but you don't give a shit about the woman and the kids. What scumbags.

Hey, a punk ass gun nut with a concealed carry permit considers women and children a fair fight.

Or a threat in this case.

If that was a white woman with kids in the car, this thread wouldn't even exist.

Hey. Madame Cleo... There are actual facts relevant to this incident. Let’s use those.... Mmkay?

You mean facts like in other threads you've been proud to announce how proud you are to be white and you think Black people are inferior?

 

[kaz]

So in response you escalate the situation?
How'd that turn out for Saint McGlockton?

I'd escalate the situation by not screaming at another guy's woman in a parking lot while I'm packing? Seriously? How does that make sense?

Big difference between yelling and assault.
And as I said earlier all involved are idiots.
From the chick on down to the shooter.

I agree. But only one decided to raise the stakes to violence. And it cost him his life...

So you are saying if a guy with a gun was standing outside the car your wife and kids are sitting in and yelling at them, you'd not do anything about it?

I sure as fuck wouldnt assault him!!!
Thats a good way to get shot.......oh wait.

It's also a good way to get shot standing outside someone's wife's car yelling at her for where she parked. Or in this case, it's a good way to get to shoot someone, which was his goal

 

[OODA_Loop]

Though come to think of it I could make more distance on foot faster than Himself ------------- and he'd never drive away and leave me. Darn, this is really a sad situation, isn't it? I think I'll go play some video game.

I would un-ass the vehicle to go get my wife if she were in danger but would not want her to expose herself and leave the car to come to me were I n danger.

 

[Vastator]

Victim blaming now? Maybe the rape victim should have dressed less provocatively as well, eh?

Your Demon-crat is showing, best cover up.

She was verbally attacked no right to lethal self-defense.

Guy that got shot initiated a hands on attack Thats what got him shot, No right to lethal self-defense.

Well that's good because the self-defense used on him wasn't lethal. He was just pushed down.

Because the assault on him wasn’t committed in defense of “self”. Are you even trying to be serious?

Self defense of his woman means nothing eh ?? Remember this, before you choose to use self defense in regards to another person being assaulted or attacked you best think twice, because if you intervene you could be the one killed, and unless you are willing to risk life and limb, then just stay home and never go anywhere.

The victim hadn’t assaulted, or attacked anyone. Quit trying to resort to a “Red Herring”. It doesn’t help you prove your case...

You calling the live guy the victim in disregards to the dead guy is quite interesting. I refer to the dead guy as the victim, because he shouldn't be dead to begin with.

He’s dead due to his own actions... Don’t assault people just because you think you have the drop on them, and think they can’t defend themselves... You might be dead wrong.

 

[kaz]

So in response you escalate the situation?
How'd that turn out for Saint McGlockton?

I'd escalate the situation by not screaming at another guy's woman in a parking lot while I'm packing? Seriously? How does that make sense?

Big difference between yelling and assault.
And as I said earlier all involved are idiots.
From the chick on down to the shooter.

I agree. But only one decided to raise the stakes to violence. And it cost him his life...

So you are saying if a guy with a gun was standing outside the car your wife and kids are sitting in and yelling at them, you'd not do anything about it?

If he was just yelling?

I would have ignored him

If he put his hands on them or tried to open the car doors that's a different story

You'd ignore some nutcase yelling at your family for where you parked, but if he touched you, you'd waste him. I'd say that's a good argument, but wow, it's not

 

[kaz]

So in response you escalate the situation?
How'd that turn out for Saint McGlockton?

I'd escalate the situation by not screaming at another guy's woman in a parking lot while I'm packing? Seriously? How does that make sense?

Big difference between yelling and assault.
And as I said earlier all involved are idiots.
From the chick on down to the shooter.

I agree. But only one decided to raise the stakes to violence. And it cost him his life...

So you are saying if a guy with a gun was standing outside the car your wife and kids are sitting in and yelling at them, you'd not do anything about it?

I didn't see any gun until the thug pushed him to the ground.

Yep, that was part of the murderer's plan to kill someone. Scream at women in parking lots then kill anyone who tries to help her